/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

So how would a mage from Ascension combat vampires and werewolves when it's either too hard or too easy to even use magic(k) ???

Vanilla (1 pt. Flaw)
Oh my gods, you’re such an innocent! In a world filled with sex magick and power plays, you’re the little lamb who’s strayed far away from home. Jokes get past you, clues escape you, and references to anything rawer than a Disney flick go straight over your head. Maybe you grew up in a secluded place with overprotective parents; or you could be in denial about the things you see all around you because life can’t possibly be that twisted… can it? Regardless, hold firm to your innocence. Once it’s gone, it ain’t never coming back again!

This is a Flaw in m20 Book of Secrets. What a great use of word count qq.

Yes, tell me how it went?

A prepared Mage is the most terrifying thing in cWoD.

Rituals let you roll your Arete up to Willpower+Arete times to accumulate successes.

If you are out to kill a leech, having access to any of its possessions would let you cast any spell with +3 succs to it with Correspondence 2+. This means that you can just sit in your sanctum, perform a ritual over an evening and whack it with 21 levels of aggravated fire damage. Nothing they can do, unless they have Thaumaturgy to counterspell.

In hand-to-hand combat Mind 2 lets you force a frenzy check, Forces 2 can let you fly, turn invisible or increase the difficulty of all attacks against you by 3, Time 3 can give you mega-celerity way beyond anything a Vampire/Garou could ever imagine contesting. So on and so on.

M20 Book of Secrets want.

>de-watermark
How many times does it have to be established that OPP doesn't watermark shit?

Or has that changed since I last bothered worrying about PDFs in these threads

Because OPP would have to pay a guy to watermark stuff and you know they don't do that shit.

Smart mages will utilize existing things, as well. Teleporting a pipe bomb to a vampire's coffin is a pretty easy Correspondence 2/Matter 2 effect.

With a couple dots of Entropy and only a few successes, a mage could redirect a speeding car from the street to the sidewalk where his enemy is taking a stroll.

Spirit 2 lets a mage bump the local Gauntlet rating easily, which stops Garou from jumping in and out. Fire elementals can also be conjured into creation with Spirit 2, and those deal 10 dice of automatic, undodgeable aggravated damage to targets.

Correct. There are no watermarks.

>This is a Flaw in m20 Book of Secrets. What a great use of word count qq.

Any new ttprg culinary advice from SatyrDouche?

Yeah, but how do mages fight 1v1 eh? They can't really. Fireballs take too long.

1. As was covered extensively in the last thread, it only takes a single turn to cast a decently powerful fireball.

2. You can also hold spells for later using Charms or Wonders, among other things.

3. Mages can also buff themselves into the ceiling. The idea that Mages are squishy is a myth, with a few simple Life 2 or Prime 2 effects you can make yourself stronger, faster, and more durable then any vampire. And that's assuming they're not wearing power armor or something equally stupid to make them durable on demand.

How about playing in a literal World of Darkness?

Mother.
Fucking.
Certámen.

Okay but how do two Mages fight each other? Does it just turn into "whose everything-proof shield wears off first?" Or is it rocket-tag, where the first one to score a solid hit might as well win by default?

youtube.com/watch?v=S_JUlXh7sP8 ?

Well, the new FAQ actually clarified the fireball question to be a lot weaker.

Q: Can I “Hold” the Aimed Damage Effect Indefinitely so That I Can Accumulate a Lot of Successes before the Effect Goes Off?

A: No. An immediate-attack Effect that’s coupled with a mundane attack is an all-or-nothing affair – one roll only . If Agent Adara Okafor adds a Forces boost to a blast from her Bolan Mk. 13 weapons system, the player makes only one Arete roll to determine the Effect. The Storyteller may rule that a damage-inflicting ritual (as in, an attack using the extended-roll rules described in Mage 20 , pp. 538-543 ) may accumulate successes for a greater level of damage. Story-wise, this would represent a curse, a death-spell, a war-machine’s activation, and so forth. In that case, the usual rules apply… though the Storyteller may wish to set an upper limit of one Arete roll for each point of Stamina the mage possesses, in order to reflect the strain of containing such potent energies, and to cap off a potentially nuke-level degree of damage.

It's a mix of the two if they have preptime. It's hurling effects back and forth until you find one they didn't factor in and they explode. Or the Universe / Abyss gets tired of your shit.
If it's 2 Mages that didn't expect the fight to happen, it's retreat if possible and minor effects (removing friction on the ground under them, jamming their gun, shit like that) + normie fighting methods if they can't run.

Pretty much.
Which is why in Awakening 2e the Duel Arcane is essentially play-fighting with imagos, showing how hard you could have kicked their ass, with multiple shots required, given the fact that frequently any one could have been lethal, and they want to see who's actually the best, rather then the luckiest.

we decided to abandon the subject and I have not touched that book since that day

In Mage the Ascension, everything-proof shields aren't that common and buffs tend to last for a scene or a day or longer, meaning they don't really wear down.

In my experience, most fights tend to revolve around a few concepts.

1. Is there Sleepers around?
2. Does anyone have tons of ranks in Coorespondance?

If someone has ranks in Coorespondance, then usually there isn't even a fight. The second the person with Correspondence realizes there is a threat, he can start setting up preparations to teleport you to the bottom of the ocean or something and you effectively lose right there.

If no one has Coorespondance, generally the winner is either the person with the more preparations [active buffs, Wonders, etc] or the person whose stronger, and it turns into a slogfest or rocket-tag, depending on how defensive the characters are.

Two Hermetics fighting each other in a crowded subway is going to look a lot different then two Akashics fighting at night on a rooftop.

He was talking about Ascension.

Reminder that it's always the husband or boyfriend.

Awakening mages are OP as fuck.

I wasn't specifically talking about Ascension, I'm interested in both.
Thank you very much. That actually does sound quite interesting. I am beginning to better understand what makes Mage fun, when you're facing off against foes with equivalent powerlevels.

The main difference is in Awakening there are far more everything-proof shields, so you have to find his weak-point instead of overpowering his defenses. That and sympathetic casting is easier to pull off.

In practice, Awakening turns into a game of paranoid gods trying to get the other first, preferably from across town, whereas Ascension is more throwing crazy bullshit at each other and hoping your bullshit is crazier.

For instance summoning a bunch of demons and sending them at an opposing Mage but he figured out early and channelled tons of Chi so he could beat up all the demons so you have to plan something else so you teleport him into a volcano but luckily he has the right Spheres to just tank the fire and punch his way out so you cast him into the future where your evil is law.

Am I the only one who disallows held spells and charms in my Ascension games?

Eventually your players are going to curbstomp most everything.
Wizards utilizing contingencies is always a 'no-no' in my sessions.

I allow held spells but I say they still obey the rule about "Only one Effect per turn" and I follow the rule that limits successes from a Ritual to Arete+Willpower maximum.

In practice, it means the only PC who even can store spells primarily uses it to make Escape Ropes to teleport the whole party back to their Node if shit gets too crazy. Annoying, but not gamebreaking.

He could also create ultra-damage effects but he hasn't taken the initiative to do so yet, since he keeps rolling botches on the extended cast and he's afraid of getting any more Paradox.

Holding spells and using Wonders (in this case Charms) aren't the only contingencies available to a competent Mage.

Just imagine an old Hermetic having a score of fire based spirits surrounding his person at all times. No Vampire or Werewolf worth their salt is going to challenge him.

Three (sometimes four) Spheres are capable of "holding" spells/effects. You're kind of being a bitch if you disallow this pivotal part of prep.

Charms are overpowered though.

Forge Masters

Honestly unprepared fighting sounds much more fun to actually play. What m I not getting?

Just hope the shenanigans from my last Ascension game doesn't happen. TLDR my Etherite was a bad influence on the Technocratic defector, we built a dart gun that shot teleporter beacons. Said beacons were keyed to the massive teleporter back at the base and would move the beacon (and whatever poor bastard was stuck with it) 1,500 miles straight up.
It made our GM angry.

Oh it is. But playing magic death chess with another Mage is fun at times too.

Nothing, unprepared fighting is fun.
However not every fight you get in will be "balanced", so sometimes you really do just need an ace up your sleeve.

Ok what are Charms?

Why are they overpowered?

Signs and Sorcery already has a mistake.

Dont have spells that increase its own Withstand rating.

That's nothing. In my campaign I'm running right now the PCs teleported into the house of a powerful Brujah during the day, paralyzed his 400 lb Mexican ass with an ofuda [Mind] and then when he tried to flee had a high speed chase down the street in broad fucking daylight while everyone's speed was buffed by time.

So you have a Japanese shrine maiden in Sohei armor, a guy who kind of looks like Thor in a cowboy hat, and a horrible deformed fish-man chasing a morbidly obese man down the road at 40+ miles per hour. The chase ended with the cowboy slowing him down with a Jojo pose that turned part of the street into soap, making him slip up and move slower, before ultimately burning up in the sun despite his Fortitude.
Instead of rolling an Effect on the spot, you roll it ahead of time. It replaces all that stuff about the danger of the evil dice with narrative cards that say "He is thrown into orbit now" that you can set down on a whim.

Are there alternate temenos? Like can I travel to the collective soul of dogs, pigs, or cows?

animals dont have souls so no

Some concept art for the WtA game in E3
rpgamer.com/news/Q2-2017/061417b.html

How long until is finally canceled, /wodg/?

>see all this mage talk
>my only character is a hunter and he gets his shit kicked in constantly
>was going to make a shitpost about how celerity was cancer to fight due to instant disarm, and how much I hated grapple plus bite in the same turn just because the baby shit his pants and frenzied
>mfw mage players are literally talking about teleporting their opponents into the ocean without a hint of irony or humor, but rather just a thing that's a decent one on one strat
>close thread

I think even the anti magic benediction wouldn't do shit for me. -2 to their rolls versus them throwing me into the fucking sun. I don't really get why the splats aren't a bit more balanced around one-another

Charms are hung/held spells compacted into physical form. Incredibly easy to make and produced in batches.

You could have a bag holding dozens of 'fireball marbles' and 'lawnchair pebbles' ready to bombard your enemies with.

I question why every mage doesn't get Prime 2 and just make them every fucking day.

Because crossovers are a mistake. At the highest levels of Mage [either edition] you can create things that would give Gurren Lagann a run for its money.

Even at mid-levels creating a 50 foot magic robot powered by willpower is a completely legitimate [if borderline-suicidal] strategy.

>Fighting any supernatural in a 1v1
>Ever trying to play fair as a Hunter
>Ever trying to fight with any honor outside of playing a fuccboi Werewolf

This guy gets it. Just get your hands on a nuke and pray he's too distracted by a dispute with another mage to care about what your measly mortal ass does.

Is this oWoD?

It's not even a nuke, if it can kill an armored vehicle it can kill a Mage that doesn't know it's coming, shielding practice / mage armor up or not.
Just shoot the fucker with a .50 from across town, hit them with an IED, slip a dolls eye berry extract into their wizard tea.
Don't walk up to a Mage with a 9mm and a sword and go "I challengith ye to a duel good sir." and not expect bad things to happen.
That applies to all Supernaturals really.

never allow charms in your games

didnt we establish forces 2 makes you immune to all kinetic energy even from a 50 cal?

poison is pretty good though, without life magic said mage is fucked.

Hunters exist to be anally ruined by other splats. This is both Supernal Truth and Consensus Reality - and also thematically appropriate.

Poison that has no symptoms aside from feeling tired and then stopping your heart could catch even a Life Mage off guard.

>Never allow archmages in your games

fixed

Carnival Melancholy, please

People also like to forget the most powerful archmage in canon only had Ent 7 as his best sphere.

Primal Marks (3 pt. Flaw)
You’ve been marked by some god, spirit, myth, or other metaphysical entity… and the mark is not a pleasant one. Maybe you share Papa Ghede’s nasal voice and crude sense of humor, or Coyote’s grotesquely huge cock, or Christ’s bleeding stigmata.
>Coyote’s grotesquely huge cock
>3 pt flaw

Ironic since the book literally says you can do that since if you fail, you can reroll at +1 difficulty.

dude, if your wangus beef terrifies all women who look upon it that are smaller than 6'5'', it *is* a flaw

Where the fuck does OPP post those FAQs?

Is this bait?

Where the fuck does OPP post those FAQs?

...

The unnamed is an Oracle.

It's from the new Book of Secrets. Friend who has the book copypasted it to me. Asked for a copy, he told me off.

The Unnamed is a guy that might exist in a spinoff timeline maybe. He's borderline fanfiction.

Aswadim are nephandi archmages.

>He's borderline fanfiction

Except he's just not. End Times scenarios are all canon if you so wish.

Future Fates is a thing as of M20.

>Not kicking his ass with a fuckton of marauders in that scenario

pleb

Oracles ARE Archmages.

They're the Archmages that glimpsed a taste of Ascension and turned back.

lol dude ask your friend to copypaste it all page by page that's what froends do

Focus is pretty good at seeing things through. It'll make it to completion.

Does anyone have "Infernalism: The Path of Screams" pdf handy?

OPP is kill.

>if you so wish
Okay. I don't wish. My opinion is as valid as yours in this context, therefore he is just fanfiction.

Probably. The Astral Realms sourcebook implies at one point that Werewolves may have their own temenos. I'm sure you can work something out with your ST. Also the Primordial Dream from Beast is a thing.
>animals dont have souls so no
The earth does not have a soul, but the Anima Mundi is a thing.

tenemos != Anima mundi.

Why do you think only a very few select splats get to go there?

There will be catland, pigland n all that shit in the temenos but it'll be the collective imagery of humans that make up the place, not animals.

Why does the sample NPC private eye have a whopping 4 intelligence? Academics have next to nothing to do with PI work.

Perhaps it's for a more Sherlock Holmes type detective instead of Columbo?

This is why Acanthus are the undisputed top dogs and every other path is simply fighting for second place.

Academics is a skill. Being a PI requires intelligence.

I don't think so. The doubles as part seems to indicate otherwise.

Why would a PI need intelligence?

THERE ARE NO WATERMARKS

UPLOAD BOOK OF SECRETS YOU PRICKS

Id like to kindly ask for Beast the primordial building a legend in addition to that

Calm down

So has anyone here read the nWoD / CofD fiction, and if so is it shit? Tempted to give the Mage / Demon short stories a go but if they're M20 / Mobile game tier I think I'll pass.

The Demon: the Descent anthology is good, and the one new fiction in the Werewolf anthology was pretty fun, though I wouldn't call anything in that book good.

Nothing is as bad as the mobile game.

Thanks user, I'll give it a look.

Because mages in Wod for some reason arent traditional mages at all, despite werewolves being werewolves and vampires being vampires. Their more akin to a Gmod admin than they are to a chanting spell casting mage whom are working out of old tombs and ritual. Instead they poof things into or out of existence as needed.

Seriously why did whitewolf decide that mages are going to be so different from what basically every other form of media views mages

They really are stereotypical sorcerers, sorry.

It just really depends on their Paradigm.