How did we go this

How did we go this...

To....this?

codification of a power curve which Bolt was way, way above, along with an encouraged emphasis on creatures and, by extension, a weakening of spells.

I'm really not clear on the point of this bait. Should someone be angry that newer direct damage is weaker than what is pretty inarguably one of the top 5 efficiency cards ever printed, and the only one to make it out of Unlimited?

The moxen and black lotus need to get reprints.

>inarguably one of the top 5 efficiency cards
Well first let's bring up the power nine, followed by much better removal like Swords and Push.

Fatal Push is better removal than lightning bolt, and the format is better because of it. The majority of creatures played in standard have ETB effects, or recursion, or on-death effects, or efficient stat-lines, or any number of things that make them perfectly fine in a format with one-mana removal.

old magic cards are stupid overpowered... magma spray is still better imo

giant growth was in Return to Ravnica

better than open fire that is

I remember my friend's big brother's deck being something like tons of mountains and 4 each of lightning bolt, disintegrate, fireball, ball lightning, and another direct damage spell.

I think the idea was that every color had a "broken" 1 mana for 3 somethings card so it balanced out. Black had dark ritual and so on.

Fatal push can't kill players.

Killing players isn't removal. Although, on that note, there is nothing wrong with pic related

It could be worse...

The point is that Bolt's versatility gives it some advantage over Push.

>I think the idea was that every color had a "broken" 1 mana for 3 somethings card
yeah Healing Salve is so broken

>make bolt way better then most creatures
>nerf a bolt to 2 mana and make creatures better
>2 bolt sees a fair amount of play
>nerf 2 bolt anyway
>frontload creatures so much that they vomit value the second they hit the field and give them amazing stats too
>nope 2 bolt still too good

Fuck you

You're right, but that isn't the reason they use for why bolt will never ever see a reprint. No, bolt can never see the light of day again because it's "format warping," and is "too powerful as one-mana removal."

Burn/aggro is an underpowered archetype that deserves to have it's place in the sun. The claim that bolt is 'too powerful' is nothing more than a way to hurt this archetype, even though they keep printing powerful one-mana removal - one mana removal, I might add, that only makes the format healthier instead of more degenerate.

I remember reading an old expression of the rules in the long-defunct magazine The Duelist that mentioned the original thinking behind Lightning Bolt. I believe it was rulesmaster Tom Wylie who explained it. Originally they thought these five cards were ideally balanced to one another: Healing Salve, Lightning Bolt, Dark Ritual, Giant Growth, and Unstable Mutation. (The original idea was that you would use Dark Ritual to pump Pestilence 3 times.) Because they saw the game as a casual game rather than in a professional competitive environment, they completely overlooked the fact that 3 of those 5 cards required a second card to work as advertised. The damage prevention phase hadn't even been created yet, and banding was still not properly understood in its offensive and defensive senses. So Healing Salve was only really good if you had out another creature with 3 or more health, which White did not have, apart from Serra Angel and walls.

After Arabian Nights came out, a friend of mine won a tourney using an all black/artifact deck with Dark Ritual/ Juzam Djinn, and won the time magics and a bunch of other loot. That's when they realized they would eventually have to kill Dark Ritual like they had killed the Black Lotus. Lightning Bolt hung on a little longer because Blue was extremely formidable at that time and they wanted to balance to that.

>Unstable Mutation
It was actually Ancestral Recall as the blue card of the Boon cycle. Once they realized how completely wrong they were, they "changed" it to Brainstorm, which was still wrong but less so.

You missed a step.

This and Searing Spear were perfectly balanced.

The game was better when you had lightning bolts for 1 and counterspells for 2

That at least draws a card. It's playable in limited.

>fw came back to MTG during the alara/zen standard and everything since felt like total scrubcore in comparison

What is your Spark Elemental going to do against turn 1 Tundra Wolves?

Direct Damage is no longer a supported style.
Hasn't been for years.
It's all about your summons, and things that modify them.
The game has moved more towards other CCG styles which focus on creatures exclusively.

Why are people getting angry over this card like it is the new baseline for direct damage spells? It's not like they've printed this card for five sets in a row or something.

Open Fire is playable in limited just fine.

This, not to mention its easier to balance a creature than a spell. We still get cool spells, look at Cruel Ultimatum, Approach of the Second Sun, etc... but efficiency like Lightning Bolt probably isn't going to happen anytime soon.

Tempted to run this in Mizzix edh

because no matter what color you play, you will bitch when you get even the slightest nerf that makes it imposible to do your turn one win

Cruel Ultimatum is still about creature management.

Approach of the Second Sun is just... Well... It's funny to see a delayed blast win button especially with the current deck management options.

This wouldn't be so bad if direct damage wasn't literally Red's only way of dealing with planeswalkers.

I guess it's not that much of a problem in most formats, but it still triggers my sense of fair play.

I pulled this in a chaos sealed, it wasn't even close to playable.

>This wouldn't be so bad if direct damage wasn't literally Red's only way of dealing with planeswalkers.

Creatures with Haste, turning sideways. ;)

Yes, planeswalkers have zero ways to defend themselves built in and the entire game is incapable of interacting with creatures, the most common card type behind basic lands.
I know you're just messing around but you're still getting to me because this is what people actually say to me.

would brainstorm still be playable as a sorcery? I just want a way to get the bad stuff out of my hand, which i think is something modern and standard really need

playable? probably not, Ponder fills that Niche already
If Wizards was able to retcon Brainstorm to a sorcery they probably would though

Now we just have to wait for a R 1/1 creature with lightning bolt comes into play effect for that full circle.

Bolt makes them have to design everytning around the bolt test while also someone finding out a way to balabce a metagame witg an insane tempo kill spell thats super cheap and can wipe out 60% of your life for 4 mana.

That you for pointing out the inherent flaw with the mtg combat system.

The whole threat/answer matrix wouldnt be needed if creatures could deal eith creatures inherently. All you can do is offer trades really.

It means if you are screwed on board, you have to draw an out card, you cant really stitch togetger the resources you already have on the field to get out of tough moves.

There needs to be an Ambush keyword for creatures or whatever, that lets the creature attack a chosen creature directly instead of a player.

Because red is it's red headed step child.

When red does get something nice, is a creature, because is been decided that burn is "unfun"

Eh, I don't really think that's the answer. There's enough games out there that are Hearthstone style and the idea of just smashing creatures into creatures over and over seems incredibly boring to me. Probably why I've got like three hours total into a well-made f2p game and hundreds into various forms of subpar digital Magic.

Here's a list of passable burn spells in Standard right now

>Burn from Within
>Chandra, Torch of Defiance
>Dynavolt Tower
>Fiery Temper
>Incendiary Flow
>Shock

Here's some red creatures creatures with Prowess too if you feel the need for some blockers

>Nimble-Blade Khenra
>Soul-Scar Mage
>Stormchaser Mage

And a few spell-focused cards in Izzet colors to help fill the boat

>Enigma Drake
>Mercurial Geists

The question is, is it possible to make a workable burn deck in the current Standard environment? Keep in mind Burn from Within, Fiery Temper, Incendiary Flow, Stormchaser Mage and Mercurial Geists rotate out with Ixalan

yea it makes the deck build more about trade

Yeah, I agree.

I play MTG specifically for weird-ass combo moves. Like Mycosynth Lattice turning everything into artifacts, and then playing Mirrorworks to make duplications of artifacts I play. Obelisk of return to bounce lands into my hand, play them back over again to dupe my lands, etc. It's the weird quirky stuff I like, not just smashing creatures into creatures repeatedly.

>every piece of red Limited burn/removal must be as good as Lightning Bolt

>>>>>>>>burn from within
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>mercurial geists
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>nimble blade khenra

I think it's a punishment for your terrible grammar.

Burn is shit tbqh, good riddance. 12 damage to face for 4 mana is ludicrous.

Yes that's why burn dominates legacy.

Get gud scrub.

>Yes that's why burn dominates legacy.

So play legacy.

Of course it would be. I'd say almost 75% of the time you cast Brainstorm as an instant anyway. Sure it would hurt the card, but honestly it would just make people play the card better. I love when people go end of turn Brainstorm with no fetches in play.

He was being ironic and you're missing the point. Weird how it's the most unintelligent players that are always crying about burn, you'd think they'd flock to the cheap and efficient strategy.

You can't make a card that's more efficient than Bolt. It kills design space and warps the format around it. This is why every creature is Modern is either really good or passes the Bolt test.
Besides, this is draft chaff. Can you imagine having Bolts in Amonkhet draft? I don't think there's enough support for 8 R/W Exerts on the table.

It's so the uncommon Abrade isn't strictly worse in limited.
They could've added a rider of some sort, but nope, just overcosted piece of shit

There's also the fact that Black SHOULD be the best at creature removal.

I think you forgot this.

Which is pretty funny because, if we add an "S" to "lash", we get a very decent red removal.

MEANWHILE

FUCK

...

That is even worse than . And I always considered it a trash card, lol.

It's only effective removal in limited. If you're drafting to win, it's a pretty good pick for removal suprisingly.

Limited fucking ruins everything.

I've done my part, explained to a couple of kids why this thing is shit yesterday :P

>why is a Modern / Legacy staple no longer printed in Standard
Hmmmmmmm.....

Shouldn't "Bolas' Defeat" be G/W?

>Jace's defeat is U
>Nissa's defeat is G
>Gideon's defeat is W
>Liliana's defeat is B
>Chandra's defeat is R
>Shouldn't "Bolas' Defeat" be G/W?
How dense are you

Really though, it should be 'multicolored' instead of listing all three of his colors individually.

How dare people play the game in a way I don't like

well it impacts the standard format as well as prohibiting beneficial reprints

>finding out a way to balabce a metagame witg an insane tempo kill spell thats super cheap
We already live in a world with Fatal Push. It's not that hard

>and can wipe out 60% of your life for 4 mana
And 4 cards and a hell of a lot of luck.

Also dark ritual dor T1 lurking evil

They are the best at creature removal, because they're the only colour with sure, 100% guaranteed creature removal.
Blue is the best at countering spells, but that doesn't mean that cards like Guttural Response or Dash Hopes shouldn't exist.

>There is people that actually like a format without bolt, counterspell and dark ritual

It's called fight
Unless you mean that they still can be blocked

It was called Provoke. But they prefer to use fight effects as a one-time thing.

Burn's fun though, even if it's fucking brainless, you'll never hear me defend it as a cerebral deck.

It would be cool to have a creature with a fight ability like that.

"At the start of your combat phase, ~ fights target creature an opponent controls. Cannot attack or block an opponent that controls one or more creatures.

When a creature that ~ dealt damage to dies, attack any equipment or auras that were on that creature to ~."

Eh, it's a decent common removal spell for limited with the intention of going against power creep; makes me long for pic related in that it can at least help deal with X/+4's.

a u/r burn deck already exists, it's fevered visions/ thing in the ice

Get out of here with your Hearthtrash inspired ideas.

The people who bitch about burn are the same people who bitch about counters and discard and everything else mildly inconveniencing. These playstyles being in the game and forcing players to confront them winds up making better players.

...

>paying 6 mana to draw a card
Red mages, everyone.

>Mercurial Geists
>Stormchaser mage
>le 1/3 Prowess
>le blaze
This... is the power... of red.

>paying 3 mana to deal 3 damage
Modern Red everyone

>goatballs
kek

what is time passing?

Red needs better cards. There's an argument for having a red centric set.
It's the color with the least abilities and least play styles,

I think the playable dragons they printed and that angel with haste is a good start but the drawbacks are too great.

They can never print a "all good" red card without nerfing it with a terrible drawback while they print all good blue and white and green cards, even black gets stuff that doesn't hurt you as bad as red.

Red can't go all smash, destroy, damage crazy without paying a huge prize.

Blue can go all intellectual, read draw and stall, for no real loss of tempo.

>that angel with haste
You mean Goldnight Castigator? Really interesting design that could have been a great card but they were too safe with it. Being a 4 power hasty flyer for 4 isn't enough upside to balance the downside of doubling all the damage you take. It should have had 5 or even 6 power.

Prove that red is a shit color for shit people according to wot

I agree they could have even been more aggressive with the cost. If the problem was the stats. At mythic 5/x flying for 4 is not too pushed. But Gods forbid red gets a "chase" card that's worth anything.

Flame Smash, Flame Gash, Lame Sash.

Red is pretty fine in Standard.
It's playable as MonoColor deck, has many useful kill spells, it's present in most Tier decks: RG Energy, Mardu, UR Tempo. ,
With Dynavolt Tower you don't even need to turn creatures sideways to win.
Everyother format has Bolt and it centralizes the shit out of everything.
We want Standard so we can play something different.

I really don't get why Stormchaser mage isn't played more. I mean, sure, it has 1 power for a card that needs to be as aggressive as possible but its got an incredible combination of abilities.

>Flying
>Prowess
>Fucking HASTE

With a bulky body and just 2 cmc I just can't see what's wrong with the card, specially in formats with 0 cost or cheatable spells that can have it attack hard right away.

Agreed.

Stormchaser mage is a great card but he needs the right types of support spells to really make him shine.

Thermo thing was a good standard deck not too long ago and included him.

Why use this card when Lightening Bolt is literally the same thing with lesser cost?