What Happened to them?

I don't think anyone would claim that PP makes good models. Their non-Hordes sculpts are pretty much all awful.

CID is a good thing that I'm genuinely surprised HASN'T caught on more with other games/systems, but Soles is such an petulant, intractable fuckstick I barely have the energy to intetact with the devs.

I have no idea why that guy is kept around, why Grymkin is a thing but not Zu, why so much has happened the way it did.

Wouldn't go that far, some of their warmachine stuff looks pretty good, but then again, the aesthetic is subjective. However their plastic models really need work. I mean, fuck I've seen better from spartan games.
I agree with steampunk being pretty horrible recently, but I have found warmachine to be pretty tame when it comes to cogwank (barring Convergence models). It does, however, have a very cartoony and top-heavy design that I very much disliked at first.

Well, Warmachine's a solid ruleset since Mk2 as a whole. Very clean, the epitome of good technical rules writing to limit ambiguity. The gameplay's fun and not a simulation, but rather a very competitive game where a good player will beat a less good one if both play right.
What's really been an issue IMO for a few years is the expansion space. Every factions kinda well set in play options and such, so growth has to be through new units. Stuff like Colossals I despise since it goes away from the root of the game being a very small scale tactical duel between two warcasters/warlocks.

If faction balance has drifted (even though the core MK3 rules are better), that's an issue--- but also engagement with the community's gotten worse, and IMO the more modern sculpts are actually inferior to older ones due to cheapening the design.

They forced everyone to beta test their game. It isn't worth IMO, Malifaux and Infinity are just much better choiuces.

New faction every year now tho

Can soembody give me a quick rundown on the Jason Soles character? I see his name bandied about in a negative manner a LOT. The search I did only came up with some low quality art and pictures of an exceptionally gay looking man. What makes him such a cancer to PP?

>What's really been an issue IMO for a few years is the expansion space. Every factions kinda well set in play options and such, so growth has to be through new units. Stuff like Colossals I despise since it goes away from the root of the game being a very small scale tactical duel between two warcasters/warlocks.

I started playing Warmachine in 2004, and I left not long after the release of Mk II because of these issues. The game has just expanded too much, especially as a game where knowing what everything does all the time is so critical.

While I agree that Malifaux is better they're using the community to beta test as well.

Infinity is an utter clusterfuck of rules however. When it works it's great but there is far to much flicking through the rule book.

Soles is the lead rules designer and he does a shit job of it. His interactions with the community is almost always him defending his shitty rules that don't make sense and he doesn't know how to play his own game.

For example:
>make a model called the Gun Carriage
>decide you don't want it to be primarily a mobile artillary model as the name implies
>instead make it a shock model designed to run over infantry
>community tells him this is stupid and we liked it when it was mobile artillary
>people get banned from the CID forum for disagreeing with his melee focussed gun carriage idea
>most of the battle engine CID is spent trying to fix Soles stupid rules on the Gun Carriage

Also related, one of the complaints about the GC was that one engaged in melee it was very vulnerable to being killed the turn after comminting because it's much faster than the rest of the models in the army and is way out front. Soles solution is to hold it back then have it use its Reposition move to move it away from the enemy and screen it with Winter Guard.

No, CID is awful.

First of all, PP doesn't have the level or competence or the resources to make the CID actually work smoothly or address the needs of the game.

Secondly, it's too much of a demand for players dipping their toe in. People have no idea where if anything they buy will be worth anything and trying to navigate around what's happening to the game as a whole is too much.

Thirdly, it's misused. It's not being used to actually address balance issues on a case per case basis, but it's an entire content batch of various things all being pushed under a themes like battle engine or trenchers, instead of going on per faction or tourney result basis.

>Do you want to play CID?
>No
>Oh well that invalidates the list I brought with me today

>Bringing a homebrew list with homebrew rules to a random pick up game and expecting a game.

The people that played PP games where abuse victims from GW.

PP does some problematic stuff.

GW comes back and flashes her stuff and talks about how "She's All Changed". GWs flock back on mass for very minor changes and continued the abuse of them and cash, and overemphasize whatever failures PP had because they just wanted PP to be GW just slightly less abusive. Now that PP is actually doing better things for the community and the game, and no longer just a slightly better GW (So as in a MUCH better GW), people are bitching.

GW players don't want a better company. They want their flavor of abuse. They like their purchases invalidated, they like playing aggressive second banana factions, they like bad rules. But they also like shiny new toys that kick the asses of everybody else and makes them jelouse.

The only thing that PP did wrong was move away from "Shiny new Invalidating toy" to just "New Toy". So GW players are up in arms.

Gotta stop you on point number 3. GW didn't do anything to emphasize PP's flaws. 8th ed is the nail in the coffin, the grave was dug by PP themselves.Also PP isn't actually doing anything better for the community or the game. They still haven't addressed many of the balance issues in the game and community communication is terrible due to Soles and Shick, not to mention the axing of their pressgangers and the forums.

>What Happened to them?
Nothing really, why are you asking? because of the "ded gaem" meme?

WOOOO INFINITY!

Something I've noticed is that Warmahordes is really not a very casual friendly game with either design or with community. You don't find people playing odd scenarios, you find them doing the same tournament-style matches again and again.

I'm a little bitter about the time I brought a heap of warhammer fantasy terrain and asked if anyone wanted to play a big cityfight game only to have the guy running it go 'No tournament would ever allow that much terrain' and start removing pieces.

>The only thing that PP did wrong was-
1. Release broken rules
2. Lie about the amount of testing they did
3. Publicly make fun of their community when they ask for the broken rules to be fixed
4. Publicly make fun of their community when they ask for the faction they utterly destroyed through nerfs to be fixed
5. Buff factions with theme lists but only do it one at a time so some factions get left in the dirt
6. Create decks of faction cards then immediately stop supporting them, forcing everyone to use the second worst optimised app on Google Play, with the title of worst optimised app going to the previous version of it, with no way of redeeming your faction deck on the app so you have to buy it AGAIN
7. Confess that your own internal playtesting is unable to solve the game's problems so create CID, then refuse to use it to actually balance the game, preferring instead to use it to balance brand new models
8. Create a new faction that didn't need to exist
9. Announce you're going to create a new faction every year
10. Announce you're going to release a balance patch for the game every 6 months but only do it once
11. Refuse to ever actually TRY and balance any ADR rosters, instead just jamming your BB caster, your latest caster, and 2 random underplayed fuckheads on there, meaning Una2 had access to specialists at the height of her power if you paired her with Tanith who was an okay caster
12. Refuse to address spam lists

Anything I've missed?

t. Severely disillusioned Skorne player

>t. Severely disillusioned Skorne player
Makes sense. Move on. It's better for you.

The game simply is not built for that. City fighting is impossible to play because an entire faction of big guys (trollbloods) can't navigate that while Legion and Circle fly and teleport everywhere they need to go.

That's nothing to do with casual or seriousness, but what the game is built around. Every game has a standard level of optimal play experience. X wing has 3 asteroid per player and 100pts, Malifaux has 50 SS set up, etc.

>Infinity is an utter clusterfuck of rules however

I'm a lover of fighting games so the clusterfuck isn't all that bad to me. Both me and my crew are new to the game so it feels like each match we are learning more and more stuff. The model count is so low and the game is so fast that it doesn't feel like the massive time-consuming slogs of 40k and Fantasy.

Warmachine is simpler in mechanics but I find the gameplay itself to be more like an abstract game than a simulation of battle (which I prefer).

>That's nothing to do with casual or seriousness, but what the game is built around. Every game has a standard level of optimal play experience.

The idea was that it won't be totally balanced but it will be a fun scenario. Though maybe it's because I grew up playing Battletech, so my general assumption is that weird scenarios are fun ways to play the game.

You are confusing complexity and clusterfuck. You like the complexity of the infinity's rule and fighting games. Clusterfuck is when complexity becomes overwhelming due to poor conveyance or access. Infinity is just fucking horrible with that shit. It's special rules refer to other special rules. It's like a pointless dictionary half of the definitions are "see also-"

>t. Severely disillusioned Skorne player

I'm so sorry. I'm getting in Warmachine only through the specific models that I like and Skorne is on the list but I know by the time I get around to them they will be (hopefully) fixed.

Well Battletech also has pretty standardized unit sizes and can rock pretty low model counts so you can bring a box of mechs and be like "yeah this is the scenario let's whip some shit up."

Warmachine is more: You create a list, this is your list. There are many like it but this one is yours."

and the game doesn't support that. Capacities for models can be stretched to very high levels and imbalance leads to very easy abuse.

Skorne won't be fixed at this point. It's a melee centric faction that struggles to get across the table in one piece, and whatever makes it over there won't be able to deal with your opponent's shit.

I would be shocked if looking at the coding of Guilty Gear XXrd wouldn't reveal a chain of states and moves that refer to other states and moves. Fuck, Soul Calibur has, like, 6 or some shit different locations to hit and that's before getting into frame data.

It's not a pointless dictionary. You have 8 guys in your army so go ahead and learn what they do. The more you get familiar with it the more insanity and breadth of utility you realize that you have access to. Also once you get a hang of how the rules are laid out it becomes super easy to look stuff up (way easier than a bunch of roleplaying games and board games).

Also there are apps and a website that has links for ALL those rules so it is super fast to look all the stuff up.

The game isn't for everyone but if you are someone who wants to be rewarded for treating a firefight like a firefight, then Infinity seems to be the way to go.

Yeah, which is what led to me leaving the game. I get bloody bored playing the same tournament-style matches every week. Malifaux/Infinity gives me a lot more variety in map design and scenarios.

But what if they realized that guns are super fucking lame and restructure the game?

Or what if they gave Skorne smoke grenades because they kidnapped some Trenchers?

This. Stuff like reaction hacking requires you to look up which hacking device you have, find out what type of hacking it can do, then which hacking types can be used as reaction then what those reaction types can do, and they're all in different parts of the rulebook. It's a mess and honestly Infinity would REALLY benefit from stat cards like Malifaux.

>But what if they realized that guns are super fucking lame and restructure the game?
It isn't just guns though. Other factions have melee dudes that are just plain better, like Nyss Swordsmen. Slightly less P+S, but it's cheaper to get their weaponmaster, their weaponmaster isn't a mini feat, and they have higher DEF. Yet PP thinks Skorne players will use Swordsmen while Legion players don't even think twice about their own better Swordsmen.

Nah, Infinity has fully embraced the future.

APPS

There would be too much text on the cards

The difference is that videogame does the math instantly, doesn't require multiple output from you.

My example for kind of shit design Infinity has are things like Morat. It's veteran1 and religious troops, WHY THE FUCK does it need to refer to 2 separate rules? Why doesn't it just have veteran 1 and religious troop on the profile or have the morat rule encompass both rules in it's text?

or things like Booty levels where each level has a separate chart that you can roll on the lower one if you wish. Why not just have one big chart and have levels modify?

Infinity just overbloats shit for absolutely zero reason

At first I wonder

>But what if Skorne has tools to get more mileage out of there guys than Legion will Nyss Swordsmen
>Remember that "Skornergy" is a term

I am so sorry, dude. I have a friend who plays Tau in 40k so I know how it feels.

Most likely to keep things open and allow for more design space.

Like this is me hypothesizing but they might have guys who go after the Morat rule and the like.

Coming from a guy who comes from some crazy complicated games, Infinity isn't all that bad, especially since you just gotta focus on your own rules.

What was the new faction?

And was there any word about what factions they have/had lined up next?

I fucking hate using a screen for rules. I play mini games to get away from fucking screens, not rely on them more.

>40k 8th turns out to be tolerable.
FTFY

Grymkin. A Malifaux-y Tim Burtonish faction. Supposedly they're supposed to be Hell creatures and Nightmares but they just look like a teenager derivative wank faction. You won't see them much because three quarters of the playerbase hate them or are indifferent.

No.

Git Gud.

These fuckboys.

They're less intimidating than the Hellraiser wannabes they called the Cephalyx.

holy shit! it is worse than AOS! FUCKING ACHERON IS LESS OVER DESIGNED!

>LESS OVER DESIGNED
It's not so much overdesign as just really awkward posing.

>AoS turns out is growing.
AoS has registered amongst the best selling wargames exactly one semester, when it had more releases than WHFB had in a decade, and it was still below WMH.

Given the investment, it's an utter failure.

>not bringing two lists

>10. Announce you're going to release a balance patch for the game every 6 months but only do it once
>Mk3 was litterally released a year and four days ago.
>CID was not a thing when they announced that.
Now you're just trying to be mad
>t. Severely disillusioned Skorne player
Oh, well that explains it.

And flames

They could look more dynamic. If anything, the exhaust pipes need to go. It's a pretty bad sculpt. That much is true.

PP does have good sculpts though. They're not fancy, but I like that. This little fellow here is a good example of the kind of mini I enjoy. A simple design, but it works.

I love that cute lil' guy both rules-wise and look wise. Sad cygnar doesn't have more "helper drone" types.

Sometimes the over the top design is nice. I know not everyone is fond of the warjacks, but I like the behemoth, as clunky and retarded as it is.

Thanks user. I just looked at that Gun Carriage... everything about what you've described is saddening.

>stuff like reaction hacking requires you to look up which hacking device you have, find out what type of hacking it can do, then which hacking types can be used as reaction then what those reaction types can do, and they're all in different parts of the rulebook.

Why are you looking that shit up mid-game? How do you not know what hacking device your own guy has ahead of time? How is all of what you said not a one-time thing you do way before your first game? I get that some things can be a pain and do require rhythm-breaking lookups, but your example is like saying you have to go through the entirety of D&D's PHB every time you make an attack roll, finding your proficiency bonus, hashing out what your STR bonus is, looking up what Advantage is, etc. instead of doing the math once and writing down your to-hit bonus.

Skorne's fixed... getting up the table is easy if you build for it... you probably should move on, user.

They let monsterpocalypse die.

So, I haven't played Warmahordes since the very end of Mk2. Given the lists I played (and I swear I juust picked models I liked and things that synergized with them) were eSorscha WGDS, Legion pAbby spamming heavy and lesser warbeasts + forsaken and shepherds, and Gators with Gators Gatoring Gators, if I picked up Warmahordes again, right now, what could I reasonably expect?

Well the meta is entirely different. But you don't have to worry about that. There's currently less BS in the game than ever before and it's probably the best time to get into it. Let's have a look at your stuff:

>Sorscha2 WGDS
Not the most popular Winter Guard caster, but I can't see why that wouldn't still work.

>Abby1 Beast-Heavy
Legion beast-heavy is making a comeback with Oracles of Annihilation. However, Abby1 is just as bad as she was in Mk2.

>Gators
Very playable, but mostly in theme. The Gatorman Posse got some nerfs in Mk3 and I wouldn't play them outside the Blindwater theme.

For me it was the point creep of the games, I loved to play at 15 to 20 point games with tons of terrain, but they began pushing bigger dudes as time went on, to the point that since I began playing with Trollbloods, PP released only 2 light beasts vs 3 gargantuans that look pretty much the same to me. Even simple units, that used to be fielded with 5 models now go with 10+.
After mk3 released, my group just said "fuck it" and dropped it in favour of bloodbowl.

I hope the new "totes not AOS Skimish" they're releasing brings back the small focus that the game started with.

WGDS is gone but theres a good Winter Guard theme in it's place and Sorcha is now overshadowed by Vlad1 or eIrusk.

Lesser warbeasts are shit, pAbby is a shit, Legion now relies on moving opponent models around in order to take them apart bit by bit rather than having a strong alpha.

Gators went down to 5 boxes and pigs can intermingle with gators. Pigs are generally stronger than Gators because vanilla gators die easily unless you play gators in theme which bumps them back up to 8 boxes. It's a fucking mess.

Sorry I can't memorize a list of 30 odd hacking options along with the rules for Lvl2 Martial Arts and Lvl1 Visors or whatever.

>I loved to play at 15 to 20 point games with tons of terrain, but they began pushing bigger dudes as time went on
That is weird. In Mk2 the game sized in the rule book were between 10 (or 15) and 200p, but the standard settled on 50p. So the push was in fact more towards smaller games.

However you are right, if you want a small-scale skirmisher, there are better games than WMH.

Thats literally "crawling in my skin" tier.

Nah, PP models a REALLY over designed. I genuinly hate painting solos and human models because the sculptors cram as much stupid shit onto the models as they can. Pic related.

This model is what snapped my patience with PP sculpts in half. She has so much stupid shit all over her, shes wearing like 3 capes one of which is half an inch thick and solid metal, random armor plates bolted on at random, feathers and little stones on ropes fucking everywhere.

Like her main cape has an entire plate of armor strapped to one corner but it's still blowing up? What the fuck is that black bit of material with armor stuck on it? What purpose does it serve? Cape armor? Why do her flares have armor and why do her ankles then have armor underneath that? Do people attack her feet that often?

Look at the feathers on her left boob. You can see that they just painted the underneath of the surface black and they're sculpted on to be away from her body, but there's a load of metal underneath.

Her staff is too thick for her hand to fit around but shes holding it out unsupported with two hawks on it and a shitload of metal all over it and PP brand Staff Tape on it (every fucking staff in the game has that shit on it).

I could complain about this model for day.

>Hurrr 'memberin things is HARD
Okay champ, I've got a game more your speed: you and your opponent take turns rolling dice at each other until someone has to leave to go to the bathroom.

Jesus Christ, Corvus Belli aren't going to award you a fucking prize for defending their game. Calm the fuck down.

PP's aesthetic always looked to my like they wanted to imitate like WotLK era WoW

Holy fucking shit, the longer I look at that model, the dumber it gets. I mean, the base model isn't terrible, but they just piled so much shit onto it. Why the fuck does she need 3 seperate Falcons on her model? Why does she have so much armor if shes a falconer druid? Why is her weapon so retarded?

There is so much going wrong with that mini.

It wouldn't be overdesigned if everything wasn't so chunky. GW can get away with extremely busy designs because their models have a much finer level of details, but PP miniatures have a style that's meant solely to create recognizable, characterful silhouettes, at the expense of details.

PP models look like they were designed by piazzo and blizzard's lovechild

>GW can get away with extremely busy designs
No.

To be fair your complaint is retarded.

Here's a helpful hint; You can make Your Own stat cards that hold your hand through the process.

Amazing revelation right?

>telling someone to calm down while throwing a fit and swearing at them.
This may be the reason why it's really hard for you. You're retarded.

>GW can get away with extremely busy designs because I'm a shill
ftfy fampai
GW AoS models all look shit and have way more details than necessary. It's like every model is meant to be a fucking centerpiece. On the table, it looks like plastic vomit.

Nothing happened.

Warmachine is still the biggest non-GW plastic army man game, bigger than AoS by far. Basically everything you hear about them being ded is just Veeky Forums memery.

A few players left when Mk3 made their faction no longer overpowered, but more joined.

The status quo is as ever.

Yeah, agreed.

The best PP models are the ones where they just fucking ease up on the details.

I mean, look at these guys. They're great. Why? Because they're not warcasters/locks and therefore PP didn't feel the need to make them 'special' by lumping extraneous shit on them. Not all warnouns have this problem, of course, but so many do.

This is one of the reasons I'm really down for Company of Iron. Small, objective-driven games with customization and no overdetailed warcasters.

PP can do good overdesign at times though. Pic related works as an exception because they blend overdesigned parts with large smooth surfaces. And it's meant to look weird anyway.

If that's the case then Morat should be it's subfaction label, not a rule that references other rule.

Focusing on your own rules doesn't make the rule any less poorly designed. High tolerance for bullshit doesn't make it any less bullshit.

Shit like hidden deployment for example. Making other people look away while you take photos/take notes is idiotic. Why would anyone think it's a good idea that people need to generate two lists for yourself and the opponent? Why would anyone think actively causing delays in set up where people avoid their involvement is a good thing?

Warmachine used to have a nice 'jack of all trades' appeal to it that let it be highly accessible to different types of gamers. Now there's just really no specific hobby aspect that isn't just done better some where else.

>Tightly balanced competitive ruleset specifically designed for tournament play

Guildball.

>High immersion gameplay

Infinity and Malifaux.

>Easy to start, low commitment:

X-Wing

>Painting and customization

AOS/40K

>beer and pretzels gameplay

Warhammer, Malifaux, X-Wing, and indie crowdfunded games.

>narrative league gameplay

Literally almost every other miniatures company.

>model sculpt quality

Literally almost every other miniatures company.
The one thing WMH had going for it that made it special was that it used to have a little bit of all these things, with the added benefit that it had a very large community. Now PP is shitting themselves and people are leaving in droves. I know someone is going to call me a 'ded gaem' memer, but I've travelled to multiple states and provinces for events and I've been stunned by how some communities I've been outright envious of in Mk2 era have just dropped dead.

I was inactive, so I'm late.

THIS is the new hordes faction? There are so many possibilites (Zu, Infernals etc) and they make this?

There is another aspect of WMH you seem to forget. The idea of having to play by protecting your central model and the fact you have a lot of resource management. Sure infinity does both of those to an extent with lieutenants and orders, but I feel like managing focus/fury and protecting your warnoun is way more important in WMH and are elements I like the most about it.

Yep. For what ever god-forsaken reason, Privateer Press has released what could possibly be the most random and uncohesive army possible.

The "GRYMKINZ" army is made of spewky folk-lore monsters, and are led by the 6 humans who gave Menoth a big finger.

The major problem is that they feel like half their army doesn't mix with the other half, cause you have some really gothic stuff mixed with silly monsters:

>Undead:
The Demagogue
The Undead Soldiers
The CAGE RAGERZ
The Rattler/Fleshman

>Spooky Undead:
The Dreamer
The Child
Pumpkin men
Piggyback Riders
The Tree and Girl
Gremlins

It just doesnt mix.

>protecting your central model
>what is Chess

Memery aside, it's also done in Guild Ball, but better because you don't have to play your Captain like a pussy. Losing the Captain means having your most powerful piece out of the game and severely out of position for a turn, rather than just losing the game.

Warmachine assassination rules means that if you're not Butcher3, you better hide your caster like a bitch even if they're some kind of towering monster that is supposed to be destroying models in droves.

>resource management

There is a ton of this in Guild Ball and Malifaux as well.

>Why the fuck does she need 3 seperate Falcons on her model?
To protect her in the showers and bring her crab legs, obviously

I was going to make a chess analogy in my first post but refrained because, playing both, I know there's a huge difference between positioning for the kill and actually getting the kill in WMH.
>Losing the Captain means having your most powerful piece out of the game and severely out of position for a turn, rather than just losing the game.
Different strokes for different folks here. I like the idea of having to protect your warcaster at all cost and being punished when you don't. Sure losing the game seems a little rough, but even if the game went on, most players would concede from losing their 6/7 focus/turn and their spell list.

It's not that surprising though. PP didn't just drop the ball, they tried throwing it and it bounced back and hit them clean in the face. A year and a half ago, PP and GW were on completely different footings. Warmahordes was thriving, new units were being released, Skorne players were salty but still actually playing, and the community was solid. GW on the other hand was reeling. People were still furious about WF/AoS, 40k was languishing under 7th's BS, every release felt like a new flavor of the month OP unit, and GW wasn't going anywhere fast.

Fast forward to the present day: PP kneecapped themselves with Mk3, not only creating an unoptimized rule set, but also alienating large portions of their community through horrible PR and 'balancing' of factions. Their models are no longer 'cheap' or even on par with most other companies anymore. They've also released a new faction that the majority of the community finds unnecessary and/or fucking stupid. GW meanwhile has, relatively speaking, turned around and given the people what they want. They've released a new edition that, so far as we understand so far, is bretty gud. They've been actually working with their community. They've been releasing big-box sets and specialist games.

I left GW with the end of 3rd edition. I've been gone for a long time, and in that time GW had been disappointing me every step of the way. Had GW continued along their path, they probably would've tanked given another few years, especially if 8th didn't work out. But in the past few months, GW has actually given me the feeling that they're genuinely doing things to improve their game and community. Unfortunately, PP, in their endless quest to beat GW at its own game, ended up causing some of the same blunders GW has in the past. And even worse, a lot of wargamers are (somwewhat) aware of that song and dance by now, and they won't be fooled a 5th time.

>Infinity is an utter clusterfuck of rules however. When it works it's great but there is far to much flicking through the rule book.

Yeah, this is just plain wrong.

The core mechanic of Infinity is extremely simple and once you've gotten the hang of it's just a matter of remembering the special rules your models have. This ain't hard.

Remembering what your hackers can do for example is no harder than remembering what a 40K psyker or a Warmahordes warcaster or virtually any linchpin model in Malifaux can do.

>Legion now relies on moving opponent models around in order to take them apart bit by bit rather than having a strong alpha.
Well that's certainly unusual compared to how Legion used to play. How are the other Legion casters faring nowadays? I used to be a big Vayl1/2 fan, with Saeryn being my go-to backup girl. Haven't touched the game in nearly 2 years though.

Yeah, but the beta testing for Malifaux is optional. PP on the other hand just rushed MK3 out and took their sweet time to fix things.

I got banned from the PP forum before it closed for saying that Skin And Moans sounded like a strip club name.

Is that dude supposed to be Gristle and Flay?

(From the old IKRPG)

Dude, Hidden Deployment is one of the best parts of Infinity. The shell game and mind game potentials you can do with camo/TO camo/AD/holoprojector shenanigans is a huge part of the game, and it's so much fun.

>Why the fuck does she need 3 seperate Falcons on her model?
Because all weapons need to be displayed on the model.