What is the appeal of Low Fantasy?

Don't forget that Euron Greyjoy has basically turned into Sauron with the ironborn as his orcs.
He's even borrowing the eye symbol.

OP or the "low fantasy memers"?

You, probably

Me in what context and role?

For me, a good setting has to make sense. The geography, ecology, the way society works. It doesn't have be 'realistic', just have some depth into it. Being 'low fantasy', 'grimdark', 'gritty' or whatever labels you want to put is completely irrelevant. So, yeah, Westeros is a decent setting, Forgotten Realms is not.

Always and in your normal role as bottom

Yeah but not because Westeros is LF and Forgotten Realms isn't bad because is it high fantasy.

What is the appeal of High Fantasy?
I don't really get it, most of the time high fantasy settings are just medieval fantasy with elves and orcs everywhere and farting fireballs
I like some settings like that but it's always because they have some sort of consistency and grounded measure of reality and not because of the high fantasy
Is that a meme caused by Lords of the Ring and a false perception that there are too low fantasy settings and making a high fantasy setting is somehow enough to be good and original?
Like the fairy-gay manchild memers unironically thinking you can't have fun if it's not filled with magical fairy dust and unicorns all the time and you must be child to ever dare disagree with them?

Hey dipshit, has it ever occurred to you that those settings are fun?

>Is that a meme caused by Games of the Throne and a false perception that there are too high fantasy settings and making a low fantasy setting is somehow enough to be good and original?
>Like the Grim Dark memers unironically thinking you are mature if you are bleak and edgy all the time and you must be a child to ever dare to disagree with them?

100% this. The entire 'low' fantasy fanbase is literally soaked in memes, buzzwords and tryhardism.

Literally the only way to enjoy grimdark is the pure edgelord route. Trying to enjoy it as over the top fun that isn't meant to be taken seriously is pretentious bullshit for fedora-wearing fatasses with ''''''ironic'''''' neckbeards. Don't let any faggot hear tell you otherwise. Similarly, 'low' fantasy is really a codeword for 'muh historical accuracy' so you can expect a whole lot of autistic screeching about how halberds and billhooks are the god-tier weapons and swords are completely useless.

Your right that Gayme of Groans is a big influence too. It was a popular show that reached the mainstream, and so the virginbeards leapt on it as a way to unite with the normalfags. Every time you see some shithead posting on Veeky Forums about how "muh new blood in the hobby is saving pnp" and railing against some user for sayng casuals are bad, dollars to donuts this is a GoT fan. Their cancer and should be redirected to their homeboard at most of them probably only came here from making a typo in the address bar anyway.

>foreign mercenaries
>savages
>eunuchs

>high fantasy tropes

Confirmed for retarded.

For someone complaining about buzzwords, you sure use a lot of them.

>they have some sort of consistency and grounded measure of reality
Not the same as flavor though.
>Like the fairy-gay manchild memers unironically thinking you can't have fun if it's not filled with magical fairy dust and unicorns all the time and you must be child to ever dare disagree with them?
Grimdarkers are generally the ones doing that though.
Also ad hominem while I had the decency of not really insulting those I critized.
>Hey dipshit, has it ever occurred to you that those settings are fun?
Care to explain why? It's the point of that thread after all.

What is high fantasy, in your opinion?

Found the GoTfag.

Not him, but it typically has two common meanings.

The first, and technically correct one, is a fantastical setting that isn't the real world.

The second refers to narrative type: a heroic epic pitting the forces of good against evil would be high fantasy. A gritty story about the criminal underworld in a fantasy city's slum quarter would be low fantasy.

You'll also sometimes see 'high fantasy' used as a broader version of 'high magic', i.e a setting stuffed to the gills with wizards, elves, dragons, demons, and whatever else. A setting that is high in fantastical elements, like burgers are high in fat. I think this comes from people not knowing the original meaning, and taking a best guess stab at it.

>Magic being a thing that much of the world's commonfolk has seen cast with their own eyes or if magic can be treated as it's own brand of setting physics.

>Much of the geography/astronomy/ecology not conforming to realism. I.e continents that could not show up naturally, Not-Mordor being a place, acknowledging the existence of afterlifes/elemental planes/alt universes that people can travel/summon to/from.

>Magic doomsdays that heroes prevent.(and x100 if the story has more then one magic doomsday happens or is stopped.)

>While not an utterly clear indicator the a setting's 'highness' the number of distinct sapient races interacting with each other in the story is a decent measuring stick.

You do know, that Lord of the Rings doesn't qualify your criteria, right? And there's no higher fantasy than that.

>3/4 criterion filled
>doesn't qualify

>Lord of the Rings
>There's no higher fantasy than that.
That's really not true though.
Many fantasy settings have far more fantasy elements and much more magic.

So Harry Potter would be Low by the first, but High by the second
Angel (the TV show) would be Low by both

>Magic being common/is quantifiable.

No.

>Irrational geography/magic planes.

Yes on both.

>Magic doomsday.

Yes. Sauron gets his ring.

>Lots of races.

Somewhere in this middle. which is fair considering lotr is pretty tame overall.

Three quarters high fantasy isn't high fantasy, and it's certainly not the ur-example like LotR is.

Stop homebrewing your own meanings for words, user.

Three quarters of being completely autistic still makes you autistic user

Lotr is something that dangles on the edge of not-high fantasty but it still gets a 3/4 on the criteria.

Not wanting to do that "LOTR is low fantasy" meme but LotR is not really "the ur-example" of standard high fantasy.

>fictional but rational world
>fictional world with its own set of rules and physical laws
>distinct
That people insist a thing can only be self-consistent if it follows real-life laws of physics is my only problem with low fantasy.

>implying these criteria are any good when half of these are almost criticism.

I can play this game too. Let's take A Song of Ice and Fire.
>Magic being a thing
Magic is a thing, and it's becoming more and more common with each book. It's not everywhere, but neither it is in LoTR.
>Geography
Years long winters are confirmed to happen because of magic. Essos and Westeros are split, because Children of the Forest hit it with a magical nuke. Valyria is worse than Chernobyl because of another magical nuke.
>Magic doomsdays
The Long Night - an apocalyptic eternal winter that will happen once the Others defeat men and conquer the world.
There's also Euron Greyjoy's ambition of becoming a god and drowning the world in blood. He's halfway there.
In the background, the most advanced civilization in the world was destroyed by the Doom of Valyria.
>Distinct sapient races
There are humans, children of the forest, the Others, Brindled Men, giants and dragons. Crannogmen and Wildlings are technically human, but are distinct enough to qualify. Grumkins and snarks were not spotted yet, but since every other legend Old Nan has told turned out to be literally true, they probably exist.

Please stop using the terms high fantasy and low fantasy incorrectly when what you mean is high magic and low magic. It is giving me an AneUr[T]ISM. I'm serious tho, stop it, or I guess just be fine with taking a chainsaw to semantics

>i was wrong, b-but your autistic

Thanks for conceding the argument. :)

Prolly just missnamed my dude.

>17 posters
>buzzwording badwrongfun
>none of them actually play games
You know it tru.

Because it works better in fiction than the mythical "hard scifi"

It's kind of like the low-level adventures where your characters die off over realistic, if slightly unfair, deaths. Easier to believe, less bullshit.

After running around with elves and dwarves for years you realize that they don't add anything to the story and that 90% of them are all the same character in disguise, so if you do away with that and everyone is a human, people have to think of realistic and interesting character concepts. Same thing with magic. If every character backstory/campaign plot is "an NPC wizard threw some spells around and made people sad" then it becomes equally lame.

>What's the appeal of low fantasy
lolidunno, read Dragonlance, and the once prevalent detail of magic casters being part of a uniqur role-playing aspect in RPGs that took up most of what the were made of to balance out their role in an adventuring party.

If I see the word "badwrongfun" one more time I'm going to kill someone. This has got to be the stupidest shit tumblr has brought to this site, and the list is long. Are you seriously not aware of how much of a cocksucking faggot you sound like?

Badwrongfun.

kys when you're done being triggered

Hope you get an aneurysm from sitting on your ass all day being a retard on the internet.

u2bb

>t.amerifat

Some people are history wanks. Some just enjoy being restricted, like imagination bondage.

>Some just enjoy being restricted, like imagination bondage.
>implying generic high-fantasy is good example of imagination

>implying generic low-fantasy is good example of imagination.

Yep. Because low-fantasy have much more potential lyric and charm
youtube.com/watch?v=HoBW1VLJzds

Not inherently so.

low magic settings are for histfags that don't actually know history

the absence or low presence of magic also helps not triggering autism

but a good low magic setting also ends up being heavily worldbuilt, which may be what people look for in a setting to begin with

What prevent you to make a worldbuilt high fantasy setting?

>What prevent you to make a worldbuilt high fantasy setting?
Because it will look like another clone of DnD/Warcraft?

Look at him and laugh.

Excuse me, but what this picture supposed to mean?

Maybe you should read high fantasy and find out.

The lack of "lolmagic" explanation for everything forces players to use character and action rather than gear to distinguish themselves

The lack of "lolmagic" forces the DM to come up with better stories aside from "demon invasion" or "magical plague"

>The lack of "lolmagic" forces the DM to come up with better stories aside from "demon invasion" or "magical plague"
But what about Warhammer Fantasy?

That is an exception
They chose to have a deep story.
Low fantasy settings are forced to have a deeper story because you have to have a reason for people to do things.
If you have monsters, there must be a reason for them to be there.

I wrote a low fantasy setting with my friends and we made pages upon pages of lore just to explain why there are bandits and raiders in the woods. Then we had to write about their culture, morphology, etc.

nothing in theory
but in practice high magic often replaces worldbuilding with "magic did it"

one could argue that the more you move away from history the less your arrangement of things will feel as good

in the end I think it's mostly purposes that dictate the decision: high magic is fertile ground for strong images; low magic seems the decision of people looking for a story

maybe that's why such a visuals dominated market like the east developed more towards the high magic

songof ice and fire is high fantasy you dumb pile of shit

ASOIAF is a high fantasy world that turned into a low fantasy one for umpteen years and is slowly turning back into a high fantasy one, much to the consternation of every fucker involved.

>I wrote a low fantasy setting with my friends and we made pages upon pages of lore just to explain why there are bandits and raiders in the woods. Then we had to write about their culture, morphology, etc.
Your group's personal autism is no indicator of general quality.

>If you have monsters, there must be a reason for them to be there.
No there fucking doesn't. "There are monsters in the woods. Why are they there? To eat your dumb ass. Don't ask questions, just stay out of the fucking woods you pillock." is a perfectly LF explanation.

>Implying there is nothing visually stimulating about hundreds of smiths hammering together iron suits and hot steel blades
>Thousands of soldiers putting on armor still steaming from the quench to defend their farms and homes, determination in their eyes

Just because it isn't a technicolor rainbow of people screaming and world ending destructo energy beams doesn't mean its not visually stimulating

THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS

>There are monsters in the woods. Why are they there? To eat your dumb ass. Don't ask questions, just stay out of the fucking woods you pillock." is a perfectly LF explanation.
What do the monsters eat?
What is the ecosystem like?
Are there different strains?
How aggressive are they?
Can we dig out their pheromone glands and use them as decoys?
Logical weaknesses? Strengths?

That's what I mean. Too frequently it boils down to "lol they are magic" and its just lazy writing.

>Your group's personal autism is no indicator of general quality.
immortalpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Rakkaan_tribes
You be the judge then

Why would you have any of that prepared ahead of time on the off chance your players want to go hunting them?

If they go for them, come up with the answers on the fly and work with it. And don't just hand that shit out - if they want to know, have them find out. If they ask peasants, they're just going to get fucking rumours and hearsay.

>If they ask peasants, they're just going to get fucking rumours and hearsay.
Well yes, why would some random carpenter or farmer know the biology of wood monsters?
Rangers? They would know their behavior and how to kill them or avoid them
Biomancers? They are the ones who would know. Good luck finding one outside of a larger civilized area

ASOIAF is definitely playing about with the high/low magic thing (to side step an extended "what is high fantasy" debate). Magic is coming back to the world; the setting is getting more magical as time advances (and had ages of high magic in the past).

Without getting into low magic/high magic vs low fantasy/high fantasy, ASOIAF isn't a clean example of "low magic", it's a set of books which plays around with the dichotomy.

And your point is?
Also, your first picture fits low fantasy pretty good

>What do the monsters eat?
You
>What is the ecosystem like?
Woods
>Are there different strains?
No
>How aggressive are they?
Powered by pure hatred
>Can we dig out their pheromone glands and use them as decoys?
They don't have them
>Logical weaknesses?
Being stabbed
>Strengths?
Stabbing you

Look, shit worldbuilding knows no genre.

It's OK. Not loin-stirring, but it's not hideously dull either.

>Implying there is nothing visually stimulating
I didn't say that

I'm saying that technicolor world ending mumbo jumbo is MORE visually attractive (note that this isn't an indication of quality) because direct and immediate

even in your own example to sell me the awe of realism you had to exaggerate numbers and timeframes, something very cinematic, while what I'd consider natively low magic is the part about the guys motivations and determination, something I'd consider easier to evoke through words than an image, and that to be appreciated requires a developed emphatical sense, a more matured reading tool than the childish attraction to hyperboles.

>I'm saying that technicolor world ending mumbo jumbo is MORE visually attractive
>source my ass
Also, best fantasy battles use very-very small part of high-magic stuff
youtube.com/watch?v=8Tgi-j56ueU
I hate this series, especially DeusExMachina ending and Harrington magical cloak, but cavalry fight was perfect
youtube.com/watch?v=ToOIvD5mlow

...Low fantasy is THE breeding ground for caster supremacy. Giving martial characters heavy restraints and limits based on "realism" but magic users get magic is far more an issue in people who play low fantasy.

So you can fight a dragon with clever riddle game, roguish traps, knights bearing lances, rangers with cursed arrows instead of asking divination, alteration, evocation and conjuration wizards to handwave it all.

Magicmarts, a cleric healer in every hamlet and a wizard in every city.

On if you allow High fantasy casters in a Low fantasy game.

>It's OK. Not loin-stirring, but it's not hideously dull either.
Thank you, any suggestions?

>In one recorded instance, a place of worship for Rakkaan was discovered to have an entire floor based mosaic depicting Rakkaan warriors savaging each other made entirely out of human teeth of various size and coloration.
>Mosaic
>Made out of teeth
Jesus

>even in your own example to sell me the awe of realism you had to exaggerate numbers and timeframes
Thousands of soldiers is an exaggeration? Excuse yourself very fucking much because historically speaking ancient humans have fought with armies exceeding a million armed men trying to kill each other.

You strike me as the kind of person who sits in a quiet room all day watching "Dragon ball Z" thinking that real life is boring

Sorry, perhaps if I said
>Thousands of SUPER SOLDIERS FIGHTING OTHER MAGIC SUPER SOLDIERS
you would be a bit happier with that, damn their motivations

I just like low-power games.

>historically speaking ancient humans have fought with armies exceeding a million armed men trying to kill each other.
>global population estimate for 1000 AD is 250-350 million
I don't think I believe you.

>What is the Persian Empire
>What is Thermopylae
Even if you look at the historically adjusted number, the scale of that battle alone was in the six figure range

>Hi I'm an user who thinks that every battle in history was like four dudes wearing animal skins and nothing cool every happens without magic or superpowers
fucking millenials man

>>What is Thermopylae
67,000-307,000 is not even close to a million.

>Completely ignoring the second point
Again, tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of men fighting and dying for something they believe in, forced to fight by uncaring lords, doing it for a paycheck so they can feed their bright eyed child that might go farther than they ever could in life.

None of this is stirring to you. None of it evokes any sort of action.
I bet you get a stiffie whenever your animu says "This isn't even 2% of my power! I can still go super duper super level mega 4!"

TIME TO USE MY NEW NINJA WIZARD TECHNO TECHNIQUE! TAKE THE SUPER MEGA ULTRA MAGIC PSYCHICK BALL THAT CAN TOTALLY DESTROY 12 GALAXIES YOU GUIZE!!!

That doing anything for you?

Well what do you know, it looks like was right.

>Thousands of soldiers is an exaggeration?
hundreds of smiths sound like one

> magic users get magic
> magic users

Do you see where you fucked up?

>the most generic of heartstring-tugging attempts combined with BIG NUMBER
Just as boring and shitty as your anime strawman, really.

Most people play D&D and some of those eventually get bored of playing super human characters in a world full to the brim with 100s of different fantasy races and endless magic and want to play something more down to earth , grounded and relatable. Hence low fantasy settings.

I forgot that George R. R. Martin Wrote Stannis as a Dark Lord