In most games I've looked into, it seems like Archery is always part of the "Agility/Dexterity" statistics.
Shouldn't archery damage be based on strength? It takes a lot of power to draw back a bowstring and the further back you draw it, the harder the arrow strikes. The only real application of dexterity in archery is nocking another arrow.
And, you know, actually hitting people, since hand-eye coordination is usually represented by dex.
Honestly though, I find the way Dragonquest does it is best. Bows, depending on the type of bow, have a minimum strength and manual dexterity requirement. If you don't hit that, you can never gain ranks of skill with the bow. Going over that offers minimial benefits; your main determination as to how good you are with a bow once you hit that minimum is the amount of XP you've sunk into your appropriate bow skill.
>The only real application of dexterity in archery is nocking another arrow.
And aiming, and not hurting yourself with the string as you shoot, and not getting in anybody else's way, and not bumping your bow anywhere and fumbling the shot, and moving while shooting, and a whole bunch of other things.
In one of my favorite video games, Mount&Blade, it's strength. For gameplay balance in a lot of TTRPGs it's dex or agi but if we were doing this realistically it should be strength. You do have an interesting point there, what if str managed your damage/what power of bow you could use but dex managed your rate of fire?
D&D seems to have handled it ok. Attack rolls are based off dex with the bow, you can use a compound bow to apply your str mod on damage.
For the bow you posted, Strength isn't a big part of it. It's only English longbows that require a monumental amount of strength, and any smaller hunting bows make more sense in the context of a game's smaller skirmish scale, where the emphasis will be more on hitting small exposed areas of a target rather than simply going for a full draw and volley firing.
It has nothing to do with realism and everything to do with meeting people's expectations of what skills influence archery and to a lesser extent balancing of game options amongst builds.
If you want a realistic archery system engage in actual fucking archery
Let players pick one. It's the easiest option.
>And aiming, and not hurting yourself with the string as you shoot, and not getting in anybody else's way, and not bumping your bow anywhere and fumbling the shot, and moving while shooting, and a whole bunch of other things.
So like, everything else every other weapon has to take into account?
>And aiming, and not hurting yourself with the string as you shoot, and not getting in anybody else's way, and not bumping your bow anywhere and fumbling the shot, and moving while shooting, and a whole bunch of other things.
>Shouldn't archery damage be based on strength?
Try to put more strength into a bow. Congratulations, you broke it.
Because in M&B you are the one aiming. What rpgs usually simulate via DEX is done by your own hand-and-eye coordination.
Swords and most melee weapons should be Dex-based. Discuss.
All of your abilities are based on your learning capacity, so everything should be based on Int.
Learning is based on how well you perceive and understand the world around you, so everything should be Wis
I believe strength for swords and dexterity for bows is reasonable abstraction/simplification for any system i am willing to play.
I guess that dex is used to represent the accuracy, and being more accurate allow you to hit more sensible spots and do more damage.
Have you ever actually practiced archery, OP?
Bows > Str
Melee > Dex
No, learning is based on IQ you dirty commie, it should be INT.
Strength for damage
Dex to hit
Modern compound bows != old warbows.
Modern archery doesn't take into account that you would be firing at men with more or less armor.
>Open book
>Fail Perception check to see the letters
>Can't read
You've failed befoee you've even begun
With a WIS score that low how did you identify the object as a book in the first place?
There should be a luck stat and if you are not very good at aiming, you should be able to roll luck instead of dex.
>str managed your damage/what power of bow you could use but dex managed your rate of fire?
Strength bonus requirements to wield bows of a given damage level, can use lower strength bow for bonus to hit, damage and range dependent on the strength level of the bow
Dex for to-hit chance
Endurance/constitution for rate of fire.
WIS is a retarded stat though. What is it even?
>I'm literally retarded but have high WIS so I somehow have high 'common sense', can see well, and can utilize my accumulated life knowledge even though I can't add 1 +1
If you're shooting arrows at a guy dressed like that, you're either trying to kill his horse, ensuring that he can never take his armor off to rest while terrain or fortifications make it impossible for him to reach you, or you're praying for a lucky hit before he shanks you.
It's also influenced by weapon level, which is tied to an agi-based skill.
Melee is int (knowing how to use the weapon)
Bows are wis (aiming with perception)
Academic knowledge is con (ability to stay up late and study)
Charm is str (fit people are typically considered to be hot)
Endurance will be dex (balance to stay on your feet)
Animal ken is cha (charming animals)
If by most games you mean D&D I have good news for you.
Dex weapons only get bonuses to hit their targets not damage.
If you want to get bonus damage you have to get a compound bow.
On the compound bow there is a flat str value which is the minimum str needed to wield it and the bonus damage.
Having more str does not grant you more damage unless you build a new bow with a higher str rating.
>Animal ken is cha (charming animals)
When has it not been like this?
Weapon attack rolls should be based on the average of STR and DEX.
Magic attack rolls should be based on the average of INT and WIS or CHA.
I'll admit that I couldn't think of any wisdom skills that weren't perception.
Roll DEX to see if you hit your target
Roll STR for damage
Does that mean that you punch the enemy where the arrow lands?
I guess it matters if there is an Aim or Perception stat. If there is, then Dexterity has no impact at all on archery and Strength would determine damage.
Just play RPGs where you have a general abstracted stat for Attack or Power or something.
Who cares how you do it, just what happens.
Dex is fine, Drawing most bows takes little strength maybe if you have like 6 Strength you struggle a bit.
But even then I'd say you need Dex to properly aim
Minimum STR requirement to draw it, or if it's a crossbow, a STR test to reload it. Aiming and shooting will depend on the system, but it's usually gonna be some kinda agility/dexterity/perception kinda test
But they are? Every weapon skill is based on DX. It's just a matter of whether it is an easy, average, or hard skill to learn. Most melee and thrown weapons deal damage based on the user's ST, while bows and crossbows deal damage based on the pull of the weapon (but you have to be strong enough to pull it).
You draw it faster and can hold a draw longer, actually. You don't overdraw, that's stupid, because that changes your trajectory and aimpoint.
Honestly perception should handle accuracy.
strength and dexterity shouldn't be different stats. Their should be one stat to determine physical ability, called fitness.
My favorite system was old school rune quest, where your Dex and int were the primary modifiers on melee attack, with strength giving a secondary bonus. Your damage, though, was modified by strength and size.
this is flawed thinking.
Compare Bruce Lee and Dwayne Johnson. Both are/were in peak physical condition. however, johnson is fucking HUGE and if he could get his hands on lee, would pretty successfully break him like a twig. lee, on the otherhand, is still strong, but EXTREMELY fast and tiny, capable of defeating many of the best martial artists of the time through mastery of body and application of, believe it or not, physics, using his speed to his advantage to do so. while he was strong, he doesn't have the same raw strength johnson has, and the opposite is true.
>in D&D, they are the difference between an 18 str,15 dex and a 15 str and 18 dex. i'd say both have 16 con, though johnson has the charisma while lee has the wis.
Dexterity to hit, strength to damage.
Or strength to utilize a bow properly, dex to hit.
Which is why Dex should be used for to-hit for melee weapons as well.
Obvious the solution is to have fitness and weight class
women get -4 WHT
Bruce lee was hella strong dude, not le DEX Monk meme but actual STR strong.
I like to think of it as situational awareness. A cat or dog probably has a fairly high wisdom, but low interest for instance.
All you have to do is create different fighting style skills
both Lee and The Rock have a FIT score of 18 but,
Lee has got 20 points in Martial Arts and The Rock has got 20 points in Wrestling (I know that Wrestling is also a martial art, but just go with it)
To use OPs archer as an example
William tell had about 16-18 FIT, but he dumped all his skill points in Archery and Crossbows and ignored Sword Fighting
My current favorite system takes that into consideration rather nicely, I think.
To set things up there is a 'Missile Pool' which you roll to see if you hit, a derived characteristic called 'Aim' and 'Weapon Proficiencies', which are basically how skilled you are with a weapon.
Aim is (Perception + Agility)/2
Missile pool is Perception + Aim.
After finishing knocking your arrow you get your Perception added to your usable pool.
You can then attack just with that, or wait another round. If you wait you get your Aim added to your usable pool, so you have your full pool to attack with now.
Bows have a 'Effective Strength' which is the minimal Strength needed to operate the bow effectively, and it's also used to calculate damage.
You can't do or learn anything if you're dead.
All actions should be based on HP.
Dex for hit ,str for dmg and range
>Tfw I'm an archer at larp and am a pretty damned good shot
>Tfw clumsy as fuck with zero hand-eye co-ordination
Dex is a pretty bad interpretation of aiming, its more about thinking and judging time/distance than having fast hands.
Shadowrun has both give an impact. Base bow damage relates to strength and the bow's quality. Better bows can handle more strength, but also require more strength.
It also has tohit relate to agility. Succeeding an attack roll by a higher margin also increases damage deal, so both stats have an impact.