I spoke with a CPA recently for crypto tax. You should only be paying taxes on gains according to your filing, regardless of if your gain is 1,000 USD or 1 mil USD, and in general you can get away with paying 1% over your regular tax rate if you don't want to contact a tax consultant and have them run through your trades and calculate the actual value for you.
So this means, since most of you here are NEETs with no job and hence no income, you should be paying 10% according to the 2017 tax bracket, meaning there's no reason for you to be throwing pink wojacks everywhere. For people like me - middle class job earning between 32k and 92k, I pay 25% on any gain.
Another tip is that while yes you do have to pay tax on each transaction, this really only makes a difference if you are trying to abuse tax provisions to pay less, which none of you are smart enough to do, so you can get away with paying whatever your tax rate is, so 10%, 25% etc
Im just relaying what I heard from the CPA, I dont really know enough to verify but It's what im gonna do, if all I gotta pay is 25% then I can live with that
I've never filed taxes before I literally don't know anything about doing it
Brody Lopez
Finally some real advice
Jackson Long
I know i'm probably replying to a bait thread, but what the FUCK are you even saying?
If you're a NEET without income, then your capital gains are your income for the year. If you made 1Mil, you are in the 1Mil tax bracket. Capital gains are only realized on sale, which in the eyes of the tax man should be when you convert BTC back to USD, regardless of whatever shit coin you hold.
Not saying you NEETs should be paying tax at all, fuck the IRS, but you should at least know basic tax brackets to be aware of if you're cheating the system or not.
1MIL tax bracket is what, 35%? too lazy to do a basic google search.
Jordan Rodriguez
Your CPA is a low IQ tard. I wouldn't trust her too much.
Jason Howard
Your crypto gains will change your bracket retard, otherwise you could quit your job the year you cashout and save hundreds of thousands
Camden Lee
what do you know, the NEETs were fudding for nothing. need more middle class wage earning anons like yourself to balance these autists
Noah Price
WRONG
Christian Thomas
Thanks, anyone know much about specific Australian crypto tax laws? Ill likely just get an accountant to handle my tax for me.
Matthew Jones
it's 0% if you hold over a year and cash out less than 42k. fuck off shekelstein
Carson Price
his example was for your average neet with less than capital gainz to survive off
Benjamin Ward
use turbo tax it goes through it step by step.
Colton Powell
So does that mean I only need to report my gains if I cash out during the tax season
Nolan Robinson
i can only imagine what a million in crypto will be worth a year or two from now.
Carter Watson
This is pretty much correct. OP is an actual retard.
The amount of disinformation on this board is astounding.
Justin Bell
this is actually whats on bitcoin dot tax so its probably true
Jacob Ortiz
You fucking NEETs are so pathetic. Stop making taxes complicated.
IRS cares about the money you put in your pocket each year. Did you magically turn 1K USD into 100K USD this year? If yes, you owe them taxes on 99% of that money. Is it taxable? Yes? OK, that's your taxable income bracket.
If CPA said you pay tax based on your current bracket, thats because he probably thinks you made $1k, not the insane shit we saw this year.
In real world the long term and short term capital gains taxes are different, long term are securities held longer than a year. No clue how this applies to neetcoin, but for stocks short term is flat 35%, long term is effective rate.
If you have 1M in your bank that you didnt have last year and don't pay them 350k in tax IRS will come auditing you. You're not stupid enough to cash out 1M in bitcoin into your bank account are you Neet scum? IRS has no idea what you hold in your online wallets unless you registered and hold assets on a shitty exhange. You not stupid enough to hold your Neet coin on a shitty online exchange do you Neet scum?
Elijah Williams
Literally how would they even know? I'm not paying shit.
William Hernandez
what? you will go to prison, lol
Josiah Foster
>No clue how this applies to neetcoin, but for stocks short term is flat 35%, long term is effective rate.
Holy disinformation batman
Jace Perry
This. Fuck taxes
Jordan Hernandez
I guess people don’t know about the flat 15% tax rate on long term investments (1+ years)
Joseph Lee
ty
Carter Wood
yeah short term is just your normal tax rate, nothing special
Zachary Lee
I loled hard when I saw his flat 35% shill.
So much disinformation out here in biz today. It's incredible.
If you don't understand accounting on a forum dedicated to buisness and finance, please go back to undergrad and finish your classes.
You are not going to make it boys.
Ian Thompson
>1MIL tax bracket is what, 35%? It's 50% when you include state tax. Basically you give uncle same half your stack for selling before 1 year.
Ryder Reed
SHORT TERM CAPITAL GAINS ARE TREATING AS ORDINARY INCOME!
long term capital gains are subject to 25% cap gains tax (i think)
so if your holding period is less than 365 days - that's short term
so if you gained 99k by magically turning 1k into 100k in under a year and you realized that gain your tax burden falls under the income tax bracket of 99k.
not that complicated at all. what is complicated is determining the fiat value of your gains because alts are paired with BTC and BTC isn't exactly stable. so do you take the average price throughout the day or do you take the closing price? also according to which exchange do you determine the price of BTC at the date and time which you entered and exited your alt position?
these are the tricky parts and ofcourse the burden of proof is on you. enjoy fags
Luis Green
Yeah exacly. Why the fuck would i pay 25% when i can pay 15% cuz i bought bitcoin ahead of the normies
Gabriel Ross
I think the IRS just cares about consistency. You can't take the average price on some days when it is lower then the closing price on other days. You either take the opening price, average price, or closing price, and remain consistent in your reporting throughout
Anthony Gutierrez
also if you sold some of your bags and therefore realized a gain do you use FIFO or LIFO? or is it voluntary? does the IRS have a preference?
Juan Martin
thanks man - can i send you some FAPCoin as payment for this advice?
Adrian Mitchell
Thank you
Cameron Sanders
As an accountant I find these threads fucking hilarious. Watching you morons try and figure out the tax differences between short and long term gains, brackets, not even mentioning offsetting losses, etc is nuts.
You niggers have nfc what you are doing. Hire a fucking cpa and dont do it yourselves. The irs will shit down your necks.
Caleb Carter
I guess this stupid nigger doesnt know the irs taxes crypto just like stock and long term gains taxes have brackets based off ordinary income.
Levi Powell
tax loss harvesting in crypto is limited to 3k or so i heard. but please continue being a useless asswipe instead of contributing
Jackson White
Almost right! You can carry the excess of 3k over to following years until it runs out.
Andrew Bailey
There are no gainz until you cash out. There is nothing to be taxed on as long as you're still in coin. You don't get taxed on your Runescape money until you sell it.
This is why old people need to stay away from legislating anything. Liberals keep the fuck away from guns until you learn the difference between a magazine and a clip, old banker jews keep away from crypto. Then we can all get along.
Nolan James
3k in crypto is immaterial to be honest
Robert Rogers
>There are no gainz until you cash out.
THIS IS FALSE. THIS IS FALSE. THIS IS FALSE. THIS IS FALSE. THIS IS FALSE.
Jonathan Harris
since the authoritayyy is treating crypto as property every crypto to crypto trade is a taxable event.
which really sucks because if you come to cash out and BTC eats shit your tax liability could potential be worth more than the fiat value of your portfolio
Hunter Ortiz
As if the average CPA knows anymore about cryptocurrency then any NEET on here.
Chase Wilson
Depends what he meant. If he thinks crypto qualifies for like-kind tax breaks he is very wrong. I wont touch that post its vague af.
Joseph Scott
You treat it exactly like stock as of right now.
Austin Wilson
>Not funneling all of your crypto profits to offshore bank accounts
James Gomez
300k in losses spread out over the rest of your life is nice though.
Caleb Rogers
Im doing the 60/40 blended split (35% short term/15% long term) like oil and gold futures. Fuck the IRS , I'm taking the most agressive approach.
Aiden Long
>>retards not using foreign exchanges >>throwing money away to the IRS
Jacob Torres
i ttrade on gemni
but i never send the cash to my bank account
what do, i made so much money but i never sent it to my bank account
Brandon Cruz
Watch what happens when you enter only 2 trades into bitcoin.tax
>You buy 10 BTC for $1000 on January 1st. >Then on December 28th you trade all 10 of those BTC for 200 ETH at .05. >You never sold for fiat.
Mason Taylor
Deposit small amounts under 10k and hope your bank doesn't call FINcen
Landon Martin
Oh no! You just realized $146,963.90 worth of short term gains, putting you in the 28% tax bracket and owing an estimated $41,149.89! Too bad!
Easton Cruz
Withdraw, file normal income tax, IRS has your record if you're on a big exchange and holding over $20k.
That just means you have to file taxes since they know you're balance. But an audit is only for $1m+ holders so you can file standard income tax on it.
Carson Torres
Lol. If Veeky Forums can't figure out simple capital gains tax then you guys really are dumber than I thought.
Samuel Diaz
Just hold onto your earnings for a year, then count it as long-term capital gains. If you're in the average class bracket (38k-92k income for a single person), that should only be 15%.
Liam Scott
Nobody here held for over year without making any trades, making everything into short term capital gains.
Josiah Davis
>paying taxes >inb4 cia is here
Jack Cook
So, are crypto-to-crypto trades considered like kind until Dec 31st?
Christian Ross
No, they never were considered like-kind. The form for reporting like-kind trades is 2 pages long (for EACH trade) and clearly meant for real-estate.
If you fill out thousands of these and mail it to them, they'll just reject every single one, throw it in the garbage, and come to your house to audit you. Like-kind never applied. And it definitely isn't the default.
Eli King
0% income tax faggot where I live. Washington truly is the greatest state.
Juan Hernandez
Save that reply in a text document; you will need to copy + paste it continuously for the remainder of time.
Samuel Evans
buddy this is for canada
Christopher Jenkins
Why can't I just subtract the total amount I've invested from the total my profile is worth now and pay 25% tax on that amount? Why do I have to report every single trade?
Dylan Anderson
Veeky Forums is truly hopeless. Enjoy getting fucked by the irs. I did try.
Julian Russell
Ayo faggit, I live in Washington state too, what do crypto taxes effect us the same? I'm awful with this shit.
Charles Thompson
this turbo tax online is free for most poors I'll be using it again this year and will pay a touch more than 25% on my gains, just as OP suggested. gotta pay the man but it's better than a surprise tax evasion charge.
Carter Gomez
Because then that would make this extremely convenient way to launder money. If a drug dealer made millions selling drugs he could just say he made all his money "trading crypto" and pay a percentage of his gains while reporting no details, and then buy houses and lambos with his drug money. Also different tax rates apply to long term and short term gains.
Jackson Fisher
I have no intention of not paying my taxes. I just don't understand why it matters if they come to the same amount.
Ryder Young
Federal taxes are same across all the US. Your tax bracket for each day trade. For long term trades should be 15%. I wish I could do that, but they do this for "anti-laundering" purposes. Implying my shit-stack of a few thousand means anything though. Fuck being poor.
Lucas Ross
The IRS has no way of verifying this, so why should that matter
Hunter Young
>Big gain >4u
Brayden Lopez
That makes sense. Thank you.
Gavin Hall
So I gotta pay 15% on EVERY crypto to crypto trade, holy shit..
Jaxson Baker
if under a year yeah. it comes out the same as your total profit times tax bracket anyway. But is shitty.
Colton Bailey
They do. If you used any exchanges that required KYC/AML. If they find just ONE trade you didn't report, there's already evidence you committed tax fraud by misrepresenting short term capital gains as long term. They already have records from coinbase, they're also hiring Chainalysis to look where the coins go on the blockchain. So if they see you sent to bittrex or poloniex they could go over there and make them hand over your records too.
James Martin
Wrong on so many levels...
Jacob Nguyen
Fuck yeah it's shitty these rules make zero sense and they stink of stupid boomers and greedy kikes.
Cooper James
I lost my money in a monero accident. How the fuck am I supposed to pay my gains if I accidentally lost it all FUCK.
Ryan Long
You don't, as you only get taxed on whatever you withdraw.
Lincoln Nelson
False. You get taxed whenever you make a trade where the fair market value exceeds the cost basis.
Ryan Phillips
I think you can pay for what is basically an extension on paying taxes that will let you pay them back later but I can't remember. Honestly I think they are trying to deliberately crash it, making crypto like-kind would make things 10000 times easier and even make them more tax revenue because you wouldn't deal with the issue of people who owe more taxes than they gained in profit because the crypto you went all in on crashed and right before that you traded it from something else which created a tax event. My sympathies user, how much did you lose and how much do you owe, I'm like at 1.5K myself.
Anthony Mitchell
thx trump
Joseph Sullivan
wait it comes out the same as your total profit time bracket? why the fuck is everyone complicating it then?
Wyatt Bennett
another question: by holding for a year do you guys mean holding in a single altcoin or just not withdrawing for a full year and continuing to trade?
Kayden Gutierrez
All my coins obviously. I have 0 idea where my monero is now!
Asher Myers
So you don't launder it and buy coke and hookers basically
Ethan Anderson
Hmm... how did you buy that lambo and that house then?
Ryder White
How much Monero we talkin' goyi- I mean fellow /biztard/...
Lucas Jackson
Would this work for stocks though? Could you say you withdrew all your stock trading profit into cash, and you were carrying around in a briefcase but then dropped it in the ocean in a boating accident.
Joshua Thompson
>>trade on binance >>laugh at IRS >>laugh at retards on /biz throwing away money
Nolan Cruz
>implying that lambo cost me more than 500$
Mason James
If i use Turbo tax can I get out of the Obamacare mandate? I don't qualify for the opt out so i have to go through a CPA (no idea how he does it, i even asked his assistant, who did my taxes, and said she didn't know and had her boss do it for me). And Trumps tax plan, which repealed the mandate, wont set in until 2018 tax year.
Brandon Gray
Exchanges doesn't report to the irs. It's a complete honor system based on the fear of audit correct?
James Bailey
coinbase does over 20k. As long as you don't cash out huge amounts to your bank 99% chance you will be fine. Don't listen to these fud spreaders.
Levi Sanders
Most of them don't but the IRS won in court to get coinbase users records from 2013-2015. Most people probably just made losses during that period but it still set the precedent that your records aren't safe from the IRS.
Matthew Hernandez
That's for 2018 though.
Luke Watson
They don't explicitly bar like-kind reporting until 2018. But just because you technically can report 2017 as like-kind and mail them thousands of 1031 forms doesn't mean they'll approve it. They'll probably reject the deferral and audit you instead. I think a lot of anons are under the false assumption that like-kind treatment is granted by default without having to fill out any forms.
Caleb Allen
1. what's a safe amount to cash out? 2. to trigger the 15% long term capital gains taxes do i have to hold in a single coin for a year or do i simply not withdraw for a year?
Carter Jackson
REEEEE SOMEONE FUCKING ANSWER
Easton Taylor
1. IDK, the law is that you pay taxes on what you sell or trade no matter how big or small. 2. The taxes never had anything to do with withdrawing. The law was that if you made a trade where the FMV exceeds the cost basis before 1 year, you owe short term capital gains, if longer than 1 year, it's long term.