Burger expat living in The Netherlands here, just found out I'll have to pay a fuckload of money (5 figures) to the Dutch tax authorities because apparently there's a wealth tax imposed on crypto whether you trade or not
Is there anything I can do aside from getting up and leave? Any chance that the tax authority will introduce some sort of a tax amnesty for crypto given that bitcoin has rallied hard over the past 12 months?
I'm guessing this is a problem for all of your Dutchfags because you're taxed based on your net worth effective January 1st. What were you planning to do in light of this predicament?
Also is the Dutch tax authority a ferocious relentless blood sucker like the IRS?
Jace Lopez
Bump, want to hear about the subject too.
Daniel Taylor
Tot 25k betaal je niks, na 25k valt het in box 3 en moet je 1,67% erover betalen. < ik weet niks van belastingshit, maar dit is wat ik vernomen heb.
Blake Lewis
Dude it's less than 2%. Also, if you have the 30% ruling you don't have to pay it.
Easton Baker
In english pannekoek.
Alexander Taylor
1,67% from your net worth when you're over 25k? God damn I'll be back soon
Robert Fisher
I don't, but regardless I don't think that's what the 30% ruling implies. It implies that you have to subtract 30% from your total tax liability, not that the 30% ruling cancels out the 30% tax imposed on the Box 3 yield
Christopher Cooper
Its tax free up to 25000 everything after that is taxed at %1,67
Robert Sanders
Worse no this >kanker
Tyler Rivera
maybe if you didnt trade fr a year but if you increase your money in crypto you need to pay income tax.
Connor Murphy
>if you increase your money in crypto you need to pay income tax
bullshit...source on this?
David Walker
you made money trading instead of holding. so the goverment will tax it as income. just like if you had another sidejob for a few hours a week
Brody Russell
If you had no coins on 1st of January 2017, you pay nothing in 2018. 1st of January is measurement date.
Tyler Robinson
I think that's only if it is your main source of income like day trading. Not sure though.
Dylan Hughes
Bullshit. It is unrealized profit. Maybe if you live off the returns, otherwise it is box 3. Trading or changing positions doesn't make it your full time job.
Matthew Harris
You can't just make your coins disappear. Even if you claim you lost your wallet or gave it to someone you won't ever be able to use them again without risking tax evasion charges. What's the point?
Jacob Cook
say you bought a shitcoin and it mooned 100x
Alexander James
Nee. Box 3 kudt
Ian Price
moet ik nu volgend jaar aangifte doen over 2017 (en dus de waarde bepalen van 1-1-2017) of over 2018?
Jeremiah Allen
Not sure of your laws but let's say you bought Monero and then bad things happened...
Luke Moore
Just pay your taxes. It's less than 2% ffs, contribute to the fucking country.
Do you notice how good our roads are? Our health care is in the top 5 of the world. Our universities are all in the top 200. Be happy that you get to live here, don't be a jew.
Kevin Sullivan
REEEEEE NORMIES!!!!! GET THE FUCK OUT OF CRYPTOS AND ELAVE US HARDCODERS WITH OUR OWN WALLETS ALONE
Logan Jones
In 2018 betaal je vermogensbelasting over wat je op 1-1-2017 had.
Isaac Moore
>Our universities are all in the top 200. [citation needed]
>bitcoins en andere virtuele betaalmiddelen Virtuele betaalmiddelen, zoals bitcoins, staan op uw computer opgeslagen. U kunt deze alleen gebruiken als betaalmiddel op internet. U geeft van deze middelen de waarde in het economisch verkeer aan op 1 januari van het jaar van aangifte.
lmao, our tax people are slow as usual, thank god.
ah, fijn. volgens mij zat ik toen nog net onder de 25k grens. wordt volgend jaar wel flink dokken.
Elijah Gonzalez
Als je zoveel moet betalen aan belasting bezit je over de 1m, kanker gier.
Chase Wood
Procentueel blijft het toch het zelfde. Als je een flink bedrag moet dokken heb je zo veel geld dat je het ook wel kan missen. Je moet in deze markt wel heel dom investeren om in 2019 minder geld te hebben dan op 1-1-2018.
Christian Carter
whats the best site for dutchies to buy btc? my mom wants to buy some now because its dropped a lot
Henry Russell
What does this mean, user?
Also, all in all, how can they make you pay taxes if the money never makes it to your bank account? Someone already said that this is unrealised profit, so, how does the "tax only over the 25k" specifically work? does this only apply for the money that made it to your bank account?
Dankjewel in advance, pannenkoeken van Kikkerland.
Nicholas Hill
I studied tax law. You have to report your cryptos, which you owned on 1 jan 2017, valued at the price of 1 jan 2017.
The government says you made 4% profit off them (give or take). And you pay 30% taxes over that 4%. So effectively you only pay about 1,2% taxes.
Also, if you work in the Netherlands and make enough money, you and your employer can opt in for the 30% tax exclusion. This means you pay 30% less taxes over your work income and you pay NOTHING over any savings you have.
Ryan Lee
anycoindirect.eu is prima. Het verificatieproces kost even, maar je kan met iDeal betalen wat heel chill is. En je krijgt zoals de naam impliceert direct je muntjes.
Ethan Thompson
Also, you can substract 25k over your cryptos.
Brandon Gonzalez
nice dubs koen
David Collins
>leeching off european country >doesnt want to pay taxes go back, faggot.
Hudson Rodriguez
Nah, if you qualifty for the 30% ruling, it's ANOTHER bonus you get. Hence why people fucking hate expats ;)
Nolan Smith
cryptos are box 3. In box 3 they assume 4% gains per year and this is taxed at 30%.
Isaiah Gutierrez
You lost it all on some bad etherdelta trade. Next day you made it back with random shit tokens
John Young
The 30% rule ensures you don't pay taxes over 30% of your income. And it means the Netherlands won't tax you over your box 3 savings, which means your cryptos and crypto gains won't get taxed.
The 30% rule is a means for rich people to avoid paying taxes.
Andrew Wright
it means crypto is still a grey area in the netherlands...so if you started with 1 BTC, and ended up with 100, due to trading, you don't get taxed extra, you always just pay around 1% "vermogensbelasting". however, if your net worth is less than €25k, you don't have to pay anything. of course you can have a wallet with like 1000 BTC and easily hide that from the tax man, your choice.
>The 30% rule is a means for rich people to avoid paying taxes. Incorrect, as this only applies for expats and not all expats that move to NL are rich. Get your facts straight, mietje
Ian Nguyen
what's the point?
>cash out €50k crypto gains, hide it from the belastingdienst >can't tranfer it to your bank account because they'll instantly know and fuck you over >can't buy a fancy car because they'll instantly know and fuck you over
Lucas Turner
>be a billionaire >""work"" in the Netherlands >you no longer pay taxes over your billions and no capital gains taxes
Mason Allen
You still pay taxes, you fucking moron, even if you benefit from the 30% tax ruling.
Cooper Sanchez
Not over box 2 and box 3.
Lincoln Wilson
bitmymoney is pretty chill.
Cameron Rodriguez
Wait, so how does that last part work? And what if youre freelance?
Jacob Nelson
Even the Open University rocks the fucking world >Top IT Educator motherfucker >TFW even Delft & Eindhoven can't even manage that shit >TFW Prestige is overrated TFW I have no face
Ian Miller
It's an opt in, which often results in that the other country will treat you as someone who pays taxes in the Netherlands. And the Netherlands will treat you as someone who pays taxes abroad.
Luke Cook
It's a practical joke that you can pull in many areas of tax.
Ryder Martin
So no one has any valid solutions then?
Daniel Sullivan
>5 figures It's a 1.2% tax, imposed on the value it had on January 1. >Any chance that the tax authority will introduce some sort of a tax amnesty for crypto given that bitcoin has rallied hard over the past 12 months? Any chance the state will voluntarily let you keep more of your money than the law currently dictates? Fuck no. >What were you planning to do in light of this predicament. Pay the tax. I don't see the problem. It's a lot less than pretty much any other country's capital gains tax.
Luis Rodriguez
>bitcoin costed 1000 dollars >you made 4% profit, which is 40 dollars >you pay 30% taxes over 40 dollars >please help
Ryder Myers
Your gonna pay a flat fee on your assets from 25K up, wether its in cash, crypto, shares or real estate
So you literally pay 12 dollar taxes over each bitcoin.
Lincoln Taylor
Gister een aangenomen verrassing van ome duo kon meteen de dip kopen.
Ethan Williams
ik heb gisteren verkocht op 11k eur....gekocht op 18k eur... toen teruggekocht in bch omdat ik dacht dat we gingen flippeningen...kanker :(
Charles Barnes
Volgende week donderdag is segwit2x. Dan word bitcoin weer gekopieerd.
Dan gaat iedereen in de bitcoin zitten voor een gratis muntje, die mogelijk bitcoin cash overbodig maakt. Dus momenteel is bitcoin cash een erg riskante investering.
Kayden Price
Ga weg joh, MOET JE GEEN GITAREN VERKOPEN OFZO
Tyler Miller
I think if you are benefiting from the 30% ruling you are exempt from that.
Jace Murphy
Is het weer zo ver. "ontslaan" we bitcoin core team?
Nathan Thompson
>Kanker
Kankerdom bedoel je?
Nathaniel Cook
Ultra kankerdom. Gewoon kopen, niet naar omkijken en over een jaar of 2 paleis soesteinde kopen
David Turner
ik koop hoog, en verkoop laag.
Elijah Morgan
Trouwens, voor alle Nederlanders die hier zitten en een coin zoeken die binnenkort 10x of 20x gaat, koop Oceanlab/OCL. Is een coin nu nog alleen te krijgen op de Waves Dex maar hij gaat binnen een paar weken of maanden naar grote exchanges. Als je nu nog koopt ben je spekkoper. Gewoon een tip. Doe ermee wat je wil.
Dat is nep fork door een scammende autist die helemaal geen adoptie heeft. Als je echt daar op gaat zitten wachten kom je van een koude kermis thuis.
Ethan Rogers
Nee, ik ga dan gewoon een uurtje in bitcoin zitten.
Levi Hernandez
Ah dus dit is wrm al die kankersites je ID willen hebben. Ik heb t zonder ID nog kunnen doen door op litebit te kopen (500eu p/d limiet maar t moet maar en tyfushoge kosten) en te sturen naar gatehub wallet. Nu vraag ik me af wat ik ga doen als ik t weer naar euro om wil zetten. Kzit onder 25k dus voor nu boeit t eigenlijk geen flikker maar je weet nooit.
Ayden Harris
>Oceanlab/OCL
wat is hun doel?
Daniel Morales
Hou alles anoniem, zo anoniem mogelijk. Als je grote gains hebt (gaat iedereen lukken in 2018) ga naar Hongarije, cash alles contant uit, zet een bedrijf op, maak nepfacturen en betaal 9% inkomstenbelasting.
Angel Jones
>paying 9% income tax instead of 1.2% tax here why.jpg
Chase Williams
Ik begrijp niet waarom je al die moeite zou doen voor 1.2% vermogensbelasting.
Alexander Martin
Omdat je geen 1.2% moet betalen pannenkoek
Ayden Gonzalez
Alleen als crypto handelen je baan is
Brody Kelly
omdat inkomstenbelasting hier 30% is
Ayden Hernandez
cool. weet jij nog nederlandse projecten die ik kan steunen? kankercrypto (KKC) when
Brandon Wilson
Gulden?
Henry Hernandez
wat moet dit gaan doen?
Andrew Gomez
:)
Charles Gomez
>dutch get taxed on assets not income WTF
Nolan Brown
Bitcoin zal volgend jaar niet x10 of 20 gaan. Maar je moet het zelf weten.
Ze werken samen met het waves team om handige blockchain ondersteunende applicaties te bouwen. Automatische betalingen, token distributies, online games, blockchain workshops voor bedrijven, een centraal Europees blockchain hub en nog veel meer dingen die ik vergeet. Check hun whitepaper op oceanlab.eu. Ze brengen elke week een update uit over wat ze aan het doen zijn. De prijs gaat constant omhoog.
Kwestie van tijd voor ze op grote exchanges komen en een flink paar keer over de kop gaan. Het gaat de afgelopen tijd hard omhoog. Daarom nu kopen nu ze nog onder de radar vliegen. Nu nog te krijgen voor minder dan 1000 sat.
Jose Garcia
Echt geen flauw benul. Volgens mij is het een blockchain die lang niet zo veel innerveert als veel andere producten, maar Nederlands is het wel.
Andrew Myers
*innoveert
Chase Williams
Dude We dont have a capital gains tax!! One of the best countries in the world for crypto gains, taxwise.
They have decided to just asume a 3% return on your wealth and to tax that instead of taxing capital gains. Which HUGELY favors people making massive gains like the crypto neets right now.
Oliver Fisher
what's more fucked up is that from the looks of things ITT, every single dutch faggot is a full blown cuck who's eager to pay taxes
Aiden Parker
because we don't live in a shithole like you do and we are actually in the top 5 with almost everything. Our country used to be nothing but water and we made it into a worldpower. So fuck off
Austin Adams
t. greek
Leo Evans
I love how foreigners don't understand the concept of a government that actually builds roads with your tax money.
Must feel really bad to live in a country where your government is so untrustworthy that people buy guns to feel safe from their own politicians.
Jason Wilson
>2,871% jezus man ik schrok me de tyfus. was even vergeten we hier kommas gebruiken als decimale punt.
Jayden Gomez
was ook een woord vergeten zie ik nu
Ryan Reed
Ziet er goed uit. Vanavond even lezen.
Alvast bedankt voor de gains, mocht ik investeren.
William Carter
>bitcoin cash overbodig
Jaxon Foster
Netherlands is nice, but Germany is nicer.
Still a top 5 country though
Carter Bell
bratwurst in dein sauerkraut
Brayden Hernandez
Compared to germany and belgium we have very fucking good roads and infrastructure. And it sometimes baffles me how other countries throw their hat at important shit like that.
Alexander Walker
>Germany is nicer >shit education >East Germany reunification tax >an even worse sense of humour than us >gazillions of refugees, due to an eternal guilt complex >Berlin is a literal shithole Ummmm no thanks sweetie