/5eg/ Fifth Edition General:

Do you mean the artificer?

Rework the class from the ground up to be an actual alchemist and not a dinobot summoner.

I'll mock something up in a bit.

Nevermind. I'm retarded. I see now the spell needs to be at least first level.

There was a pretty popular homebrew alchemist.

I'm playing a game with 4 other guys. One of them is a good friend of mine but the other three of younger guys I don't know as well.

The thing is, the three 'kids' are the biggest bitches I have even seen. The DM even had to make a point of saying that the party are trying to be Adventurers with a capital A.

The kids didn't want to go through an abandoned town that had a warning sign saying there were undead around. They decided to spend 8 hours and walk through the woods to go around the town altogether.

One of our quests was to investigate the rumors of a dark mage in some runes near this ghost town. Their reasoning was that the DAM said there were things that could kill us if we didn't act correctly so now they are wary of the smallest encounter.

As a character, I am getting a bit bored with these guys chicken shit antics and want to take my Tempest Cleric buddy and go do some adventuring. We are level 4 characters now, 5 of us shouldn't be to scared of some zombies and skeletons.

If I just walk into the planned encounters, do you guys think the other guys will follow me in or just be ~100ft back doing jack shit?

Ray of Sickness?

They won't follow, but you'll get to go at your pace and use your tactics. So honestly just do it and go have fun being an Adventure.

Eventually they'll either join you or leave because they'll be bored compared to you.

>Ranged attack less complex than melee attack
>Less complex than moving
Holy shit they really don't know what they're doing, do they?

Your party has to kill this dude. What do?

Kill the dude.

Well considering he's literally unkilable by normal tactics and CR18.....

Weaken him and then Disintegrate. Hopefully the party has a Monk or at least 2 casters who can chew through the Legendary Resistance.

Prioritize ranged attacks.

How precisely do you accomplish it?

Like, in one situation the DM was dropping serious hints about 'don't fuck with this lady' but they treat every fight that isn't a night time random encounter as some sort of super lethal combat they should try to talk their way out of or just avoid entirely.

>Disintegrate
This is genius, I totally forgot about it.

Yeah I know the feeling. Eventually just say "I draw my sword and charge the guy" or something. If they get angry point out that you're all alive and did what needed to be done.

>Condition Immunities
>No Stunned
>No Grappled
>No Charmed
Get everyone in your group to gangpile him, get the biggest guys in the group to Grapple and Pin him while the spellcasters wail on him with everything in single-target spells they have.
Either that or just Suggestion him to leave.

This character is sort of bullshit, don't you think?

Ah, I mean Restrained.
Still,
>216 HP
God fucking damn.

>x2

He totally is, but we have several advantages.
1) We don't have to fight him yet. I'm planning his death in the distant future.
2) We know his exact stats.
Which is why I'm crowdsourcing a way to murder him.

I understand how trying to avoid some low level undead is annoying, but provided the enemy is intelligent enough to talk to, what's wrong with trying to talk your way out of situations?

Hey, Veeky Forums, could I get you to look over this class? The short version is that it's meant to be a "spell-less druid". Basically something that could be inserted into a low-magic setting as an alternative to druid. In practice it's kind of like a monk/barbarian/ranger hybrid.

The intent is to create a class that can represent someone like Dar (duh), Mowgli, Tarzan, or the Cultists from Majesty: the Fantasy Kingdom Sim.

Part of making the class involved building some spells directly into it. Those spells were: Find Familiar, Speak with Animals, Animal Friendship, and Sympathy/Antipathy for the base class; the Circle of Beasts additionally got what amount to Awaken, Commune with Nature, Conjure Animals, Conjure Elemental, and Conjure Fey. Circle of Shapes doesn't get any additional built-in spells except for at-will Alter Self at 14th level (built directly into the kit, and leaving out Alter Self's natural weapons clause since it's redundant to a beastmaster)

Some notes:
- Animal Cohort is just the find familiar spell with expanded options. Is CR 1/2 to high an allowance?
- I'm not really all that happy with the Natural Weapons feature, but the class needs some offensive oomph so that was my best thought.
- Should battle roar be usable more than once per long rest? Should I tie it into primal points?
- Not sure if I balanced the Primal Rapport (ki) costs well.
- Also not sure whether or not there should be more Primal Rapport abilities built into the base class. As it stands most of the abilities are instead gained via Circle choice.

- I have no guarantee if I balanced the primal point costs for the spells in Circle of Beasts correctly
- - Additionally, note that the beastmaster (a) doesn't need to maintain concentration, and (b) doesn't risk losing control of elementals/fey

- The Circle of Shapes gets all the benefits of a Moon Druid's wildshaping, except:
- - It's based on spending primal points, so it's usable FAR more often

>All melee, ranged and spell attacks automatically miss when in wolf form
Forgive me but what the hell do you do against that?

It's a reaction, and he has one per turn.

Sure, I knew I was missing something.

WE WUZ ELVES N SHIEEEET

If Huntmaster's Chosen is usable as an action, why isn't it listed under "actions"?

How long does it last for? I.e., how long does he retain Regeneration 40 and access to Primal Smite and Pariah Rage?

>how long does he retain Regeneration 40 and access to Primal Smite and Pariah Rage?
Until the combat is over, looks like.

Not less complex. But resolving faster.

The underlying idea seems to be about an arrow/bullet coming faster to your face than you can swing an axe back, or run away from it.

But true, they could had explained the rationale a little (only vaguely hinted to it in "Order of Operations") more.

1) Create a trap using a portable hole
2) Lure wolfboy into trap
3) Wizard flies over hole and drops in a bag of holding

So, something that hasn't been said yet. Wulfag can't deal damage, if he can't hit you. His Wisdom saving throw is utter shit, so he should be suspectible to Bestow Curse. His Cha is even worse, so Bane should be able to harm him too.
Regeneration 40 is very serious, but can be theoretically overcome with Harm and Chill Touch.

But the IDEAL way to kill him is probably to wear down his legendary actions, get him to reasonably low HP and cast Disintegrate before he even thinks of using Huntmaster's Chosen.

Well, you could hit him with Dominate Person enough times until it sticks, have him lay down on his back, put two Immovable Rods in a triangle over his neck and then use Control Water to drown him in 20ft of water.

Made the potion making rules for the alchemist class. I'll move onto other things, but I want to get your criticism of this.

The main idea is:
1. instead of spell slots, you have potion slots. Make potions during long rest. Potions are not interchangeable. You make a fireball potion during the long rest, and it remains a fireball potion forever.
2. Potions can be used by anyone, including enemies. Regardless of who uses the potions, the alchemist stats are used for any save DCs
3. I haven't made the spell list yet, but I want to keep it to nonconcentration, nonspell attack spells.
4. I haven't decided how many spell slots I want the alchemist to have yet. I was thinking of doing something similar to the warlock, but with more slots at a lower level.

Thank all of you for your help. For those of you who like story times, you'll hear about Wulfgar soon enough.

Literally how wild elves are supposed to look in the Forgotten Realms. Gold dwarves also have dark skin in FR but I don't see Veeky Forums talking about that.

I need help on the following premise:

A powerful celestial being becomes the Patron for a large number of people turning them into celestial warlocks. In turn these people become fanatics and begin worshiping the celestial being as a god. The Patron is uncomfortable with this new turn of events and even their refusal isn't enough to deter the warlocks from venerating their Patron.

- How would it make sense that if the Patron withdrew his favor from the warlock, the warlock still retained their power?

- Alternatively, what conditions would prevent the Patron from withdrawing their favor?

The backdrop to this is that a celestial city was forced into the material plane and refugees and supplicants are over swarming the city and the Patron needed mortal help in stabilizing the city but now it's warlocks are turning the people towards worshipping the Patron.

clean up the wording about claws being finesse weapons, just say they are 'considered to be finesse weapons'

Is he going to need specific material components? How micro-managey is that going to get?

In place of concentration spells, you should still have potions that mimic concentration-effects like haste... but with set durations instead of requiring concentration. (and non-stackable, for the same reasons you can't concentrate on more than 1 spell at a time. Don't wana bring back the flying invisible blurred elemetal resisting stoneskin polymorphed Pathfinder Wizard, after all).

Couldn't he just have a component pouch? If the wizard's louch is bottomless so could the alchemist's.

The alchemist satchel is not written correctly right now, thanks for pointing this out. The intent is that the alchemist satchel works like a spell component pouch, and the necessary reagents are ignored as long as you have it.

maybe. I could see something like that working with a duration equal to the Int Modifier. I'll keep it in mind, thanks!

So I wanted to remove athlete and charger feats because they're hot garbage, and work them into the brawny feat (athletics feat from skill UA). Not sure which things to keep as I don't want it to be too crowded, maybe the charge part should just be scrapped.
>+1 Strength.
>Gain proficiency in Athletics, expertise if you already have it.
>You count as one size larger for determining carrying capacity.
>Climbing and swimming doesn't halve your speed.
>When you are prone, standing up uses only 5 feet of your movement.
>If you move at least 10 feet in a straight line towards a creature and make a melee attack against it following this, you do an extra 5 damage on a hit and can shove the creature as a bonus action.

Roger.

Anything else stand out as good or bad?

The pact is a binding contract and the warlocks will sue the patron if they withdraw from the arrangement.

Will it need a few SP to be restocked every few town-visits? Sounds like a depletable resource to me.

>"Gotta throw the potion"
> no range on the throw
I think short rest slots might work, take an hour or so to mix up a few, along with some cantrip ones. Honestly, the artificer has this concept covered.

There's a number of misconceptions about warlocks, and one of the key factors being tied to the fact that they're a charisma based class.

Many see the obvious front of this implication - being more persuasive and sure of yourself will enable you to get a better deal during the initial bargain or deal.

However, the implications afterward are very different from those of a cleric or druid. There's nothing saying that the warlock actually is continuing to gain power from the entity they're contracted with.

Imagine if I made a deal with you for a loan. I've now obtained the full amount of money in cash. It's mine to do with as I will - for the intended purpose, hopefully, but there's nothing stopping me from using it in other ways except for the threat of reprisal. So, you can send debt collectors to try and get the money back, or you can come fuck with me yourself, but you can't actually take the power back without doing something; and often, it's not in a form that's recoverable. An even better analogy would be to say that power is like a meal. You've eaten it, and now it's part of you.

This fits consistently with the other charisma based classes - paladin, sorcerer, and bard. The paladin's oath is based on charisma because they're drawing magical power from their own internal abilities - assisted by a god, maybe, but if their god abandons them, they still have this power. Sorcerers are born with magic. It's part of who they are and can't be taken away by any but the most extreme methods. Bards are the same - their magic is built into their ability to express their soul in a way that generates these effects. It doesn't come from an awareness of oneself and the universe or the divine, like a monk or druid or cleric, and doesn't come from studied intellect, like a wizard.

Warlocks cast from the soul. To get it back from them, you've got to kill them or come damned close.

Probably not, but for depletable resources, I need to add in component rules (basically just the default ones) That should bring it in line with others.

Question: Let's say I want to make a class or subclass that revolves around anti-magic. How can I ensure that the class remains *interesting* in a wide variety of situations? Specifically, how do I prevent combat for this character being more complex than, "I pop a cone or aura of anti-magic, then I spend the rest of the fight hitting it with my sword?"

>misconceptions
>Proceeds to list a ton of stuff that's baseless unproved speculation as some sort of "counterargument"

Interesting. What do the players want from game and what are their characters motivations?

I usually do this exact thing as well - when i feel my character has no reason to enter the fight, i avoid it. It's stupid to die just because you wanted to save some traveling time, or because "muh aanr" when fighting random ambush.

Forcecage his ass and bury him under a metric shit-ton of rock?

The Mage Slayer feat in 5e is derived from the Mage Slayer feat tree from 3.5. Just take those and turn them into class features and you're good.

I'd focus more on being able to stop shit before it happens. Build off the mage slayer feat (e.g., at higher class levels, you can disrupt at range instead of needing to be within 5 feet).

This is why "I'm an Adventurer" is a shit character motivation. A good DM will take something meaningful from the player characters, or tell them to come up with a goal that requires risk and sacrifice.

"Adventurer" as a profession is one the most retarded things to exist in tabletop. No sane person risks their life because "HEY! IT MIGHT BE TOTALLY COOL AND AWSUM XD!"

Well shit user, how do you think they work? And remember, it's gotta be logically consistent, or you're no better than me.

>illusionist wizard
>cast Mirage Arcane
>turn open field under him into a crevasse (allowed in the spell description)
>use Malleable Illusions to change the crevasse back into an open field
>Wulfgar is now buried alive.

He may never die. I don't really know. But all the wizard has to do is come back to that spot every ten days and he'll never get out.

How I think they work doesn't matter. The issue was that you stated your interpretation as fact when there's nothing in the text supporting that it is.

If it is possible to send power one way, why it's not possible to send it the other way?

Because the guy is literally talking out his ass and presenting his theorycraft as fact. There is nothing in the actual text that specifies it works this way. How it works is ultimately up to the DM of the game.

hm, I'm reading to lv2, wild empathy is confusing, it seems that you can auto charm any beast with higher than four intelligence? Also rather than say the beast is entitled to a saving throw, say it may make a saving throw to resist Wild Empathy, or something more derived from how the official material words things

>The kids didn't want to go through an abandoned town that had a warning sign saying there were undead around. They decided to spend 8 hours and walk through the woods to go around the town altogether.
Part of this is your DM's fault. What's the overarching plot in your campaign? What are your characters' goals? If it's just murderhoboing around, then avoiding a fight with undead isn't unreasonable. In a better-run campaign, there would be consequences for spending 8 extra hours to go around the town instead of punching through (plot-related, not "oh, you missed out on some XP"). In other words, the characters should have a good reason to go through the town beyond "there are things to kill there".

Are you stupid?

It all comes down to Warlocks having no strict rules of conduct like Paladins, and not as much of a ritualized attachment to their benefactors as Clerics and Druids, so you can play them however it fits your character and the campaign because there are no mechanics for depowering them for disobeying their Patrons, nor any implications that this should be the rule in the generic official fluff.

If anything, it offers an antagonistic relationship as an example, and mention that most often the arrangement is like a master and apprentice - ergo, Patron teaches/grants you power, and more and greater power as you take Warlock levels, but the Warlock's already unlocked isn't actually reliant on the connection to the Patron.

Your pact with your patron isnt borrowing a book from your local library.
Its a sale, trade etc and the patron shouldnt be able to take back the power even if they disagree with you; read the part of the phb where it talks about disagreeing / working against your patron

His theorycraft may just be how he runs it at his table, but it does make sense.

The warlock's patron isn't constantly sending power. The power is the Pact and the Pact has already been made.

>How would it make sense that if the Patron withdrew his favor from the warlock, the warlock still retained their power?

Because the power is the Pact and the Pact has already been made.

>Alternatively, what conditions would prevent the Patron from withdrawing their favor?

Nothing, but it has no impact on the Pact.

Bring in a drow ranger that uses twin swords and has a panther companion.

>The warlocks Patron isn't constantly sending power
>The warlocks patron can't withdraw their favor

>Gain a level
>Get a shiny new boon from my PATRON who supposedly hates me and refused to grant me any more power.

Huh...I have no idea how the text got that badly mangled. Changing it now to be a nearly straight copy/paste of the spell.

>You can spend 1 primal point to attempt to charm a beast within 30 feet that can both see and hear you. If the beast’s Intelligence is 4 or higher, the charm attempt fails. Otherwise, the beast must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or be charmed by you for 24 hours. If you or one of your companions harms the target, the charm effect ends.

I think of a warlock pact as your patron fundamentally altering your innate magical abilities, and something not easily taken away.

Can't gain new levels while the Patron refuses to assist you.

There, easy. Wave the carrot, not the stick.

Are these arrays balanced against each other? I want players to start with higher stats so there are more feats in play for more customizable characters. I'm thinking monk would benefit the most but it's not the strongest class anyway so it doesn't seem like a bad change that way.

>18, 16, 15, 13, 12, 10
>18, 17, 15, 10, 10, 10
>18, 16, 16, 10, 10, 10
>17, 16, 16, 14, 13, 12

This kind of stuff is why I love the illusionist specialization. Malleable illusions is so unique and flexible.

Paladin and Paladin multiclasses would love this.

What's the most D&D picture you got?

Do you mean just the first one or the last? Losing a point in strength probably isn't worth it but I can see the first one being really nice as you only lose out on some charisma/con and get +1 wis/dex.

The PHB specifically mentions that the warlock may have an antagonistic relationship with the patron, and doesn't mention anything about this preventing them from getting new powers upon leveling up.

...

Do you have any limitations on CR? Charming a T-Rex doesn't really seem the same as charming a weasel even though they have the same INT and WIS scores.

I can have an antagonist relationship with my bosses at work, but as long as I do my job they're legally obligated to pay me.

shit, that's pretty good.

Should I play a Paladin or a Loremaster Wizard

This discussion is why intelligence based warlocks should have been a thing.

>DAMMIT AELAR YOU'RE A LOOSE CANNON. I'VE GOT BOCCOB BREATHING DOWN MY NECK AFTER THAT STUNT YOU PULLED
>But you do get results. Consider this your final warning!
"Antagonistic" doesn't necessarily mean you have opposite goals.

Any advice on how to choose a school of magic as a 2nd Level Wizard?

I'm still pretty new to the game and not entirely sure what to do here.

...

Who do you wanna be? (as playstyle/fluff)

...

But only someone stupid would make a pact with evil!

Why is Jackie Chan a hobbit?