There are people in this very board who are, defend...

>not charging your players in food

Yes, because they either lack the time or the inclination to take a chance on random GMs, and potentially end up mired in some fuckwit's magical realm, or railroaded through some hack writer's failed fantasy novel. If they can pay money to get a GM they can trust won't be that kind of weirdo, they will do so.

As far as being a GM and charging money for one's services goes, I would never do it, but that's because I already have too much pressure on me to deliver a good game for free. Turning one or more of my players into a paying customer would just make the pressure to perform 100x worse.

There's certainly nothing sacred about GMing, which could be sullied by a business transaction. People buy audiobooks, people buy videogames, people buy tickets to improv theatre. Paid GMs sit in the middle of that venn diagram. Anyone who compares paid GMing to prostitution is an idiot with no sense of perspective.

>mfw other countries

...And you live in which country, exactly?

>mentioned that I think people getting paid to DM is fucking stupid
>one of my players argued with me about it

Should I charge him based purely on principle?

People pay for sex, pay for talking, pay for food. GMing is all that and more

The best country in the World of course. If you have to ask what it is you don't even deserve to reply to me.

You are exactly the kind of petty asshole that are making people seek out paid GMs in the first place.

Not him but I'm confused by your logic. So the DM who is doing everything for free thinks doing this role for money is wrong and refuses to do it for the money, and he's a "petty asshole" for it? Nigga what?

>making people seek out paid GMs in the first place

i'll take "fictional people who only exist in the mind of people who think paid GMing is acceptable" for 1000, alex

>55435634
Neck yourself amerifat.

Dissolving the SU was a mistake.
First time I've ever seen a North Korean post on Veeky Forums

The only 'payment' my players give me as a GM is that they pitch in for my pro account for roll20 since I'm the group's foreverGM

>Thinks North Korea is the best country in the world
>Every rpg is glorious labour while Kim finds the unicorn in the cave

That's actually a very sweet and thoughtful thing to do, user
I'm glad you have such a nice group

Belgium?

t. yuropoor

It's like 10 canukbucks a month so each person pitches in 1 or 2. I honestly enjoy like 95% of my rpg players

It's a free country you cock-sucking communist

>say that I don't think I should get paid for the thing I'm doing
>somebody argues with me to say I should
>I'm petty for thinking of agreeing

You've bamboozled me, user.

Belgium almost banned their own national double-fried fries, that hardly makes them the best.

What, you expect someone to GM for free?

>GM was GMing for free
>Got into an argument with a player about people who GM for money
>Instead of being a mature adult and just letting the disagreement slide, the GM instead considers passive-aggressively punishing the player for arguing

That is why the (admittedly hypothetical) GM in this scenario is a petty asshole.

I've already made it clear in previous posts why someone might seek out a paid alternative to a free GM. But just to make it clear: it's because free GMs are a fucking gamble. You might get a cool, reasonable person, but you're just as likely to get a railroading, Magical Realming asshole, who does nothing but waste the player's time and energy. If a player wants to skip all that, then they will hire a paid GM, whom they can rely on to not waste their time.

I don't know why you fuckers think this is so unacceptable. No-one is forcing you to charge money to GM, and the onus is on the paid GMs to prove their service is superior to a hobbyist GM. So long as tabletop RPGs continue to exist as a hobby, the onus will ALWAYS be on the paid GMs to justify their existence. Paid GMing does not affect you at all.

The biggest problem with paying a GM is that the players may begin to see the game itself as a product that they are paying for, not the GM. The consequence of that is the GM making decisions for the game and its narratives, and then the players saying, "No, that's not what I pay you for, I definitely get to seduce the dragon."

It creates a sense of entitlement where players believe they are paying not just for the GM's services, but for the GM to spin the game to cater to them entirely at risk of producing a bad product.

The GM did nothing wrong. You are a faggot. End your life.

>I don't know why you fuckers think this is so unacceptable.

They are lazy fucks who want free shit. These are the /v/ermin that complain when Free to Play games have monetization plans.

>turn the hobby into a service and the players into customers
>>You know what the issue is? Players become customers.

well gee user whoddathought

>These are the /v/ermin that complain when Free to Play games have monetization plans.
Jesus Christ user, I can't believe you're actually completely serious right now.

Stop projecting

I'm a GM and I dislike it on principle. It's turning something I do as a hobby and for fun into a service. It's fine if people do it, but I don't personally support it or think it's beneficial for the hobby. Like most hobbies, a lot of the fun comes from participants having a passion and enjoyment for what they're doing, and introducing payment to it feels like it removes some of that. It's no longer a bunch of friends getting together to create a collaborative story, it's now a bunch of people paying somebody to entertain them.

>paid GMs are the equivalent of freeto kusoge
right from the horse's mouth

Don't use words you don't understand the meaning of.

>I'm a GM

No you're not.

>It's no longer a bunch of friends getting together to create a collaborative story, it's now a bunch of people paying somebody to entertain them.
>You can't have fun if you pay for something.

If you have to pay someone for them to play a game with you then you probably aren't their friend, and why would you play a game with someone who isn't your friend?

Look it up, you're still projecting.

>No you're not

Wow, user, you sure showed me. Truly anybody that disagrees with you MUST be lying and seeking only personal gain.

>Why would you play a game with someone who isn't your friend?

Have you never played a game?

Nah, you ignoring the rest of my argument proves that.

>acceptable
I don't see why it wouldn't be. It's an exchange of money for services. No one else is involved, or hurt. It absolutely should be allowed, just like prostitution.
>acceptable
In terms of advertising on Roll20? As long as you put it up front and clear that you are charging money for the game, I see nothing wrong with it.
>acceptable
As in getting people into a campaign then announcing you are charging money for it after session2? Yeah you're being a cunt.

My opinion on it? Most GMs who charge money are full of themselves, full of shit, and while they are usually better than the average DM, they really aren't that great. I had a friend who was considering paying to be part of a game on roll20. He works for minimum wage and has 2 kids. I right away offered to DM for him because there was no way I was letting that shit happen. Now I'm committed to running a game at a weird time and I'm not really interested in running the campaign anymore, but other people have changed their lives to make time for it so I basically have to. Thanks a lot roll20 paywall GMs.

Look it up, oh wait you can't your head is too far stuck up your own ass.

>widdle baby mad he hav 2 pay 4 bibeo bame

Truly the lowest /v/ermin

>afraid to look up "projecting"

Well at least you admit you don't know what you are talking about.

I'd never do it but I won't begrudge them for making a buck.

It's incredibly easy to denounce someone by calling them a derogatory term but /v/ermins are still completely right in hating Pay to Win shit.

user you've become a /v/ tier shitposter, I think you need to take a break.

Just stop already.

>Pay to Win

Nice strawman

You're projecting.

Stop projecting.

What user, don't you want to replace normally getting new loot with gatchas?

Why make a real game when you can just cater to gambling addicts and people with waifus that have a lot of disposable income?

>Implying I'm not a paid GM
>Implying I'm not adding microtransactions to my game world
>Play a homebrew race or class starting at 5$
>Having trouble with this boss? Get a special double damage and experience potion for just 2$
>Resurrect your dead character for 5$
>Implying I'm not putting save vs death traps everywhere to keep the money flowing

Competent, willing GMs are a scarce resource. Paid GMing is the market's way of rationing them out in the face of a growing demand which far outstrips supply.

Does the GM provide snacks or meals? Because that's just a more streamlined chip in for pizza if so.

Is the group all randos? Because in that case money means everyone may be more inclined to actually show up.

I got paid at a board game lounge to draw new people in and get them to come more regularly, because they charged admission. Clientele was largely high schooners who never had a chance to play, a few people who played in college, but didn't have any groups in the summer back home, and a couple getting back in to rpgs after having a kid and taking break for a few years. it was interesting.

Those entitled players will get what they paid for.

And that's fine! They paid for an ego massage. If the GM's not happy providing that, then they can either stop serving that customer, or stop charging for their service.

Yeah, and guess what: those players who use money to get the in-game outcome they want? Once they get into that mindset, they will never, ever intersect with the hobbyist groups, ever again!

Imagine if paid GMing was the norm. What would happen if a GM came along and offered to run a game for free? Yes, they'd probably get a lot of players who are used to paid GMing, complaining about low production values, and feeling annoyed that they can't use their IRL money as leverage to make the GM do what they want. But the free GM will also get a goodly number of players who are just happy to be playing: players who consider free gaming to be better than no gaming at all.

Eventually all the entitled players will learn to ignore the free GM, while the more humble and grateful players will stick with them. Players who recognise that the game is a collaborative story, not a service; who recognise that dramatic losses and in-game hardships make for better stories; who don't complain about poor production values, because they know they're getting exactly what they paid for.

That is the truth: so long as there are GMs willing to run games for free, paid GMs will never, ever be a problem.

Any player who sticks with you for more than 5 minutes deserves all the fleecing they get.

No there aren't.

That honestly sounds kinda fun. I dunno why.

Could make for an interesting meta-game. Or maybe even an interesting layer on top of something like Paranoia.

Well there could be some sort of appeal in such a thing if only for the sense of risk that comes with losing money when a character dies, but generally speaking if you want to be ripped off like that just try any phone game

Read the thread. There are people defending paid GMing RIGHT NOW

Please don't feed the trolls.

Same, if a new module comes out that the group wants me to DM they'll buy it for me.

I'm not against paid DMing but I'm afraid of getting bad players and being stuck with them.

>Present an unsolicited opinion on divisive subject
>Get called out and debated about said unsolicited opinion
>Perhaps lose said debate
>Ask if immature behavior and complete misinterpretation of irony and principles is a welcome act

I'd pay for it. If he can prove and show evidence of being a competent content creator suitable for my tastes, I have no problem with paying him for his time.

If he is going to show up and run a module or something he rather than the group wants to do that would not be welcome.

It is the free market, nobody is forcing you to pay them. You are more than welcome to find yourself a market if you so like. But, like every other aspect of life, there is a time when you want something done professionally and well and have enough wealth to do so.

Paid gm fuckers probably think pc gaming modding should become a business too. Sucking bethesdas cock.

>Have mods
>Some people charge for their mods
>Others do not

If you are being forced or coerced to do so, that is not good. But if you make the decision yourself to charge or not, that is entirely welcome. If people do not want to pay, they will not.

Just fuck off already.

>GMing is an ofttimes unrewarding, hard work and unthanked
>GMing can be expensive in resources for books, materials, time and effort to make a game
>GMing has a high turn over and low retention rate
>Players are often ungrateful demanding everything tailored to them
>GMing wants to run something
>Players often disagree

Money is an incentive to better a hobby that is filled with some of the worst aspects of team projects. If you are able to prevent the worst players and attract only dedicated players with a fee no larger than two cups of coffee a week, I welcome it.

>not charging your players in sexual favors

Well when I was a teenager the owner of the FLGS let me run D&D Encounters for 4e. I played them a little bit but he'd charge a quid a session. So when I took over I just thought that was the norm, it really wasn't much and I let people skip out on paying, so long as I had enough cash to take the bus home I was happy enough.

What is the fear that requires this absolute level of dogmatic aversion exactly? That if one GM starts getting paid then all will expect pay? There should be a clear distinction between gaming with your dudes and being a member of a club. Perhaps the club has a membership fee and that covers the time the club GM would otherwise be actually working? Honestly I don't know what it's like to not have friends so you're gonna gave to fill me in here, OP.

They do not want to pay, they want no negative consequences for their actions.

>there are people on an American imageboard that don't believe in capitalism

You're wrong in that your statement implies that prostituyion is a bad thing, so you only get ten internets instead of a gorillion.

>passive-aggressively
I'm sick of motherfuckers on Veeky Forums who don't know what "passive-aggressive" means. Calling somebody out on their shit and hoisting them by their own petard is not "passive".

I don't even know why people qualify that "good" or "competent" GMs are rare.

Even finding a shitty GM is rare.

>Thanks a lot roll20 paywall GMs.
That's not their fault, it's yours. You wouldn't have stuck your neck out if he wanted to spend money on going to see a fucking movie, would you have?

>I don't even know why people qualify that "good" or "competent" GMs are rare.
Because I'm not interested in finding the shitty ones.

Also I don't want to imagine the possibility of someone paying a neckbeard like $20 or more a week to GM a game that makes everyone at the table unpleasant and miserable.

Belgium?

>Everyone pays in $10
>The Winner of the game gets half the pot
>Why half? Because the GM is the house and the house always wins.

Even Belgians don't think Belgium is the best country in the world

I intended no such implication. I believe that prostitution is fine if it's properly regulated and the workers are well-paid. My point is merely that selling one's sexual service, and selling one's improv storytelling performance, are not even remotely comparable.

If said player was arguing that all GMs should charge money, then yes, they would be "hoisted by their own petard". But in the absence of any specifics, I am forced to assume the most reasonable position - that the player was arguing that there's nothing wrong with paid GMing, it's a GM's right to decide if they should charge for their service or not, and if a player wants to pay for the convenience of a reliable, professional-quality GM (caveat emptor, of course), then the option should be available for them to do so.

The fact that the GM was evidently not charging for their game prior to this argument says two things: that the GM did not want to charge money for their game, and the player they were arguing with was happy to take a gamble on a free GM. The fact that the GM then decided to charge only the one player they had an argument with (instead of the whole group) makes it clear that they had not changed their position on paid GMing, and just wanted to wield their power as the GM to abuse a player they disagreed with.

A normal, well-adjusted person would make it clear to the problem player that they don't want them in the group any more, explain why to them clearly, and ask them directly to leave. Instead our hypothetical GM felt that such a confrontation would be too scary (or they knew they couldn't justify the expulsion of the disagreeing player in a way that didn't sound childish), and instead decided to try and drive the player away by pointedly being an asshole. That is passive-aggressiveness to a T.

I see your dubs, but do not believe the truth that you speak of.

I do not care for paid GMing, wether good or bad. It is there, it is a fad and it will pass. And I will not care nor change because I will just keep on playing with people I like in games I like. It's as easy as that.

Interesting. In my country we say that you shold not do what you love for a job, because you will inevitably grow to hate your job.

I would gladly pay 2-5$ per game if the GM could guaranty:
>players and if they don't show up a game that caters to my character backstory
>games on whatever dates have been pre established and if they are subject to change he has to find a way to acomodate to my times
>sandbox style games with clear objectives
>no DMPCS
>if magical realm must cater also to my interest and the GM must be really good at reading tones and be subtle
>5 hours games per day at least
>GM must be fun to be arround
>games must be fun
>no more than 6 players
If the GM is good he can have around 5 players and earn 5$ per hour of game, which isn't half bad.

So basically you are willing to pay 1 dollar to gm and his 4 yes-man slaves?

This too is the fault of capitalism

I've always wondered and this may be the only opportunity to ask before Pyongyang gets Hiroshimad; What do you get paid in for this sort of thing? Extra rice rations for (you)s, by the post or by the hour or is it an in your half day off you get one free and unrestricted (but obviously not unmonitored) google search?