Who else feels under appreciated by their players?

Who else feels under appreciated by their players?

I have a group of friends I play with/dm for, and I made a campaign I was going to start tomorrow. We have an additional player, who has never played before, so I decided to start them all out at level one.

However, all of the veteran players are upset by this decision, because they want to start at level 5 or 8, because that when they get all the goodies. What do?

Start at level five or eight, make the new guy's player. Fuck knows he won't get though D&D's awful chargen process in a timely manner. Just make him a champion fighter or some other braindead class.

Do not do this. Unless you really want to kill the new player's enthusiasm.

If you want to start them at the lower levels then do so, if the group is entirely against doing that then walk the new player through the character generation process. Ask them what they want, offer them the mechanical options for that.

If it's a simple or intuitive system then hopefully it won't be too daunting a task.

Tell them to fuck off

have the veterans start off at level 5 and the newbie start off at level 1.

have the game begin with an encounter against a villain. use the battle as a way to introduce the characters to each other and allow the level 1 newbie to get a grip on turn order/how to use actions. the battle will be not be something the players can win. once the battle has gone on long enough for exposition purposes you simply have the villain pull out a scroll and use it to place a curse on the veteran characters.

the curse shall turn them all into old people and give them significant ability penalties. this will put them on par with the new player despite the level difference. the first quest shall be to hunt down the villain or simply acquire a way to undo the curse. by the time the curse is lifted the new player should be level 3-4.

Start them on early levels, but significantly boost the rate at which the party levels up. Unless you're playing Trashfinder, the newbie will get the hang of things really quickly. No need to spend a few months on levels 1-5.

This is a terrible advice.

Start them at level 1 but significantly increase exp gain until they hit 5, and then go back to normal. Make it VERY CLEAR that they will level much faster than you're meant to pre-5 but it will go back to normal levels after that

Less than half of my players are ever on time. One of them regularly sleeps away entire days ("just a nap" becomes 10 hours straight of sleep), another has a work life so busy that he never should have signed up for my game in the first place, and another regularly forgets to even show up despite reminding him the day before and the day of.

I'm thinking of booting out everyone except the ones who show up on time every time, and trying to figure out who else I know who is actually fucking punctual.

please do exactly that. fuck those cunts.

>want to sit down and have a serious, interesting adventure
>LOTR tone
>fight serious villains, deal with morality, form deep bonds between characters through dramatic struggle
>everyone just want to sit around a table, drink beer, tell each other jokes, and occasionally roll a d20 and not know what to add to it

Every time I see that cringeworthy Kuo-Toa art I think of this.

>“Three Rings for the Elven-kings under the sky,
>Seven for the Dwarf-lords in halls of stone,
>Nine for Mortal Men, doomed to die,
>One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
>In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.
>One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them,
>One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them.
>In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.”

>I fart on him.
>You what?
>I fart on him.
>But he just told you about-
>I fart on him and a little bit of shit comes out
>table erupts in laughter

this is my life

Start at level 5 or 8 and have the newbie play a simple class.

Start them all out at level 1 with the understanding that you will give them a level for each encounter they overcome, up to the desired level. That will give the new guy a chance to ramp up.

kek
sounds like a fun group xD
its just a game bro why are you mad xD
xD

I'd just compromise and start them at level two or three, it would be a good excuse to teach him the different aspects to the character as you teach your new player how to level up.

>and a little bit of shit comes out.

Admittedly, that was stupid until he said that, because he admitted to shitting his breeches in front of everyone.

Destroy his rep. Make him the Indomitable Incotinent.

>I slap him haha
>okay roll me a
>lol I was just kidding
>okay
Next encounter with an NPC
>I steal his shit
>roll m-
>just joking haha
>no roll me a fucking check I don't care done with your joking bullshit
>WHY ARE YOU SO MEAN??? IT WAS JUST A JOKE?

Why is it so much better to get a group of likeminded strangers for serious campaigns than trying to explain this shit to friends?
I just want a serious campaign with them.

>one of my friends who's also my player showed interest in starting a new campaign again after the last one fizzled out months ago.
>go world-building DM mode
>put together a cool setting w a fun plot hook
>get really excited about running a new system
>friends interest wanes and isn't all that into starting a campaign soon anymore
The hell, man? Why you gotta blue ball me like that?

I wonder if it's intentional, they basically are fanatic fanboys.

>No need to roll, you called and he didn't see it coming. You automatically hit and deal 1 + Strength modifier damage. He immediately calls the guards.

When players mess with me, I mess right back. Someone thinks he's funny by doing the same boring shit over and over again? Counter it. Someone thinks he can mess with an eccentric NPC? That NPC can annoy the fuck out of him and just waste his time. They are Good guys but use Intimidation as a cudgel for everything? Angry mob.

They joke about doing something but take it back? Do the same.

>The Dragon immediately engulfs you with flame! Nah, just kidding, man. T'was a joke, bro.
>Behind the door is a large shining magical ruby! Nah man, I kid.
>The lady touches your arm as she laughs loudly. She seems to be into you. Lol, kidding, bro! She is disgusted by just looking at you! Funny huh?

>When players mess with me, I mess right back. Someone thinks he's funny by doing the same boring shit over and over again? Counter it. Someone thinks he can mess with an eccentric NPC? That NPC can annoy the fuck out of him and just waste his time. They are Good guys but use Intimidation as a cudgel for everything? Angry mob.
How to alienate everyone around you: the post

I feel over-appreciated by my players because they always take steps to affirm how much they enjoy the game and help out with food, costs, transport etc but the actual level of work I put into the game is pretty minimal and I know I could be running it 10 times better if I put the effort in.

I've also got some pretty messed-up wiring upstairs and pretty frequently get in these really black, spiteful moods and when I'm like that I'm often keeping the game going while thinking about how much I hate everything I'm playing with. Which I don't let on or anything, but I feel pretty bad about it later.

>I feel over-appreciated by my players because they always take steps to affirm how much they enjoy the game and help out with food, costs, transport etc but the actual level of work I put into the game is pretty minimal and I know I could be running it 10 times better if I put the effort in.
I know this feel. When people thank you for things that seem trivial it makes you wonder if saying thanks has any real meaning or value to them, or if it's just a social gesture.

Maybe take the risk that when you put effort into something it might not turn out great instead of just being lazy and hating yourself for it.

>I feel over-appreciated by my players because they always take steps to affirm how much they enjoy the game and help out with food, costs, transport etc

ITT: Things that never happend

This. You DM, you set the rules. If they know that you want to add a fresh player to the hobby and are still bitching, reconsider playing with them.

BTW, what the fuck is this attitude "because that's when they get all the goodies"? Fucking suck it up, whiny bitches, and play a normal character instead of min-maxed shits. They start at low level, they need to make some sacrifices sometimes. Kick your players in the nuts if they complain again.

How closed-minded. Not everybody wants to start a game as a dirt farmer that dies in one hit to a hogboblin. Some people actually like playing fantasy games.

How closed-minded is wanting to introduce a new player to the hobby with smaller steps?

It doesn't matter if you start at level one, five, eight, or fifteen. A fighter only ever has one thing they can ever do, and that's full attack. There's a reason you use it to introduce beginners to D&D. It's absolutely no fun at all, which is a good thing, since the sooner you skip D&D, the better.

>A fighter only ever has one thing they can ever do, and that's full attack.
t. 3.5 babby who never moved on to 5E

HAVE YOU TRIED NOT PLAYING D&D?

Start them all off at level 5. If the newbie ever playerd an RPG in his life he'll get over it. Or do some quick solo tutorial sessions for the newbie.

Friends like to fuck around, strangers feel like they have to prove themselves as good people to you. Ever played a board game with good strangers? Nobody wants to fuck over anyone else, they go on forever until luck determines a winner.

>I want to be friends with That Guy
t. doormat in desperate need of human contact

>A fighter only ever has one thing they can ever do, and that's full attack.

Someone doesn't understand that you can do anything you want even when in combat including setting traps, grappling creatures to get a buddy to make a clear shot, or making a creature trip.

>muh Eldritch Knight xDD

The character isn't even really a fighter at that point.

>kind of serious RPer
>little brother gets into DMing
>is kind of serious at world building and DMing
>legit has Gary Gygax as his DM idol
>wants to build group up to Tomb of Horrors by running through a few modules in a long spanning 3.5 campaign that goes from level 1 to level 20
>group of friends are varying degrees of incompetent
>roll up a human bard to fill in any gaps they make
>one friend rolls up human fighter because he's still learning the system
>actually a decent roleplayer though
>does lawful good without being lawful stupid
>kind of strict code of honour, doesn't want to run from a fight unless it's obviously unwinnable
>other friend also trying to be serious
>rolls up a high elf rogue
>this is his first serious 3.5 experience
>chaotic neutral
>but more pragmatic than lolrandumb
>has no problem helping kill monsters but has a few nonlethal methods, even has a blackjack
>unfortunately he has bad luck on rolls for this campaign and can't make any of the search or disable device DC
>feels like his character is useless and grows an obvious preference for 5e D&D
>final group member rolls up a Lawful Evil Cleric of the god of assassins
>he's been playing D&D longer than us
>figure he can probably manage an evil character without being stupid evil
>is hiding his clerical nature and magic
>uses healing magic very rarely
>prayers in secret
>saved my bards life once at least by using his cure minor wounds prepared level 0 spell to stabilise him
>doing sunless citadel
>3/4 players haven't read the module and we don't so we can enjoy surprise
>cleric player played it once ages ago
>we side with kobolds
>help Meepo get the white dragonling back
>our reward is a key
>cleric finds reward insulting and shoots his crossbow at the kobold leader
>while we're surrounded by kobolds
>he doesn't even land the attack roll
>resulting combat is an escape attempt
>cleric and rogue die in the chaos
>he justifies it as "muh evil"
Do people know how what the word pragmatic means?

I've heard this story before, only last time it was more concise and well told.

>grappling
aha, the longest running joke in all role playing games.

I bet you never use things like trip or disarm because "they dont kill the enemy faster"

I frequently use an enemy in my campaigns that, at this point, the players actually get mildly upset when they see.
It's just a Skeleton with a Mancatcher. Wildly effective at weeding out bad characters/players.

I've told it on here before and I had just woken up when I typed it up just now.
Also I didn't feel like splitting it into two posts this time I needed a shower.

>killing the enemy faster is a bad thing, therefore I intentionally use less efficient methods to do it

I'm laughing at you, but I do feel bad for you too.

It's pretty dope in 5e though. No Attack of Opportunity, no melee touch attack, just opposed ability checks. You can still make Attacks of Opportunity, keep your Dexterity bonus to AC, move at half your speed, and take any action that doesn't require both hands (like making another grapple). However, so can your target. It's good for setting up a Shove the target can't stand up from, keeping the target away from squishies or from escaping, and dragging the target into traps and other hazards.

Throw the newbie into the deep end and make him play a level 8 Wizard.
Also give him a 30 second time limit on his turn.

>The only thing you can do as a fighter is attack for direct damage
>lol why would i want to do anything other than attack for direct damage?

Fighter's options that don't deal direct damage are shit at best. Wizard's options that don't deal direct damage are gamebreakingly good.

30 seconds to state your actions or 30 seconds for everything? I once had a DM who had a time limit on turns. He was a dunce when it came to the rules, so when I had to explain what my spell did and wait for him to comprehend, that would count against my time.

>enemy is a damage sponge
>has a magic weapon
>you are fighter
>you have taken improved disarm and two weapon fighting as feats
>disarm enemy and use their magic weapon against them
>casters in party tell you when an enemy has magic weapons through detect magic
>fighters BAB also means his full attack will wreck total ass at higher levels with a magic weapon
>fighter doesn't have many out of combat options because that's what he is
>a fighter
>a combat specialist
>a good fighter realises this and has a party to support him

Yeah dude Gandalf was a more important part of the Fellowship of the Ring than Boromir was. Stop comparing yourself to people and roleplay.

Sorry that I find having options fun, user. I'll remember to leave my fun at the door when I game with you. I now know that it's difficult for you to understand that someone might be comparing two things for reasons other than what your knee-jerk reaction thinks they are.

I wish I could play a game with someone like you. Hell, I wish I could play a game.

Level 1-2 should take 1 session each, you can keep that same progression from 3-5 as well so they get to 5 quite quickly.

Also, the best levels for play are around 3-5, 1-2 are really boring past the first time you play because you have virtually no options or class features, even as a caster. If you start higher than 5 (it depends on how fast you make them level though) you're going to be pretty close to the breaking point already, 5e is not good for high level play and if they want really powerful characters with many options and powers 4e or not-D&D is better for that honestly.

It'll be okay user, is there like, a game store near you that deals in miniature wargaming and card games? My LGS runs 5th edition on Wednesdays and I got a 3.5 group out of that, so you never know where you'll find games.
Alternatively you can try your hand at roll20?

>tfw had several sessions each week with housemates, especially last year but last 2 have been very active
>summer comes along, we all move back home, saying we'll keep playing online
>the main gm expresses that he wants to do that OD&D game we've been thinking of, or anything really
>nothing happens
>I try to get their feedback on which system I should use for a game long in planning, as well as setting up roll20 for a campaign we already started in person, asking them to just make character icons and join the game
>one person joins, he and one other send me art to make into icons
>two still have not said a word
At least I'll be playing a game with relatives in a few days and witness my noob of a cousin GMing which should be interesting. Who knows, in two weeks when I come home again maybe people have come out of their summer stasis.

>tfw all the players around you are idiots who think that if it's not in the book they can't do it
>tfw all the GMs around you are the same sort of idiot
>tfw you start to think that maybe you're the same sort of idiot, just in denial

Hell 5e straight up tells the DM in the PHB to allow players to do their own actions.

>>LOTR tone
shouldn't have based your campaign in a shit setting like LOTR. Tolkien was a memeloving fuck

Just start at level one, but don't just simply run them against the gambit of low level enemies. Instead, make it a high-power campaign by tweaking down enemies in certain areas and have them fight orcs rather than kobolds, even if the stat blocks are the same and only what they are are different.

Later on you can have stronger orcs as well, as these ones may have been from a lesser tribe.

Don't track levels normally however at first if you intend to at any point, instead level them through the first five levels relatively quickly, but allow them to be as clever as if they had the full assortment of tools levels 5-8 normally have if they really want. Sure, it won't be exactly the same, but it gives them a chance. Allow the players to gain equipment and money so that when they do quickly reach those levels they actually can spend a little and get some extra spells, weapons, or armor for the level.

Is making a lasso and throwing it at the enemy unfeasible in D&D or something?

If you have to, explain to the other players you're trying to ease in the new guy if you want.

hhaha dude use their poison against them good idea haha!

>they want to start at level 5 or 8
Get new players. The ones you have are clearly homos.

I need to know more about this. How does a skeleton with a mancatcher pick out the newbies? Does it show that grappling is massively effective when the group supports the mancatcherton?

Taking over as GM for a friend who wanted a chance to play so I can give running a game a shot and by request I'm running a Dresden files fate game. Invite some of our players who graduated to play over discord since we miss them. We had the whole summer to try to get session 0 done so that I can make the world better fit the players and what they want. I still don't know what one player wants to see and I only have general descriptions of a few while the others I barely know anything. Told everybody I want their characters to be mostly done by the start of August so I can review them and talk them over with the players before going on to the last two aspects. Only one player is really anywhere and that's because I'm closest to him and helping him most weekends.

And yet it also neglects to mention the scope of what a player's actions will be.

It all basically boils down to "Mother, may I?" and hoping that the DM isn't particularly stingy when it comes to improvised actions and advantages.

One time my dragonborn sorcerer grappled an enemy before unleashing its breath weapon.

Of course, I've long since given up on cool things actually being possible in 5e and attributed it to the DM letting me do it than anything to do with the system.

Maybe if you have a shit GM. A good GM is able to impartially decide how a players action would translate into the game world, and usually it ultimately comes down to a die roll in combat

middle ground, start at 3

Sure, but unless your character is specifically built around that action it'll end up being less effective than just full attacking.

Have you tried not playing D&D?

Depending on what edition you're playing, the new player should be able to acclimatise to level 5. 5e and 4e especially are pretty easy to grasp at those sort of levels. If you really feel he needs instruction, maybe do some practice sessions with them or, better yet, encourage the other players to mentor him. You could even make this a plot point: Perhaps he is a construct that is powerful, but inexperienced with the world? Or simply a savant in need of honing?

In terms of under-appreciation, I personally feel too sensitive to their criticism. It's actually made me cancel ongoing campaigns because I've been seized with anxiety about some part or another which I feel is not up to snuff, until it's too stressful to prepare. I know, logically, that everyone is having fun and the parts they are open about their likes and dislikes, but some defective part of my brain wants to convince me I'm a shit GM and everyone is just gritting their teeth through it.
It was actually cathartic to have one game be an actual failure that ended...semi-naturally instead of in my own irrational panic. It helped me realise that it's pretty damn obvious when a system/setting isn't working for the group, that's it's not some clandestine conspiracy to humour me.

I hope your games go well, OP and those crusty vets can put their experience to use!

Play a new system. When players start wanting to "skip to the good part" it means that your system r the way you run it is lack. Play something else that matches either the players expectations or your skills/desires as a GM.

>Maybe if you have a shit GM.
Not an argument.

If a mechanic is expected to be used throughout the campaign, it should be consistent enough to where you don't even need to ask the DM if you can utilize it or not.

I don't need to ask "hey DM, can I get advantage on my roll since I activated by Barbarian's rage," yet for some reason, it's acceptable for me to have to ask if I get advantage after tying a dude up and surrounding him with a militia of armed guards?

The most popular RPG system ever? No, not really.

From my experience, if you have a shit DM, he won't even give advantage on your roll since you've activated your Barbarian's rage, even if you ask and point it out in the rules.

What if the new guy doesn't want to be a fighter?

Well the beauty of such a situation is that it's much harder to justify why a Barbarian shouldn't get access to their rage ability than to justify why someone shouldn't get advantage from having someone bound and surrounded by armed guards.

That is true in theory, in practice not so much, but that is only because I seldom have a DM with a modicum of sense. I'm not offering anything to this discussion, forgive me.

You're just being a passive aggressive asshole if you do that.

What's a battlemaster then?

A shadow of the playtests and a reminder why fans are the worst thing to happen to a franchise.

I'm still pissed that Sorcerer went from a dragon-blooded mage who steadily becomes a martial to an off-brand wizard with less spells and a pool of points that you can't even use.

Honestly I wouldn't associate with anyone to stupid to make a level 5 character in 5E

*Too

My players don't give enough of a shit to even organize a game night.

You know what, let's up the ante, I have no friends who would hang out with me if they had literally anything else to do, or if it would mildly inconvenience them.

I want to give up on people. I really do. But I need people for board games and VASSAL just doesn't do it for me. It's not fair. I'm like the Kenichi Smith of eastern europe. If I was in america people would play DnD and complex wargames with me! They'd make time!

Better luck next life I suppose

Every single game with my friends ever, please just give me a fun yet serious group at least one time...

bitches dont know bout my bardic whip

You sound reasonable. I'd play in/run a game with/for you.

One of my shithead players tries to bully me into allowing him to do shit he shouldn't be able to do for free actions, bonus actions, and stuff all the time. I constantly get
>Would you say because I'm an Alchemist I can pull out and use a potion of healing on myself, and then as a bonus action do it again on Narg
>No
>Whaaaaaaaaat c'mon it makes sense
>No
I give bonuses and encourage intuition but sometimes all that leads to is people wanting to never die or do stuff with zero consequences.

Level 1 games are garbage for garbage cucks

Nope, previous editions have taught players that they are responsible for the skills they roll and they can even think outside of the box by using them differently with conversations.

The "Can I do [simple action that the player obviously can]?" is probably a design choice to invite new players who are intimidated by the rules and the DM can remember all that shit. The downside is that they don't learn what the rules do, so if the DM keeps telling them what to roll, why bother letting players keep their character sheet and dice with them if the DM can just roll in silence, check the stats, and tell the player what happened to their character?