/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

I do know how Mage works, which is why it makes me wanna pull out my hair when other people get it so wrong. And mostly its other magefags who get it wrong while they don't fucking realize how the game works.

Its almost like they are actually trolls getting it wrong on purpose to make the thread go to shit.

Magefags are really good at baiting.

This is just a guess of mine though.
They could actually be retarded.

im going to shield myself from gravity and jump into space nau!

People have different rules for how mage works because mage is that sort of game where people have their own ideas.

Don't 6+ entities also use Imperial Magic?

Make sure to put some factors into duration for good measure

As soon as you add rules for "creative thaumaturgy" there are going to be creative differences and therefore arguments.

They do. Which is why Rank 6+ Entities are fucking scary. In most cases they can even get away with using it without doing a millennium's worth of paperwork

equivalent but not magic

DaveB has said no to this a bunch of times.

Imperial Magic is the purview of Archmages.
Rank 6+ Influences can mimic them narrowly.

>Don't 6+ entities also use Imperial Magic?

No, most have Influences or similar abilities that, within a specific purview, create effects comparable to the Imperial Practices.

When Luna uses her purview to shatter the minds of everything on the current moon side of Earth, she isn't using Transfiguration. She's using something similar, but not.

Same with the Gentry using not-Entities to convert unlucky humans wandering into the Hedge into Changelings

Morality Question for Mages:

1. If a mage uses Mind Magic to convince a sleeper to have sex with them, is it rape? Y/N - Why?

2. If a mage uses Time Magic to keep going back in time until they have a perfect conversation with a sleeper and have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N - Why?

3. If a mage uses Life Magic to make themselves emit potent pheromones to lure sleepers to have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N - Why?

Wizards can do whatever the fuck they want because they're wizards.

This is a stupid question.

Picked up The Book of Chantries, Digital Web, and The Book of Worlds from my FLGS the other day. Nice to finally get some explanation on how the Digital Web works for Mages. Anyone ever go to the DW as Virtual Adepts or something? How was it?

^This. A billion times this.

>1. If a mage uses Mind Magic to convince a sleeper to have sex with them, is it rape? Y/N - Why?

Yes, because the Sleeper is not able to consent of their own volition.

>2. If a mage uses Time Magic to keep going back in time until they have a perfect conversation with a sleeper and have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N - Why?

No, because the Sleeper is giving consent.

>3. If a mage uses Life Magic to make themselves emit potent pheromones to lure sleepers to have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N - Why?

Yes, because the Sleeper is not able to consent of their own volition.

Not really sure what you're trolling for, but fuck off.

So if I used Spirit Transfiguration to give myself a rank 8 Influence of, let's say, Pride n' Pestilence, would my Seeker character still be bound by the set limitations of Transfiguration?

It's not technically Transfiguration, so I'm curious.

this and #2 is like you changing your own behaviour. At worst it's pickup-artist skeevy (insincere change) and at best you're actually learning to be not shitty to someone like a non-autistic person should be able to. In this sense it's like a crutch for a disabled person.

I too thought about all the ways i could rape people when i first read mage..

or was that changing breeds..

Not trolling - genuine question.

I agree with your view on the 1st and 2nd situation, but I disagree with the 3rd. If you took magic out of the equation and just had a person who smelled super nice because of pheromones, does that mean everyone they have sex with is being raped?

>Its almost like they are actually trolls getting it wrong on purpose to make the thread go to shit.

Now this is a Mystery worthy of a mage's time

Range limit is still there, but you could probably do anything related to those two purviews on a whim, just like Luna or another rank 8/9 being.

It's not Supernal magic though, so it won't garner anything great in the long run, assuming you're going for Ascension.

I'm gonna answer this as both the mages I've played: Thunderhead, an Obrimos ex-veteran with a purple heart and a bronze star and Wizkid, a Mastigos programmer girl and unrepentant pervert

T -
>If a Mage uses Mind Magic to convince a sleeper to have sex with them, is it rape? Y/N and why?

Yes. By forcing a person's mind to change you take away their agency.

>If a mage uses Time Magic to go back in time until they have a perfect conversation with a sleeper and have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N and why?

No, but that doesn't mean it isn't at least a little creepy. Still it means there was a possible way they'd say yes, you are just fishing for that yes.

>If a mage uses Life Magic to make themselves emit potent pheromones to lure sleepers to have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N and why?

Yes, because that's basically drugging someone to have sex with you.

Wiz -
>If a Mage uses Mind Magic to convince a sleeper to have sex with them, is it rape? Y/N and why?

Depends on whether they used Compelling or Ruling. If Compelling they would have done it anyways so you are basically fast forwarding things. Ruling takes away their choice. And yes, if a Compelling worked on me to make me want to sleep with someone, then I wouldn't be mad. Doesn't mean I won't think you are at least a little bit creepy though

>If a mage uses Time Magic to go back in time until they have a perfect conversation with a sleeper and have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N and why?

Yes, as that is save scumming and can never be forgiven.

>If a mage uses Life Magic to make themselves emit potent pheromones to lure sleepers to have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N and why?

Yes. You are basically drugging someone at that point. They didn't consent to get spiked with your pheromones.

Tell the thread a story about a time your chronicle went outside its regional comfort zone because in mine we're trapped in the GM's kind of shitty custom city

youtube.com/watch?v=-r8jlHDBMsw

>Yes, as that is save scumming and can never be forgiven.

Genuinely lol'd.

>Yes, because that's basically drugging someone to have sex with you.
>Yes. You are basically drugging someone at that point. They didn't consent to get spiked with your pheromones.

Fuck, this has got my wheels turning. Where do you draw the line? I mean, if the Mage buffed their smell to a natural human limit on pheromones, would that still be fine until they stepped over the limit into inhumanely good smelling? Or is it the moment they use magic to boost their chances that it becomes rape?

>>If a mage uses Life Magic to make themselves emit potent pheromones to lure sleepers to have sex with them, is that rape? Y/N and why?

>Yes, because that's basically drugging someone to have sex with you.
>really good perfume is rape

So both of your characters were permavirgins then?

What if the life mage didn't go the pheromone route, but just made themselves look super, ridiculously good looking?

>psudo-science bullshit

bbc.com/future/story/20160509-the-tantalising-truth-about-sex-pheromones

Replace pheromones with 'just smells really, really, distinctively nice' then, if it helps.

>Exercise, good food, and healthy living make sex rape

Nah, Thunderhead got laid in highschool, went into the military and proceeded to not get any for his entire time in the military for reasons of time and chance and shit. When the character retired he probably got all the sex he was missing out on for that good 2 tours of duty. Moved in with a sleeper kid (no not the kid you sick fuck) and his caretaker who had the hots for him.

Wizkid was completely sexually liberated. Even if she was a total dork she still had Striking Looks 1 and social secondary. Getting laid for her was fairly simple, and she liked to do so often. Never used magic on a sleeper though. A Sleepwalker who's fetish was being the target of slightly hubristic, lewd magic on the other hand...

Well, if they ever wore a really nice perfume then they are hardcore unapologetic mega-rapists according to their own metric. Since that's all available science suggests human pheromones even are.

>the permavirgin was you all along, user

Anything that over-rides a persons free will is violating it, and would therefore be rape.

Looking good and smelling nice? No problem.
Looking so good and smelling so nice that people literally cannot fight back their desires? Bad ju-ju.

I'd actually argue that the Be Kind, Rewind time approach is massively rapey.

Read, fool.

T - I don't see something wrong with that. Its something you are changing about yourself then, that is your choice

Wiz - Yeah that's fine.

OOC: I see how fucking weird this question gets and how quickly it does so. Now the line for me is "Does this override a person's ability to choose on a level comparable to getting someone drunker than they expected or some theoretical aphrodisiac making someone incredibly horny". If it does act more like a drug then its rape, but if its just "really good smelling perfume" like other anons have said then that's perfectly fine. Mostly because I have never smelled a perfume I've enjoyed the smell of enough to want to smell it for more than 5 seconds though but that's just me and I know I have a weird sense of smell

Thunderhead - Wait, we're talking about perfume now? I thought you meant like pheromones like what my buddy Woodstock could do to make birds and animals come close to you at the park without running off.

Wizkid - Perfumes are fine, but when we get into the realm of magic you gotta be careful what you are doing. If you are just using Life to make yourself smell good, that's one thing, but that better be all your Imago does. The second it starts triggering a person's brain to make the mind be overridden by the body you are crossing a line.

Are you literally retarded?

Did I somehow mention the concept of pheromones when I wasn't looking? Did the letters arrange themselves in the middle of my sentence to trigger your pseudo-science erection?

Or did I perhaps say that making yourself look and smell nice is morally fine, but doing something WITH FUCKING MAGIC that overrides a persons will and violates their freedom of choice is a BAD THING?

Did I in some way imply to your tiny autistic mind that pheromones are somehow going to make you irresistible? Or did I perhaps make a blanket statement suggesting that ANYWAY you choose to make yourself look or smell so good as to be literally irresistible is BAD?

For arguments sake I'd just figure out a way to somehow sweat cocaine and wait for the addicts.

Lynx is rapey

Yeah, but we already knew that.

fml how 2 embed on4chan

Having sex with sleepers is the mage equivalent of a person fucking a dog.

This is a beautiful post

This made me realise for the first time that Mage-on-Mage sex would be really fucking weird.

More like fucking the disabled.
Fucking Sleepwalkers is like fucking a callgirl, or some other form of cheap lay.
Fucking Werewolves is like fucking a dog.

I like to think of archmasters and the pax as like the Ancients and Ori from Stargate/Atlantis.

The majority just hang about in the upper planes not interfering but once in awhile some asshat decides to try ruin everything and all shit breaks loose, they fight via proxies and shit then it gets sorted and happens all over again and again and again..

T and Wiz - Mysterium pls go
I feel violated user

same dude, i actually mine alot of shit from stargate sg1 and atlantis for ideas. It has ascended beings, and all sorts of wierd shit that is right up Mages alley.

Wouldn't that turn the Archmage into a spirit, removing his Arcana and other Supernal privileges?

Sleepers are unenlightened baboons that don't know what good or bad for them. If a mage wants to sexually slum it with the monkeys or anything else, not only should they consider themselves quite fortunate, but if the mage, as the far more advanced being, decides something should occur, consent in supernally implied.

My fellow Wise really need to stop drinking the Free Council Kool-Aid.

Also, lest there be any confusion, sexual intercourse with werewolves is bestiality, and worse, relations with vampires is necrophilia.

Honestly its more like a Mage having sex with a Sleeper/Sleepwalker is more like having sex with someone who has an extra, fully functioning limb

>Mage-on-Mage sex would be really fucking weird

Mage-on-Mage sex would be really fuckin' fantastic. The possibilities are quite literally endless.

no its like adding a sub template with the powers of a spirit but not actually being a spirit dumbass, you graft them on to you.

I fail to see how an Archmage giving himself influences will determine just what he is. You might even ask why he shouldn't just give himself Luna's influences and replace her.

>Archmasters
>The majority just hang about in the upper planes not interfering

Quite the opposite. Archmasters are always trying to change reality to fulfil their Omens and ascend.

dont remind me of dolphin of dolphin shapechange sex....

You were one of those Mages who supported Hitler, weren't you?

>a mage wants to sexually slum it with the monkey
>consent in supernally implied
>werewolves is bestiality,
>vampires is necrophilia

1. You're flipping back and forth on your views.
2. This kinda thinking is how we get Magic Space Aids.

interfering in other archmage shit, you can obv rewrite the fallen world as much as you like but as soon as you step on another archmasters pet project you have to fix it

>You might even ask why he shouldn't just give himself Luna's influences and replace her

Archmages can't lengthen Transfiguration, nor can they give it to others.

You would probably be able to get away with it for about 1 spell, and then immediately get slapped on the wrists assuming you did nothing too crazy, and from there be expected to act with those powers within the Pax

says who fuck face, you even read ?

>mage relations with vampires is necrophilia

You know, snorting magic cocaine of the ass of a vampire stripper does always just lead to her becoming a lawn chair (at least not right away, unless she's into that).

Those vamps are mysterious and sexy-times powers. What good and dedicated mage wouldn't investigate?

Influences aren't Imperial Practices. An Archmage of Spirit applying 'total control over madness, change and the moon' to himself isn't extending (because it's not Transfiguration) or giving it to anybody.

It's a clever workaround regarding the nine dot Imperial Practice.

Just remember your Death Shielding protection.

I'd like to gain that Arcane Experience if you know what I mean

>Just remember your Death Shielding protection.

Prime 2: Supernal Condom

All the sexy-times, no blood magic rape.

Aren't high ranking Influences rather specific in function compared to that of the broad Arcana?

Gods and their respective Influences aren't exclusively spirit in nature either, so couldn't you do the same thing using the other Arcana?
Such as Fate Transfiguration giving you the Influence of Narrative or even Destiny. Or Death giving you dominion over Decay, Entropy, Endings, etc.

If she touches your wand, be careful not to "flare your nimbus" too soon.

>Premature conjuration effects over 40% of mages at some point in their magical careers. Don't be too embarrassed to ask for help.

if you have influence: death then how is that rather specific?

Until this happened archive.is/Jr6lz

I had an Archmage PC create a oracular staff of total control over gravity once. It was "Transfiguration in an item" relating to 'Gravity' as its purview, more or less.

Looking back, maybe he should have enchanted himself with such power instead of the nearest walking stick. Perhaps he would have gotten away with it too, had it not been for those pesky Pax whoring Siddha.

...

Good thing that T looks nothing like that guy

Tricky. Though Death to a god might be something completely different to a Archmage of Death.

I'm saying this because of how esoteric Death has become in 2e, shadows cold and endings, whatnot.

Actually that reminds me.

There is a Daeva lounge singer NPC in my groups game and she likes to bat her eyes to get what she wants and on the rare occasion that fails she's not afraid to use Majesty.

I had the chance to analyze her using the power with Mage-Sight and I know the discipline is a Mind effect.

But I also have access to Death. Would Mind or Death shielding be a better insurance policy? Or would either work as well.

Mind would be the better catch against it, but you could also use Death with some reach, it just means there is more reach you gotta use in the spell

Death, it'll also catch every other Vampire power.

Mind shield. She is under the purview of death, disciplines are powered by the purview of death but its a mind/mental effect not a death effect.

Same reason death shield wont protect you from a vampires claws..

wrong shut up faggot.

>Majesty

>Poor man's Dominate

Transfiguration isn't permanent, retards. You can't extend it.

Page 39
Fucking read it FFS

Any direct effect can be countered using a power which protects against its power status.
It's the principle that Wards and Sigils runs on.

Blow me asshole.
A direct death-based power can be protected against with Death Shielding.

Won't help against claws or fangs, but it will against Vampire mind control.

Vampires shouldn't be using Vampire rules in a Mage game. Find what's actually equivalent to the power in the ruleset you're using. Just being in WoD isn't auto-compatibility.

I'd say both would work in this instance. Since it's a direct effect Death would be valid.

Nobody is saying anything about extending it, dumb fuck. We're looking at the various way to circumvent its limitations.

The results ARE permanent.

Of course it isn't.
What you do however, is.
And granting yourself lesser, non-Awakened powers counts.

this thread is one big fucking tumor

I agree.
But nowhere else can I call someone else a worthless cunt when they start spewing shit.