Warhammer 40,000 General /40kg/

Not against vehicles, but given the increased effectiveness of armour I reason that it'll probably become more feasible to drown Space Marines in wounds than try to grind a smaller number of shots that only slightly impact saves through a big block. Also, being a good shot helps for blasts now. It's not that woundspam has got stronger, although they did buff small arms a tad (especially vs. T5) with new wounding, it's that they've dramatically nerfed AP3.

A second wound that's invalidated by an autocannon two-thirds of the time. Doesn't really amount to as much as it used to. We'll have to see how the points look.

Yeah, but I wouldn't use them if you gave me free starter sets then paid me to use them.

Primed and painted with like 3 colors.

Newfag here, grabbing necrons for 8th and was wondering if anyone had any pics of some decently painted warriors. Obviously theres only so much one can do with them, but was wondering what a paintjob that was a bit more than spray painted silver + wash would look like.

Then pass them my way
>At least the Incessors. Not only do they look great, but statwise they're good too.

Highlights, glowy bits. Heck, I've seen Necrons painted to look like ceramics.

Comparing the new rules to the way sigmar plays makes me wonder if melee won't be a central necessity of 40k 8th. Combing wound inflation with the overall increased durability of 40k units compared to sigmar makes me think that shooting just won't be able to put out enough damage anymore to stop say an imperial knight with a lot of strong multi wound units like dreadnauts from getting in.

Google Thokt.

And seriously, you can paint them whatever colour you like. Personally I started with leadbelcher all over as normal, then added a bunch of red to personalise them and make them less bland than Sautekh. I wasn't very creative, but it was my first army.

>leadbelcher
>nuln oil
>necron compound
>paint details
Done, your standard warrior.

The real key is to paint the details nicely, They're goddamn robot space aliens. Make them look as alien as possible.

Sword Gauntlet

4.17 hits 3.33 hits
2 3.47 wounds 2.78 wounds
3 2.78 wounds 2.78 wounds
4 2.08 wounds 2.78 wounds
5 1.39 wounds 2.22 wounds
6 1.39 wounds 2.22 wounds
7 1.39 wounds 2.22 wounds
8 0.69 wounds 1.67 wounds

All hail the Grotslaying Sword!

Hey, if one were to start playing, what would be the minimum amount of points(?) in my army I should have before I play a game? Is there a specific minimum?

Isn't that a trap?

start at about 500 points for small games
the maximum point limits for standard games are about 2000-2500

I recommend building a 500 pts army first, then a 1000 pts based off of it, then a 1500 pts expanding on that, then 1850, then 2000, and then 2500.

Then buy whichever models that are in your list in the order that they come in your army list.

i would aim for 750 or so. enough to have a small army to paint and not get overwhelmed by having too much to work on at once

no mercy to shooting armies, we had a few editions where shooting was really strong. don't you wanna slap tau silly in cqc?

Nop.

Buying SoB is a trap thou.

>pictured: leader of the chaos spa- I mean loyalist space marines

So if test tube captain #954 has 6 wounds and guilliman has 9 most named charcters are looking to have 7-8 wounds?

If so I feel like snipers are going to be super important in 8th with efficient ones perhaps being too strong.

>tfw bought a vindicare assassin just before 8th rules were announced
>tfw 8th ed just made him incredibly vital to taking out HQs
ty based nuGW

I think snipers will be more important for killing off the weaker independent characters that hand out buffs, like Ork Painboys or Commisars.

For really heavily armored characters, I feel like you'd still be better off peeling away their bodyguard squad until you can shoot them with heavy weapons.

You use the sword when fighting 2 wound models, when rolling a 1 on the damage would be inconvenient for the fist

Actually fairly good.
"Tabletop standard" means "no excessive embellishment" but otherwise has layers, highlighting and clean features.

So basically above pleb standard, which is still unattainable by us plebs.

That's not dark angels though.

So, now that we've seen the souped up Mega Captain and Ultra Ultramarines what do you guys think Custodes will have for a statline? I expect with terminators and characters getting buffed we'll be seeing something close to Monstrous Creature numbers.

upvoted :)

Careful, you know what happens when you bully the Dark Angels.

hohohoho

I think guilliman would have had 5 wounds in 7th like most primarchs. seems they more or less double the wounds for characters based on what we know

Then whodat?

Oh wow a OP that's worse than Inceptor models.
Impressive.

I know exactly what happens, which is why I do it.

Yess, believe this Thrall

I guess the term varies than, TT standard here is 3 tones and a wash or above.

1000 right now seems to be a good low point. Not sure about after the 17th though, but I'd guess 500-1000

You realize Guilliman has a published 7th edition profile, right?
he has 6 wounds currently, bumped to 9 in 8th.
characters will prolly have ~1.5x the wounds they have now.

A start collecting box should be all you "need"
They usually are around ~500pts

T'au gonna steal psi-transmitters from Starcraft, Octavius war leads into orkanid hybrids who dominates all the other hive fleets leading to single orkanid race. T'au gets eaten but Shadowsun is assimilated, bullshit plot things happen, Shadowsun becomes the queen of orkanids who leads the WAAAAAGH fleet against Ynnari, Primaris marines and chaos.

Primaris marines will take over the side of galaxy Bobby G is and replace all the fighting forces because they are so cool and shit.

Ynncarne will revert necrons back to flesh and finally the War in Heavens is over and the Silent King and ynnari join forces to defeat orkanids.

Chaos conquers the Dark imperium but can't cross the great rift thanks to the combined tech of ynnari and necrontyr.

Since the Chad not!Assault marines have two Assault 3 Assault Bolters each, do they get 6 shots a piece?

GW will probably slowly add new kits over the next couple years. If you look at some of the early 6th CSM models, they look absolutely shitty by today's standard, especially all the "finecast" models they released. i can see those all getting new models akin to Kharn, Ahriman, and Typhus

Thanks for answering my question regarding the minimum starting points!

4-5 wounds a guy, 2+ 4++

Yep.

No, they get sqroot(3*2+[number of chadassults in squad]+[turn number])

I'm not upset about it, just that no one expects that it will be as big of a deal as it will probably end up being. Knights can wade through 20+ typical lascannon shots. A dreadnaut can take about 6, it seems to me like these big dudes can shrug even the heavy weapons meant to handle them whereby the only way to get the firepower to kill them is with other big dudes swinging their armor killing drill fist or whatever with 5 attacks per round each.

This.
I want custodes to cost as much as five captains
And then BE five captains.

"Tabletop standard" varies wildly and people will give you a million and one answers. Basically from what I've seen it's anything between unpainted/only primed or base coated minis and Golden Daemon nominees. Realistically, just don't half-ass your minis.

Aren't meltas going to be really good at taking out vehicles actually? iirc, within a given range, it's 2D6 pick highest. I'd see this as a good deterrent to moving in too close.

Same as they are I expect, although any Cusodes characters will probably be fucking ridiculous

>custodes characters
dear god no
it'll be kaldor draigo all over again

I'm still holding out hope that bikes and jink will get massive nerfs. :(

Actually, given wound counts a melta's potential for oneshotting a vehicle has been completely destroyed. High RoF attacks with multiwound potential carry a much higher potential power, but meltas are more consistent.

A meltagun rolls 2d6 and picks the highest, but with it's one shot it will never score more than 6 wounds, which pretty much every vehicle exceeds. A lascannon has the same issue.

A battle cannon, on the other hand, has a small chance of throwing 18 wounds at your target. It's a VERY small chance, but it's there.

So, are all the new space marine suits Mk. X or was there some confusion and the basic primaris are in Mk IX?

Bikes shouldn't get +1T but jink needs to be more tweaked than nerfed.

no, 9 didn't make it past production testing or cawl didn't see a benefit to using it

Is it possible that jink is gone since there is no longer a cover save and vehicles just have a flat armour save now?

A Meltagun in assault range kind of essentially is a melee weapon for most purposes. I'm saying I suspect melee will be required because you'll need to the 2x or more amount of attacks you typically get over ranged weapons to have enough heavy tier weaponry to deal with the wound inflation in 8th.

I miss the days of "boosting gives a buff"
Do that

There's Mk X Tacticus and Mk X Gravis.

I have no idea why they seem to have skipped Mk IX (possibly an unfunny Windows 9 joke?) or why the differences between Tacticus and Gravis don't justify them being different marks.

Unfortunately, today's article hints that bikes are still +1 T
>they combine the speed of Assault Squads, the durability of units like Bikes

Can someone check my mathhammer for swarmlord VS mark X gravis captian, because right now I'm getting thst it takes 7.6 rounds for the captian to kill the swarmlord, which doesn't seem right.
5*(4/6)*(3/6)*(3/6)*3.5= 1.666.... right? Which takes 7.6 rounds to equal 12.

Some nidfags were bitching about the captian being to powerful compared to the SL last thread, but I just can't see how they figure that. Mathhammer, the swarmlord kills the captian in 1 round, so I can't seem to understand the issue.

Can xenos and heretics not into basic math? Do they lack the STCs for calculators or something?

When was the last time anyone used single melta gun to anything? It's always squad of fire dragons, melta vets, sternguards, crisis suits etc.
Also chunking the vehicle down to just few wounds allows your smaller guns to take it out more easier.

>It's a VERY small chance, but it's there.
There's a VERY small chance you're going to win the lottery and then immediately be struck by lightning, too.

Unlikely. They seem to be trending towards agile units getting an invulnerable save for dodging (dark eldar, harlequins and genestealers all get invulnerables), so jink is probably going to become an invulnerable. It's going to be on an unit-by-unit basis though because USRs are gone.

Hopefully, but they'll probably bring some way to bring that bullshit back.

"Oh you shot at me? I get a free 2+ (or 3+) re-rollable save. I'll also cross the board in one turn and I'm still great at melee. Isn't this fun?"

I agree, insta-kills on vehicles will no longer be as much of a thing, and I think that was the goal. However, by the time vehicles/MC get into melee range, a lascannon or melta shot will also have the added effect of possibly reducing the model's stats before it gets into melee.

Yeah speaking as a nidfag those guys were retarded. The Gravis Captain has 0 chance against Swarmlord.

>Can xenos and heretics not into basic math? Do they lack the STCs for calculators or something?

This exactly. The Swarmlord will own the Captain, as is proper, they were just REEEing over him being T5 with a good few wounds.

Excuse me, off to find some Vanguard and wound the guy on a 5+ with double sixes, which is mathematically a 4+.

Yes, yes, but the potential for a spike is very statistically interesting. If there's a psychic power which allows reroll like there is in 7th, the battle cannon can become a truly terrifying weapon. In what other edition can it match the power of THREE meltaguns?

Even with re-rolls you are never going to inflict 18 Wounds with a battlecannon. Ever.

I've seen 4 ork kannons to take out a landraider in a single shooting phase. My body is ready.

Says you. I smoked an entire squad of centurion devastators with a single manticore shot once.

Never count on the spike. But always be aware of it.

user I don't care what you've seen. You are literally never in your lifetime going to see a Battlecannon do 18 Wounds. You will never even see it deal 16 or 17 Wounds. Not even with re-rolls.

Sure, you Guard players are enjoying discussing the mathhammer benefits or drawbacks of a Battlecannon as you have the BS to do so.

Meanwhile, Orks now have to roll to-hit with Killkannons and Boomguns (and chances are high they won't get to ignore the "fire on the move" penalty. Enjoy rolling those 6s to hit).

I suspect you'll pick up many many more shots than everyone else, though.

On my end I play Skitarii, so I'm expecting the Neutron Laser to be D3 TOPS given it's laser-accurate.

I'm mostly talking the Battle Cannon because it's related to the Earthshaker Cannon and Demolisher Cannon (my two best problem solvers). I suspect since strength is no longer as relevant they'll have more damage or shot potential than a Battle cannon shot.

Yes, because you hit with guardsmans BS of fucking 3 or 4+ as it is in the age of sigmar, shooty edition.

I have 6 lemons and im mad, although I have already some turret conversions done but im going to miss the big plate and not having to worry about bs too much.

>I don't know how statistics work: the post
If something is a possible, not matter how unlikely, it sill occur at least once given enough time. For a battle cannon to do 18 wounds against something like a T:16 SV:2++ model, the chance is about .15...%, which means it's bound to happen at least once (from a statistical point of view) if you play 1000 games.
So no, it's objectively untrue to say it will never happen. Highly unlikely? Most certainly, but it's not a never.

I figure this.
Table top standard is half the effort of your best mini in the collection. Likely because they aren't a character but a common infantry unit that you have a ton of.

Are you people just completely incapable of simple math?

The chances of a battlecannon doing 18 Wounds to something equivalent, like let's say, another Leman Russ, is:

(1/6)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(2/3)*(2/3)*(2/3)*(2/3)*(2/3)*(2/3)*(1/3)*(1/3)*(1/3)*(1/3)*(1/3)*(1/3)

Let me know when you find a calculator powerful enough to compute the number of 0's after the decimal point to get to the fraction of a single percent chance of that happening, because the one on my PC gives out before I finish getting through the chances to Wound.

Well now I just wish it happens on warhammer's live stream and someone gifs it... just for the BTFO potential

See

>For a battle cannon to do 18 wounds against something like a T:16 SV:2++ model, the chance is about .15...%
Uhh.... no. Not even remotely. How do you fuck up that bad?

More like, don't see that post, because that guys retarded and cannot do math.

So if it's my birthday and I hit the bottom of the cake and my qt friend is standing next to me and seems all for it but I've got shitty 50/50 guardsman accuracy and I have no idea if she's going left or right what's my chance of accidentally headbutting her?

Are you baiting or are you that bad at math? I agree that it's possible and your post has reason behind it, you're just terrible at applying the theory.

Think my number was around 4.9×10^-9
>Was a Leman Russ shooting something T8 3+

what is your problem with agile melee units?

>Accidentally
BRAIN THAT BITCH user
BRAIN THAT BITCH AND OWN IT

That's 4.9*10^-9, or 4 billionths.

Yeah, fucked that up big time. Shouldn't do mathhammer and quantum physics at the same time, it's easy to get confused between the two. Probably shouldn't shitpost while doing lab work anyways, but what are you going to do. Now if you excuse me, I'm going to make sure mathhammer was the only numbers I fucked up.

Math or no, my point is that it's not impossible. Let's actually run it.

Assume the worst case, a T16 model with a 2+ save (assuming such a thing exists). So you have:

(1/6) (chance of rolling 6 shots) x (1/2)^6 (chance of every shot hitting) x (1/6)^6 (chance of every shot wounding) x (1/2)^6 (chance of every failed save) x (1/3)^6 (chance of max damage), or 1.19x10^(-10)%, or 0.000000000119%.

That's small. It's very small. But is it zero? No. That was my point. That was ALWAYS my point.