MTG: Legacy General

Main deck RiPs and DRShamans are main reason why I don't run LED main that much anymore and instead play firestorms and abrupt decays.

How often were you running into main deck RIP? The only decks I've even seen have them are off the wall brews and rouge decks.

what's the cheapest, viable deck that runs her?

and I mean cheap as in around $1,000

i have been hyped to post in legacy general all day that i played my first event and went 3-0-1 on tin fins. the draws were phenomenal. in nine games i pulled five turn one kills, often with protection. it was kind of a bummer because i didn't get to play that much magic but also sick because i got a bunch of store credit

D&T with ghost quarters instead of ports and UW Spiritblade without Tundra's clock in at ~$1k.

Nice user! My night wasn't so good with UW Parfait, I went 2-2 beating Moggcatcher and Dredge, losing a close games to UR Delver, and getting curb stomped by Infect. I'm thinking I need to adjust my sideboard to help more against the tempo type decks, they were very hard matchups.

Goyf seems to be pretty unplayable in legacy right now due to Push and Decay. I've been trying out Mandrills and they have been doing a lot of work.

i played against ANT, br reanimator, and two uwx stoneblade decks. i was told that the meta at the shop usually has more lands and i know one of the players likes to play aggro loam and MUD so i think i may go up to 3 serenity

I come from /KDM/ to check out your thread's art, and I love it it all but goddamn you guys speak a different language.

Fwiw you all sound smart af

I don't play legacy so maybe this is a dumb question. Any chance the Old Growth Dryad has a place in Nic Fit?

How's Miracles now without top?
Post list if you have, I'm curious to see what you guys run now

Hw is xmage?
Does it have a good pauper community?
Should I strem pauper mtgo?

Man, I feel bad for you poorfags. You should just get a better job and play the best formats the game has to offer: Legacy and Vintage. Enjoy your 70%+ aggro format, I'd think not playing magic was better than playing a format this shitty. In the mean time here's a picture of a Black Lotus to help motivate you to stop being such absolute plebs.

This stopped being funny a few posts ago.

I have money bud, I just know economy better than to spend absurds amounts on non physical goods that to boot are fucking cardbard physically and hold no inherent value.

Doesnt stop me from slowly finishing bazaar dredge.

...

It's currently a split between maindeck Entreat and maindeck Mentor, with Mentor putting up better results.

It's still pretty funny to me mate.

>I just know economy better
Well do tell me what else you know better, because it certainly isn't English.

>non physical goods
>cardbard
It's cute, your trying to sounds smart, but it took you literally less than a sentence to contradict yourself. The definition is of a non-physical good is: "An intangible good (also known as a non-physical good) is a good that does not have a physical nature". Sorry, with the exception of having a collection on MTGO, your cards ARE physical goods.

>hold no inherent value
This is Econ 101 shit, but NOTHING has "inherent value", the only value something has is what others are will to pay for it. If everyone's starving nobody gives a shit how much gold (or virtually anything else) you offer them for their loaf of bread.

t. Sub 90 IQ retard known as Rud

Yo parfait bros do you guys run Karakas on your decks? I have 1 extra that is not in any of the decks and was wondering if it would be any use.

>What's your favorite nonsense combo deck?
Using Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth to enable Darien, King of Kjeldor by means of Karma.

Thinking about putting together fetchless Burn, would running 1-2 Forgotten Caves be worth it?

Seriously guys, WTF. This thread was chill as fuck when I went to bed.

Anyways, since we don't have a MTG: Vintage General, what do you guys think about the new Vintage restrictions? Do you agree with the Thorn/Mentor restrictions? Do you think Shops will survive as a competitive archetype now that almost all of it's lock pieces are restricted? What's going to take the place of the UWR Mentor decks? Is Storm going to be overpowered due to the Yawgmoth's Bargain unrestriction and its natural predator taking another nerf? I'm actually really excited to play/brew, Vintage has been basically a two deck format for a while and now it's looking more wide open than it has in a long time.

I don't personally, but I don't see any reason why a singleton Karakas would be an issue. The manabase in my UW build currently is:
4x Flooded Strand
3x City of Traitors
3x Island
9x Plains

The CoT's have been consistent over performers allowing me to power out 4 drops fast or once in a blue moon get silly turn 2 RIP+Helm kills. It's hard to give up the speed of the CoT's, but if Reanimator/Sneak and Show are a big thing in your meta I could see Karakas being very good as a 1-2x as an additional hedge against them with very little downside in other matchups.

My friend is using Crystal Veins as budget CoT.

t. Butthurt poorfag.

Don't. Just run mountains, they won't get hit by wasteland or be waste of space, because they come in play untapped.

Karakas is good, it shouldn't be an issue, especially because you are going through your deck relatively fast. In the best case scenario it wins you the play and at worst gets hit by wasteland, which is not an issue in parfait I believe.

>Seriously guys, WTF. This thread was chill as fuck when I went to bed.

Looking at the board, I think it's just all the shitposters are riled up due to spoiler season, and they're posting in any Magic-related thread.

I'd play Barbarian Ring over Forgotten Cave. The Ring might do you some damage, but can also be cashed out later as a shock. Being slowed down a turn by the cave coming into play tapped would really hurt Burn.

Not really. A one mana 3/3 isnt that impressive anymore with gurmag anglers and D&Ts running around. Even if it were just a g: 3/3 it would be better off as a nimble mongoose. If you ramp as nic fit you want to play fatties like rhino, if you dont ramp youd rather not ramp your opponent. This dryad will find a place somewhere, maybe 8 land stompy.

Nic Fit is better off playing DRS and Veteran explorers, it just doesn't need 1 mana 3/3, when it can go into 6+ mana in turn 3.

Well yeah. Im just pointing out that even if it were the best 3/3 for g it wouldnt be what you want. Honestly Id rather recurring nightmare a parade of rhinos, but I sold off nic fit when top was banned.

Wombo Combo 4 lyfe. I top8'd a 1k this weekend. Bombed out of first round of top 8 though.

Report, now.

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/topless-doomsday/
About 44 people turned out. 6 rounds, cut to Top 8.

Note: I've added roughly how I boarded and a bit about why(from memory/based on how I think I'd do it since I didn't take notes on that).

Round 1 vs GR Sneak Attack ----------------------------
It looked like a normal Mono-R Sneak list, just with a green splash. Not sure what for.

G1 I play Badlands and Duress away one of their 2 Chalices. They don't have acceleration so they just play mountain for turn and keep the chalice in hand. I Therapy it and win a turn later with a basic pile. After the match I asked why they held back the chalice and they said they thought I was on BR Reanimator based on the Badlands so chalice on 0 was relatively weak.

+2 Echoing Truth, +1 Consign//Oblivion, +1 IoK
-4 Therapy
I don't like Therapy post-board because they have so many different things to hit that it's almost useless blind. I'd rather have bounce and duresses. Sure sometimes you'll duress and see double Trini or triple chalice, but you could also Therapy and name Chalice and hit and they'll still have double Trini and a blood moon or whatever.

G2 they land a Chalice on 1. I Burning Wish for By Force on my turn 2. On their turn 3 they hardcast Inferno Titan. I destroy the Chalice but Wish was my only business and I don't win before I die to the Titan.

G3 they mull to 5. I Duress and see Chalice and Trinisphere, Inferno Titan and 2 Mountains. I take the Chalice and hope to kill before the 3Ball comes down. I win on turn 3 with nearly the same pile as g1.

Round 2 vs 4C Loam-----------------------------------
G1 They have liliana but no real threats. I have an anemic hand, but I manage to field 3 black sources and hardcast Doomsday with an LED on board to their Lili with 5 loyalty. I intend to build this pile: [Probe, AoI, LED LabMan, Probe] which wins through Lili ultimate if they don't draw something to kill my LED or LabMan. Unfortunately I bungle the pile (my only misbuilt pile all day) and swap the LED and first Probe. I scoop.

+2 Echoing Truth, +1 IoK
-2 Therapy, -1 Duress
Similar reasons to the previous match. They have a diversity of hate athough some is creatures, so I diversify my anti-hate. Not totally sure about the numbers here.

G2 I fire off Empty the Warrens for 10 gobs on t2 or 3 and it gets there, barely.

G3 I mull to 5. I fetch around their Wasteland. They land Lili on t3. Around turn 5 I somehow scrape together a kill with exactly enough storm. Don't have notes but I think it involved Brainstorming to put a Wish back into my deck after Doomsday.

Round 3 vs Dark Depths----------------------------
G1 they're on the play and start Swamp, Petal, Petal and I think I'm just dead but they play Sylvan Library and pass. My hand is a little slow. I fetch basics and cantrip. They brick pretty hard off library. On my turn I Brainstorm into something ridiculous and make about a jillion Drills (really only like 15).

+2 Echoing Truth, +1 IoK
-2 Duress, -1 Therapy
I think you need at least 1 ETruth in just for the chance at bouncing Marit Lage or random permanent based hate they might bring in. Your targeted discard is just ok against them because it can't hit lands, so I diversify my options a bit. Looking at lists online though, many are playing mindbreak trap in the board. Perhaps -2 Therapy, -1 Duress would be safer.

G2 was probably my favorite of the day. My draws are a bit trashy and they get the combo together quickly. Staring down Marit Lage, I cantrip a couple times and set up a Wish on top with Echoing Truth Below it. Double LED, Probe into the wish and Tendrils for only 9 copies, leaving my opponent at 2. Take one hit from the eldritch horror, then bounce it. Opponent got a little salty about my "topdecks" but didn't realize i'd set it up that way. At this point we'd both expended quite a few resources and are topdecking. I am able to set up a pass-the-turn pile a couple turns later and kill with a storm count of 4.

Round 4 vs Czech Pile/4c Control------------------------------
G1 I mull to 5 and manage to get there since my opponent's draws weren't great. No notes on my pile but I think it was a Lab Man kill because I couldn't get enough storm.

+2 Defense Grid, +1 IoK
-1 Wish, -1 Petal, -1 Preordain
You're planning to play a longer game so cutting a little action is fine. When you cut a wish, Empties aren't as likely so cutting a petal is good. If you wanted to keep the Wish in you could cut another preordain instead. That might even be better.

G2 they mull to 5 and I'm pretty pleased but try not to show it. However, I can't for the life of me find a Doomsday or Wish to go with my Ritual, LED, and Probe. They Hymn me on t2 or 3, Snap-Hymn on turn 4 or 5, and start attacking/DRS-ing. They get me pretty low, and I wish for and cast Massacre to try to buy time. They rip Leovold and I die anyway.

G3 I resolve Defense Grid but again I can't find a business spell for too long and die to like 3 DRS's.

Round 5 vs Goblins---------------------------------
I'm playing against a guy who plays at my LGS and I feel a little bad about having to dreamcrush someone I know but what can you do. They are a very good goblins player so I know I have to be on my toes even though it's a fine matchup.

G1 I cantrip and cantrip and can't find action and die to the goblin horde. I am concerned about my chances at top8 at this point.

-3 Duress
+2 ETruth, +1 IoK
Duress is Kind of Bad I think. IoK can hit a creature in a pinch. I assume they're going to have some kind of permanent-based disruption so the ETruth's come in. Worst case scenario they reset Aether Vial. Mindbreak Trap is a concern but if you therapy the turn you go off, that's really the only thing relevant to name so you generally won't miss. I suppose they could have Pyroblast but I've never had a goblins player bring it in against me. It's a nonbo with the chalices they probably bring in.

G2 I mull to 5 but my opponent has no real interaction, just beats, and wasn't fast enough. On the last possible turn I get my shit together and give em the drills.

G3 they mull to 5 and keep something like double Wasteland, double Vial, Lackey. Not bad for 5 I guess Potential quite good. The game ends on t3 or 4 with me having only basics and him not drawing real disruption.

Round 6 vs Intentional Draw--------------------
It's a clean cut to top8 so we ID.

Quarterfinals vs Omni Sneak---------------------
I sit down and start shit-talking myself a bit, telling my opponent about my curse of never being able to get past the first round of Top8, no matter the format. I jokingly wish them luck in the rest of top8.

G1 I summarily smoke them. I Duress a FoW, then another, and then give them the Drills on t3. I enthusiastically promise them the wheels will come off soon.

+2 Defense Grid, +1 IoK
-1 Preordain, -2 Petal
Goblins aren't really part of the plan here so petals can come out but I like to keep in all the wishes just to have business density. Cutting one cantrip is acceptable in most matchups if you feel you need the slot, so a preordain goes away. IoK maybe isn't the best but post-board they'll have extra countermagic so even though it can't hit most of their combo pieces I feel it's worth the slot. Defense grid is obvious. Putting it in off SnT to their Griselbrand feels great (even if you still lose).

G2 I probe and see spell pierce and a turn 2 Show and Tell into Griselbrand. I therapy and they pierce it. They SnT in Griselbrand, I drop in Defense Grid. They tank for a bit and pass without attacking. I don't rip the ritual I need, and on their turn they draw 14, SnT in Omniscience, Cunning Wish for Intuition for 3x Emrakul and I scoop it up.

G3 I pull the countermagic from their hand leaving them with a few fatties. I cantrip and have a kill set up for next turn, I think turn 3 or 4. After fetching and probing I am at 15. On their turn, they rip Sneak Attack and sneak in Emmy to hit me for exactsies.

FINAL STATS-------------
Match Record: 4-2
Game Record: 10-7
Doomsday+Tendrils Kills: 8
Lab Man Kills: 1
ETW Kills: 1
Natural Tendrils Kills: 0
Telemin Kills: 0
Between Round Bathroom Breaks: 4

>I Duress a FoW
gods work user.

Post parfait lists please

Pic related. I stole the image from an user who posted here, so I can take no credit for it.
However, it's fair to say it's probably one of the best versions of Parfait right now.

Bumperooney

>playing xmage
>join a game
>free mulligans
>other person is playing combo
>they mulligan till they get a hand they can turn one with
rofl

Saw the new torpor orb creature. Is there a way to resurrect stiflenought? Somekind of no etb trigger postmortem lunge reanimation fling shit

nice reports
your games were a lot more interesting than mine

Karakas is pretty good in mono-white builds, but if you're playing Wr you should go all basics for Charbelcher, and if you're UW something like this is probably better .

>more interesting games
I think that's why it's held my interest longer than any other weird combo deck I've tried. I feel like I earn more of my wins than I do with other decks. That's probably a mix of it being complicated and bad. Most of my piles this time weren't too complicated though. I think the loss of top made the easy piles easier and the hard piles harder, and I didn't really have to build any hard piles this weekend. The only pile I bungled was a pretty standard pass-the-turn pile and it was just cause I wasn't paying enough attention.

where can i get proxies of decent quality? printing paper just feels real ghetto, desu

How are you playing Rip and helm on t2 with CoT?

Disregard this I'm retarded and forgot about Mox.

> sort of want to sell everything to build a parfait deck
> and i have no one to play legacy with

does anyone else know this feel

Turn 1: Mox, CoT, RIP
Turn 2: CoT, Helm

I know somebody's going to give me shit over this, but go check out the BootlegMtg subreddit. Its an entire group of people discussing proxies, where to buy, who has the best, and anything else you might want to know. [Spoiler]I have aged and played the shit out of some double sleeved Villa Zheng proxies, never been called out.[/spoiler]

thanks, but proxies are legal at my store. so i'll be fine anyway

My 60 is around $1200 last I checked, the sideboard is kinda shit in that list and not exactly what I'm running now, but it's a good jumping off point. My UW goes a little bit of a different direction than most. It's honestly not optimal but it's fun especially in the heavy combo meta where I am:

4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Spell Queller
3 Mausoleum Wanderer
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 True-Name Nemesis
2 Vendilion Clique

1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte

4 Brainstorm
2 Counterspell
3 Daze
4 Force of Will
2 Spell Pierce
2 Stifle
3 Swords to Plowshares

1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

4 Flooded Strand
5 Island
1 Plains
4 Polluted Delta
2 Tundra
1 Karakas
3 Wasteland

Sideboard:
1 Chalice of the Void
2 Chill
1 Containment Priest
1 Council's Judgment
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Mindbreak Trap
1 Pride of the Clouds
1 Sanctum Prelate
1 Seal of Cleansing
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Venser, Shaper Savant

Good show!

There is only one answer. Poops All Spells.

>free mulligans
>no game 2
>no time limit
Like, why not just goldfish it?

Weird question, but does anyone know what song SCG uses in their finals intro?

I noticed an RTNews video about the hurricane in texas used it as well: youtube.com/watch?v=3rCP_TUA4nA

Can I get opinions on this UW parfait deck? Is there an argument to run path over swords because of land tax? Card suggestions? I feel like I should pack another wincon in the side desu.

Main board:
4 Land Tax
3 Scroll Rack
2 Detention Sphere
1 Oblivion Ring
4 Mox Diamond
2 Helm of Obedience
4 Rest in Peace
3 Energy Field
1 Back to Basics
4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Flooded Strand
3 Island
11 Plains
1 Web of Inertia
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Supreme Verdict
1 Isochron Scepter
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Orim's Chant
1 Luminarch Ascension

Sideboard:
1 Back to Basics
2 Pithing Needle
3 Meddling Mage
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Nevermore
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Mana Maze
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Runed Halo
2 Seal of Cleansing

>build budget, everything but the lands, death and taxes
>noone around here plays legacy
>noone likes to play against the deck

Good thing I didn't buy rishadan ports.

Web of Inertia is mostly redundant with Energy Field. I wouldn't run a 4/3 RiP/Field split, I think 3/2 is better. Crutching on it too hard can lead to you getting blown out, and it's useless against decks like Storm. I would run something like Trinisphere or Solitary Confinement instead. Also, Humility is an absolute must play in the main, wrecks Reanimator, Show and Tell variants, DnT, Elves, and is strong against all the Delver and Control builds.

You could probably run Path if you cut the maindeck Back to Basis. BtB is weaker than Blood Moon anyway, because it's not a hard lock against decks that don't run basics, and it doesn't stop most land based combos.

I just play a deck of all Plains. Everybody's happy- the opponent gets his deckbuilding validation, and I get to see my favorite Plains.

Man what a plain deck.

If you have no local scene, why would you build a paper deck?

Mainly for collection purposes but I have an lgs, most people there just don't have legacy decks. Once in a blue moon or at prereleases someone with a legacy deck shows up.

what should I build in a meta that's heavy on czech pile and DnT

Ah, I misread that one part, apologies.

Sure thing user, here's the list I ran Monday night: tappedout.net/mtg-decks/uw-parfait-4/

I'm wasn't really a fan of Ensnaring Bridge or Elspeth, so I'll probably cut them from the SB. Other than that the deck felt pretty good, I think I just got some harder matchups and little but of bad luck leaving me at 2-2 with it.

Seems like it's one the right track generally, but I would make a couple of cuts. I'd cut down to 2 Energy Field, the cards is either great of awful. Web of Inertia is basically a more expensive Energy Field, so I'd give it a trim. I'm not a huge fan of 4x Chant, I'd drop down to 3. If you have access to City of Traitors I'd swap 2-3x Plains for them, if not Crystal Veins are reasonable replacements. I'd also swap out Luminarch Ascension for Thopter Spy Network, Ascension is hard to get online and gets hit by Decay while TSN represents almost the same overall clock, draws cards, and is decay proof. I'd drop one Back to Basics, we are a toolbox based deck and it's one of those enchantments that wins you a game or is terribad. On the same line, there's very little harm in going up to 61 cards MB with this deck because of all the tutorable silver bullets and card selection, so I'd add Zuran Orb as card 61 to pad you life total and help enable Land Tax. Mana Maze is interesting/Spicy, I assume it's there to help with combo matchups?

So, the changes I would recommend:
-1x Energy Field, -1x Web of Inertia, -1x Orim's Chant, -1x Luminarch Ascension, -2/3x Plains
+1x Trinisphere, +1x Supreme Verdict, +1x Moat/Ghostly Prison, +1x TSN, +1 Zuran Orb, +2/3 CoT/Crystal Veins. For the SB, I'd trim -1x Back to Basics, +1 Council's Judgment

What legacy deck would tupac play?

D&T definitely

Oh, what about D&T? It might be good with arbiter.

>Test new build of 12post on xmage
>EVERY SINGLE matchup is reanimator
Fuck this gay earth.

Just one more step to vintage becoming 60 card singleton.

Is that the point where competitive Commander and Vintage merge?

maybe? I see vintage as magic in its purest form. As broken as possible. Competitive commander seems just.........like a shit format.

There was no doubt about Mentor getting restricted, it's basically a 1 turn clock once it hits the board.

I'm curious to see whether Shops will go and bring back more control elements like Tangle Wire to replace Thorn, or if it opts for an even more aggressive style of play. It could also mean the Eldrazi Shops variant will become much more prominent instead.

Agreed, the question was more why is Shops taking a hit for mentor being overpowered? I'd have thought they would have let the dust settle after the Mentor restriction to evaluate if Shops was overpowered in the new post mentor meta before making the move to restrict Thorn.

>bring back more control elements like Tangle Wire
This is what I'm hoping will happen with shops, It'll get a bit slower, but still remain a valid archetype. I really want to see decks like Uba Stax become prominent again.

did some looking and I guess Leonin Arbiter is just a modern thing.

Just so y'all know, with the restriction of thorn control Shops is 100% dead, and now Mentor is likely the uncontested best deck

>He doesn't know Mentor got restricted too
Kinda hard to build a Mentor deck when you only get one Mentor.

Here's how it shakes out. Ritual Storm is better, definitely the best Storm deck and probably #2 to Mentor. Bargain is still pretty unplayable.

Mentor is now the best deck (from being slightly worse than Shops). Losing 2 mentors is not a huge hit. Shops losing 3 thorns is a massive gain. The deck is now the best deck in the format.

Eldrazi was a tier 2 deck. It is now unplayable.

Shops now has exactly one viable build (from 3-4 before WotC decided they understood vintage). It's aggro shops with Precursor golem and tangle wire or bust.

Outcome and Oaths best matchup just took a huge hit while their worst matchup just got better. They get slightly worse.

Mentor is at its core UWR control. Mentor is a compact win condition. Now I would run one Mentor, one Chandra and one more of each Jace. The core of the deck is the same, it loses 2 win cons. Mentors strength was flexible answers and compact win cons. That's easily replaceable, and now that Shops is neutered the drawback of turboxerox decks is significantly reduced.

Have you played vintage?

How's a deck like this suit your fancy? I can't claim to know much about vintage but I have to wonder why it isn't playing Vault Key when it already has Tinker or Mindslaver with a Welder and infinite artifacts.
mtgtop8.com/event?e=16431&d=301524&f=VI

I play vintage occasionally, I'm just thinking that now that mentor is restricted UWR mentor is basically the UWR control deck that existed back in 2015. Sure, it's got the Khans delve spell now, but so does every blue deck. I'm just skeptical of it being that overpowered now that it's premier threat is restricted in addition to its premier enabler (Gush) and it's going back to it's old, slower wincons.

It looks pretty suboptimal. Welder is pretty bad right now, and in that deck basically just bins Null Rod or loops Strixae I guess. Probe makes no sense in it. It looks like at the time it would just roll over to Mentor and be decent against Shops and good against Outcome. After the last round of restrictions I wouldn't be thrilled with it.

When I play Mentor, there are a lot of games you win through "slam Mentor, go ham". You win more games through drawing more cards and filtering to the right part of your deck. Since 2015 shops keeps getting worse and worse, and it's role was a predator to cantrip decks. I'd be stoked to run a turbo cantrip deck against one that's less likely to open with sphere, much less likely to have 2 spheres and way less likely to have 3 spheres. Losing mentor hurts, but not as much as losing thorn helps.

Pretty sure Vintage Mentor decks just go to running Young Pyro in the slots where the extra copies of mentor were anyway.

Now is the time for the return of GRIXIS THIEVES in Vintage