Why does nobody want to play a jedi anymore? Even if people want to play the good guys...

But Luke's totally the goodest guy.

It's worth noting that Luke was not trained as the typical jedi, and by the looks of the trailers for the new movies... doesn't believe in their ways entirely either.

At the risk of sounding like /pol/ here, Jedi philosophy fails for the same reason abstinence-only views on sex fail. The Jedi basically steal away children before they're too young to make their own choices, then brainwash them their whole life that emotions are bad and wrong and dangerous... but emotions are a part of being human, of being sentient. Now you have all these force-trained teenagers later in life who are feeling these feelings, trying to supress them because they don't know what else to do, and when that pressure finally builds up and snaps them, they literally don't know any healthy way to cope or deal with those feels... so they become prone to extremes and easily manipulated by the Dark Side.

The Jedi teach that love is selfish and evil. They need to teach that love is what makes life worth living, what will save you, not damn you.

They need to teach how to properly deal with emotions, not to suppress and despise them and live some half-alive "life" of self-assured denial. Passion destroys, but it also inspires and creates and makes good in the world too.

But user, don't you see, the Jedi Order is low-key a death cult.

>There is no Death, only the Force.

>people talking about what is and isn't canon
friendly reminder canon is shit
Also I have two players in my game who aren't technically Jedi but may as well be, they're packing lightsabers and a 90-100 place on the F&D morality scale

Anakin Skywalker is 100% canon and still a shining example of what happens when you give a teenager who's never been taught emotional coping skills a bunch of space magic and delusions about being something special.

The plot of the prequels makes no sense at all, and I still have no idea how Anakin went from "I need to save my wife" from "I need to murder children, wipe out my friends and serve this creepy weirdo, who just revealed to me that he orchestrated the whole war" in the span of two minutes.
The entire trilogy better be forgotten. I hope The Last Jedi salvages the jedi and trashes the "le emotionless robots" meme.

Yes, and?
I never said the Jedi Order wasn't some retarded-ass shit, just that players aren't all edgelords refusing to move from their spot on the border of light and dark.
Hell, they got mad when one of their comrades decided to blast a captured Imperial agent with lightning and risk her dying on them because interrogation wasn't going well.

>nucanon shit
>salvaging anything

EU was garbage, and deserved what it got.

Shut your filthy whore mouth, you know nothing of what you speak.

Good is overplayed and overrated

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD

>emotionless

Why do people immediately go to "The Jedi are trying to become unfeeling machines" instead of "The Jedi are trying to set themselves apart from the temptations of worldliness, like the Buddhist monks they are ostensibly based on"?

Seriously its just the core philosophy of "Attachment leads to suffering, freedom from suffering comes when you free your self from attachment" dressed up in space mumbo jumbo

Even nostalgia glasses can't change the fact that the majority of the EU was shite. Was some of it really good, sure. But that doesn't change the fact that most of it wasn't.

good guys vs bad guys is kinda simplistic and you can tell it's something that was created in the 70s (when standard fantasy was also good paladin against monsters and evil shit).
Fiction as a whole kinda went past that idealization phase (see for example Watchmen, the rise of the character Drizzt, a song of ice and fire) now anti-heroes or grey morality stories are all the rage.

And practically all of what's been coming out since has been irredeemable dogshit. The only good thing I've seen is maybe Thrawn.
Don't even try to defend Helicopter Sabers and Space Aladdin: the Show.

Yoda's stance on how jedi should live their lives is not appealing. At all.

At least to me the philosophy of Jedis doesn't make sense in the first place. Spending your love as a figurative rock to not interfere in the business of others is plain nuts.

Because mindless hedonism and feelgood bullshit is too important for moderate society to lose

Just imagine if people started doing productive things instead of slacktivism and talking about politics, the world would break in two!

Too bad the Jedi didn't actually DO much either, that was one of their biggest flaws. "Wait-and-see" while millions are dying, and then just being like "LOL, IT'S OK BECAUSE THEY GO BACK TO THE FORCE ANYWAY!"

"Productive" does not describe the Jedi to any degree.

Because they're hypocrites. They claim to want to set themselves apart from worldliness while claiming their responsibilities and reason for existing is for the sake of the world. It's all a lie they feed to themselves to justify their own warped sense of "righteousness".

It's not that the Jedi want to be unfeeling machines, it's that the emotion they want to feel is that they're right, and then they use their "detachment" as an excuse to be above any kind of counter argument, viewpoints, or consequences.

More like because as Luke and Anakin discovered, you can't deny all attachments to the galaxy at large. You still have friends, relatives, people that matter to you as more than just a face in the crowd.
That is the flaw with such a philosophy: nobody exists in a vacuum.

Go back to the roots, go to daoism. The Force is literally just the Dao. The interesting question is how to resolve violence with this worldview.

Isn't the word jedi from a Japanese word Lucas just changed a bit?

To answer your question OP I think many anons ITT have raised good points. The Jedi are viewed not so much as evil as they are inefficient, blundering, and weak. Its one thing to play attached to a morality, another to be attached to one that you (as a player) find to be hypocritical and/or nonsensical.
In the star wars RP at my FLGS I really really want to play a non Sith dark side user who is truly evil... Just not an edgelord. Somebody who believes the ends justifies the means and that order and might are the foundations of a truly functional society that allows for self-deception entire. A team player, as well. I just can't do it because there are no real Dark Side rules yet for the system they're running which means I'll probably join next campaign arc as a non-Force user support character

The Jedi code is unappealing. It's a unclear mish-mash of several philosophies mixed in with vague religious and spiritual elements, topped with the fact that they operate like an insane cult makes them hard to like. When it was just Luke and a creepy old green puppet it was all well and good, but the more they get expanded on the more they're horrifying.

To put it in perspective, I'm a member of a nearly 2000 year old apocalyptic death cult, and try to practice it in a very orthodox manner. Yet the restrictions on my life are nowhere near as extreme as the Jedi, and if I manage to wrestle my own sins to the ground and willingly take vows adding more extreme restrictions to my life, it would still be less extreme than the Jedi. The only way I could match those crazy fuckers is if I strapped myself to a pillar in the desert, but even then I would still be allowed to love. They're expressly forbidden from forming attachments that could lead to love. The idea of taking children from their homes and teaching them that love is wrong is a deeply disturbing thought that I can't get over.

Grey Jedi were a thing in the EU far before the Clone Wars cartoon was even concieved. It's a stupid concept, but it's not in any way new.

We live in a culture that feels need the to critique and subvert EVERYTHING that is traditionally "good", and explore and exonerate everything traditionally consider "bad". Nothing is allowed to be A or B, everything has to be some shady middle ground or it is considered "cliche" or childish. Meanwhile in reality, people who are genuinely fucking awful for no reason actually exist, and forced moral ambiguity is played out as fuck.

Children believe that behaving as you are supposed to behave "good" is a punishment and getting to behave contrary to have you are supposed to behave "bad" is a reward.

This explains everything you need to know about "autism", why everyone is a fatass, and all the other problems that children (and adults who never grew up) suffer from recently

>If our society seems more nihilistic than that of previous eras
It doesn't. It's a cycle. One generation get tired by the constant black-and-white morality hero stories of the previous one and instead start buying into the grey-and-grey morality anti-hero stories. And then the next generation grows tired of that and starts buying into black-and-white morality hero stories once more.

>perhaps this is simply a sign of our maturity as a sentient species
No, and the thought that it might be is if anything a sign of the opposite.

Yep, it's Jidai which refers to an era typically. Ie Sengoku Jidai would refer to the Age of Warring States. It's used to label a type of historical genre of films that Lucas drew inspiration from. A New Hope was heavily drawn from a film, can't remember it's name, in which a pair of prisoners in a castle must save a princess I think?

You need to lay off the memes. It's not the Jedis hate love, it's just that if you are a Jedi you are expected to put being a Jedi above your personal relationships. With great power comes great responsibility, and what happened with Anakin and Padme shows why letting Jedi get their dick wet is a bad idea

What happened between Anakin and Padme shows why it's a bad idea not to teach Jedi PROPER EMOTIONAL COPING SKILLS.

Like another user said, the Jedi Code fails for the same reason Abstinence-Only sex-ed fails. Abstinence is hard, some people are gonna fuck it up, and not having a "Plan B" for then the Plan Abstinence fails is a very bad idea.

the hidden fortress?

Is Lucas' divorce the reason for the jedi's abstinence?

I think you're misrepresenting them a bit there. They don't say love or any emotion is evil. They just frown on attachment and emphasize control and balance. That's not bad in and of itself, and it's even quite a bit more lenient than the Christian and Buddhist monks they're inspired by.

Really, obvious fuck-ups aside, the Jedi are hardly repressed or incapable of dealing with emotions. Their main problem seems to be just too much contemplating their navels and too little listening to what's going on in the galaxy. It's a meme that I think came out of this sttuborn idea that the dark and light must be in balance and have parity both in power and philosophy, whereas in the movies the Jedi are the obvious sensible dudes and Sith are always screaming autists.

The Hidden Fortress by Kurosawa

And holy shit now I see the parallels

That sounds an awful lot like Lucas' usual post hoc explanation for stuff in Star Wars to make them sound way more thought out than they actually were.

If they emphasized control and balance, their adherents would actually be able to deal with difficulties in their lives instead of falling harder than a Lawful-Stupid DnD Paladin who just killed an Orc baby.

Only Americans like black-white stories.

I have no knowledge of star Wars but here we go arguing...

Okay, while that is still true those kinds of philosophies such as Buddhism and stoicism usually also preach love to all men as far as I'm aware of. Yes, you can be closer to a friend than a what's his face on a crowd but you are supposed to love equally both. Also things such as death/poverty/pain are usually seen clearly as not preferable but they should be indifferent.

I'm not sure if I'm making sense but follow me.

The world is ruled by a benign being such as God, the Force, Nature, The Universe, the Common Good or Providence, and, if they are truly good, they won't make good things happen to bad people.

At the same time pain/poverty/fame/fortune/pleasure happen to both good and bad people. Then it is not really hard to suppose that those things are neither good or bad, but indifferent and when a person in his mistaken beliefs judges the life of a friend something 'good' rather than 'preferable' he is bound to suffer since he can loose it to external factors that are never on his control and then blame the gods or whatever.

What then could be considered to be good?
To such philosophies the only thing that are gifted (and are inherently) to a good person and that cannot be harvested by an evil(read ignorant taking platonic grounds where stoicism developed from) one is virtues.
Therefore, to live a happy life you should not make your happiness depend on external factors that many times are out of your control and depend only to God or the Force, but on the cultivation of virtues in your everyday life and inner strength.
And what are virtues?
Rightful beliefs that are in according to that all powerful being. To live according to Nature/God/The Force

Ate the pasta

Have you ever heard the tragedy of Chairman Yang the wise?

No.

To be completely frank, I just prefer guns.

>This brown greenish shit is better than that green brownish shit
Nucanon is as bad as old EU, it's also astonishing that they managed to spout that steaming pile of shit in such short time while it took decades for old EU

>Why does nobody want to play a jedi anymore? Even if people want to play the good guys, it's always the "grey jedi" or noble sith, or something like that, never simply jedi.
>Did I miss when people started hating them?
Because the B I G H E R O in Star Wars, Luke Skywalker is a GREY JEDI?

>Jedi
Sorry, I only play snipers or masters of teras kassi. Jedi are gay and ineffective.

>perhaps this is simply a sign of our maturity as a sentient species.
>maturity as a sentient species.
>sentient species
>sentient
Well it certainly isn't a sign of our ability to learn proper vocabulary.

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Veeky Forums Please fuck off

You used to be cool

>Why does nobody want to play a jedi anymore?

What? When I ran my campaign 3/4 of the players were jedi.

I thought not. It's not a story the Peacekeepers would tell you.

Men in their arrogance claim to understand the nature of creation, and devise elaborate theories to describe its behavior. But always they discover in the end that God was quite a bit more clever than they thought.

I thought not. It's not a story the Peacekeeping Forces would tell you.

>God
Okay Achmed. Don't you have a plane to 9/11 or some shit?

>has never played alpha centauri

>ever playing as that fucking retarded ginger cunt

I pride myself in having played every faction to death except the fucking durkadurkakikes.

Learn to overcome the crass demands of flesh and bone, for they warp the matrix through which we perceive the world. Extend your awareness outward, beyond the self of body, to embrace the self of group and the self of humanity. The goals of the group and the greater race are transcendent, and to embrace them is to achieve enlightenment.

This, desu. In a world of space wizards (because every time I've played a Star Wars game the party is always several flavors of force-users) I like to be the guy with the big gun that kills things so hard they die to death.

Deirdre or Zakharov a best, jesusfags and militants get bent

>Play a Force-sensitive pistolero
>Have a gun that can only be fired using the Force and is even more accurate when fired at living beings with a Force resonance
This is why FFG is best

Wait, really?

Considering he rejected both his teachers going "killll himmmm" when it came to his dear old dad, the case can be made.

It's a Hive legend. Chairman Yang was a leader of the Human Hive, so powerful and so wise he could use social engineering to run Police State without inefficiency... He had such a knowledge of nerve stapling that he could even keep the Drones he cared about from rioting.

No, it's fanon. Grey jedi is not even a thing in current canon.

I reiterate:
>canon is shit

Jedi were ruined by the prequels. Their code is retarded and they all act like idiots.

Luke Skywalker acted nothing like these feebs and turned out to be the greatest Jedi ever, so clearly the Jedi institution of the Old Republic is absolutely pig retarded.

>doesn't listen to joda and obi at all
>almost turns to the dark side
>gets his shit together and goes back to the light side
>pulls his dad back to the light side

He's a "grey" jedi.

No, he's a smart jedi who won. That doesn't make him grey.

The problem with Jedi is once again the Force has an immediate misunderstanding of its basic nature. It's clear Lucas borrowed a lot of concept from Japanese film and as such eastern mythology but since he (and many others) are dumb westerners who didn't bother to study anything beyond that it simply became a binary "Light side good/dark side bad" thing like Christian belief systems and not what it actually represents which is more like Taoism.

In essence: Taoism states that the world has a simplicity to it. A universal perfection like a still pond. When you work with the universe, as per the precepts of wuwei, then you are following a divine order which flows and inadverdently helps others, or at least follows what the universe desires.

When you attempt to force your way to what your goal is without thought or consideration or work AGAINST the universe then you merely harm those around you. You kill people, endanger innocents, bring about the wrath of the gods, etc

That's why the concept of "grey jedi" is dumb. It ONLY works if you subscribe to a good/evil axis which the light side/dark side MAYBE is but it's not based on intent it's based on action.

Sith are always more fun

You have equally strong feelings about sand, so how serious can we take your opinions, really?

haha, i see what you did there.

>smart jedi
Impossible to be a smart jedi.

If you use the force and you're smart, you're either a sith lord or you're "other".

Based on my time roleplaying in SWTOR, it seems to be a few factors from what I witnessed.

1) Some people misunderstand the Jedi Code, like some anons in this thread. In particular, the line, "There is no emotion, there is peace." A lot of people seem to take that as meaning that Jedi are taught not to have emotion, but that's untrue. All of the Jedi in the movies show many range of motion, including anger. This part of the Jedi Code means that you shouldn't let emotions control you, having them is fine and normal. Hell, in the old canon the Dark Woman largely purged/suppressed her emotions, and many of her fellow Jedi saw her as a sort of extremist.

A lot of people don't like this perceived lack of emotion because it seems boring.

2) As some anons pointed out, some people find the straight-forward good guy archetype boring, so they look for ways to make a Force using character that is a but "edgier," usually again misunderstanding the Jedi. Being on the light side of the Force does not mean you are Rainbow Bright. It means you can't be a sociopath, sure, but you can be stern and condescending, such as Vrook Lamar and Mace Windu.

3) Special Snowflake Syndrome is also a big part of it, similar to point 2. Some find the straight-laced Jesi boring, so they aik for weird twists on Force using characters like the light sides Sith or the "grey" Jedi (despite the fact that there is no "grey side of the Force," and that the term Grey Jedi just refers to a Jedi that does not always follow the Council; Grey Jedi are very much on the light side, such as Qui-Gon Jinn and Jolee Bindo). Turning to the "grey side" is called the "dark side in denial."

But user, all sith lords are clinical idiots, especially Sheev.

>Mace Windu
Who was as fucking GREY as you can get while being a member of the Jedi Council. He fucking had killing techniques he developed himself that would have gotten him cast out of the Jedi order if anyone saw him use them.

Stop it. Grey jedi are a stupid meme, and they do not exist.

>He fucking had killing techniques he developed himself that would have gotten him cast out of the Jedi order if anyone saw him use them.

You are the third most retarded person I've ever seen on Veeky Forums.

Mace Windu was still firmly on the light side, edgy techniques aside. Not as far as Yoda or Ki-Adi-Mundi, but still light. There is no such thing as the "grey side."

It's because the prequels fucked them up so badly. Before, we knew they were a mysterious peacekeeping order who had a mystical connection to the universe and magic later swords. Afterwards, we realized they all had their heads up their asses about pretty much everything, and got rolled by an elderly politician.

> Be doing Star Wars freeform roleplay (I was 16, don't judge me)
> Dark siders are kicking our asses, have at least 75% of the galaxy conquered
> Start approaching other anti-Dark Siders to see about setting up a mutual defense pact
> A couple Jedi agree, mainstream Jedi are getting demolished so they don't have a choice
> Approach the Grey Jedi
> "YOU'RE A BUNCH OF EMOTIONLESS ROBOTS"
> "THE DARK SIDE ISN'T BAD OKAY IT'S OKAY TO USE DARK MAGIC IF YOU HAVE NOTHING BUT FUZZY FEELINGS"
> "How is this related to the problem at hand?"
> "IT DOESN'T MATTER IF THE SITH LORDS CONQUER THE GALAXY HOW IS THAT MY PROBLEM"
> Check user statistics
> Sith Lords 56%, Jedi 10%, Grey Jedi 34%

I'm still emotionally scarred by that conversation.

NO ONE IS SAYING THERE IS A GREY SIDE, YOU FUCKING RETARD!

A "grey" jedi is simply a jedi that follows the FORCE, not the Jedi council.

Windu was a grey jedi, Quigon was a grey jedi. Luke Skywalker was a grey jedi.

Windu was ON the Council. Saying he doesn't follow the Council is fucking retarded.

Luke didn't HAVE a Council to follow. He had Yoda and Obi-Wan.

I'm pretty sure that in oldcanon, he was suffering from something like 2 weeks of sleep deprivation (roughly equivalent to doing a kegstand with absinthe) and Palps was deliberately goading him into not trusting anyone else.

>Luke Skywalker acted nothing like these feebs and turned out to be the greatest Jedi ever

What was so great about Luke?
He didn't even kill the Emperor.

>Luke didn't HAVE a Council to follow. He had Yoda and Obi-Wan.
Who both had learned and followed Council teachings. And then they learned Luke the Council teachings and he took a big crap over it, used his anger as a force, reeled himself in and dragged his dad back out of the Dark side.

First of all, user, take a deep breath.

Second of all, I misunderstood, I apologise.

Because Maul made being a renegade sith cool. Because Qui-Gon made pissing in the face of the jedi council look like a jolly good lark.

Except they didn't teach him Council teachings. In fact Yoda's whole arc is how the Council was wrong in a number of ways and how the Jedi have gone wrong under his guidance. For fuck's sake he even says that the Jedi have grown arrogant in their power.

Nothing whatsoever in ESB shows that he's teaching Luke Council-approved stuff. A good portion of his material he teaches Luke is pretty much against what he is like in the PT, and that's because of the hard lessons he learned during the Clone Wars.

And Obi-Wan? Obi-Wan didn't teach him shit about anything. He had like one "real" lesson from Obi-Wan.

The closest you could come to saying that Luke took a shit on their lessons is the whole attachments thing about not going to save his friends - but you know what? Luke learned the hard way that they were right. He didn't help his friends escape. That was all Lando. The only things Luke got out of that situation was a missing hand and the truth of his parentage.

And when he left to go to Endor, they didn't say that Luke had to kill Vader - Yoda said he must confront him. Which he did.

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