Capitalism

>How does capitalism work?
Someone produces a good or service and trades it to someone who wants it.
>Does someone have to get fucked over in order for it to work?
Not at all, however, greed can lead people to fuck others over. Some people willingly fuck themselves over because they do not have the will to either make themselves more valuable or the creativity to create value.

Greed in a capitalist system can and does lead to exploitation, to some extent, and that is why we have regulations.

Why am I feel like I'm explaining work to a 5 year old?

No, the issue is business takes over the education sector and creates a generation of fucking idiots

Yes. That's the great thing about it.

capitalism is getting into crypto early while the bagholders after you fight over altcoin scraps

Capitalism has lead to the highest standard of living in all of history.

www.econlib.org/library/Enc/bios/Smith.htm

Read Adam Smith for the basics. TLDR: Individuals pursuing their own interests maximize utility within society. Government regulations supress this utility-maximization principle.

Free markets do no exist on the international level, as multi-national corporations lobby local state governments to pursue corporate interests over those of their electorates, and the voters are too uneducated to realize it/ do anything about it.

But yeah, free market capitalism works for the most part. Social services such as police and firefighters have been socialized to protect the poor as living standards rose in western countries.

>I'll trade you this 5 bucks for that cheese burger

EXPLOITED

it's the only system that actually works and produces results long term.

theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/12/26/exiting-nafta-the-myth-of-global-markets/

That's an incorrect way of viewing it. It's not that there's a set pie and we distribute that pie. Money is infinite, and the worth of a nation or individual has a very high ceiling. If one concentrates on very high profit ventures like investing, real estate or business ownership, almost anyone in a free enough economy can become a millionaire.

As opposed the government keeping it and still making a generation of fucking idiots?

Capitalism was great until people figured out that planned obsolescence was the best strategy for getting repeat customers.

>planned obsolescence
it accelerates technological development which is good for us as a species and civilization in the long run. it might just save us from extinction.

Capitalism shows you what happens when you capitalize on your prioritoties

Zero-sum games are what get people fked over because most people who play those games don't understand the consequences, as in most of the people in life

Capitalism is also where corruption is bred since one prioritizes their life over someone elses

tl;dr Capitalism gets bad when it is viewed in a a form of racism (whereas I believe my race is better than yours therefore I deserve more)

You kinda get fucked over in the sense that richer people get richer and poor people stay the same but in other systems where people don't waveslave you don't get as many commodities.
We could all have a lot of money, the governments decide when to print it. But it's all worthless if we have no goods and for that we have to work for it.

/thread

>Does someone have to get fucked over in order for it to work?
Let's put it this way: In a capitalist economy, you don't get rich by stealing from the poor. You get rich by providing a lot of VALUE to society. So rich people actually improve society. Look at how capitalism has lowered the poverty rate over the last few centuries and tell me it isn't a miracle of a system.
Obviously someone is getting fucked over no matter what, usually because of bad decisions that person has made in life. And occasionally just bad luck, but that's life. We all gotta play the hand we're dealt, and I'd even say that poor trailer trash kids with alcoholic parents still have amazing opportunity to succeed in the US.

I'm too uninterested in making an intelligent rhetoric so I'll just say yeah.

its all in horseshoe theory. the further you stray from the middle the less it matters where you stand. if you're going to propose a system that's 100% based on capitalism everyone who's not upper class will suffer. if you propose a system based completely on socialistic values everyone will suffer (except for a handful). the only proper way is a middle ground

so to answer your question, yes. pure capitalism will lead to suffering and a handful who have the very most. and yes, people have to get fucked in order for it to work correctly.

standard of living =/= standard of well being

That is part of capitalism, there are a lot of companies to choose from, you can even make your own, and you're the one who decides which products or services you buy

have mcdonalds, coca cola and nestle: some of the very biggest companies in modern society to which I could add many more, really provided for society? yeah fucking right. they've literally killed people by lobbying and advertising and made hundreds of billions in the process.

sure, a handful like microsoft and Musk&CO might have provided, but a vast majority just either do nothing or have actively worsened it.

WWI, WWII and the Cold War probably did more for technological progress than anything. Peacetime capitalism mostly just innovates bread and circuses.

so much this
it's why private schools are so trash compared to public schools

Fuck off to pol

I think planned obsolescence actually puts less pressure on companies to come up with an actual new, innovative product.

>create smartphone which starts showing symptoms after like a year of usage
>new version is basically the same phone, but with a fancier shell
>customer buys it because his current phone is breaking anyway

easy money

>does someone have to get fucked over in order for it to work?
Yes, but only if you believe that to be true. You see, wealth like everything else, is just another aspect of consciousness. Believe in scarcity and you will make it your reality. Believe in abundance and abundance will be your reality. Financial limits are a mind virus.

No one is forcing the consumer to eat/drink Mcdonalds/Cola. Obviously if they advertised those things as healthy that would be illegal and they can easily be sued and put out of business. Food companies are required to have their true nutrition facts publicly available, if the consumer makes the decisions to eat/drink it anyway that's his decision.
I'm not saying these places should be unregulated, but to put zero responsibility on the consumer is shortsighted.

That would necessitate people not being fucking stupid, which they are. When you give some of the smartest people in the world a full time job trying to figure out how to trick average people making daily purchasing decisions it's not a fair fight.

There's an entire multi-billion dollar industry (marketing & advertising) dedicated to convincing people of wanting things they don't want and don't need, and fostering horrible habits, by use of clearly unethical social and cultural manipulation.

But we accept it as normal and in line with our values as a society, even though it isn't. It even goes against the principles of capitalism itself, as it undermines the rational agency of consumers in the market and de-couples success with merit.

Blaming the consumers is just more of scapegoating to protect the people who are truly responsible for these issues. It's another instance of the dilution of responsibility that is holding us back as a species.

mcdonalds
>basically supplies meals to the public at cheap price
coca cola & nestle
>sugar

All of what you said was provided for a society that 'works' 9-5. Why? Because you need everyone to work, smart or dumb, everyone needs to work.

Easiest way to supply energy is frankly through these methods.

People sometimes aren't grateful for what they have today, taking it for granted that it was always there.

Advertising & marketing don't "stimulate demand". That's an extremely naïve view of it. If it was meant to be strictly informative and objective, it would be fine, but it's not.

They mostly create artificial demand where none existed, and artificially create consumer habits where there were none before (examples are plenty, Gillette's "clean shave = respectable" campaign, Listerine inventing "halitosis", diamonds in engagement rings, etc.)

Such power is constantly used to create poor habits and modulate our behavior against our will, and against our collective interests (regarding health, economical, social, cultural, and environmental impacts).

We are constantly surrounded by institutions that are constantly using this power of manipulation over us for profit, trying to get a hold of every second of our attention. And we inevitably end up acting against our own interests in the process.

We are driven to interact with and depend on these things more because that creates more value to these institutions, and more ad revenue. So now our time spent watching videos is padded with ads. The screen space is padded with ads. The processing power is wasted in ads. These ads often make us wish things we didn't really care for otherwise, they convince us we are worse off than we really are because "we don't have X and we need X", and as such we feed into and support a system where our attention, self-worth and "true will" is eroded and attacked even more.

Advertising & marketing are an aggression against our limited attention span and our self-esteem, and undermine the core principles of our modern society. Advertising & marketing turned us humans into products, and our limited attention span and willpower into a resource to be exploited for profit.

Saying it is "our own fault" for being "fooled by advertisers" is victim blaming, ignores our human weaknesses (which are not going away), and is supporting an extremely unethical practice just because we're already used to it because it is part of our economic processes.

exactly.
i should get to decide what you're (not) allowed to buy

>It's another instance of the dilution of responsibility that is holding us back as a species.

not really, people who are manipulated by marketing are idiots who will never amount to anything without proper guidance. if it isn't by advertising or facebook, it's by relgion or propaganda.

At the scale we practice it, yes a lot

>Caveat emptor

>not really, people who are manipulated by marketing are idiots

Wouldn't it be great if kids don't go to school, instead they have to prove to the world that they know how to handle it at a very young age. I personally feel like that would solve a lot of mistakes that happen just by letting them go into the chaos with no guidance

Oh wait guidance? Doesn't someone have to spend the time to do that?

Religion manipulated stupid people into funding cathedrals and works of art, capitalism manipulates them into buying garbage.

every brain has a backdoor. AI + rapid advancements in neuroscience will become the advertiser's next tool.

>caveat emptor
fuck personal responsibility
>kids need guidance
Well said. I will program your children because I know what's best for your offspring, you need to just sit back and let me do the programming.

>personal responsibility

Well to be frank, if you didn't learn anything from your parents/didnt have parents, then you are simply a replica of what your environment stimulates.

Everyday you are mutating your body/programming your brain automatically. Once self-awareness is reached, you can try to figure out which way is best, based on your current knowledge.

And how do you get more knowledgeable? Well hopefully you look at role models in society and guide yourself from their teachings.

Once we run out of role models and people who frankly don't care for the future, that's when the world falls back into Oblivion

Capitalism is absolutely bad as it leads to the rich abusing the poor. Ever seen a poor person being given the same opportunities as a rich man? Didn't think so, sweetie. Capitalism produces an unjust society. Hence, capitalism absolutely MUST be abolished.

capitalism is inherently cruel and unjust, and is certainly not the end-all system for the world
this does not mean however, that I will not still try to thrive regardless of what shit system I am in

yeah, let's become communists!! oh wait, i live in europe already.

But sweetie communism treats people unfairly as well. It is unfair for someone who works hard to have to be burdened and forced to pay to make the lazy comfortable.

What about if you had a communism where people who didn't work hard enough were sent to educational camps where they were taught to work harder?

How does socialism work? Does someone have to get fucked over in order for it to work?

The difference is in capitalism, the better qualified candidate is the one who succeeds, and arguably everyone has an opportunity to become better qualified. Unfortunately the nignogs have convinced those afflicted with white guilt that racism is alive and well and that only white people can succeed. Tell that to the HR managers I've met with who have turned me down for jobs no matter how much more qualified I am, because they have a race quota to meet and they already have enough white guys. Talk to me about privilege.

Meanwhile in socialism, there aren't many classes other than government and the people. Government and a small section of people are considered the elite in socialism, the rest of us all suffer together with no one allowed to break free of the poverty mold.

Capitilism was designed to increase productivity it isn't mean as it works right now. But humans are corrupt and will turn it into such. Same happened to Marxism/Communism. It's designed for equality buy people will abuse eachother and then you get the scenario where some are more equal than others.

But what happens at the international level?
Is it not true that the wealth in one country often depends on the exploitation of another country, its people or its natural resources?

"Capitalism" is a marxist term. Any society that allows people to truly own and employ their own private property will experience some forms of business and wealth accumulation. Any society that doesn't has to operate as a heavily repressive authoritarian dystopia. Think about it.

stay in school. do your homework

there is zero ethical consumption under capitalism.

The theory of labor power is absolute

You need capital to "make" more capital. You make more capital by taking profit, which means literally "obtain a financial advantage or benefit". If you're investing in stocks, cryptos, metals or whatever, you're basically fucking someone else over. But, who cares... "someone's gotta win", right? Meanwhile, we're all getting raped by the people on the top of the pyramid, because they have a lot more money than everyone else (the top 0.1% own 50% of all the riches) and they can easily manipulate ANY market on this planet. In short, capitalism makes it so a few rise to the top and make gains, usually by creating a bunch of schemes and working together to exploit the system, while the majority will get fucked eternally. BUT DON'T YOU FUCKIGN DARE COMPLAIN YOU FUCKING COMMUNIST SCUM (says the uneducated trailer trash white male who watches fox news and will never have even 0.0000000000000001% of the riches in his local neighborhood). "Pull yourself up from your own boostraps", while getting raped by a bunch of greedy bankes that never had to work one day in their entire lives. Capitalism is meritocracy, don't you believe? I mean, just look at the nice hardworking wallstreet bankers. Just look at the british royal family. Look at the gold in the vatican. Look at all the shady suitmen with sunglasses. Clearly they didn't get that rich by scheming, stealing and exploiting theyr way to the top. Brothers and sisters.... WE'VE BEEN BAMBOOZLED... swindled, taken advantage of, like sheep walking through the wolf's woods. WAKE THE HELL UP, YOU FUCKS. Quit exploiting each-other by playing their sick little games. The enemy sits on top of the concrete towers and laughs as you gut each-other in the streets to give them "their cut" of the deal. Fuck you all.

thats not how communism functions

Not intrinsically, and as some other guy pointed out, it's the only system that actually somewhat works without major negatives, HOWEVER, it needs some sort of regulation. Globalism and current turbocapitalism is destroying our societies (in an actual social way), nations and identities. We're not that far off from "Jennifer Government", a somewhat entertaining dystopia.

Maybe it's time for something new, combined with something trusted - Nationalcapitalism. How about that?

>muh ethics
pay for my healthcare

>Jennifer Government
>People take the surnames of the corporations for which they work
lmfao

>Buy Mitsui starts the novel as a successful stockbroker who just made a big break. Feeling good about it, he gives a girl some money in the mall only to find out that the girl is killed after she uses the money to buy Nike Mercurys. Feeling
holy shit i haven't laughed this hard is days

Stupid ancom

the short answer: yes
the long answer: yess

when marx talks about "private property" he's talking about shit like factories, offices, restaurants...things that generate wealth and are owned privately. he's *not* talking about personal belongings or like, your house.

Exactly. It's why if you start making bird houses in your garage and selling them we will come seize your home. Also, make sure your kids don't start a lemonade stand.

Not necessarily. But asking "how does capitalism work" is very broad. Do you actually have a specific question?

ur dumb

well, no. not unless your birdhouse building becomes a business with employees and capital investment. and no, under socialism the state isn't what would own the company, the people do--i.e. all of its workers and managers would be co-owners.

There are winners and losers but the net is better than other economic systems. If you want to be a winner, you should check out this discord, it has trend analysis and they haven't been wrong all week, making mad gains fampai

discord.gg/USV36RY

...

>slowdown in technological gains
Are you living under a rock?
Everyone has smartphones now, we are talking about colonising space again and this entire board is basically devoted to revolutionary new technology, the blockchain.

exactly. it's why if you decide to accept some money in exchange for helping we will punish you. your choices are not up to you, i decide for you. the end.

truth

To add to that: the constant requirement to be always producing will eventually reach a point where it will no longer be profitable.
If youre in the business of making tvs it is not gonna be of any benefit to keep making the same tv once everyone has one. When youve reached maximum you upgrade and start over
The beauty of a capitalist society though is you can change your business venture on a whim to always be in pursuit of maximizing profit.
This is a good thing.
Capitalism is freedom to pursue those profits.
OR sell your labor for monetary gain.
Capitalism most often seems to get the worst reputation when viewed from the eyes of the individual who sells his time and labor for what he deems to be an unfair price.
Next time you go for an interview and negotiate a higher wage, that's you demonstrating capitalism.

Someone has to get fucked over. The different systems just switch around who gets fucked. Capitalism lets the smartest/most driven/luckiest people thrive, so it could be said to fuck over people who lost the genetic lottery. Whether or not that's a worthwhile sacrifice is apparently controversial.

>You need capital to "make" more capital

No, you just need someone to accept your ponzi scheme

well before you shit all over them look and see what type of charitable actions these companies made.
and like user said. there has to be consumer responsibility.
They make a product because people want it. A lot of people.

Again, no. The founder of the business works in partnership with the employees and managers and all profits are split up.

If you think equitable distribution of capital is punishment, i'd hate to find out what you think is a reward.

Oh wait, I think I already know.

People like you used to be slave traders.

>revolutionary new technology, the blockchain.

I know you're trying to be serious but holy fuck that made me laugh.

it's still a slowdown compared to the acceleration we saw from the industrial revolution up through the internet. We can't keep being impressed with smartphones and dick pic apps that we've had for five years now

if anything capitalism suppresses technical innovation. there are dozens and dozens of examples of this.

>How does capitalism work? Does someone have to get fucked over in order for it to work?

Basically in Capitalism your capital works for you, if you got no capital you gotta trade your time (your life) for money, usually substience level. The people in the first category prosper, most of the ones in the 2nd one get fucked.

and btw literally 90% of the world's population is in the 2nd category.

makes u think

capitalism just rides the waves. the ROI on technological innovation v. business innovation is slim now w/o govt investment, and there is little motivation for that without conflict between nations. the actual force behind technological innovation is not capitalist but fascist competition, because capitalist entities don't have enough capital.

We need a (hopefully Cold) war in order to make the next technological breakthrough

Slaves consented to work just like employees

Depends on the type of capitalism.
if we're talking about primitive barter (the only true capitalism) then no. All participants exchange goods not based on some value assigned to it by some kike but rather based on the value these goods possess to the participants at the moment of exchange.

The """"""""""""'capitalism""""""""""""" we've got today absolutely. Someone needs to be fucked out of their money so someone else can make a profit

I think stricter border controls + encouraging automation and nuclear/alternative energy + minimum guaranteed income generated from the profits of automation + encouragement of local capitalism and small businesses in all other instances is the ideal scenario + focusing on rehabilitation rather than punishment for victimless crimes and focus on defense rather than interventionism when it comes to the prison and military industrial complexes is my ideal scenario and my hope

Sounds worth a try.

In the past, before America in Europeland all merchants, farmers, millers, animal breeders(holders of capital) and such were subservient to the local lord, who "owned" or retained the land which they used and who was a professional warrior with a militia under his command. A state, a government is an "entity with a monopoly on legitimate violence in a geographic area", much like the aforementioned lord.
Capitalism is the result of all these aforementioned holders of capital, becoming free to administer their capital however they wish,(as a result is associated with a strong sentimentality about ownership) but also a result of increasing trust, and less violence, highway robbers making the feudal lord unnecessary, and also this trust between people makes it possible to "own" things you can't store yourself or even know if they still exist.
The way it's supposed to work is much like democracy, the people are supposed to evaluate whether businesses and services in society produce something of value or not, and pay accordingly, leading to the proliferation of the productive and the decline of unproductive.

Lol, no. Usually wealthy nations help poorer nations up. It is then their opportunity to grow, stay stagnant or regress through distributive systems... the bucket crabs. In fact as technology marches on, less and less of this "exploitation" will exist.

Look at democratic states of Latin America after the Cold War, one nation (Chile) attempted to open it's economy the most, and is the richest in the region. And one (Nicaragua) fought progress the most and is considered the poorest in the region.

>communism
>functioning
pick one

Wow that Karl Marx guy sure must have put a lot of time into writing those big books with all those important ideas! How on earth did he hold a job and provide for himself while writing the sacred texts of failed revolutionaries?
Oh wait, I forgot...he was a fucking dirtbag who never held a job and relied on others to provide for him. (seems to be a common theme among those with high-minded socialist ideals)