How useful is spear and shield for adventuring?

They could deflect it then you'd be stuck

Unless the other guy has a spear and shield.

This picture is neat. Got any other pictures of spearmen?

Scratch the shield. Get a heavier two-handed boar spear for killing monsters.

...

The spear is one of the most-used weapons in history, and for good reason. Easy to make, easy to learn, high skill ceiling, pragmatic outside of combat, effective against both infantry and cavalry.

In a vacuum, it'd be my melee weapon of choice.

If there's walls all around, he'll have very little space to advance through even if he knocks it aside.

If you hit someone's point aside, it doesn't go wildly careening. You step back and there's a very real chance you can skewer them.

Also, that's why spearmen carry swords. If the gap's going to close, drop the spear and draw it.

One-handed spears are either short or unwieldy.

So... what system does it do justice?

>One-handed spears are either short or unwieldy.
I'd still give the guy with the shield the advantage in the original scenario. A shield+spear combo is going to be better than a long spear in enclosed spaces where too much reach can make it impossible to even turn a corner without have to awkwardly maneuver the shaft around. Yeah, it depends on the exact dimensions of the space available, but a shield is a pretty pretty damn useful is most situations. This is assuming both combatants are equally lightly armored and properly trained in their respective weapons of course.

>Moribito
Man, I enjoyed the hell outta that show.
Such a damned shame that Adult Swim dropped their Anime for a while right in the middle of showing it.
Balsa having the same voice as Major Kusanagi turns me diamonds.

>pragmatic outside of combat
Nigga what? It's completely conspicuous, large and fairly heavy, and can't be conveniently set aside and quickly drawn like most smaller weapons can. Going into a battle, sure it's a good pick. But for everyday odd adventuring jobs in dungeons and cities, it's shit tier.

>Monster has two heads
Yer fucked now Bucko.

>Monster has two heads
What?
Boar spears go in the other guy's chest not head. The point is to jab it in the center of the creature's mass so it doesn't pull away or push toward you with its larger heavier body. Extra heads don't mean a thing.

Instead of 'how good they are', I guess it's more productive to think of 'when' or 'where'.
- The dream situation is the spartan case: everyone short on armor, wall/box formation, in a corridor (no flanking), the enemies all packing shorter-ranged weapons, you can throw the spear and get a sword for closer combat.
- The more heavily-armored everyone is, the less effective this combination becomes. Bigger armors make shields less appealing and one-handed spears don't do enough that much harm on plated warriors.
- Heavy plating renders shields mostly worthless... just trust the armor and grab a bigger weapon. Jousting (mounted versus mounted) may be the exception.
- in one-on-one battles, this combination kindda gets in an awkward position: loses in range and harming power against longer spears/polearms and lack flexibility in comparison to flails, maces and swords in short combat
- closed spaces (like inside a house) are one-handed spear's doom. And big shields aren't much better

A boar spear works with boars because they don't stop trying to get whatever is attacking them to fuck off and just keep going forward, even then it still requires a massive amount of strength to keep it at a distance. A monster with multiple heads able to change where it wants to attack from, a long neck, sufficient mass, any form of tail attack, longer arms for swiping etc etc, leaves most of the benefits of a boar spear null.

Move over, best weapon coming through.

...

>It becomes a game of reach, and you have the superior reach.
and what is she has the flexibility?

The spear, the backbone of empires, king of the battlefield, this thing is so fucking practical and useful that it only fell in disuse by the most modern of armies by the late 17th century and for a good reason, couple that with a shield and you can turn into an impenetrable wall of long range melee

Well I'm playing a phalanx soldier in a pathfinder game right now and assuming you are okay with tripping enemies, you can become a trip king fast and easy. Use a Bill and you can trip people at reach without provoking AoO because they can't hit back. Get greater trip and you can get 2 AoO on them with 1 trip on a guy. Get things like pin down and combat patrol and you get decent mobility to keep this up at and stop 5ft steps with in your reach zone. With the phalanx soldier archetype you get to provide cover to allies with your shield so there is that too.

Spear is almost always good.

In most systems:
>cheap
>longer reach
>decent damage/speed/mobility

Outside of combat mechanics:
>poke traps from a distance without getting hit
>poke monsters to see if they're dead
>poke things you suspect to be mimics
>poke other shit
>tie things to it to carry stuff
>use as a tent pole, part of a stretcher, or various other camp crafts
>use as a lever for prying things
>use as a wedge for holding things open
>fishing pole
>flag pole
>pole vaulting

Shield really just depends on the system. They don't seem very useful in most RPGs unless you're doing the whole "tank archetype". And outside of combat it's just weighing you down.

Reminder that unless your character is a noble or a mercenary he or she should really have either a spear, an axe or a short sword at best.

I would stick to something with a lower mass for combat in vacuum, like a knife.

GURPS. Not even memeing. Throw in the additional stuff from Martial Arts and Technical Grappling and the expanded gear catalog of Low-Tech and you're even better.

If you love spears so much, why don't you marry them?!

So like a hydraulic? But not just long necks n heads but long arms and tails n shit? Sounds like more a cathullu monster.

I mean against such a monster would normal weapons even work?

Can I get a meat cleaver tied to a stick?

Theres a reason people stopped using them

Pretty good. Shields are great, and spears are too. For something a bit more rough and tumble though, axe and shield may prove more compact and utilitarian.

Just tie a bowline and hang one from each side of your saddle. Boom, stirrups

Like a voulge?

I literally have a boar spear 1H though. It sits hidden close to my door. Never bothered to screw the head to the shaft but I've tried like hell to get the head off and it won't budge. I also have a tried and true machete in my dining room, a Lee Enfield rifle and 80lb compound bow in my bedroom along with swords varying from fantasy to functional to actually have been used in various sometimes strategic locations throughout my house.

Pic related my Lee Enfield

And by 1H I mean short but I'd still use both hands for the extra force. Probably cause I don't have a shield and it's use would be limited to reactionary

That's why a good spearmen has a sword too. Every weapon has its place

>pragmatic outside of combat

A spear is a soldier's weapon. Heavy and a huge bitch to lug around. It takes up a hand no matter what.

Rich people wore swords because they're portable, lighter, prettier, fit through doors, and don't get in the way. It's similar to the reasons why armed civilians and many guards tend to carry pistols and not rifles. The smaller version does the job without getting in the way as much.

People have used spears from horseback well before the advent of the stirrup. Look at Macedonian Companions and Iranian cataphracts. Even then if the adventurers are medieval tech level they should have stirrups so its largely a moot point anyway.

Fuck regular spears
Add a shotgun to it

Also it made sense to have a sidearm in a mounted context, in case a spear or lance broke.

Sometimes it is a little sad how even some of the simplest fantasy games offer a lot of variety in weapons, but most just don't have the utility to be useful to take, or they're just clearly outstatted. It's a rare weapon that's completely useless, but in a lot of games half of them are.

MAH NIGGA

There's also the problem that most games with lots of weapon variety make them all play the same. Breath of the Wild might have hammers, clubs, and halberds, but they play identically to greatswords, one-handed swords, and spears respectively.

ninety percent of the time doesn't it just come down to how many dice you roll? with bigger weapons having more or bigger dice, and no other considerations taken really? You know what, I'll bite

How does GUPRS do it that represents them all properly and hopefully uniquely?

Useless in all d&d edition and clones
Better in WFRP

Actually, Egyptian smiths spend years working on a single khopesh and fold it up to one times to produce the finest blades known to mankind.

A spear gives a reach advantage over other weapons, some of them can be pulled in to shorter range as well with different grips. They deal Impaling damage which doubles your damage (cutting only 1.5x). The tradeoff being that they deal 'thrust' damage which is affected by strength quite a bit less than 'swing' damage like a sword, but with the damage modifiers it tends to even out to the same thing without munchkinning.

With the ability to retreat/back up being a staple of combat in gurps you can keep a guy at bay stabbing at him for a very long time in non closed areas. His only real recourse is to attempt to run and attack at you, which lowers his chances of hitting by a lot. There's also a few fancy maneuvers you can try to pull with a spear but each weapon type tends to have a few.

GRORIOUS KANG STEEL
FORDED ONE MIRRION TIMES

Why can't wizards use spears? Even peasants know how to use one.

Let my buy the Enfield.

Considering that mages tend to use staves it's bizarre they can't use spears.

Stick it in her cloaca

>Turian sex fantasies
Not even once

get past a spear's tip and the weapon is all but useless, i'm not sure it would be useful for the wide variety of tasks an adventurer may need. hard to go mountain climbing with a spear, harder to sneak into a noble's mansion, harder still to crawl through goblin-infested tunnels. Better if the rest of the group is similarly equipped and rear ranks can support those in front, or with plate armor and a short sword or dagger replacing the shield.

Why not divert the river into the goblin-infested tunnels?

Need to preserve them so precious materials (whether mineral or cultral or whatever) can be extracted easily. also, a dude with a dagger (or several dudes with daggers), are probably cheaper than a massive aquatic engineering project.

It's not that big when armies did it regularly to fuck over castles.

>not using double murderbuckets as a weapon

i mean, if you want to pay an entire army instead of like, 5 competent tunnel rats, go ahead.

Why don't block the entrance and pay 5 militamen to guard the blocked hole?

That is known as a mace.

A lump of metal that you swing down and break bones, spears, shields.

Difference between spears and lances?

My opinion: if your adventuring buddies have plenty of spear and shield users and the rules have something like the old AD&D rule about receiving charges, very useful. After all, plenty of people with spears and shields are what shield walls were all about.

Spears aren't that heavy. It's a seven-foot, one-inch-diameter stick of ash with a narrow metal bit at one end.

If you're using a couched lance in a charge, they tend to be longer and with a bit more diameter to the shaft. You want a stout weapon to put in a solid hit, not one that breaks before you've driven the point completely through the unlucky bastard on the receiving end.

Lance is meant for cavalry.

Not really, it's a purely thrusting motion, no risk of hitting the walls or cealing.
Now if it was a pike you might have some trouble, but for a short spear its the ideal environment

You can use a lance inD&D without horses though

Polearms ruled in Two Worlds 2.

It was kind of a shitty, nonsensical game in general, but it was cool that polearms were so good.

Speaking from a real world perspective, I practice historical martial arts and I fucking hate fighting a competent spearman ot staff.

The thing everyone forgets is the speed of the things, the length and leverage means the fucker can feint at your feet, then have the blade back in your face before you can get a sword back up to guard.

On the other hand, I'm glad I don't have to carry the fucking thing around to practice, spears are a pain in the arse on the tram.

They aren't meant to work that way. You use them with a horse running at fast speed. Lances are often equipped with a vamplate (a small circular plate to prevent the hand sliding up the shaft upon impact). They are not designed to be used by infantrymen, it would be awkward to use for them.

>spears.
>not pikes.

>hey, let's explore this twisty underground labyrinth full of deadly monsters
>imma bring my 20 foot long piece of wood with a kitchen knife on the end that's only ideal on formation against cavalry
>yeah. No, fuck off Dave, you're not coming you cunt

It's the perfect weapon to kill dragons and trolls. If the cave is that cramped and twisted, how did they manage to enter it in the first place?

Pike formations would be ideal fit r confined places like that.

Two words.

BREATH.
WEAPON.

Nah m8, you need a zweihander for that. Literally designed for clearing out alleyways.

Dragons can change form you mong

>breath weapon that shoots out spears and shields
It's beautiful..

Let's also not forget that Roman saddles get the job done as well if you really want to do lance charges.

>outside of combat it's just weighing you down.
Metal shields can double as frying pans/woks, if that kind of game is your thing.

I've always been partial to the long handled dadao, or the nagamaki if I'm playing l5r.

Depends on the system.

I respect your life style

kek i understand this reference

>Heavy plating renders shields mostly worthless...
friend what
getting smacked by a lump of metal still hurts like hell. shield >>>> armor every day. I prefer not getting hit at all

Is it possible to force him back with a spear then?

>fold it up to one times

>get past a spear's tip and the weapon is all but useless

Wait

Wait

But what if like

You pulled it backward and stabbed again

>Spears aren't that heavy. It's a seven-foot, one-inch-diameter stick of ash with a narrow metal bit at one end

I know they're not that heavy in absolute terms, but I mean in relation to other weapons.

I suppose the bulk and shape are the bigger issue though.

Or hit them with the haft? Or turned it and bashed his balls with the butt end?

Most kopesh were cast, not forged.

I mean one stops you getting hurt,
and the other lets you hurt things from a distance.

I recommend taking several and becoming the Velite / Triarii

He means that historically, when full armor developed, shields started to fall out of fashion in favor of two-handed weapons.

Layers of curved metal plates, chain, and padding all already serve to deflect, distribute, and absorb force. When you already have that protection on every part of the body, a shield does not add much more to justify its weight and taking up of a hand. You certainly can do it, but most of a shield's utility is already provided by plate armor.

...

have you ever tried to fold metal with your bear hands?