Warhammer Fantasy (Battles) General - /wfg/

They look good, what bases are you feeling?

dunno. probably some foresty shit but havent really thought about it yet. i havent done any research on basing techniques yet.

Elephants could just be demigryphs.
Now to actually find elephants.

I would use the lord of the rings one GW sell, no work needed just replace the figures on top. He'll be too large for a demigryph though.

a cursory google search of war elephant miniatures 28mm brings up a slew of apparent examples

primarily intended as Carthaginian or greek elephants

I don't think something as fuck-off-huge as a mumakil can count as just a demigryph.

>it's actually cheaper to get a box of demigryph knights than it is to get 3 elephants
That's a first.

I would count it as Karl Franz on a dragon and make it the centrepiece model.

Save the demigryphs for camel riders.

why is warlordgames so good

Because it's a privately owned business and only has to answer to someone who loves playing wargames and is therefore run with the same mentality that old GW was run with.

ie. lets make great games and great models and hopefully a profit as well.

But Oliphaunts cannot fly.

Well if you don't try you'll never know.

They're so massive your average terrain piece is inconsequential.

Good point.

Come on user, you can't do an Araby army and pass on a massive plastic fantasy elephant.

True.

So in Fantasy did they ever hint at what created the Chaos Gods like they have in Fantasy?

They added morghur to beastmen?

yes

How is he? Is he a mage or a warrior?

he's a melee lord with a regeneration aura, a shield that makes him impervious to damage (periodically goes down for a few seconds), and 2 abilities that summon chaos spawns (one is just a normal summon, other kills at unit at 20% hp to summon them)

he's insanely good and easily the best lord choice for beastmen, but no mount options

Wut?

Anyway 5th edition hordes of chaos army book states that chaos gods and daemons are physical manifestation of mortal feelings and superstitions. They exist because mortals believe they exist. Even barely knowing the concept of chaos entities gives them strenght.

It's stated that the chaos gods would literally cease to exist if people stopped believing in their existence, but as long as a single mortal believed in their existence (not necessarily worshipping them) they would live

oh boy I fucked that one up.

I meant "like they have in 40k". But, what I meant is if they ever hinted at when they came to be- like 40k's War in Heaven, or as a more explicit example, the Fall of the Eldar with Slaanesh.

I read the 8th ed Daemons book last weekend and Slaanesh being mentioned as the youngest got me thinking "Well how old are they exactly...?", and since people here tend to have more knowledge and access to things I might not even know how to begin looking for, I figured I'd ask.

Noob question: are human, dwarven, halfling and elvish deities more powerful than the Old Ones?

Halfling don't have gods

Apart from that, in very recent and better ignored lore it was stated that asuryan was actually an old one.

That said, i should say so, since the old ones are dead

>since the old ones are dead
I thought that was 40k lore, and in Fantasy they just kinda' fucked off and no one knew where they went. Except maybe for Kroak.

afaik in 40k they were btfo and in fantasy they just kinda buggered off, leaving the lizardmen on the globe to develop blue balls from being frustrated by gold plaques

Sometimes I think 90% of all the shitty things on this board are because of a small minority of autists.

Wouldn't the stank be more suitable?

okay?
Kinda disappointing how the LoTR games never took off
No one plays them still, right?
Golly gosh darn, basing is the bane of my existence
I might just get some terrain goop to be done with it nice and fast myself, to be honest

>Kinda disappointing how the LoTR games never took off
You must have missed the 4-5 years after its launch. GW practically forgot 40k and WHFB existed, as did many of the playerbase.
It's still played heavily in the UK and some parts of the US, but for the most part you'll have to go out of your way to find a group on their respective facebook pages

>Halfling don't have gods

What about Esmerelda, Josias, Phineas and Quensberry?

The steam mechanics and all other "mechanical" special rules that apply to the Steam Tank don't really seem fitting for a flesh-and-blood creature.

idk man, no one where I live played it at all, even when it came out
Some people got the starter when the movies were coming out but thats about it
I even have the Osgiliath one
The rules are pretty nifty (free gollum boii)

Probably.
They weren't immediately BTFO by Chaos.

Just posting my bearington unit filler progress, he's still got a long way to go but is shaping up.

got the majority of painting on the bear/holster itself to go

Them ain't gods more than how the dwarven ancestors are

What constitutes a god in WHFB anyway?
Chaos Gods are just powerful demons new fluff get out reeee, the same might go for the Elven and old world gods, the Dwarf's and Sigmar are reverred ancestors that might get elevated to "godhood" by faith. You might actually be able to create a new god/elevate yourself to godhood by orchestrating a cult over hundreds or of years.

>Chaos Gods are just powerful demons new fluff get out reeee

The Gods were never just daemons though.
They create daemons, but are not daemons themselves.

They were powerful amalgamations bound to the emotions of living creatures. In essence, an unthinkable mass of emotion magic that sometimes emanates in a certain way. Khorne is every bloodletter, all of them are Khorne and more. That's why they are fickle and chaotic, they aren't one sentient creature, they are moving masses and a single demon is a fraction of that. So, in essence, they are just bigass demons that are so bloated that they aren't clearly defined anymore because they have encroached on so many areas. They ARE their domains. But in theory, every demon could become that powerful if he somehow managed to garner the power and wrestle domains from the others.
At least it used to be this way sometimes and the Literal God with Sapience interpretations always seemed incredibly dumb to me.

>But in theory, every demon could become that powerful

No. Daemons are created by the Gods. A God could in theory expend all his energy and create a daemon as powerful as he was, but daemons are different from the Gods.

this post inspired me to get my own plastic elephant to use as a either a chariot or strap a cannon to it and call it a steam tank. Unfortunately I think it might be too big for its base.
What do you think?

This was clearly stated but I think it was a lot more ambiguous in the older editions, especially in regards to the relationship of the Horned Rat and the elven gods with the Warp and somesuch.

Elite infantry, lots of light and medium cavalry, "weird" cavalry (camels), "weird" infantry (dervishes), some cannons and gunners, casters are djinni-summoning magi.

>ywn be incessantly bullied by a wood elf waywatcher whose banter is on point

A lot of people in /awg/ play SBG. It still has a following but a lot of people are waiting for FW to update it to the middle-earth SBG.

I would have undercoated and painted the bear, the only white bears are polar bears.

Definitely a one model unit.

Is there a generally accepted or even reasonably debated run down of the various editions of whfb, what they added, what's better for what, etc? Did an edition manage to balance heroes:units? Also for skirmish and warband adaptations?

I've only played bloodbowl for gw fantasy stuff, and am interested in manoeuvring blocks of doods.

8th is the big blocks of dudes edition

You separate WHFB in roughly three eras, 1st/2nd (being more of a Wargame/RPG hybrid than others), 3rd through 5th (being the Herohammer Editions) and 6th through 8th (being the more block focused editions)

6th Edition was a big overhaul and is in my opinion generally the best edition, but not flawless, because 7th Edition brought a much needed Magic overhaul and 8th Edition gave Infantry more staying power (but went completely overboard)
Our group plays 6th Edition because it has reasonably sized armies and gorgeous supplements, with Magic from 7th and casualties from the back + Steadfast (negated together with rank bonus) and it plays great.

Cool thanks.

What's up with 9th Age?

nurgle comes about the plague of justinian (541 ad)
Khorne comes about the crusades (1095-1291)
Tzeentch im not sure I think renaissance (1452-1580ish)
but they don't really do shit until much later

Wasn't this just Veeky Forums headcanon? I mean this doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

9th Age is basically 8th Edition with a few changes

Yeah, a lot of blocks with a lot of dudes and very little pushing going on in 8th

Chaos Gods being born from humanity in 40k was always nonsensical when there were star-spanning empires of sentient creatures around millions of years before humans even developed

Exactly why it doesn't make sense, or is some of the worst human-wank in the setting.

6th with houserules it is.

You could either try out 6th straight up while keeping in mind that Magic and Casualties in combat are questionable, or you start looking for fixes right out of the gate.

Magic from 7th Edition is pretty easy to transfer to 6th.
As for the infantry fixes:
>Casualties are removed from the back, NOT from the front/"Step Up" rule
This fixes one of the bigges complaints about 6th Edition straight up. In 6th, casualties are taken from the front, meaning: If your unit is four wide and four guys are killed before your initiative comes up, you don't get to hit back. This is a pretty simple fix that gives some hitting power to block infantry.

>Negatable Steadfast
Steadfast is a rule from 8th Edition that says, in essence, as long as a unit has more full ranks than the biggest unit on the opposing side, they get to take morale checks without penalty if they lose. This gives blocks enhanced staying power, but leads to the inevitable problem of unbreakable buses with fucktons of ranks.
The easy fix is to take the above rule and add
>A unit can only be steadfast if it has a rank bonus
This gives blocks greater staying power against MSU chargers, not too much and places greater value on maneuvering.

I'd change nothing else at first, only if something comes up that your group really doesn't like.

There was a guy asking for FAQ's last thread, I have them if you tell me which ones you want.

See, I told you /WFG/ should write it's own edition based on 6.

I think people are taking it too literally, exchange humans with all sentient creatures and it makes sense.

This is helpful, thanks again.

Another user here. Instead of house rules. Just play 9th age. It's the best one of the bunch because it's fun

I went and downloaded that too. I'm going to give it a read over the next bit. Can you give me a quick rundown on differences/things they changed vs other editions?

Fellas and felletes,

I'm thinking of making a 3000pt Chaos list for 8th/8.5 but the only real way to make it competitive that I see, would be making the list half Daemons and half Warriors.

Is it normal to feel that Chaos feels a bit limited in terms of buildup and composition? I miss the synergy of Undead Legions, Aelves and Greater Emp.

Units that I like:

Sorceror Lord
Chosen
Budlighters
Chariot - gorebeast and regular (seemingly the go-to troop choice, obscene value)
Shrine
Krushers
Flash hounds

and Throgg

Both demons and warriors alone are already competitive.

Throgg is arguably op

You can have a 1+/3++ hero with rerollable 1's on saving throw just with WoC

Warriors of Chaos are pretty good by themselves to be honest, Throgg makes trolls core and is one of the most competitive set ups.

Chaos's biggest limitation is it's lack of range, pretty much all three arms need to rush up the board.

>Aelves

I like how they've got a simplistic design philosophy, math-hammer can be really fun sometimes I always put too many points into lords and heroes, though.

Also no more Throgg on the GW website! D :

Saves me typing out 'Milf-hunter Malekith and the Phunky Bunch", to give them their official title

Would a drawfag happen to be present? I'd really like to see a young Deathclaw terrorizing the Altdorf palace staff while a young Karl thinks it's harmless fun.

...

I've had some sucess fielding a unit or two of forsaken in my battles. They make a fun random addition to your army with potential for tremendous dmg-output. My most fond memory of them was that time when a unit of 5x Forsaken "one-shotted" a Giant.

While we're on the subject of WoC can anyone tell me if 2x Chariots of Nurgle are a sufficient flank force in a generic game of 1500, 2000 and/or 2500 points or if it would be prudent to enforce that flank with some additional unit(s)?

Would they be flanking together or would they cover both?

They would together be responsible for one flank.

Sounds like it could work. If they tie up a unit or two, act in concert with infantry or cavalry, or waste your enemy's time, then they've done their job. Probably their best use is making your enemy worry about them, most of all.

Though I should say the same job could be done by a unit of Marauder Horsemen which will also deny them their rank bonus if they work with other units, and can reform easier.

Could a unit of Marauder Horsemen really reliably solo a flank?

Maybe not solo, but get on your enemy's mind? Definitely. The threat of them will make him double check his moves. Does he protect his flanks or does he protect his wizards/artillery? Doubt is the death of generals.

That and wearing flashy uniforms on the front line.

That's actually quite neat to know as I like the fluff I've come up with for my Marauder Horsemen but have yet to field them due to, atleast from my understanding, their poor capabilities on paper.

However what I was thinking with my 2x Chariots of Nurgle was that they would be able to reliably (in most situations) take care of one flank. Perhaps a more prudent way to go about it would be to use 2x Gorebeast Chariots of Nurgle instead? I suppose that I could always spend the core tax on some forsaken or even an additional unit of warriors.

You should play historicals or look into the L5R RPG if you want to do the samurai thing.

thankfully I did that last night, and it's still a polar bear. Just a dirty one

>Beastmen edition

I was actually collecting Yiffmen before GW killed WHFB.

Had this idea that I was going to do grey fur with red armor/cloth.

I like them, it's like a norsca beast theme

It wasn't headcanon and it was pretty good IMO. It was the ultimate irony in 40k: these beings who were the worst enemies of humanity were created from humanity's own flaws. It wasn't perfect but I preferred it a million times over the new "Chaos is infinite" crap the lore's pulling.

TL;DR they were powerful spirits that came into the world when the Warp Gates collapsed.

The Gods of Chaos/Order weren't daemons but they weren't gods. That mantle was given to them after they came into the world.

The Old Ones weren't BTFO either. Chaos (and Order) only came into existence after the Warp Gates fell new fluff get out, but the Warp always had an innate corrupting or controlling influence over things. The Old Ones themselves resisted it pretty easily but their creations couldn't, so they kept making worlds to resist the Warp's influence. Technically they could've beaten the Warp immediately had they just closed it off, like what the Elves tried to do later, but since the Warp was necessary for space travel they didn't want to give up their empire, so instead they just kept trying to make living things that could fight the Warp's influence. When the Gates fell they didn't lose or get BTFO, they just shrugged and fucked off.

Lizzies say they'll come back and kick Chaos back into the Warp someday, which fuels everything they and the fat frog do, which is preparing for their return which may or may not actually happen.

plastic landsknechts coming soon apparently

what did they mean by this?

>The Gods of Chaos/Order weren't daemons but they weren't gods. That mantle was given to them after they came into the world.

Nope they were Gods.
Also Chaos predates the fall of the Warp gates.

>The Old Ones weren't BTFO either.

>Either dead or sent packing with their scaly tails between their legs
>Not BTFO

I stand corrected, this is true.

Chaos as an entity - the Gods of Chaos - though didn't exist until the Gates collapsed. Up until that point there was no defined side of Chaos and Order, there were just Void Gods who believed different things. When the Gates collapsed that's when Khorne and company declared themselves Chaotics and Alluminas and company declared themselves Lawful, with both chaos and law being two of the multitude of possibilities of reality.

Before that Chaos just basically meant Entropy, uncertainty and such. Chaos as a term didn't refer to Chaos in the way we think of it, just like Order didn't refer to things fighting against manfiested Chaos but Gods in the Void who stood for stability and anti-entropy.

Remember that Realm of Chaos mentions the possibility of the current Chaos Gods could be fragments or pieces of a much larger entity, The Great Undivided, who lies in the center of the Warp. In this case the Order Gods are fragments of some singular Law entity. I wonder who the Big Gods of Chaos and Order are.

Probably Gork and Mork.

>the old ones got BTFO
>"their fate is unknown"

>>"their fate is unknown"

We're given three options. They died in the cataclysm, they died in the resultant invasion or they ran away, abandoning the world.