The "Girl" problem

Many of us know of this problem, have a group which has good dynamics, introduce a girl to the group and the chemistry changes for the worse, as multiple people who are usually fine change their behavior and become more quiet, or obnoxious.
What is the solution?
Having a girl join the group and hoping the other players "get back to normal"?
Ban girls from joining a group?
Some kind of other solution?

There are two easy solutions
>quit playing with sperglords
And
>if she flirts, she has to put out.
There, problem solved.

dont be idiots and get rid of people you dont like, screw manners

Will the mods clean up Veeky Forums and ban shitposters just like they did on /a/? I sure hope so.

How do I find non sperglords to play with?

Only let ugly girls play

I'm not shitposting, are you telling me you have never had the problem of a girl shows up to a session, and one or multiple of your players become a lot more quiet and subdued?
I'm not joking, I am legitimately asking.

Ironically, my online table is WAAAAY less 'spergy than my IRL table.

Get a female friend. Introduce prospective sperg players to her during session zero. If they sperg, throw them the fuck out. Alternatively, only get players who have ,or have had in the past, a long term relationship. Play with gay boys, diverting all attention to yourself.

Don't play with spergs that can't handle being around women.

Where do you guys live that you have piles of potential players and can weed out ones you want vs ones you don't? I literally know one guy into pen and paper games from highschool and he lives an hour away

After some friends moved away, my in-person group is literally 50% girls atm. Never had a group who twinge out because "gurls" before.

Talk to the people acting out and point it out to them, people change when you introduce them to situations they're not used to.

Give them and yourself time and once you learn that girls won't bite, you would've made yourselves better people gaming-wise and social-wise. I'd also invite more girls to the table so they're more used to it.

Most of the groups I've played in have had female players, both the vagina kind and the feminine penis kind. Never had a problem with sperging. Of course, they're all total sluts, the men and women, so maybe it's just because we were all fucking?

In a city. Sorry rural user, I know that life can be suffering. Just remember that it's worth it for the four wheelers, guns, and giant barbecues.

this was my mentality a few years back

try not living under a rock and socialize, use the social tools available to you, if all else fails go teach some friends/co-workers how to play

i started teaching folks D&D at a local library last year and it spread like wildfire

I've had a couple of girls in my games. The first time was in High School and it was bad. I ended up having to talk to her and let her know that nobody would be mad at her for quitting, especially since two of the players were making her very uncomfortable.

The second was years later, we made sure everyone in the group was over 21, and it went great. We only stopped because of real life getting in the way.

I guess just find mature players

College. Gotta deal with the occasional SJW or fratboy drunk, but the options are many

>D&D at a local library
Holy shit that's brilliant! Why didn't I think of that sooner.

My library is all seniors. I guess I could try but I don't really talk with them. The median age in my town is 50 something. I just live here because I have a good job and can live with my family. The town has a population of 4000.
I would but I'm Canadian

Why do so many solutions involve ostracising the socially awkward guys?

My group has both women and men. The group has no awkward people who become quiet and subdued because of women.

Just talk to people like they're people, not freaking unicorns. Women might not speak to you much, but perhaps more would if you didn't drop your spaghetti as soon as they sit at your table.

It's been years. Two of my players are still afraid of women and clam up if they join.
They're good otherwise and are fun to have at the table. I know that keeping women off the table is an easy way to "Keep the peace" but I don't know if it's right to do. I've tried various ways but they're just scared of women.

I don't have a problem talking with women. 2 of my players do. I tell them that women are human beings but it doesn't change things.

Maturity. When I've experienced this problem, it's almost always been with people in their teens or 20s and it pretty much always fixes itself in time. In the cases where it hasn't and the someone is irredeemable one is left with an unfortunate choice. If it's someone who's not fun or you don't like or whatever it's as simple as booting them. If he's a close friend or a really good player, things are more difficult. If everyone has enough time you could schedule sex segregated sessions to accommodate his needs, but few adults have time for that many games. I'd recommend trying to help him get more comfortable with girls in general. Of course, there's always just discussing the issue like adults, but I realize that not everyone can use that solution.

A few words isn't going to change years of anxiety.

They deserve it for being neckbeard shitlords, user! Don't you know?

Because, to be frank, it's easier to get rid of a few people than it is to exclude half your potential players.

And this isn't all of them, but I've found that the ones that can't function normally around women don't have that as their only issue. In my personal experience they've run the full gamut of fedora-ism—militantly political, bad hygiene, crappy game attitude (power/metagaming, bad RP), etc.

Frankly, I enjoy gaming with girls more than I do guys sometimes. I'm the only male player in one of my groups and it's been much more fun than the all-male group I was in, which featured a LOLrandum, a Hardcore Communist, a furry, and me. The DM told me when I quit that I was the best RPer in the group and I'd just started TTRPGs.

So yeah, I find it's easier to kick the spergs.

Because they are obviously problematic that guys who voted for Donald Trump

>inserting political opinions apropos to nothing
user, I have bad news...

I don't know where you're from, bro, but I would feel terrible kicking any of the socially awkward people from my games. They're just quiet kids into nerd stuff that tend to have pretty shitty home lives, and they always appreciate a good story.

Maybe it's because I tend to try and make friends or already am friends with people in my games and don't have this weird businesslike detachment from my groups.

Oh, socially awkward is fine, it's socially dysfunctional that I have to ditch. I would really rather not boot anyone—my players are my friends, don't get me wrong. I would hate to have to kick them out over group dynamics. But sometimes that's the only option.

And yeah, I guess I do treat TTRPGs a bit too seriously. But then, that's my social issue. Would rather have that than not be able to talk to people.

Because socially well adjusted people of either gender are more fun to be around than spergs.

So we've agreed to kick out nerdy guys so we can make girls feel welcome? We've come full circle, anons. We are the jocks.

No. We only have gone full circle after becoming the girls.

>if all else fails go teach some friends/co-workers how to play
Said friends either don't give a fuck or are dead set on shit like Pathfinder and OpenLegend. And I don't have any co-workers.

>Why didn't I think of that sooner.
I know why I didn't. They tried that very thing at the local library and it quickly died from lack of interest.

We're not talking "mildly socially inept and talks about his interest with way too much enthusiasm" nerds, we're talking about "can't stop staring at anona's tits while breathing heavily and stuttering under his breath 'you smell pretty'" level of sperg. The kind of sperg you could weaponize. You know exactly who I'm talking about, the kind of guy who simultaneously seems so weak willed that he can't even speak but still seems like he'd rape any woman he could get his hands on given an eighth of a chance.

Another user here
>have 2 hrs a week game time available
>my best 2 players are girls
>i will never let people ruin my games even for social charity

But that's not what we were talking about
We were talking about
>a girl shows up to a session, and one or multiple of your players become a lot more quiet and subdued?

>you meticulously WET-BLEND your miniatures while Chad dips
Jokes on you nerd, I was already a jock

It's gentrification on a social level. The hobby becomes more popular, bringing in more well-adjusted people, and those existing nerds either adapt to the new climate or withdraw from it. I'm lucky enough to be normal and capable of functioning around people, so on an objective level I only benefit from this, but I've spent long enough hanging around this place that I still have sympathy for this socially maladjusted types who now essentially have the ostracisation that used to be standard for all nerds heaped onto them as the unlucky few undesirables.

Every girl I've ever played with has been competent, and every guy I've ever played with acts no different with a girl in the group. Yet I still worry about girls ruining the game every time I play with one even though it has never been a problem in my decade of tabletop.

No.
Almost every single one of my groups had at least one girl and none of the male players were so scared of them that they'd react like that.

The problem with Gentrification is, why didn't they just buy property and profit as well?
Mortgages aren't that expensive, and these were cheap areas, that was the entire point

Not everybody has money to invest into a growing neighbourhood, the people generally priced out when an area undergoes gentrification are those who were only managing to make ends meet before all the local stores tripled in prices and rents doubled.

I would get that in Europe, with 5 year long mortgages, but Americans have 30 year mortgages.
It would be cheaper to go 50/50 with a person you trust and get a mortgage, than it would be to rent.

I definitely nuerstand that this can happen, but it's never been my experience. I've played with a bunch of girls over the years, though granted few of them were the kind you'd want to date. Over several groups I've played with some bitchy fat girls, a lesbian with an overbite you could open beer bottle with, a woman with a face that looks like she fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down, a dyed-hair feminist who liked to screech at players when she didn't get her way, and a woman who had a severe speech impediment who was way too old to be hanging out at a university role playing club. We've had precisely one girl who was attractive, wasn't a bitch, wasn't fat, wasn't a dyed-hair feminist, and was of the appropriate age for the group; but then she had to leave shortly after joining because she's in med school and has a lot of work.

Let me tell you a story about how I had a long running game destroyed.

>have been running a series of D&D games in the same setting with the same group for years, everyone has helped shape the world, past PCs become famous NPCs etc
>Player A wants to invite a new player. Enter That Girl.
>"so user your setting is really cool, I want to make a female Holy Knight of the Tower"
>Point out this is a male only monastic order, but these other orders are either all female or mixed
>She won't accept this, wants to play someone "breaking down gender segregation".
>By changing a setting detail that everyone else is fine with, and one player no longer with us created.
>Explain it's not setting appropriate and I'm not prepared to change an established point of lore for that, because it would be disrespectful to the ex-player whose PC's retirement was founding that faction.
>Offer to run a different game, Player A suggests he'll GM for a change.
>Turn up at Player A's at usual game time to gen a character
>"Sorry user, my friend wanted to invite another girl who's interested in D&D, and we all thought you weren't a good fit after the argument you had with her about respecting the setting over making a new player feel welcome, so we made characters on Skype. You can join the next game maybe?

I play with four women and two guys, me the Only GM.

Once you actually play with women and not girls the problems are self correcting.

>Not vetting the players before hand.

What's wrong with you?

Did you at least punch Player A in the face?

>trusting a close friend to invite someone to our social group who would be a good fit

I'd gamed with the guy for years, I thought he would be a good judge of character

>Not vetting the players before hand.
How are you even supposed to do that?

Wow. Most pathetic thread on Veeky Forums right now.

do a oneshot with her and them before adding to the regular group.

No, that honor still goes to /pfg/.

You have a bitch, pussy-whipped friend, then.

Wow, most pathetic post on Veeky Forums right now.

Girl trying to shut down talk about how she and her ilk are a problem by calling it pathetic. Exactly how butthurt by this are you?

Never had any problem with girls in any of the game I play and run though all the game I played were one shot with total stranger, not a single bad experience with a that girl or that guy, guess I'm pretty lucky
Though if you have a long running group of sperglord neckbeard who never interact with a girl other than their mother, you are bound to have some awkward moment at the table if they try to get the only girl attention

>Studying all week for my D&D exam, have to pass in order to play D&D with group
>Pass physical with flying colors
>Remember my character optimization notes and manage to pass my min-maxing test
>get docked points on my roleplaying test for "problematic accents" and "uncreative elf names"
>Finally get to female test, where I am expected to have a conversation with a girl
>fumble and trip over my words, while stuttering and asking if she liked Guardians of the Galaxy 2
>They went with another candidate
Well, I'm disappointed I didn't pass all the vetting. Pretending to be a wizard seems like it would have been a lot of fun.

Treat them no differently to anyone else.
And by that, I mean don't hold back if they're being a pain in the ass or disruptive.

They'll soon learn they'll get no special or positive attention out of you, and piss off.

OR they turn out to be postivie impact on the game, and are a cherished player.

>quit playing with sperglords

What kind of hobby do y'all think that is ?

>Pretending to be a wizard seems like it would have been a lot of fun.

Give it time, I'm sure you'll be an official wizard in a few years.

Banning girls is kinda stupid. The people in your group should try to mature a bit.
But we might have to consider which girl is in the group too. A lot of them are addicted to attention, so they'll disrupt the play experience to get that attention.

Imagine what would've happened if they banned the use of fire just because a small group of slow cavemen could never handle it?

>make fancy knight character
>character flaw is that he's too chivalrous to function and will never use underhand tactics or strike a woman
>figure this will allow the GM to give me problems with solutions more interesting than "hit thing with thing"
>turn up to first session
>oh there's a girl, how unusual
>she seems ok
>characters meet in tournament
>forfeit bout against girl's female barbarian because muh chivalry
>she wrinkles her nose and calls me sexist
>DM shows her character sheet where flaw was written in advance
>she clams up the rest of the session and doesn't make eye contact with me
>she never comes to another session because she felt "creeped out"

This is weird. I'm looking back at all the campaigns I hosted - all the way from elementary to now, and I'm realizing that there was only one that did NOT involve a girl or girls, which was ironically the most recent one.

I never really ever run into this issue. Granted, the girls were almost always part of it from the start, not joining mid-way. But it's always been absolutely natural to us. There always has been at least one or two girls with similarly nerdy interests around, and everybody just found it completely normal. They've been with us - joining LARPS, games, or just hanging out - all the way back to seventh grade elementary school.

Not sure how this came into being, but I've honestly never seen it different. The people who introduced me into the hobby had the same deal. On all fantasy cons and meetings and sessions it was the same: about 3 guys for every 1 girl, and if somebody was an asshole, he was kicked out. Plently of awkward guys around, sure, but never enough for it to spoil anything: even among the nerdiest people at least basic courtesy was expected.

I just never found having girls around, even in these circles, in any way special or worth particular noticing.

I wonder why is my experience so off from what most of you seem to describe. I think it might be national/cultural thing?

Personally I would force girls at the table as much as possible so that the scared guys could get used to them being around. It can even help them at life outside the table.
If I like those guys a lot and had a stable source of income, I'd even consider hiring hookers to play and interact a bit with these people from time to time.
People won't get rid of their fear by being sheltered from it.

>I wonder why is my experience so off from what most of you seem to describe.
Because people with your (and my) kind of experience never call attention to it, except in response to people experiencing unusual problems.

>kick out those fucking nerds so we can have more stacies at the table
someone post the evolution of the hobby image

I can smell the roast beef from here.

Your story lack some specific stuff to help me understand how this girl actually destroyed your setting, but clarify me on this:
What's the big problem with her trying to go that way? Maybe she was just inspired by something like Joan of Arc? Or was she one of those extremely obnoxious girls prone to screeching?

That is a way that I never really thought about it. But here is the thing: I don't really ever remember running even into the kind of people who had this kind of problem...

Maybe you are right: your explanation sounds very plausible and I might be chasing some ghost here.
But I always wondered how much do local and cultural standards play into this. Because I was brought up in a country where the stigma on nerdiness almost did not exist. It's really something I only really know from american media. From videogames past having the best grades in the class to playing "dragon's lair" as tt-RPG were generally called: it was not usual, but virtually never enough to grant a major stigma. Or - because my experience will be inevitably rather anecdotal - I at least never experienced major stigma.

And that I think also formed the kind of audience I've dealt with. I mean most girls were not interested, but the minority who was was just... there, from the start.

What a shit coincidence. Too bad she had to act like that, though. If people could swallow their pride every once in a while, I guarantee you that we'd have at least 60% less problems in the world today.

One of the members in our group occasionally played with his gf, last one I remember them was being some sort of a tiefling bonnie & clyde like duo.

Also, they would almost always moved the passedout drunk bodies of the male dragonborn barbarian and the male human paladin in lewd-poses in back alleys and barns.

It became a running joke that unmarried dragonborn males sleep together and that this was normal for the barb.

>exaggerating an opinion to try to prove a point
You know what kind of person you're looking like right now?

The trick is only including girls with a sense of humor

That does suck but depending on how the whole thing transpired it could have been the obvious conclusion.

You guys had this whole tradition in you campaign which seems kinda special snowflaky to change it and you did have alternatives. Plus in the end they picked her over you which is a dick thing to do since you guys been playing together for years which no matter what is wrong.

Although you might have come off stand offish when saying no to her character idea and might have rubbed the other members the wrong way.

Either way someone made a dick move.

You're conflating a hobby with civilization.

>But here is the thing: I don't really ever remember running even into the kind of people who had this kind of problem...
Where would you, except for an imageboard where people feel safe to air their dirty laundry under the protection of anonymity? I mean, it's not like people on the street would just walk up to you and complain about girls ruining their niche hobby games.

let me try to give an actual honest answer here

most likely these people sperge out because they have lacked normal and/or positive social interaction with the opposing gender
if you think these people are actually decent folk and are willing to bear through some cringy times, allowing them to interact with one in a more or less controlled setting is probably really beneficial to them and they will likely improve over time

just make sure to correct actually problematic behaviour that makes either involved party uncomfortable, but try to do so in non-humiliatiang way (eg. talk to the person privately instead of calling stuff out in front of everyone)

Both are held together by social interactions. Both can be destroyed or flourish depending on those social interactions.

Not him, but if you play with your friends, they would vent their frustrations with you.

And what are the chances that your friends with whom you play have wildly different experiences from yours?

If they play with me, and we're talking about game experiences, I'd doubt it varies that much.
And again. Those same players, if they're actually my friends, would want to talk to me about the different experiences.
Unless everyone is severely immature, there are solutions to this kind of problem.

>I'm going to disavow my own friends that I have known for X years because I want to invite girls, not players, but girls specifically.

Well, I was a part of pretty extensive network of "organized weirdos". Since back then and there, internet wasn't really all that readily available, we had a net of actions - LARPS, cons, session meetings, anime-screenings etc... that were happening in regular interval, that people not only gathered to participate in the event itself, but also to just hang out, drink, talk, and organized further events. When someone played a RPG campaign, it was normal that five people played the campaign in one room, while seven others who did not really participate in the campaign still gathered in the kitchen, drinking and chatting and planning their own thing.
The network was pretty extensive and open, with maybe over hundred people participating at any time. Almost every time I went on one of these things, there would be some new people there.

I'd anticipate to run into people like that as part of this network... I mean there was the occasional asshole, and the occasional super-freak or genuine autist, but they were isolated.

Although: it's possible that if these people existed in larger groups, that they would not join this "network" of ours to begin with. Though I don't know how would they meet among themselves then. We were pretty much covering the entire hobby market back then.

Need more 'girls shitting up the game' stories.

>What is the solution?
Don't play with women. I don't care if everyone at the table is married, or gay, or both. Don't fucking play with women. Gender dynamics are an evolutionary thing and no social behavior will change that.

But here is the opposite issue: Are they really friends, and do you really want to have them as friends if they are this absolutely socially retarded?

My real question is: why would you even want to hang out with people who apparently lack basic human decency?
Again, outsider perspective as I never really seen anything like this happening on a scale worth mentioning, but...
You make friends with people because those people are decent, no? The same goes for the girls, by the way: I mean if the first thing the girl does is start forcing her insecure anti-gender-role agenda then kick her out because that shit is indicative of her probably being an insufferable person. But if the boy does some shit then he is an asshole too.

This isn't really about male to female issue to begin with: this is just about surrounding yourself with people you can rely to be kind, trustworthy, have some dignity.

>socially awkward guys are unkind, untrustworthy, have no dignity and lack basic human decency
Fuck off back to the darkest corners of tumblr.

Well that is a completely sensible reaction.

Are you just intentionally misinterpreting an issue to justify your shitty actions irl? Am I posting on tumblr?

Yeah, that was totally what was said? You sure know how tumblr works if your reaction is to take something said and spin it however you want it to look like.

On how many layers of feminism are you? Nerdy guys being uncomforatable with girls and changing how they behave is a sign of a "lack basic human decency". What the fuck?

All they did on /a/ was ban generals.

If they do that here, say bye to 40k/warhammer/ageofsigmar/horusheresy etc generals and the entire board being flooded with GW.

>Attend yet another glorious joust
>Being the shining beacon of paragon that I am, my adoring fans shout and roar in excitement as I enter the jousting list
>A lady drops her handkerchief
>Deathly silence
>My stallion, penis engorged, slowly trots in the direction of the handkerchief
>The men in the audience start licking their lips as the women cower
>I bend over, momentarily passing my gaze over the lady's bosom
>She feels uncomfortably sexualized
>I pick up the handkerchief with my powerful, patriarchal hand
>As I hand it over to her with a wicked grin, my codpiece can barely contain my erection and starts to fracture
>The lady takes her lost possession and mumbles a frightened "t-thank you"
>I lift my visor and wink
>"It was my.... privilege".

I've been a part of about 5 different groups of players, of those groups, 3 of them had girls in them. None of those three groups have ever had problems because of the girls being girls. Maybe it is just because I play with people who have the emotional maturity of an adult.

>not letting her go in disguise as a man to prove her faith trumps their dogma
What kind of unimaginative homo fagplate are you?

>Yeah, that was totally what was said?
That's exactly what you said, you stupid fuck.

>why would you even want to hang out with people who apparently lack basic human decency?
>this is just about surrounding yourself with people you can rely to be kind, trustworthy, have some dignity.