How big do you like your dragons?

Dark souls dragon size.

He's a big guy

...

Ancalagon is described as being literally as big as a mountain.

Bigger than your tiny-ass thumbnail. Seriously, was the the best image you could get?

Not at all certainly. Tolkien uses almost the exact same phrase to talk about how Durin's Bane destroys the side of Zarakzigil when he too was thrown down in ruin, and the Fellowship explicitly states he was more or less human sized.

And Earindil had made the choice to be an Elf, not a man by that point.

The dragon in my world is what creates the day-night cycle

100 ft give or take.

Kind of defeats the potency of size if a lone human can bring it down.

Greetings newfriend. Here on Veeky Forums we don't criticize others.

No he isn't. The only way you get to him being as big as a mountain is that bit about how he destoyed the peaks of Thangorordrim when he fell. See the post about Durin's Bane and Zarakzigil as to why that kind of reasoning is highly flawed.

You must be new here.

He was a magic human with a flying ship with a holy gem that shot god lazers

>is it big enough

Not very

That was a cool as fuck discovery in Dark Souls 3

lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Ancalagon#cite_note-5

Earindil chose to be an elf because his wife wanted him to, but he would have preferred to remain a man.

> a holy gem.
Call it what it is - a Silmaril.

Yes, the Silmarils give you enough destructive power to defeat beings the size of mountains.

So... cats? ...Can't really argue with that.

if it can't vore me then whats the point :/

It was holy, Varda hallowed it

Hell yeah it was.
Only issue I have with it, like a lot of people is that the dragon covenant is gone.

DoD sized

It's holiness was never in question considering it was produced by divine craftsmanship in the first place.

>lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Ancalagon#cite_note-5
That refers to an etymology of Ancalagon's name; and isn't connected to the article's own claim as to Ancalagon being as big as a mountain. The citation to that claim is made in the Atlas of Middle Earth, which has 0 canonicity whatsoever and is riddled with other defects (like claiming that Aragorn brought about a thousand men with him to Pellenor Fields, which is obviously wrong)

>Earindil chose to be an elf because his wife wanted him to, but he would have preferred to remain a man.
Irrelevant, he chose to remain an elf. That difference of Fea is pretty huge.

Still not as big as Ancalagon.

I like 'em nice and human. Makes hugging them easier.

>hugging
How disgusting. Almost as sick as hand-holding.

Ok, that's great and all, but why the fuck not?

>Feanor
>Divine
certainly not, kinslayer.

On the other hand imagine if Celebrimbor's dad (maker of the Plantir) or grandpa (Silmarils) tried their hand at ring smithing.

...

> implying the elves are not divine.
> in a setting in which life is literally created by gods.

Uhm.

Well shit, I guess this became a LotR thread. So much for originality.

Are you actually complaining about people looking to LOTR for dragons rather than D&D and claiming unoriginality?

Are you aware of how much of a vapid shitposter you are?

How about kissing?

Elves aren't divine, a lot of them just spent millenia in the Holy land.

An actual LotR setting dissociated of all later fantasy and especially D&D influence would really be original.
I don't think any adaptations ever come close to that though.

...

I wanted to hear what people here came up with, not stuff from settings that have been around for decades. I'm as interested in hearing about LotR here as D&D.

So a setting that takes place in pre-medieval times, dark ages to be more specific?

They were literally created by God. Technically the only beings that aren't divine in middle earth are those created by Morgoth, and the descendents of the Numenorians (who were cursed by God) and Hobbits.

Maybe a lot of the creatures awakened by the Valar too, but that's a case by case scenario.

Whoops, wrong thread. Well, off to kill myself now.

Humans were also created by God and we sure as hell ain't holy.
Neither were the Avari.

Because it's ridiculous looking. Especially since we're dealing with fictional myth here, and the stuff from the "Elder Days" is necessarily most exaggerated and least accurate.

Except the only real difference between modern stories and ancient mythology is that nowadays we know where the stories came from.

If you want us to draw inspiration for you but you don't want us to draw inspiration from specific settings you should have said so.

Humans were cursed by God. In the setting they desired the long lives of the Elves and Sauron used that against them. The wars of Arda stretch back to the first age, when Sauron was merely a lieutenant rather than a Dark Lord.

Humans that have achieved redemption however have absurd power levels in the setting, however there are also descendents of the Numenorians who embraced their curse, becoming Black Numernorians who serve Sauron, sharing in their master's hatred for the creations of Illuvatar.

> it's ridiculous looking.

That's because of your perspective of reality. The Dawn Age of Arda was a psychedelic kamikaze of music and primal forces. Humongous creatures like Ancalagon could be said to be a manifestation of the song of the Ainur.

god*

>Humans were cursed by God
Nope. Mortality was a gift, but the lies of melkor and sauron twisted the men into thinking it was a curse.

Are the Valar Gods?

They're certainly in a league of their own.

The curse was falling from Illuvatar's favour.

Humans were never cursed by god, they were given the gift of death but only the Numenoreans decided to piss in Eru's cereal.
He trapped the host sent against Aman and rounded Middle-earth sinking Numenor. The dark men were relatively unaffected.

They were thrown from their island paradise and into a death struggle with the forces of corruption.

It's a Garden of Eden story.

>some guys in an island off in bumfuck nowhere anger god and get punished
>I, a man living somewhere eating nuts in northern wilderland, am also guilty despite not knowing anything about this nor being one of the guilty
Let's also not forget that humans aren't "redeemed" to become stronger, bloodline has a lot to do with it. Even someone cruel like Castamir was a mighty long-lived man while the likes of Eomer are considered lesser men.

The Numenorians were the pinnacle of human civilization, something that would only later be emulated when Aragorn rose to the throne of Gondor.

Though you may be content with your nuts and your simple life, you are about as inconsequential as the hobbits.

There was no garden of eden story.
Men went west because orcs and worse were eating them, helped fight off (or with) Morgoth once they ran out of room to run, we're given an island and lots of knowledge to do cool shit, they then wanted to stop dying and took a dump on god's porch.
This is just the Numenoreans, there were a lot more men.

The Dawn Age of Arda was way, WAY before you have Ancalagon, which is towards the end of the First Age, and much more "grounded" in 5th century Northern European norms, customs, people, and powers. It does not fit with a mountain sized dragon.

The Numenoreans are irrelevant, god never cursed mankind.

And a lot of them were already corrupted, too. However;

> The island was brought up from the sea as a gift from the Valar to the Edain, the Fathers of Men who had stood with the Elves of Beleriand against Morgoth in the War of Wrath.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Númenor

They earned those lands. It's not like they simply squatted.

Faggot

> have the greatest civilization of your culture to have ever existed and ever will existed wiped off the map.
> not a curse.

I think our ideas of curses might be different.

It's not a curse, it's a punishment.
The survivors made one fine realm.

Which is why I said "helped fight against Morgoth".

I don't understand how you fail to see how a punishment can be in itself a curse. To fall from grace is no light a thing.

> "Helped fight"
> "Helped Defeat".

ftfy.

The valar did most of the work.
As for curse, user Numenor's fall was a blessing.
This world-wide tyrannical dictatorship that kidnapped so many innocents to sacrifice at the altar of Morgoth under Sauron's command was no more.

The corruption of Melkor was no fault of Man, user.

Was Ungoliant really big or is that a phrase taken wrong?

But a giant spider that was about to devour a literal god/devil is kosher? Ungoliant was definitely in the dawn age I believe.

Sauron, Melkor was cast off into the gates of night at that point.
Point is when the Numenoreans were good they made the world they ruled good, when they were seduced by a newhalf in skimpy leather thongs in a dungeon to be dicks then things got out of hand.
But it was definitely the fault of the Numenoreans and their pride.

That's after she had devoured the trees of light that were basically acting as suns for Arda considering at that time it was a flat disk rather than a globe. It took a host of Balrogs to defeat her at that point, and she basically curbstomped Melkor.

No one knows her origin for sure, however her powers at least put her on the same standing as a Maiar. Melkor fucked up by letting her eat the trees.

And their pride caused them to fall from the favour of the Valar and Eru. To lose the support of such beings is pretty fucking bad.

Seriously just a giant spider fuckingg APPEARED and nobody has any idea where she came from? Is she fucking a fucking old one?

She's probably in a way similar to Tom, a "foreign" story, originally from a completely different mythos, that got wrapped into the Arda mythos, and then badly.

Her "devouring" is mostly some sort of attack on the inner light (for the trees and gems) or the fea. It does not necessitate her being physically huge.

It's unsourced, but I have a text that suggests that "It is also said that she came from the darkness above the skies of Arda, leading some to believe that she may be an incarnation of darkness or emptiness itself".

I suppose for there to be song there must also be silence...

Their pride made them jealous of the elves, and they stopped coming to Numenor. That's the point of no return.

I get your sauce
you are a gentleman and a scholar user

>a horror in spider form
Shit.

in addendum "Even Tulkas, the strongest of the Valar, was unable to break through it when he pursued Melkor and Ungoliant from Valinor.".

Her power rivals that of the Valar, which are basically greater deities in the setting.

tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Unlight

Good thing the bitch ate herself.

Fucking Tolkien man. That glorious bastard really knows how to make a story that simulate real life myths.

Why is there a giant spider of darkness? Why were there already existing spider demons for her to mate with? Fucking TOM BOMBADIL, who is he? And the idea myths that make no sense to a proto Anglo culture, because they came from Saxons and or Danes, mucking up the original story.(Just a fake example)

Lagiacrus sized.

Unconfirmed. It is possible she is lying in wait for the (now non-canon) Final Battle(tm).

she just walked alway one day and disappeared

I though the dagor dagorath was still canon but without the good guys being destined to win it.

To be fair if she is a creature of everlasting darkness it's possible she was merely just a shadow of reality in the first place.

Which also suggests a root cause of Melkor's corruption.

One of the author's relatives said Tolkien didn't fancy it anymore apparently.

Silver da best.

She's an ancient entity from outside Arda, that came in when/after the world was sung into being with the Song of the Ainur. An eldritch abomination in perhaps similar fashion to but on a greater order than those dark things gnawing on the roots of the world that Gandalf says the Balrog feared when they landed down there during their fight.

He toppled several mountain peaks that were larger than Mount Everest just by FALLING on them. He was fucking gigantic, even at his lowest approximated sizes.

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Would Gandalf make a better dark lord than Sauron?