/5eg/ - Fifth Edition General

Probably, but I might ask about the character and why specifically a wererat. Just to get a sense of what he's about and how he may or may not fit in with the group.

Sorcerer is your best bet.
Bard and warlock work too, but they're best used for a small splash of bard/warlock for shillelagh and then rest of the levels in paladin.

Also going paladin to 11 is great for two more auras and improved divine smite.

I would heavily try to dissuade you from such character, because neither goblin nor wererat are supposed to be good guys.

Our party mostly needs the utility so I was leaning bard, and going order of whispers as it would fit the way my character thinks.

All sorcerer gives is those sorcery points what do you really get?

Oh, just for a bit of detail, this would be for an "Evil" Campaign.

if it's evil then it seems fine by me.

>All sorcerer gives is those sorcery points what do you really get?
Twinned booming blade or quickened booming blade / green flame blade.
Works better if you don't have PAM.
You can then also convert spell slots for more sorcerery points for more quickened/twinned BB/GFBs.

If your party just needs magical utility, ritual caster (wizard) should be able to do some of that. If you need non-out-of-combat utility, more levels of paladin gets you stuff like aura of vitality.

I guess you could go for bard and pick up shillelagh at level 6 in that though. It has good skill utility if you don't have a rogue.

yeah we lost our rouge so it was the skills we need. but I also like having the mantle of whispers and stuff and adding venom blades stacked on my smites would be fun

>retrain fiendish vigor?
>a pirate
>Retraining the Invocations that turns rum into health potions

For shame

>That feel when quickened spell

Even quickening cantrips is fucking retardedly overpowered as fuck. Like, holy fucking shit, I'm Booming Blading this stupid fucking asshole for basically free. Holy shit, this guy is absolutely fucking dead from 2d8+3 at level 5, what the fuck

Still sounds like lore bard would be better for +3 skills and cutting words being brilliant but eh
I can't recall but there might be some synergy in one of those non-valor melee bards

Though I'd take cutting words over dealing a bit of extra poison damage any day

Quicken Action Surge EB is 6d10+30.

>He thinks Sorcerer is OP
Really makes you think

Warlock.
At level 1you get
>Short Rest Smite Slots
>Eldritch Blast cantrip (as a Paladin, your number 1 weakness is range) and Hex
>SCAG cantrips, like Booming blade
>Levels 2
Invocations
>Level 3
Either ritual cast all rituals in the game, including familiar, and acquire both the guidance and the Shillelagh cantrip
Or
Get a pretty baller sword
And
Level 2 smites on a short rest

And on top of that, enjoy subclass features ah lá carte

Any of you want to help me with deciding on possibly multiclassing a character?

Is there a better combo than paladin/warlock?

should i only dip 3 levels or go all in with the warlock?

Wererat also adds in the immunity to all nonmagical / nonsilvered weapons. I might allow it if it fits the game I was running, but probably nerf your character in some way so that it balances out and you are not overpowered in comparison to other characters in the party.

Sorcerer is definitely fun

Oh, I didn't even notice that. Damn. In any case, I'd be fine with those resistances being removed entirely, for one reason or another. Appreciate you pointing that out.

Nigga, quickening shit is intense as fuck. It's like I'm taking five rounds in two rounds. It's fucking crazy. I'm dealing so much fucking damage. My LITERALLY 8 int character has become the party leader because I FUCKING KILL EVERYTHING.

Dip no more than 3

don't downplay chain, it's strictly better than the regular version of familiar

So you can cast one normal spell and a cantrip or two cantrips in one turn (Level/2) times a long rest. Big fucking deal? You could have also used those points to get more spell slots instead or something, but no, you wanted to cast some cantrip again.
Outside of that, you're a worse wizard.

It's powerful with agonizing-repelling-slowing eldritch blast, yes, but that's multiclassing bullshit.
It's pretty okay with GFB/BB but you're not really a proper melee combatant anyway and you'll be turned to paste if an enemy wishes it.

>A short dip in a class that uses the exact same stats as your base class and thematically fits 100% is "muticlassing bullshit"

>A dip into warlock makes you better than any other warlock at the same level at the thing warlocks are supposed to be good at

I've only been playing D&D for two years, all of it 5e. Playing a Wizard was the single worst experience with the game I've ever had. They literally can't do anything. But now, now I can nova, unlike a paladin, I'm not reliant on crits. I can cast, and cast again, and utterly devastate a battlefield. My last session, it was my party versus one vampire spawn, seven acolytes and a souped up acolyte. In two rounds, two rounds! I slaughtered six of the acolytes and their leader. The remaining acolyte was killed by ally fire and the vampire spawn got focus fired like a chump. It was exhilarating! Two quickened Thunderwaves cleared the vast majority of the fight! The power, the rush! You would downplay it?! The only thing that comes close was when I was a Cleric concentrating on Spirit Guardians with an ally Fly on me literally strafing above enemies.

Is there a Mega for older editions?

It's good to see you're having fun but we exist here to crush your fun, and the longer you stay the more you'll realize the truth.

Firstly, when you quickened thunderwave, what did you do with your action?

>[Wizards] literally can't do anything.
A well-played Wizard can literally do everything.

it's certainly the most fun in terms of potential builds/fluff and strikes a good balance in terms of effectiveness

but that's more because of how limited most other classes and builds are in this game

Check the OSR Mega Trove or the Dnd rem/uz or wherever it's called.

Any ideas of what to do with a 5th level party on the Sword Coast?

But paladin 2/Sorcerer X is op

Discover a nefarious plot to draw surrounding nations into war and sell them arms and armor for massive armor, which is only a cover for the real plot, wherein a demigod of murder will use the resulting slaughter to fuel his ascendance and claim his father's power?

It's good, but I wouldn't call it OP.
Merely a sidegrade.

>They literally can't do anything
They have the most versatility as long as you know what you are doing and what spells to pick. For example if you are picking no rituals and a bunch of strong concentration spells, you aren't going to be doing fuck all except concentrating on a spell and casting cantrips

I've a Goliath Paladin who really, really wants an Allosaurus Find Steed mount.

I've been thinking about making it a bit of a quest to 1. Find an allosaurus. This will be difficult, since there are none on their current continent and would require them travel to one of the "lost world" islands which are difficult to find and gene then they'd have to track it.

2. Have the paladin somehow befriend the beast. Hard to say how this will work but I'll leave the options open to see what the player come say up with.

3. Conduct some type of ritual that'll turn the Allosaurus into a celestial find Steed mount. Again, not sure on details for this specifically. Maybe the Paladin requires permission from some kind of celestial being such as a Deva for this to happen?

Is this a good idea? An allosaurus is better than a warhorse, but I've played with this player for a long time and fully trust them to not abuse the power. And with the party at level 10 going into n to 11 it doesn't seem like it'd be drastically overpowering.

>Multiclass is OP
Breaking news!

>Two quickened Thunderwaves
user, I...

Just use a downgraded allosaurus until later it gets an upgrade.

Kidnap some short quests from something else. Storm King's Thunder has a lot of adventurous stuff in chapter 3.

"The Sacred Stone Monastery" or "The Long Road" from Princes of the Apocalypse could work, if you wanted.

Those are just from published things. I'm sure you could get more if you needed.

Either he thinks you can cast two spells in the same turn, he's doing booming blade + thunderwave which doesn't work or he seems to think that a cantrip+spell is a big deal somehow.

So I'm playing a 10th level gunslinger fighter (the variant made by Mercer) who is becoming the champion of a death goddess (more taking care of the souls and the repository of knowledge than anything else) and I'm trying to decide between just continuing on as a fighter or taking a dip into either cleric (likely war with the proficiencies changed to that of knowledge with the DM selecting them for me), paladin (probably not enough for an oath but maybe vengeance or crown), or warlock (probably a variant of celestial or undying light patron). If it's relevant my current stats in order are 13, 20, 14, 15, 18, 13.

Part of my issue with dipping is that I want higher level fighter features and it doesn't quite fit the character since he's spent his life as a mercenary, acting as little more than a sword, and his parents were both casters (forge cleric and a gunslinger ranger, my DM allows rangers to take the archetype) which led to him trying and failing to use it himself.

You see, that's where you're wrong. You are confusing your role as a part of Veeky Forums with your role in Veeky Forums as a whole. And I guarantee you, I've been on Veeky Forums longer than 95% of the posters here have been.

As for my action, it was over three rounds. First round I ran up, cast Guiding Bolt, missed, then bonus actioned Tempestuous Magic for ten more feet of movement. Second round was Booming Blade, 2d8+3 damage, instantly killing an acolyte, then quickened level 3 Thunderwave to kill three more acolytes. Third round was quickened level 3 Thunderwave to kill the leader and two more acolytes, then Sacred Flame on the vampire spawn, who succeeded on his save. Overall, I won the fight 80% singlehandedly. Not that I had wanted to, but it makes me giddy that I had.

I literally shat myself with utility, but I could do literally nothing. I could blame it on shitty DM, but I feel that's a copout. Wizards are memes.

Their versatility is dependent completely on the setting. No matter what the DM threw at me, no matter how prepared I was, I couldn't handle it, while six or seven rounds of the attack action from our martials could. I was helpless. I didn't have enough spell slots to shield for five rounds of combat every combat. There was nothing I could do.

What's wrong with quickening Thunderwave one round, then quickening it another round?

It IS a big deal, in my two years of playing 5e, I have not done this level of damage save for the scarce times I've critted as a paladin. I'm at literally shitting damage levels. It's completely insane.

How do you go about saying specific words in a language? Say you wanted to tell a player that the command word is the dwarven word for "Burn" would you just say the command word is the dwarven word for burn? Just come up with a random word?

>What's wrong with quickening Thunderwave one round, then quickening it another round?

>DM doesn't follow 6-8 encounters guidelines, caster is OP!
Who would have know?

How do you guys handle betting for Fighting Pits, Coliseums, or Battle Arenas?

That was the first session of the night, I had 0 spell slots for the "boss" session of the night, so I cantripped it for the final boss. Our Warlock had full spell slots however, so he Feared half the giants and made them run away, turning a completely deadly encounter into a mildly challenging one.

But yeah, you're right, your completely faggoty way of playing the game is the absolute way to play it, and there is no need for variation or thought in theorycraft, just compliance. Go fuck yourself.

Our role isn't really to crush your fun, but that's what will happen when you come to realize the truth.

The truth is, if you run 5e the way it's supposed to be run, all classes should feel great with a good DM.
If the game is run the way it's supposed to be run with a bad DM, some classes such as the sorcerer will feel lackluster.
If you run the game in the wrong way with a bad DM, you get shit like the wizard doing nothing because the DM insists on 7 round combat with nothing but 'attack'.

So let's start with the damage. You can do at levels 1-4 1d8+3 damage with booming blade without having to make yourself MAD with a slight possible extra 1d8 and you can do 2d8 in a small area with thunderwave.
That's great for some level 1 encounters, I guess.
But until level 4 you can only really quicken one spell. A day. Unless you waste more spell slots.
And it still costs you spell slots.

Once you hit level 5 you get fireball which completely overshadows your thunderwave damage. It does four times as much damage.
And you can't cast two fireballs at once.
And the wizard can cast fireball too, on top of their 'shitting themselves with utility'. But at least booming blade does +1d8.

But, anyway, here's the big thing:
You only get so many spells every long rest.
In a proper game, you don't rest constantly.
The fighter can do 2d6+26 damage without action surge at will or 3d6+39 with it every short rest, yet once you expend your slots you can't even do rituals.

People talk about paladin/warlock where you dip into one class and go all the way in another, but can a more proper hybrid work where each class has a pretty large investment?

As a real character I mean, not "you can do this cool thing at level 20" charop nonsense

I.. I feel my post is pretty incoherent but maybe I'll polish it up more with your response, but, essentially:

Sorcerer is like wizard but shittier, but can twin spells/cast spells a bit faster. That's it. Wizard is great for all their utility that helps in the many non-combat encounters. Sorceresr get little of that.
Sorcerer generally feels like it plays well for new players because nobody who starts on a wizard realizes what they can do.
So when you see someone say 'sorcerer is great!' it feels like they're not really playing as the system intended.

>Go fuck yourself.
Literally no arguments, so he must call others faggot

Whoops, I meant a fighter at level 4 can do 2d6+26 at-will with a total of +2 to hit.

Look I am absolutely the biggest sorcerer fanboy, but they are not that strong. They have shit amounts of spells to choose from, get shit amounts of them compared to the wizard knowing every fucking spell and every ritual under the son. Sorcerer uses its Sorcerer points a fuck load in their class abilities so going around twining everything or quickening shit isn't economical. Now what the Sorcerer can do, that Wizards can't is cool shit like twinning Haste and making your martials go berserk, or twinning things like Blight and fucking things up.

Right, so, you're a player who only feels powerful if he gets massive burst such as with paladin critsmites and gets to roll a lot of damage in a turn, but doesn't care if it fucks them over in the long run.

I'd recommend trying paladin2/sorcererX, it sounds right up your ally.

I've actually been inspired to rip off the Amonkhet setting for the desert area I hadn't done anything for in my setting. Going to make it ruled over by their Gods who are actually just powerful Liches doing the whole "Undead Army of the best" that Bolas is doing.

In order to make my players uncertain and not too quick to say that the gods are fakes, does it make sense for the Liches to be able to have Warlocks and Favored Souls serving them?

Could just use an actual language like Gaelic or something

undying warlock pact on the scag is a pact with a lich look that one up for you worlocky things

I have prepared for this moment, that's how.

- Abyssal: Tolkienesque Black Speech
- Aquan: Hawaiian
- Auran: Basque
- Celestial: Hebrew
- Common: English
- Draconic: Sumarian
- Druidic: Irish Gaelic
- Dwarven: Icelandic
- Elven : Sindarin
- Genie: Arabic
- Giant : German
- Goblin: Spanish (Goblin/Bugbear - Mexican; Hobgoblin - Castillian/Old World)
- Gnoll: [dog barking sounds]
- Gnome: Dutch
- Halfling: Esperanto
- Ignan: Japanese
- Infernal: Latin
- Orc: Klingon
- Sphinx: Ancient Egyptian
- Sylvan: Welsh
- Terran: Greek
- Undercommon: Cthulhu-esque speech

I need help deciding a build for a conspiracy crackpot Divination wizard. A real loony guy who's convinced "mighty powers" are ruling and ruining his life from the shadows and that mastering divination is the only way to foil and expose their schemes. it's not necessarily a meta thing but maybe it can be.

anyway I can't pick between these two builds. help me decide, /5eg/?

High Elf
>STR 8 / DEX 14 (+2) / CON 15 / INT 16 (+1) / WIS 13 / CHA 8
>shortsword proficiency (I just like the idea of him having a shortsword)
>an extra cantrip (probably for prestidigitation)
>fey ancestry, etc.

Variant Human
>STR 8 / DEX 14 / CON 16 (+1) / INT 16 (+1) / WIS 10 / CHA 8
>free Insight proficiency (already getting Investigation, Arcana, Survival, and Perception from class/background)
>Alert feat (+5 to Initiative, can't be surprised while conscious, hidden enemies don't get advantage on me)

I disagree entirely. In my experience, the Sorc does everything the Wiz does, but extremely better. Metamagic is absolutely fucking retarded and breaks everything wide open. So the Wizard learns two spells a level, nobody gives a shit because you can't actually cast them due to level restrictions, and trying to fit that many ritual spells into so few levels is an absolute chore.

I've been playing for two years, mostly maritals, and now that I'm Sorc/Cleric, I'm shitting damage the likes of which I've never seen before, I'm far outpacing the edgy crossbow expert/sharpshooter character I made with half the levels. It's ridiculous.

That's because I'm not arguing with you, you special snowflake little twink. But you're still a faggot, even without arguments.

Stop for a second, and imagine someone like you, but not a fucking retard, who handles their resources in an economical way. Then you'll have me. Unlike you, I'm not a complete fucking retard and I'm able to figure out not to blow all my shit in the first hour of a six hour session. I mean, this might strike you as high fucking intellect, but that's not the kind of thing that sane people do.

Good questions. I guess it all depends on the flavor you're going for.

The thing about these types of combats is that they're spectator sports. So you can't just have a messy, confusing, clustered "real" battle... so there need to be some rules.
Things like 1v1 battles
A "Royal Rumble" type thing where it's a free-for-all where only one must be left standing.
And one I've been tinkering with, a "last team standing" type of multi-1v1 battles, where two teams fight with each members doing a separate 1v1 battle, and then when one fighter drops another, he waits until one of his team drops so he can step in and try to finish off the adversary that dropped his teammate, and so forth until one team is left standing.

If they're not "to the death" type combats there could be referees and such to stop the fight when it's clear an adversary can't keep fighting/is close to death...

Lots of options, I hope what I've provided helps.

I would like to see your current character's spell list, if it please you.

>Newbie DM
>First session, we're all level 1
>Party barbarian is thrown against sci-fi bio-mech soldier
>Three rounds worth of "your attacks don't seem to hurt him, but his shit wrecks your fucking face two ways from tomorrow"
>DM says super soldier decides not to kill you, despite it going against the bloodthirsty monster of an NPC he had built
>That feel when it wasn't even my character, but someone else at the table, but I'm still disgusted

Kind of at least in terms of what I can do with future fights. I'm trying to figure out a system for bettings, how much should a person gain for betting x amount of Gold, how much does the house and bookies get.

I really don't get what you're getting about this.

The sorcerer gets metamagic which can potentially make more spells or be used to cast those spells faster.
The wizard gets arcane recovery to make more spells.

So, if you use your sorcery points to quicken, you have less spells than the wizard.

When you quicken, you get to cast a cantrip.
A cantrip for +1d8+3 damage or +1d10 damage or at level 5 +2d8+3 damage or +2d10 damage.
That hardly seems like a big deal in the slightest. Twice a long rest you can do +8 damage? Wow?

And what did you sacrifice to get that? You sacrificed great archetype features such as portent, you have a much more limited spell selection (Which can matter when you find things to apply those spells to - find familiar for example allowing you to essentially give somebody advantage without any actions every round, tenser's floating disk for carrying more loot, alarm for camp protection, tiny hut for more rest protection, identify so you can always work out wha teverything is, detect magic to avoid all the magical traps.. And so forth) and ...
Well, I guess dragon sorcerer gives you mage armour without a level 1 spell slot?

I could understand if you said 'Look, I can twin haste!' because that's pretty damn good, but really?
'I can cast an extra cantrip once or twice a short rest'?

I've tweaked the Crab theme to take advantage of the parts of the Hydra theme I liked to make this spider abomination.

y/n? Stick with one of the other designs?

This one has an actual Paralysis Gas blaster, which I kinda like.

Never been interested in MTG, but I love the Amonkhet setting and have also decided to rip it off, but focusing entirely on the Naga. Snake dudes are cool.

Whoops, sorry, not short rest, meant long rest.

This is so god damn autistic.

I fucking really love the Hydra one though, I know I plan to steal that if you don't mind.

Holy shit cunt, bring it down a few levels. You can try to be as resourceful as you want, but look you doing an extra 1d10, or 2d10 per round for like what 3 times? That is an amazing increase? Twin Haste is a much better use than quicken ever will be, and twin Blight makes quicken a pile of trash. And dont bring up the argument of changing spell slots over to sorcery points, that is a shitty waste of potential damage throughout the day. I've played sorcerer as my main character for years, in fact sorcerer was my first character ever in DnD, I am the first to defend it to the death, but it is no god class. It is not as bad as people say, but I think you are high on the sorcerer points buddy, just a honeymoon phase.

That's not even all of them.

I realize the Quadrone basically throws the original theme out the window (Well, even more than the rest of them) but I think those should be the most "human" of the basic Modrons.

Forgot to add wizards actually can cast more spells per day which straight pisses me off, why do wizards regain spells on a short rest, that is a pure sorcerer ability.

Oh, I'm a total dope, I somehow missed the word betting in your post.

The thing is betting is mathematically complex and involves the odds given for one fighter over the other (the sure thing is the safe bet but nets you little profit, the underdog is risky but you get a bigger cut)... I guess it all depends on what strikes you as profitable for the house based on how many betters you're putting in there.

I've been thinking about how paladin/warlock order and pact mixes work from a fluff/story standpoint. I've got multiple fun ideas for every combo in core except for the old one. What would lead a paladin to have contact/power from something like that? Does that make any fucking sense?

Not that guy but, what sorc absolutely does better than wizard is direct damage.

They still have the option to drop the encounter-ending save-or-lose spells, but if what's called is doing more damage, they absolutely can do that better than wizards while generally being more resilient.

I hate sorcerers to be honest, I have a choice paralysis every time I try to choose spells, why sorcerers had to learn so few spells?

Vengeance, bargain for more power to smite evil.

You need to spend more time playing then making this stuff. Either that or get work designing monsters for rpgs because these are awesome. I'm not a huge fan of the Quadrone but I love the others. The Tridrone is rad as heck.

I really vote for Hydra over Crab, something about how it looks more dragon like to the weaker humanoid shaped ones just feels cool.

For someone not too knowledgeable about them, are their ones higher ranked then Pentedrones?

>generally being more resilient.
Dragon sorcerer gets +1 hp/level and mage armour. That's hardly being much more resilient.

>doing more damage
Again, you're doing hardly any more damage over the course of a day. If they use all their sorcerery points for more damage, the wizard will then get recovery and get more spells overall which can potentially translate to more damage than the sorcerer unless the sorcerer has a feature like fire dragon sorcerer's bonus damage to fire, in which case.. They definitely do more damage? But it's not enough to justify anything, and if you just want raw at-will damage any martial is better than you.

To highlight how there's only 2-3 spells per level worth learning.

>why do wizards regain spells on a short rest
But they don't, wizards need a long rest to get spell slots back

Paladin Sorc feels lame and weak as shit.

No problem pal.

At level 5, my spells were:

Cleric: Guidance, Sacred Flame, Thaumatury, Bless, Guiding Bolt, Healing Word (Fog Cloud, Thunderwave),
Sorcerer: Booming Blade, Lightning Lure, Thunderclap, Shocking Grasp, Create Bonfire, Shield, Witch Bolt, Feather Fall, Misty Step, Levitate

Because when I was a Wizard I did fuck all and was the least useful member of the party but now as a Sorc4/Cleric1 I am shitting damage nonstop and as an 8 Int am the leader of the party for no logical reason?

Believe you me, I am looking forward to changing spell slots over to be able to quicken more Thundersaves on top of my Booming Blades. It'll be massive, massive fucking damage. It's fucking ridiculous, being able to slam so much damage in such a small space. I'm not really sure how or why you were having 7+rounds of combat at levels five and fewer, but that's kind of sad if you couldn't Witch Bolt them to death at level, or they couldn't simply kill you at that level. Sounds like DM fiat to me if they didn't simply kill you.

Dragon Sorcerer does more damage.... until the Evoker gets to level 9 and does much more damage while also keeping their team safe.

Yes, though not statted for 5e. After Pentadrone they become weird ass monster-things that look like an exceptionally clean GOO or something. Like the next tier up is a giant sphere covered in eyeballs and tentacles with two fat cylinder legs.

Try again

But the edge/vengence "I will use any means to defeat evil" thing is already fiend territory, aint it? GOO is also forbidden knowledge I guess but I dunno if it really rings the same.

The closest to an idea I had was an overzealous devotion paladin that ends up using the detect thoughts and similar spells in order to ensure that people aren't acting bad, but that was more a mechanical justification and doesn't explain how he ended up connected to cuthulu

>I am shitting damage nonstop and as an 8 Int am the leader of the party for no logical reason?

So you're the leader just because you do the most hp damage? I don't think you can use your groups retardation as a point about the system.

>Paladin Sorc feels lame and weak as shit.
It's just about the burstiest thing out there.

>Because when I was a Wizard I did fuck all and was the least useful member of the party but now as a Sorc4/Cleric1 I am shitting damage nonstop and as an 8 Int am the leader of the party for no logical reason?
You did fuckall because your DM was shit and gave the party nothing to do other than 'I attack' in which case even being a sorcerer could potentially suck and you should just suck up to being a generic fighter.
Also, level dips of cleric shouldn't be allowed on no-armour classes (Wizards and sorcerers) because it's just blatant 'I want +10 AC please'. But for what it matters that dip is keeping you from having 8d6 fireballs to throw.

... And again, there's no reason a wizard can't go and cast thunderwave too and be content with not also casting a cantrip on the same turn.