/STG/ - Star Trek General

Now I want the adventures of USS Seaworld.

2500th scales are easy and fun. Also cheep to kitbash away and not burn your wallet.
Made the Concordia from last thread out of one.

>USS Marital Aid

I'm doing a pre-TOS thing. Considering making the Ares class from Prelude to Axanar out of the Miranda.

>Lieutenant Dolph, set a course for Muon 8 at warp 6
>click click eeeeee eeeeeeee eee (aye aye, Captain!)

I believe it was called SeaQuest DSV

God I loved that show as a kid!

I somehow missed the season where they went to an alien planet so was watching the show then all of a sudden there's a flashback to stuff I'd not seen at the start of the new season and now there's an alien on board. The fuck was going on with that show...

Either way there's some sneaky references in TNG to it because the effects guys and the like were on good terms.

Update: Made something that sort of looks like the Ares class out of the Wrath-of-Khan era Constitution. Its way too big to be right, but my players won't really know or care.

Asked in the last thread but does anyone know if the Decipher, Inc Star Trek RPG is good or not? I'm thinking of running a small game on Roll20 that centers on the party finding an asteroid that is filled with an ancient weapons cache from an unknown species and they only have a short amount of time until both the Romulans and Klingons move in on it as well.

From what I've seen it's ok but not awesome. Comparable with the LUG system, but not quite the same focus despite a lot of similarities.

So what system would you guys recommend for someone looking to do some space adventure?

I'm specifically thinking turn of the 25th century and sticking the crew in the ass end of the beta quadrant just to have somewhere newish to check out.

Star Trek: Adventures is really good if you can get your hands on a PDF. The mechanics follow the themes really well, especially the Momentum and Threat systems.

Is there any more information on what the New World Economy is like and how exactly it works? For my own purposes I'm trying to get more of a handle on what Earth is like beyond just the Federation because it's something that has been woefully neglected I feel in light of just assuming humanity is mary sue perfect.

At the core of it, automation, replicators, and extremely cheap power means that the Federation can provide for its entire citizenry without them having to work to keep the economy running. This means that people across the federation can focus on doing whatever they like, which tends to be whatever they find personally fulfilling. Picard's father ran a vineyard, there's plenty of civilian scientists, etc. The one character we've seen who didn't fit in well at all was Bashir's father, who constantly changed jobs because he couldn't find anything he really enjoyed.

As of the TOS era there was still money being used, with Credits mentioned in several episodes, but by the time of The Voyage Home, the Federation had apparently transited to a moneyless economy. It's possible that the Credits mentioned were gold pressed latinum though.

Obviously, capitalism and other money-based economies still thrive outside the federation and on its fringes. Even with replicators, scarcity still exists in places, but this is the exception rather than the rule.

>Even with replicators, scarcity still exists in places, but this is the exception rather than the rule.
This actually may not be true. The Klingons expand to acquire resources and territory, which they wouldn't need with replicators. It may be that their replicators are simple and cannot produce higher elements/objects the way Federation ones can.

The Cardies definitely have resource issues as well, making them not a part of this "replicators are magical" economy.

It looks like only really the Feds work on this principle, and even then, it has been noted that they can't make literally everything and that what they can make is limited by power generation, so some things are just easier to mine and carry manually.

In at least one episode of DS9, it's pointed out that replicators actually use stocks of pre-processed proteins and carbohydrates to produce food. He's specifically talking about the replicators onboard a runabout. Meanwhile, Industrial Replicators exist - the Federation sends some to Cardassia, and several times it's noted that replications aren't perfect, especially with biological stuff.

We know Replicators operate on similar principles to transporters. Transporters turn stuff into energy and then convert it back into matter. Replicators can apparently either turn energy directly into matter of the desired form(with some materials being hard to replicate) or they can turn existing stocks of raw materials into finished products. With how much power an energy/matter conversion would take, it's probably more effective to work with raw materials, so more efficiency-minded powers like the Klingons would focus on expanding into more territory to get more resources, rather than on building more solar power collectors and reactors to turn huge amounts of energy into hard-to-find materials.

TL;DR: Like any economy, the Federation's post-scarcity economy is complicated.

>one year after launch
>Gale Force 9's site still says the new expansions for Star Trek Ascendancy are slated for "early 2017" release
>don't even know if they'll be available for demo let alone purchase at Gen Con

I talked to the guys at Origins. The Ferengi and the Cardies are supposed to be at GenCon, along with maybe a small amount of the Borg. The Cardies are done enough that they were being played at Origins, for what that's worth. Also, that game is sweet as fuck.

This is good stuff. The Federation still has to deal with governments that still have a scarcity based resources so does that mean the world government (i.e. the government body for earth and the solar system not so much the federation) basically handles the bulk of business transactions and dealings? Also, I recall an episode where what's his name goes to the academy and one of his friends talks about blowing all of his credits on transporter trips back home, do they explain anywhere how people go about getting stuff beyond the basics?

That was transporter credits. The idea, as implied in the dialogue, is that people only get so many uses of the transporter per time period (month, I think it was) and those are tracked as "transporter credits". Makes sense, energy ain't actually free, so don't let people act like it is.

There's a mention or two of "transporter credits" on Earth, which seems to be some sort of rationing? makes a good point.

Anyway - it's clear most people have replicators in the home (in one episode, Keiko O'Brien finds the concept of someone preparing food with her hands disgusting) and replicators can make most stuff beyond the basics. There's probably access to industrial replicators on a basis of need if you need something specialized.

Yeah, that's the stuff I wanted to get more of a grip on. Long story short I'm trying to come up with a good concept for a TT based game where the PCs are primarily on Earth/in the solar system as basically cops. While it's not talked about a whole lot I imagine there is still plenty of illegal shit that goes on and people who want to trade for things you can't make with replicators (or may not be legal to have/make in the solar system) So that's where I'm trying to get at ultimately with my questions.

In short: nope, because economics are incredibly incidental to what what going on, and the idea of working out a future-economy that's almost/is lacking scarcity is a ton of work for little gain in writing stories.

We have hints and that's about it. Everything else is extrapolation.

>Keiko O'Brien
Oh Miles, why oh why did you marry the Japanese Hate Ghost? You were perfectly happy as you were, but then you just had to marry Keiko, the worst wife since Eva Braun.

Also, user, why do you namefag? Not super chuffed about it, but I find it unusual if it doesn't serve a purpose and it doesn't seem to. Mind joining the rest of us?

He's the dude prepping a game where his PCs are aboard the USS Excalibur and shit is going to hit the fan soon in game. Calls his campaign "The Sword in the Stone"

Oh, I started out in here talking about a game of Star Trek Adventures I'm going to run where the players are the bridge crew of the USS Excalibur at Axanar. I wanted to be able to put what I said into context while talking my ideas, then forgot I had it on.

Also it's because Keiko's a Cute.

Honestly I'm really proud of putting the Excalibur in a hidden asteroid base base just for the pun.

If it gets to the point where I have to make shit up I certainly will. One of the hard parts with keeping in the spirit of Star Trek is that it very much ignores it's own setting for narrative convenience.

I mean, you look at the sort of places that the main characters had like Kirk's home during one of the movies and how decked out it was. He was a collector and I imagine that doesn't mean he was some kind of greedy materialist so why can't other people work to get stuff beyond basic nesscesities and holodeck time? A part of me would like to think if people wanted to pursue things like working for an alien copororation or whatever it's just as valid as wanted to lounge about and contemplate the nature of the universe (or be a scientist)

There's no reason to think that international businesses can't operate for the sake of profit in Federation space. The issue is finding customers who have gold-pressed latinum to spend.

Hey, that's fair. Was just curious. I spend a lot of time in /btg/ with some namefags who're alright, so I'm not against it, just wondered what was up with it. You namefag to your heart's content, EA.

So, Trek sorta glosses over a lot of this kind of thing, but I always found it reasonable to think about it like a living wage country: the Federation will provide you good housing, a good education, replicators for your food/clothing/furniture requirements, and other basic requirements of living. Anything else, you gotta go figure out yourself. You want antiques and collectibles, like Kirk? Go be a famous ship's captain and earn credits to buy that shit from aliens (in DS9, it is heavily implied that Starfleet officers do get paid, how else can they pay their tab at Quark's?). You want to be a scientist? Go do science (the Fed will give you a basic lab) and make a name for yourself, discover some shit or do something amazing and you'll get funding from interested parties who want to see you succeed at whatever it is.

Shit like that, you get the picture.

The point to keep in mind is that, in the Federation, money is a means, not an end. Most humans don't live their lives for the sake of getting rich. Those who do tend to end up on the outskirts of Federation space like that arms dealer who worked with Quark in one ep of DS9.

This is true but it is a mindset thing. I have no doubt that the Feds do actually use credits/latinum/whatever, but they don't really care about it beyond needing it as a method of interacting with other cultures. Internally, it isn't what matters, work and skill is what matters. This is why Julian's dad is legit in the Federation: he works hard, even if he doesn't stick with something for too long, so no one really minds him bouncing from role to role.

Three things I have to say about Discovery:

1. What the fuck did they do to Mudd?

2. What the fuck did they do to Klingons?

3. The Orville is looking like better Trek than Trek is.

hell that would be great if you moved the base of the pylons to the top of the hull, then the nacelles hang down even with the hull and reduce the ships cross section.

>3. The Orville is looking like better Trek than Trek is.

I imagine because it makes no qualms about being utopian. It's probably the first tv show I actually want to watch and I don't really watch tv.

There are plenty of customers who want and will trade latinum which is all the various aliens and humans who are interested in doing it. especially when you consider the act of doing so to be an extended hobby where the goal isn't to horde money but do and be a part of economics or some other venture that allows you to get stuff like describes.

By the way, this is all really good stuff and I appreciate you enduring my questions which have no doubt been asked on here before

Would anyone be interested in trying to make a fairly simple system for Star Trek? Something that could result in character and ship creation within minutes rather than 30 minutes+?

I'm thinking there should be like 4 stats you roll (Presence, Brawn, Dexterity and Wits?), a small skill system based on the various subbranches (such as Science [Xenobiology] or Operations [Engingeering]). Race would modify 1 stat and 1 skill and allow you to pick one of two/three racial abilities (Vulcan Mind Meld or Nerve Pinch, for instance).

Ships would use 4 stats as well (shields, weapons, hull and engines) but those are not rolled but premade based on what ship it is. Each ship would also have a number of boons and flaws (sharp turning boon, weak hull flaw, etc.) that you roll on a table for.

What do you all think? Sound decent and easy enough?

Star Trek Adventures is almost that. If you want quick starts, you could do the style where you fill in your character sheet as you play rather than building it all ahead of time

This is basically the guts of the Modiphius system, but they get weirdly crunchy in places. I feel like for anything but larger engagements ships should be crunchy, since so much of trek involves circumventing the limitations of your tech.

>3. The Orville is looking like better Trek than Trek is.

Apparently MacFarlane said that in an interview, or rather he wasn't personally into the direction Trek is going into and started thinking about what he would want out of a Trek show. I think it's being pitched as a comedy, but it looks more like it's just light-hearted and personally that's a-o-k by me.

I want to try and avoid the crunch as much as possible. The ships should be a little more crunchy but not much to keep the gameplay/ship creation moving without having to stop and review rules and rules and rules.

Ah, I assumed the ship(s) would be premade by the GM, and less by the party.

Maybe just try adapting Savage Worlds or some other slim system?

I was hoping for Galaxy Quest: The Series, but this sounds good too.

Also: got ships set up for my campaign minis. Just a quick and easy thing. Getting the Excalibur's name and registry number on will be harder though...

I anticipate the first ships would, but once the party is moving up in rank and making it to where they are captains of their own ships and are part of a fleet sort of thing they could get into the nitty-gritty themselves.
>Maybe just try adapting Savage Worlds or some other slim system?
Sadly I have never had a chance to look over Savage Worlds...

Klingons expand because they feel like it

>the deviantart furries of the alpha quadrant

the Star Trek: Adventures campaign I plan on running in person: An attempt to evoke the classic TOS feel not by just pandering to the original stories but by evoking the original themes of addressing modern politics in the guise of the future and portraying life beyond what society may strictly allow, mixed up with fun adventures and alien fightan

the Star Trek: Adventures campaign I plan on running online: "THE FERENGI CANNOT EARN PROFIT IF YOU DISABLE ITS HAND..."

>"THE FERENGI CANNOT EARN PROFIT IF YOU DISABLE ITS HAND..."
Wut?

It's not even accurate.

It's a meme that started with Starship Troopers(film) but is now closely associated with Space Station 13.

Basically I plan to run a funny thing made up of "Deep Space Station K-13"

>Replicators can apparently either turn energy directly into matter of the desired form(with some materials being hard to replicate)
I take extreme exception to this, because how it's been shown on the show, this can't be the case, for several logical reasons. (I also don't believe that the transporters turn matter to energy - there's talk of "matter streams" and stuff with transporters - and that doesn't logically make sense either, but the show has also, in a typical contradictory fashion talked about transporters turning matter to energy, so I'll leave it at that). If it was matter-energy transformation, there would be no fuel problems, ever - just stick whatever matter (even your enemies!) into the transporter/big replicator (which are kinda the same thing), and boom! Fuel! Also have the issue of mining still existing: if replicators worked by turning matter into energy, you could literally make anything into anything, but there are clearly mines for specific substances. However, if replicators "merely" just are stupid transporters, rearranging molecules and atoms, you would NEED a base substance to work with, not just have it be more convenient. This is why GPL can't be replicated - latinum is apparently a base substance, and you would need a stock of latinum to make GPL in the first place - and latinum is the thing itself that is valuable. Though it would be interesting if latinum turned out to be some sort of living metal microorganism or the like.

Replicators work at the subatomic level. They do need base material to convert, but they can also recycle waste material the same way. That said, no process is ever 100% efficient and some energy will always be lost in the process, so restocking on material and energy is still needed. Additionally, there are materials unable to be replicated. Usually whatever's convenient for the plot, but including dilithium and I think also whatever antimatter they use, so they can't just replicate infinite fuel for warp speed, even if the reaction was 100% efficient.

This is entirely speculation, but the Ferengi probably chose GPL as a physical currency specifically because latinum was unable to be replicated.

I wish they would have gone to more depth of what can and cannot be replicated or, at the very least what would be least efficient in trying to replicate.

The more detail you give in this week's script, the harder it is to write next week's script

Makes sense that antimatter would be impossible to replicate, it's made of different quarks.

>The more detail you give in this week's script, the harder it is to write next week's script

You say this as if that ever stopped them from bullshitting something together or just putting together an episode where everyone spends the day inside of the holodecks

Come to Quark's, Quark's is fun, come right now, don't walk, run!

Replicating antimatter on a ship doesn't work because they are powered by antimatter. You'd be operating at a significant loss, if its even possible in the first place.
Dilithium has 4th dimensional crystal structure, and replicators can't grok that, so that's a no go as well.

Overall the impression is that it's hugely wasteful to energy > mass, so like someone said earlier it would make sense if they use stocks of proteins and such. That would probably only somewhat help though, evidenced by how voyager had to ration replicator use so severely for a while.

Which makes me wonder even more at the industrial base of the federation to afford the amount of power needed to create vital levels of fuel for it's ships and the ships of the other federation members (assuming they rely upon their own industrial/economic abilities to handle these).

That said, as for the second part of your post maybe part of their trade was for protien/plant bases that they couldn't consume themselves and used for the replicators while relying upon the garden grown stuff they had on ship.

Dilithium is relatively more common in the 2300s due to the discovery of cheap and easy recrystallization methods, so one could imagine the Federation is looking for other materials. Meanwhile, the Federation of the 2200s was nearly as voracious as the Klingon Empire, expanding massively to get more Dilithium.

I like the idea that the Federation builds huge particle accelerator covered Dyson Swarms around useless stars to generate antimatter. Nothing like occluding half the galaxy so your starship crews don't have to eat canned peaches.

Thanks to speed of light, they wouldn't even notice for years!

I doubt the federation would shrink their industrial base just because you have a new process of producing dilitioum, if anything it's useful for trade purposes especially with non federation races who might have things you want or you're enticing them to join the federation.

I don't see why not, you'd think there would be several of them around our sun. it's not like they'd be big enough to ruin someone's view from earth

What's your favorite ship, anons? Personally I love the Nebula because of how modular it is and how it is a great looking workhorse ship. Need a great explorer/research vessel? Sensor module. Need some more firepower? Tactical module. I'm sure there are other modules in the works that could work (and not those silly mini nacelles)

I'm going to be a total faggot and say I absolutely love the aesthetics of the Nu Trek universe. Then again, my main draw to the Nu Trek is primarily how the aesthetics so now when I think of star trek in general it's through that lens.

I love the Akira design. It's just such a pretty ship that looks like a logical evolution of the Miranda in the TNG era.

Conqueror class.

Love dem lasers and nukes.

I've loved the Nebula ever since that episode of TNG where O'Brien's old captain is running around blowing up Cardasian freighters. They give the Cardassians that fucking transponder access codes to the ship a Galor ambushes the Nebula, it takes a direct hit, fades back and, without shields, blows up the battlecruiser. What fucking workhorse.

Gotta be the Nebbie

>if replicators worked by turning matter into energy, you could literally make anything into anything, but there are clearly mines for specific substances
Dilithium and latinum can't be replicated, this is a core aspect of the setting.

But then that begs the question.
Why cant you replicate those things?

Antimatter might not be impossible to replicate. It probably isn't done because it's pointless to do so. As there is some loss in the process, you spend energy reserves (which come from antimatter) to simply get less of it. And it's also volatile.

With Latinum if I remember correctly it was some subatomic-out-of-phase mabojambo that replicators couldn't crunch so the Ferengi chose it as non conterfeitable base of their economy

Cheaper to replicate free neetbux for everyone than pay riot police to keep the starving poor under control.

I thought latinum's sole value was that it was impossible to Replicate. Aside from that, it had literally no practical use.

Star Trek isn't the setting for shoving your enemies into the gas tank.

If it were that kind of setting, you'd see way more of beaming people into space (or into the gas tank) so you can take their ship, or that sort of thing.

Looks like a cooling chamber for a giant as fuck cannon.

I swear to god you pansies in starfleet are so useless. You cannot even fire a disruptor properly, and you break on your first hour of combat.
>t. Chief engineer in the Klingon Defense Forces.

>Klingon
>Engineer

So I was looking into star trek models and decided to go with lego instead, to each their own, but how do you all think this came out? I've done these two so far but the Nautilus seems like it could be fun

I envy your supply of grey bricks

Adorable.

>Human
>Security

Gimme a better shot on that Defiant, user. Also, did you make stands for them or are they just sitting on the table? I ask because the Intrepid has a rounded hull on the bottom.

...

I swear to the Elements you slovenly barbarians in the KDF are so pathetic. You can't even protect your border worlds properly, and you need the Humans to save you whenever you get in over your heads.
>t. every Romulan ever

...

>tfw even fucking MacFarlane is able to call out CBS on their bullshit

Klingons had to have engineers at some point, although they were probably closer to /k/ommandos with machine shops than eggheads.

>klingon engineering
>needs to fire a disruptor at your warp core to persuade it to work
You opinion is not relevant here.

>fire a disrupter
>not engaging that pa'taq of a warp core with your bat'leth like an honorable klingon warrior.

Klingon Engineering
>A Klingon "Warp Core"
>Three (Or four on larger ships) elderly klingon warriors sitting in a circle telling the greatest tales of heroic battle and grandest honor until the very fabric of space tears and allows the ship to slip through into subspace.
>Speed is determined by how much bloodwine they are fed
>The "Warp Core" breaks down when one of them falls asleep
>It's repaired by slapping one of them and calling them an old useless fool