Alternative History Thread

Art of what-if scenarios, retro-futurism and anything similar/related.

Other urls found in this thread:

pastebin.com/Kb70U7zm
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pact_of_forgetting
newsweek.com/putin-behind-stalin-top-russias-most-outstanding-people-poll-629032
forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2017/05/12/stalin-is-far-more-popular-with-russians-than-gorbachev-infographic/#6fba2fb16635
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

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Draka bestest and most logical of all alt-hist and not dumb at all.

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I love interwar Future Designs. Looking back on what everyone thought was a good idea at the time vs what actually ended up happening makes me chuckle.

Fuck yeah, Second Contact series.

In a world where the Fourth Crusade never ended...

Can I get an opinion on a setting I'm planning on doing? It involves alternative history a little bit but I'm not sure if the mention of it is dumb fluff or not. The settings supposed to be a horror-esque supernatural urban setting in the states, so I guess historical realism doesn't really matter when involving stuff like that. But still, anyone want me to post the short summary and tell me if it's stupid or not?

Also, I'd maybe like to hear some suggestions on improving it so I can improve the setting and world it takes place in.

Shoot

Would you mind is I just posted my North America alt-his map and description, since I made a few long posts on Veeky Forums about it and got no replies.

Here's North America in my alt-his.
The US succeeds in 1812, and releases Quebec as an ally, giving them a bit of What's now Maine and New Brunswick in exchange for St. Pierre and Miquelon, which France gifted to Quebec upon her independence. The US and the UK have a deal regarding Newfoundland, where they rule it jointly.
At this time, also, slavery is outlawed in the US, and slaves are moved to Britain's Caribbean colonies. Later on, other Caribbean colonies of other countries are united as one black country, and nearly all blacks in the Americas live there. Other countries own much of the land there, but it's all officially under its own rule. Named Afrocaribbia, speaks Arabic.
Soon after Texas joins the US, civil war breaks out over something else. Maybe regarding being allied with Britain. Quebec betrays the US, take Ontario, and the CSA successfully secedes. All three make a deal regarding the land to the west of the Mississippi, and that land becomes a new country for Indians.
Also, the CSA eventually changes its language to German, to completely cut ties with the USA, and because of its huge influx of Germans. The CSA and USA change their names to The Confederated American States of Dixieland, and The Republic of the United American States of Yankeedom, respectively. Quebec is just Quebec.
Cont

The Indian country, I'll call it Plainsland for now, has a deal with its neighbors, where it will rent out land to them, which they rent out to any of their citizens who want to live over there and farm, log, mine, Etc. It has about an equal number of Indian citizens, and white non-citizens in its borders.
California secedes from Mexico, and gets hold of all of the land currently Yellow or Tan. The Tan land gets filled with Mormon-like people, and secedes from California to become a Theocracy.
Plainsland has no official language, California speaks Spanish, Deseret speaks some made-up language, Alaska speak Russian. The latter three are all white, with California the least so.
Central America stays united, and wins some land from Mexico. Cuba and the Bahamas, as it is know, unites somehow.
Mexico loses many of its influential white Spaniards to California, and, spurred by its recent humiliations, has a nationalist revolution. It changes its language to some Aztec one, and becomes a monarchy. Soon after, Central America changes its language to some Mayan language. Cuba stays Spanish-speaking.
Lastly, Alaska and Hawaii. After Britain lost Canada, Russia took even more land, not fearing losing it to Britain. But during the Russian revolution, the next in line to the throne is in Alaska. He forms the Tsardom of Alaska, and gets an influx of Russian monarchists. The Kingdom of Hawaii takes over most Pacific islands, with support from Australia, which becomes Britain's biggest colony after losing Canada, and take the US' place in opening Japan.

Also, Cuba and the Bahamas gets Bermuda from Britain, Greenland stay Danish, and Yankeedom holds onto even more Virginia in this one.
And that's just North America.
Even if it's kinda stupid, just look at those sexy borders. And tell me you don't like the idea of more languages on the continent.

Copy/pasted straight from my Veeky Forums posts.
Please rate.

pastebin.com/Kb70U7zm

Fuckin stupid captcha wasn't working

Now, I wonder why Russia would ever do something so stupid. As long as you explain that with a "The leader was brainwashed by aliens," I'm fine with it. Also, what decade is this?
Seems like a fine setting idea, though you haven't gone into deep detail.

Thank you, the explanation for Russia seems like a good idea th and for decade? I haven't totally decided, just vaguely cold war era

technically this did happen just replace it with a british flag

I hope it's sixties.
Also, pls rate mine.
It's not a setting, I just want to know some opinions.

>trying to hail a cab in NYC

Looks straight out of Fallout.

>Named Afrocaribbia, speaks Arabic.
Nah, they'll be more likely to speak a creole between Malian, Spanish and English.

>making me read an interesting 120 page webcomic that hasn't been updated in almost two years
Is this how you get your sick kicks?!

Sauce?

Зa Лeнинa!

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I figure the early "politicians," or, really, the quarter black governors put in charge by Britain and the US, would want to have a language to unite the many blacks in their new nation, and would use either Arabic or whatever African language most of the newest arrivals speak. It would, obviously, end up completely different, what with languages straight from Africa and European ones learned by former slaves mixing into the official language.

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Yeah, that's why I said it'd be a creole of those languages, not Arabic. While many of the OG slaves were muslims, they don't really speak Arabic outside of prayers, of which only the learned or the priests would actually understand.
tl;dr: Arabic is a poor choice for Afrocarribeans.

Yeah, it would be a creole.
I just figure that the early governors would think of Arabic pretty early on as a good choice for a nationally unifying language.
What do you think of the rest?

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>No independent Tibet
>No independent North-West China

If I remember correctly the pic was from a Veeky Forums thread, the premise being what if the Chinese civil war ended way later and in a stalemate (basically replacing the south/north Korea war and border)

I reckon Kaiserreich would make a cool alt-history RPG. Maybe a spy thriller.

>Anyone
>Thinking Savinkov is best Vozhd
Wrangle is objectively the best.

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What the fuck am I looking at.

It was from a shitty attempted cyberpunk setting that had laughable understanding of geopolitics.

Wrangel is the true vozhd, the modern autocrat.

Something where brits, theirs slave and german mercenaries settle someplace in South Africa, and then they somehow magically turn into a superpower over a hundred years and by 1948 they're more advanced than us right now, thanks to eugenics and their rigid caste society.

That's pants on head retarded.

Don't forget the bit where the Draka conquer all of Europe because nobody wanted to ally with Nazi Germany, even though in that universe the military kills Hitler in 1942.

In a world where the Holocaust couldn't have got going, the stigma of the Nazis blinds everyone to the threat of the invading Afrikaans who impale entire conquered populations, publicly advocate for total genocide against all non-Afrikaans.

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>World War 2 unfolds in almost the same way despite the European powers previously losing all of their African colonies to a massive continent spanning empire that's 50 years more advanced than everyone else

Is this like a super popular alternate history or something?

The Space Race would certainly have been more interesting if the Soviets had been able to afford to rise to the challenge.

I don't know about anyone else, but I see it referenced a lot in RPG discussions. A lot of my GURPS books have it in their index too. not surprising since I mostly have Alternate History & Who's Who type sourcebooks[/spoilers]

No shit? But it seems like such a poor concept for alternate history.

They were near ready to land on the Moon, but their main guy died, and they were in it nearly entirely just to be first.

Twilight 2000 V2.2 went with the whole "Yanayev's coup succeeds" thing and did it okay though it was a bit stupid that the Soviets would commit to a world war while in the middle of a civil war

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Not a matter of not being able to afford, the Soviets were actually pretty damn good at managing what they had. They got a lot of shit done first, don'tcha know, and we *still* use Soyuz to this day. It was more like Khrushchev and friends were incompetent bastards who meddled in things they should have left to scientists and actual economists.

Fucking Khruschev...

All /pol/ memery and such aside, from a purely scientific/technical standpoint I'd be curious how fast the Third Reich would have put a man on the moon (way before the space race with Braun's V rockets and all) if they had won or at least not been utterly wiped.

Best alternate history series coming through

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Yes I'd much rather have Stalin and Bread lines
Yanayev would have been the best Soviet general secretary. Juntas are the truest form of communist.

That depends. Hitler loved his propaganda, but military came before everything else, even more than in the case of the Soviets, who militarized out of fear following the civil war less than the sort of idealized warmongering of the Nazis.

If the Nazis managed to end the war for a time, especially if they managed to actually secure access to minerals (remember, that was something they struggled with), I'd say they could have had spaceflight just as fast as the Soviets.

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The author's kind of a nutcase too. Loves lesbians, wicca, and bdsm and puts them in everything he writes.

>Lord of the Sky (Il Signire del Cielo)

>Yanayev would have been the best Soviet general secretary. Juntas are the truest form of communist.

Stalin did nothing wrong you kulak.
Stalin was a product of the circumstances following the Civil War, and while overly authoritarian, the purges are overplayed and legitimate examples of sabotage downplayed. At the end of the day, Stalin preserved a degree of the workplace democracy the Bolsheviks were founded on while regularly purging the bureaucracy which would later stagnate into something much, much worse

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>Forced to enter the army
Nice memes. Soviet female soldiers in WW2 were Mobilization Only troops, not even making category в. After the war, females were discouraged from entering military positions that involved direct combat, like infantry and armoured.

Also Bread Lines.

Would you like to hear my alernate history scenario? It involves a post ww2 proxy war between the US and Japan

>Nearly 40 million dead from the Soviet regime
Come on dude I'm pro-Franco and even that's stepping over the line

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Always chuckled at that WTF segment from Persona 2: Suddenly the Nazis which were hiding out in their Arctic base return to conquer Japan with their nuclear bombers and advanced mecha because all rumors turn true and somebody apparently thought that up.

Its has a vocal fanbase, so kinda? The whole things is super pulpy and wouldnt even generate much controversy, but the author is super up his own ass. People point out the plot holes, logical inconsistencies and the Uber (as in the comic) teir bullshitting about being a wank fic and he gets super defensive.

The Volkshalle is a meme, but it's a cool-looking meme

Well the main difference between a rocket and a missile is the payload, and they certainly had the expertise - if you've got a Hitler allayed by the knowledge that you've used the race to develop wunderwaffen missile tech, or a successor who's not as militant then I could see it

>Breitspurbahn
Aw yiss.

>wheels are not swastikas
ONE JOB

How does Japan survive World War Two?

1) That number seems to change every time I hear it

2) The oft-cited death counts are both ludicrous if you know anything about Soviet populations and descended from people like Robert Conquest, who cites hearsay and worked for the IRD (Information Research Department) of the British propaganda wing

3) Don't try to guilt me fashboy, Uncle Joe actually left his country better than he entered it. Your idol left behind a legacy of shitty crosses built on slave labour and ineffectual parliaments staffed with ex-fascists.

When Francisco left the world, his people all agreed never to talk about his again.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pact_of_forgetting

Over fifty years after Stalin's death, he's still fondly remembered.
newsweek.com/putin-behind-stalin-top-russias-most-outstanding-people-poll-629032
forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2017/05/12/stalin-is-far-more-popular-with-russians-than-gorbachev-infographic/#6fba2fb16635

>Germany doesn't fold
>States don't steal their scientific progress
>Axis first to have nukes

>Well the main difference between a rocket and a missile is the payload
What? The difference is one is guided the other is not.

So your setting has no foundation in reality got it.
>>Germany doesn't fold
Possible but very unlikely.
>>States don't steal their scientific progress
Most of what the states stole related to rockets not nukes.
>>Axis first to have nukes
OTL America had nukes before Germany fell the original plan was to nuke Berlin to force Germany to surrender but they surrendered before that. Also Germany had a garbage nuclear program that was going along the wrong path to build a nuclear weapon.

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Wrong type of rocket.

The axis nuclear program was abysmal though, and the US didn't steal any of it for their nukes

Nazi transportation was immensely rad (except when it was horses) - hell, the Hindenburg was even designed with Helium in mind, the US had just stopped exporting it at the time

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What could have been :(

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What, Fascism? The self-destructive ideology of endless war? That thing that runs out of steam and dies the second it hits a wall? That bullshit founded on eugenics by LARPers pretending to be templars?

But sure, cool buildings, that makes it better.