/dcg/ Dropzone/Dropfleet Commander General

>Get bent xenophiles. We know you're in love Shaltari 2: Spherical Boogaloo, but at least have the courtesy to be quiet about it while the real humans are saving planets from the brain slugs.

The PHR Shangri-La pocket is amused that you're still pretending that this is about fighting the Scourge and not your rage-alcoholism, but in case they're wrong could you provide some orbital support? All theirs went away for some reason and the jellies are getting riled up again.

>problems solving other problems
I see no issue with how things are currently going.

We can talk about the rage alcoholism when an alien race arrives that doesn't consist of backstabbing dickheads or genocidal parasites. Right now rage is the most appropriate and safe response to any outside contact.

>join the infantry they said
>nobody bothers killing immortals they said
>if the walkers or the navy get their shit wrecked they just pull us out they said

I looked again and you are very right. I read the points off the wrong ship when I quoted the large number discrepancy.

Goes to show what posting past midnight gets me.

It would be just about fighting the Scourge except Ball Lickers like to shoot human beings for no reason and give nukes to psychopaths.

Amen brother

The man already had nukes. Also the only EAA-tech armor division this side of hell, but you still sicced an army on him when you should have been fighting the Scourge, then blamed everything on him when he rage quit instead of being sitting tight and being massacred with dignity. All John Conner had was actor good looks and being a weak enough faction that all he could do was smile and ask for more when you started shipping Eden resistance offworld as canon fodder.

Funny how the UCM keeps up the EAA's "we'd rather make sure everything goes down in flames then anyone question our political supremacy over all mankind for even a moment."

>and they probably are still wondering just what the PHR had to do to get the Asgardans to shiv them

So what are the suggested "normal" points limits for DZC and DFC?

I used to do 1500 for DZ, but I'm starting to feel like I'm not getting a lot of battlegroups at that level.

DZC - 1500
DFC - 1250

Thanks.

For friendly games of DZ, I kind of like 1750 now. I doesn't really increase the game time that much and at that point level, you can have all your must takes while still fitting in something fun like a Seraphim.

Don't bother spitting your ball fondling propaganda here. Long before we met him, the PHR was contacting him to make a deal focused only on opposing the UCM. He didn't care about anything, but controlling his little realm. He was never going to be UCM's friend and he certainly didn't care about the rest of humanity.

John Conner risked everything to save Eden Prime and he has. And like all true heroes of mankind is committed making every jelly pay.

Yeah.

My biggest problem is fitting in a decent commander and FM air assests. 1500 just feels like you can't have both with sacrificing your ground forces something fierce.

Well you got to be a little careful. I am sure you could start spamming stuff at that point cost.

However, DZ is pretty balanced so its not like there are that many free win spam units.They usually nerf stuff before it gets out of control.

Well, just ordered my command cards, anyone got a list of some good ones?

Which ones did you order?
I don't think you "build" a deck of cards, but have to use that specific list.

Just finished some jelly frigates

All of them, I know it's a fixed deck, but I'm just curious what the power level of the cards are.

I'm not sure yet, but you should post and/or scan them so the rest of us can see.

Especially the UCM/Shaltari ones, since the PHR and Scourge have already been posted.

Nice frigates, the scourge dfc stuff are some of the hardest models I've had to figure out how to paint ever

Ghost Tints are your friend

Errata making Corsair hit on 3+ when

Errata giving Juno A1 an E8 gun.

>IFV kills other IFVs on a "6", might as well not be armed otherwise, WTF

It wouldn't be a thing (the UCM makes do with worse), except it transports 10 because it's armed... and it functionally isn't. Would literally much rather have an Invader, which makes no pretense and is also a cheaper option than giving everything their own light dropship, which is another way the Juno is a weird design choice.

>knowing my luck, this is addressed by making the Triton more expensive

>errata making Bear's machine gun and Albatross' HMGs hit on 3+ because why not, might as well make them a bit useful since they do technically exist

>errata giving Scourge heavy grav tanks A9
>errata making Invaders worthwhile, I'm not sure how to even do this one
>errata downgrading Destroyer passive save to 5+
>errata giving Desolator focused mode 12" range, and honestly just rethinking how wide mode works

>errata making Menchit cheaper and grouping it with Menchit A2 instead of Ares and Phobos
>errata making Janus cheaper or 2+ accuracy on missiles
>errata letting Valkyries get hit by reaction fire during jumps
>errata making Juno A2 guns 2+ to hit?
>errata generally buffing Taranis missiles

>errata giving Thunderbird 2+ accuracy
>errata reducing Leopard thermal lance to 1 shot instead of 2
>errata doing something to Tomahawks, I don't even know how something that seems so respectable on paper can be so useless

>errata giving Hannibal main gun an alternate fire mode that drops a template

Did I miss anything?
I know I missed the Ferrum, and while they're bullshit they're also the only thing keeping UCM relevant at a high level, so they're necessary bullshit atm.

Any nerfs you can think of?

Well, that Valkyrie one gives every Rapier guy a shit-eating grin.

The Destroyer one... long overdue.

I've dodged Leopards thus far, can't comment.

For the Ferrum?

Remove scout entirely, it's unnecessary and causes drones to largely invalidate other scouts.
Make the AA and AT modes different profiles with the alt rule, since right now they just shred through skimmers like nothing else.
Possibly force the drones to choose between AA or AT when deployed, and to head back to the Ferrum if they want to change.

As for other nerfs, Helios might need one. But I'm not at all sure how to do it.

Give their weapon profiles Limited-2 or something, with a special rule that once they run out of charges, they're considered "destroyed" (returning to the Ferrum) at no penalty to the player and no benefit to the opponent.

This. Mine are by no means perfect but ghost tints do all the work

R8 my homemade garbage, /dcg/.

Tulwar Super-Heavy Siege Tank: 96pts
A10, Mv4", CM:A, DP4
Type:Vehicle, Category:Heavy, S+C:1
Chemical Projector: E5, Sh9, Ac3+, R(F):9", R(C):9", MF:4", Arc:F/S, Special: Focus-3, Demo-D3, Flame
Transport: 1x Condor (1 unit)

I think I may have just gotten addicted homebrew. I just wanted to make one tank for fun and now I'm doing stats for missile halo lasers and logistical vehicles that don't even have a purpose in-game. Somebody please help.

So, it's a broadsword that specializes in melting buildings and infantry?
How does flame interact with demo?

It sounds interesting, but I'm not so sure on the focus value, or the inclusion of focus at all. Maybe Focus-1 or Focus-2?

>How does flame interact with demo?
It doesn't. Flame applies to shooting at infantry, while demo applies to shooting at buildings. There's no situation where they both kick in. Since it isn't an area weapon I don't think a miss against garrisoned infantry even hits the building.

The focus is pretty much the only thing making it any good at demo. E5 is unable to damage hardened buildings and only damages standard ones on a 6. With focus it can do 4 E8 shots or 3 E11 shots, which is much better and also can act as short range AT.

I like it, it looks interesting! I forget the exact rules in relation to the Demo-D3, however; is the D3 rolled for each shot, or only once for the attack in all?

>is the D3 rolled for each shot, or only once for the attack in all?
Huh. I don't actually know. I think the only weapons currently in the game with demo/deva values you roll for are single-shot.

...

Is Overseer/Warrior-spam a thing?

Nope. Take a look at the FAQ

>Q. Can you explain the combined fire rule for Scourge warriors, especially in conjunction with the Overseer?
>A. The combined fire rule can only ever be used to create one E11 hit per shooting base. This means that if used with the Overseer to double their shots, each base of warriors would fire 10 shots. As long as 3 or more of these hit, the base would create one E11 shot, which would then be reduced to E10 due to the Overseer’s rules. It does not matter how many hits more than 3 each base achieves, they may only ever change that to one high energy hit per base

You kinda stacked to many special rules on there.

Ferrums aren't even that powerful any more.

They went from a massive force multiplier to just a huge annoyance in a series of nerfs.

Panther still needs to get beat to death.

Ferrum+Kodiak is level of absolute cancer that no other army can beat. A 2+ E13 template with scouts that can see pretty much everywhere, every turn?

Ferrums used to be absolutely broken as shit

It's only 3 rules, 2 of which don't effect the same targets. It's not much different to some weapons with alternate fire modes.

They're still a pretty significant force multiplier, and they still invalidate all other scouts. I'd rate them as an autoinclude for any tourney list even after the nerfs, no matter what the rest of the force is composed of.

It costs 273 points for a small E13 template. And it will be three turns before a drone really has a good targeting solution for anything out of view of standard scouts. Even more if you are smart with how you position stuff.

Its only great because it takes a unit you would already take and makes it useful (the kodiak).

There is a reason people still take Phoenix.

Its pretty good unit, but for the price you pay you are mostly getting a unit that acts as a scout and deterrent now. The weapon nerfs means light AA will reduce the damage enough that there won't be enough E to damage your target unless you are shooting something extremely weak

Most games you opponent will have to fire at them to ensure they don't do damage. So the result is that they eat up AA shots and force positioning of units unless your opponent wants to start losing units. They only run amok now if the AA bubble gets weakened enough or if you opponent is careless and leaves a light dropship or something in range.

Range extension, though.

Is Overseer/Annihilator significantly better than just Annihilator?

Bump

Don't mind me, thread.

I don't think you bring an overseer just to walk with an annihilator, but it certainly helps. Getting to doubletap your goddamn pie plate is a big deal.

Is double overseer still a valid thing for the Scourge, or was it nerfed enough?

Explain

The overseer used to have amazingly good AA I forget what it was nerfed to), and one meta was to take two overseers; one to head up with a tank line, the other to hand back and either defend the back line from air, or to buff up an annihilator.

I wonder if we'll ever get something else to stick in the minivan.

...

So when do the new sectors pieces and the other characters drop?

>hate painting white enough to finally do something about it
>watching my color washes just disappear against a black prime/basecoat

There's just no winning

The AA dropped 2 shots and it got 15 points more expensive. It's still top dog though and taking 2 is a valid tactic, all the nerf did was stop it from being completely broken.

What are you doing about painting white? And why are you starting from Black if you're going for white?!

Not painting white at all, done with white forever, completely changed color schemes to avoid it.

Do you think the PHR would use boatslut-esque projections as the avatars for shipboard AI

Do the ships even have a singular AI? I know the Scourge ship's have a gestalt "soul", but I was under the impression that PHR ships are commanded by a communal group of officers in cyberspace.

I don't doubt for a second that they would. I just hope gacha is illegal in the Post-Human Republic.

Probably. That seems like just the sort of degenerate shit they'd do.

Those animals probably wouldn't even incorporate design elements of the ship into the clothing of the girl. Truly the worst.

I'd guess that each officer would have a role-specific AI assigned to their "station" on the network.

If any single AI were to be pinned as the personifying avatar for the ship, it would probably be the one in charge of reporting shipwide status and damage reports.

So is the Scimitar uselss? Looks cool; big ol' tank with a fuck-off laser, but overall it seems a wee underwhelming now that we have 3 books for DZC.

>shipgirls
Reminder that the PHR officer corps is skewed in favor of females due to their ability to better integrate cybernetic enhancements. ShipBOYS up in this Republic

It can move and shoot these days, so that's something.

GAY

Also, it's not that females are better at cybernetic enhancements, it's just that they're better at controlling larger numbers of familiars and drones.

Meh, it's okay for locking down a lane. Nobody enjoys being shot by 2 E11 guns and the autocrit on 6 is nice.

I've been using tomahawks, but they're absolute shit. They're just so fragile, tarantulas hardly seem any better

Do what the UCM does and just take your one minimum squad.

Tomahawks aren't great. They do fuckall in small numbers and take points needed elsewhere if deployed in large numbers. As for toughness, Standard units aren't really meant to be tough. A7 sucks shit but the skimmer bonus and passive save help offset it.

Tarantulas are a lot better. Grav-cannons can really ruin a heavy unit's day. They're still going to die if someone is determined to kill them, but that's why they're cheaper than the heavy stuff.

desu I find even Sabres far more useful than Tomahawks. A10 forces the enemy to waste proper AT on their removal since most of the time some E9 shit isn't going to cut it, and they can competently hold a focal point or crit location in an army that relies far too much on non-scoring aircraft. Tomahawks are just somewhere an opponent can shovel their garbage weapons to get results, and Shaltari has far more effective options for holding ground.

Totes. I'm hoping for a Carniveafultralisk thingy that charges across the field and eats some tanks while shaking off massed railgun fire like so many annoying mosquitoes.

It's not useless, but it definitely has a lot of competition... most obviously the crossbow which does almost the exact same thing for half the price.

>They do fuckall in small numbers and take points needed elsewhere if deployed in large numbers.
This sums it up. If you're going to take them, take 6 and use them to flank something vulnerable. The one thing they have over any other standard choice is threat range. Tomahawks are not really MBT's... as you observed they don't do a good job trading fire with other things in their weight class.

Think of them more like a ground based hunter-killer unit. Shoot them up one side of the table early, or 'port them into the backfield, and use them to hunt transports, artillery, and other lighter vehicles. E10 vs A10 isn't very impressive, but against A7 or A8 it does plenty.

Tbf ive used them to decent effect with their movement speed as suicide units to try and kill Kodiaks and Ferrums

Can anyone advise on the different DZC factions and rank them, based on your experiences?

> Most common / largest playerbase
> Most powerful
> Most difficult to play
> Most fun to play

As a newbie looking in, curious how the factions rank up.

I haven't been able to play much, but from what I have played shaltari are some of the hardest to play.

Very basic:
- UCM: Pleb shooty, all rounder marios.
- PHR: Elite shooty, tough but slow.
- Scourge: Fast, short range, fragile and aggressvie
- Shaltari: Fast, tricky hit-and-run all rounders
- Resistance: Cheap fast horde + tough, slow elites

> UCM: Imperial Guard
> PHR: Space Marines
> Scourge: Tyranids
> Shaltari: Eldar
> Resistance: Orks

Most common is probably UCM
Most powerful is currently maybe shaltari
Most difficult to play, resistance?
Most fun is difficult to say, as all armies have a few playstyles, it's not as if there's just a single viable list

>Most common / largest playerbase
PHR, or possibly UCM simply because the latter is in the 2 player starter.

>Most powerful
Probably Shaltari. It can be hard to tell.

>Most difficult to play
Not sure. I've seen some people have a lot of trouble with Shaltari gimmicks while others struggle with how slow UCM can be. Scourge is another candidate with their glass cannon nature.

>Most fun to play
I'd say Scourge, but that is entirely down to you and how you like to play.

pump

Pretty much this, but I'd also add in some Tau to the Shaltari.

The analogy doesn't really fit.

UCM: Are more like Halo's USNC. An upgraded modern military with lots of neat gadgets. They rely a lot more on gunships and air units that numbers and heavy tanks.

PHR: This one fits more like the Tau or Skitarii. They have a lot of high tech stuff with a mix of heavier units and highly mobile ones. Lots of firepower.

Scourge: Is hardly aren't really nid like.

Shaltari: probably the closest one

Resistance: These guys are IG. Lots of light units and infantry supported by super heavy tanks and large durable gunships. The only think orky about them are the buses and technicals. That hardly scratches the surface of the faction.

I wanna ask about something that apparently no body in my gaming group has ever really thought about in wargames. What are your thoughts on conceding?

When is or isn't an appropriate time?

At times it can be super obvious you don't have a snowball's chance in hell of getting anything done, and continuing to game would only be for the 'benefit' of the other player, who also may not find it fun due to a already won fight dragging out.

How far gone would your army/board state have to be for you to concede? Would you hold it against someone if they concede before you would like them to?

If it's pretty well a done deal(i.e. there's zero chance of you making a comeback) tben I see no harm in it. A game isn't fun if it's entirely one sided, and when the outcomr is clear then why drag it out?

It's not okay, however, to throw in the towel because your super unit you were banking on gets ganked. I've seen people who throw it in because their ultimate plan geta foiled and they can't even fathom changing their strategy.

I typically concede once it seems almost impossible, even if units perform flawlessly, to win. This comes more from armada then my time playing DZC, but its not fun to try and play to win and then realize you can not in any way win. That said you can still play some more with your opponent, with an understanding that the game might be finished but things could still happen. I usually like to try and assassinate the commander after this concession, for instance, just to get a laugh out of myself and feel better.

It would need to be near the final turns of the game to offer that concession, and to have been pushed so far behind in terms of the game's objectives that there is no way of winning. Usually for DZC and DFC this means a loss of all objective units and an inability to secure objective locations. At that point I'll make it clear we can keep playing with my opponent aware they've won and now in charge of deciding how well they've won, with my new objectives being clear. (eliminating a commander, eliminating a powerful unit that should be difficult to kill, or preserving as many of my own units as possible.)

I don't concede myself because it never really occurs to me, but if I'm completely dominating an opponent and they have no chance of winning then I see no problem with them giving up.

>I've seen people who throw it in because their ultimate plan geta foiled and they can't even fathom changing their strategy.
Mostly I see people do that when they're coming in from other games that are based more on combos than in-game tactical decisions, such as 40k. I guess some people can't shake the mindset.

Does anyone here build their own DZC terrain? I've been itching to scratch build something for a while, but I can't decide what material would be best for a block's worth of 10mm buildings. Balsa and paper are fragile, but pressed fiberboard seems like a pain in the ass to cut without shop tools.

Anyone have some good suggestions?