How does an optimized core-only level 17 grey elf wizard from 3...

>But that's a slim fucking chance. The 3.5 and 3e are just to far apart for it ever to be a fair fight. Frankly, a fresh from chargen Solar would still have even odds against the wizard, unless they were a completely non-martial build.

Here is one thing about story teller vs the D&D system.
The wizard has significantly more HP than the solar.

What am I getting at? The wizard has a lot of ways to nuke the solar.

Take Magic Missile for instance. It does shitty damage.

However it doesn't miss, ignores armor, and ignores damage reduction. at level 17 it shoots 5 missiles.

This means it is going to screw over the solar.

wizard wins.

>hecatoncheires
>core

You want to summon lots and lots of solars to fight the Solar.

None of these rules work in Exalted, especially the planar shit, and none of those things exist in Exalted.

None of Exalted's rules work in D&D. Literally, none. Nothing translates over.

No one wins, you're retarded, and these threads are terrible and you should feel bad.

>especially the planar shit
Exalted has planes.

Oh, and some of those rules don't even work in D&D, let alone Exalted.

No, no it does not. Not in the D&D sense.

>The wizard has significantly more HP than the solar.

This is a really retarded way of doing this.

>However it doesn't miss, ignores armor, and ignores damage reduction. at level 17 it shoots 5 missiles.

They might have changed something for 3e, but 2e Solars had several ways of blocking all attacks, even attacks that explicitly cannot miss.

Even translating over mechanics, the most you could argue for magic missile is that it would automatically hit and the damage would go against the target's Soak unmodified by armor. However, that means any Solar with even mediocre stamina is going to take those two-dozen missiles to the chest without a scratch, the same way they would tank a volley of arrows if they were naked and stood perfectly still.

>just teleport away and summon stuff to fight in your place

You don't seem to understand how good an Essence 5 solar is at fighting. Trying to summon an army against it is the last thing I'd try. Best case scenario, they take some time to kill them all. Worst case scenario, they use their Social charms, convince all of the angels that they're actually a way better person than you, install intimacies of adoration, and then knock down your demiplane with an army of angels while getting angel blowjobs.

Hecatoncheires is in the d20srd, and is OGL content. It could be considered core by some.

You don't need it though,

Chain gating solars would work as well.

>This is a really retarded way of doing this.

Could you elabroate?

>They might have changed something for 3e, but 2e Solars had several ways of blocking all attacks, even attacks that explicitly cannot miss.

Perfect defenses tend to be rather mote intensive, like around 8 motes to block/soak/parry 1 attack.

Magic Missile is a first level spell, and fires 5 attacks (past caster level 9).

It's going to mote tap them fast.

Magic Missile is dogshit for damage in 3.5.

>Even translating over mechanics, the most you could argue for magic missile is that it would automatically hit and the damage would go against the target's Soak unmodified by armor. However, that means any Solar with even mediocre stamina is going to take those two-dozen missiles to the chest without a scratch, the same way they would tank a volley of arrows if they were naked and stood perfectly still.

Soak can't reduce damage to 0.

>You don't seem to understand how good an Essence 5 solar is at fighting. Trying to summon an army against it is the last thing I'd try. Best case scenario, they take some time to kill them all. Worst case scenario, they use their Social charms, convince all of the angels that they're actually a way better person than you, install intimacies of adoration, and then knock down your demiplane with an army of angels while getting angel blowjobs.

Social Charms don't work in combat.

And you don't understand how good those creatures are at fighting, the solar has no way to kill them.

Yeah, but that doesn't matter in this case as exalts don't much health.

By that logic, a Wizard can't hurt a Solar at all, since a Wizard can't make Decisive attacks.

You may as well say that the Wizard should just wear light armor because the Solar can't hit AC 12 on a d10.

So how do we compare health levels/hit points and such?

Why?

Wizard wishes Solar dead, the end.

You don't really need to. Wizards aren't known for their damage anyway and a Solar will rip them to shreds once they're in arms reach, so it's a matter of looking at other spells and charms that would set the terms of engagement.

Trying to game the system by suggesting that the solar should be immune to any blasting spell because they have Health Levels, not HP, or anything like that doesn't really help us come to a conclusion.

Would only work in some cases.

How do you know solar will rip them to shreds if we aren't comparing hp?

Because both settings have benchmarks [such as normal humans] we can compare to see which has the superior power level.

And Solars take glorious golden dumps over 99% of D&D content short of Epic Level.

The Wizard would have to first magic himself away and then secondly find a way to kill someone who can just use anime shonen bullshit logic to flat out ignore almost any spell the Wizard casts on him.

The Wizard is more versatile but the Solar is MUCH stronger in combat then anything the Wizard can summon, and the Solar is specced specifically to no-sell shit. Ignoring polymorph I think is like a basic Charm.

An Essence 5 Solar can punch out sea monsters with minimal effort. And something tells me your average Kraken has more health than your average Wizard.

Ok how many health levels does a kraken have?
IIRC normal humans have 3 health levels, and 7 if they have a name.

Just for a quick example, an Armored Terror is a giant fish that has 18 health levels.

Normal Humans in Exalted have 7 health levels. Exalted also have 7 health levels (at least in 2e) (this is with no ox bodies however).

Normal humans in Dnd have 4 hp (lvl 1 human commoner.
How much hp the 17th level wizard has depends. Lets take average hp per level (wizard has d4 HD),

at constitution 10 they have 32 HP
If they optimize for constitution, they could have like 16 or 18, giving them 85 Hp or 102

What charms are you talking about?

Everything in dnd* have an additional 10 dying hp.

*except for constructs and undead

I think important to note is that Exalted does put more of an Emphasis on Dodging, Parrying, Soak, or Hardness when it comes to avoiding damage. Health levels aren't what makes something as hard to kill as much as Soak and Hardness when it comes to just stabbing it successfully.

You could give a normal human 20 health levels and they'd still die pretty fast to anyone with actual skill. Similarly, an Exalt might have relatively normal health levels, but have enough Hardness or Soak from certain charms to the degree that swords just break against their abs.

This. Comparing game mechanics is retarded, you don't compare the rules, you compare what they can actually kill and survive.

This is why i suggested magic missile.

if we want to take silly interpretations, that 102 hp wizard could survive a nuclear weapon.
Health levels in dnd AND exalted scale exponentially at higher levels.
10 HL is the damage from a lance charge, and 100 HL is the damage from a mountain stepping on you.
1d8 is a mace damage, and 16d8 is a 1 megaton nuke.

Glorious Solar Plate is an easy Charm answer to that, as it offers a specific defense against energy-based projectiles while offering a metric ton of extra durability.

Magic missile wouldn't work against a Solar's natural Hardness for the same reason it wouldn't kill a 200 HP fighter, even though force damage can't be resisted. Again, it's the same strange mechanical area where you could argue that it'd do nothing because Solars don't technically have HP.

Solars have natural hardness in 3rd edition??

As natural as you want to call anything a Solar does, but yes there are charms for it.

Either way, it's not the sort of thing that 'lol magic missile' solves.

oh you meant from their native charms, rather than innate soak from stamina and such.?

Wouldn't work in any cases vs an optimized Essence 5 Solar.

Wish would clearly be considered a "reality-shaping" spell in Exalted's rules, and an optimized Solar would have Destiny-Manifesting Method. It activates and nullifies any effect that would leave the Solar unable to fulfil their character concept. OP didn't specify what that was, but killing the Solar would invalidate every character concept, the spell fizzles.

But before someone breaks Death Battle rules and uses knowledge of a character's mechanics when that character is non-canon for the attacker's setting, the Wizard wouldn't get that far. The Solar has options that DnD doesn't, and one of those is social influence pumped up to the same level as the better known physical attacks that can't miss and kill instantly. At essence 5, a Solar could have access to any charm, so lets imagine the Solar has intimidation charms like Tiger's Dread Symmetry or Countenance of Vast Wrath. On considering attacking the Solar, the Wizard is immediately paralyzed with fear. This effect is explicitly specified to work on creatures immune to fear, so Mind Blank and such do nothing. The Solar then convinces the Wizard to devote their life to serving the Solar, and the Wizard really isn't equipped to resist that. The Solar now has a level 20 Wizard for a lackey. Or the Solar just kills them while they're helpless. Either works.

youtube.com/watch?v=huTKdSZMRPg

Teleport away start cult based on worshiping the Solar, then teleport him to Sigil.

The megaton nuke would be "you're dead" in any game, DnD or Exalted. Of course, a Solar can survive Uncountable Damage. Hell, a solar can Parry Uncountable Damage. With a spoon.

This is the most retarded thread I've ever seen in my life.

Cleverest one yet, but there are no "you lose" enemies in Exalted, so the Solar is probably going to beat the Lady of Pain, or at least be able to ignore her attacks long enough to get away from her. TLoP only has three combat actions: Maze, Flay, and Float Slowly In Your Direction. An essence 5 Solar has options for those.

Also, the optimized essence 5 solar already has a cult. She thanks you for expanding it.

The Solar can already have a cult spanning about a quarter of their world if they so chose. You just gave them more power without actually turning them into a god like you were hoping.

Ayep. Exalted is the biggest collection of stupid juvenile power fantasy this side of a Dragonball Z marathon, and that's what makes it, and this thread, fun.

And now back to arguing about who would win: Accidentally Overpowered vs Deliberately Overpowered.

>At essence 5, a Solar could have access to any charm, so lets imagine the Solar has intimidation charms like Tiger's Dread Symmetry or Countenance of Vast Wrath. On considering attacking the Solar, the Wizard is immediately paralyzed with fear. This effect is explicitly specified to work on creatures immune to fear, so Mind Blank and such do nothing.

That doesn't automatically suceed.
Also contingency is a spell the wizard has access to.

Funny enough, I think the correct answer would be a Solar with Linguistics, Stealth, and Larceny, as there's a Linguistics charm that allows a Solar to copy any written magic and then be able to use it if they're essence 5.

So then you could have an Essence 5 solar that was also a max level D&D Wizard, so long as you can steal a spellbook as someone that good at stealth and stealing.

...

It doesn't automatically succeed, but a level 17 Wizard is still a mundane mortal when it comes to social skills unless they have a spell active. The odds of a mundane mortal succeeding against a Solar-enhanced persuasion attempt are functionally non-existent.

But sure, Contingency is a real heavy lifter, since it runs on the same narrative-style rules as Exalted. A Wizard could have a set up that specifies "if something scares me, teleport me to my doom fortress". That'd be standard Teleport, mind you; the Wizard is 3e and 17th level, meaning 5th level spells only.

The question is, what does the Wizard do once he gets there? He's still terrified of the Solar. That's not a magical effect that wears off, the Wizard is now scared of fighting the Solar. The Wizard will reasonably avoid doing so in the future. Sort of ends the fight with the Wizard having conceded, even though no one died.

This is good. Trying to match Solar melee against a Wizard is playing into the problem that created 3e Caster Supremacy in the first place: the Wizard has more access to clever solutions to combat encounters than a guy with a sword has, however skilled. The Solar should do the same.

That said, I have a feeling Contingency is going to rear its head whenever anything involving a Wizard becomes relevant.

>It doesn't automatically succeed, but a level 17 Wizard is still a mundane mortal when it comes to social skills unless they have a spell active.

That's a tricky distinction due to the level system. A level 17 guy can do stuff with skills that most people couldn't even dream of (Not talking Olympic stuff but honestly mythical stuff). The rather vestigial social system of 3.5 also makes exact judgements very tricky.

Still, this is a silly debate that will mostly go with 'The guy I think is best will win'.

I mean, yes the Wizard has Contingency, but how many things would a Wizard even think to prepare a contingency for? I mean, a Solar can literally write down a Social attempt, hide it within flowery language that only the Wizard could understand, and then have it remove the Wizard's ability to comprehend written words and replaces it with a unique gibberish language.

Like, what Contingency do you make for reading a grocery list, then suddenly forgetting every word you ever learned and being forced to re-examine your entire worldview because the subtext was just that fucking good? It could be disguised as a normal spell scroll and not even show up as cursed, since it's just exceptionally good writing.

Glorious solar plate gives soak against magic attacks, and Im pretty sure that can't reduces stuff below 1 damage.

>And Solars take glorious golden dumps over 99% of D&D content short of Epic Level.

4e would likely be a better comparison than 3.5 if you wanted something to match up to a Solar. You could likely write 'Epic tier is a roughly even match' as both of them have pushed their skills so far it's utter bullshit (A 4e rogue has gotten so good at larceny he can steal the colour of your eyes or a 4e Warlock can come back from the future to continue the fight and avoid a time paradox by raising himself from the dead.) and doesn't make either side feel bad about the matchup. 1v1 the Solar likely wins (As they don't really teamwork mechanically much) but Circle vs Party of 5, the D&D characters likely win (Due to superior ability to aid each other).

Considering how many spells in D&D can fuck with your brain, I feel like it wouldn't be that unusual to have something prepared for if someone tries mind control or some kind of mental reprogramming.

Search me as to what the prepared spell would actually be, though.

Yeah, the trigger is hard to come by, and the solution in that case also might not be clear-cut, since a Wizard would certainly be expecting a magical or psionic mind attempt, rather impossibly skilled Diplomancy.

I do think Linguistics is the prime way to fuck with a Wizard though. His power comes from books and scrolls, and a Linguistics Solar's power is words. It'd be pretty hard to go against someone who can learn magic easier than you can and turn your favorite pastime against you.

The Soak doesn't do that, but the Hardness does. Really running into the difficulties inherent in translating between systems though. In 3e, a mundane knife can get past that hardness as a result of the skill of the wielder and the opportunity they've created through previous attacks or a well planned ambush. That's the Decisive/Withering divide, and translating that into DnD or DnD into that is hard. Then again, a Solar can have charms that reduce the minimum withering damage of an attack... ugh.

Better question is E5 Solar vs Level 20 Anima character.

>At essence 5, a Solar could have access to any charm, so lets imagine the Solar has intimidation charms like Tiger's Dread Symmetry or Countenance of Vast Wrath. On considering attacking the Solar, the Wizard is immediately paralyzed with fear. This effect is explicitly specified to work on creatures immune to fear, so Mind Blank and such do nothing.

This isn't really accurate.

It doesn't prevent the wizard from teleporting out or leaving.

"Tiger’s Dread Symmetry" only give you an intimidate attempt on attackers if you activate "Majestic Radiant Presence" before it.

"Majestic Radiant Presence" is a Simple charm.

This means the wizard will have teleported out (if he is using a quickened spell), before it would be active.

Further more even if the wizard didn't have a quickened teleport spell it wouldn't work on someone bailing out.

It doesn't activate when you consider attacking the exalt or set up a plan, it activates when you actually make the suprise/ambush attack (as in trying to fire your bow).

It doesn't work with attacks you are aware of either.

The tiger thing doesn't exactly work with "Countenance of Vast Wrath" most of the time
due to this clause: "The intimidate action
may only be supported by Charms that are ongoing or
otherwise can be used unconsciously"

what charm is this

I'm pretty sure that glorious Solar plate doesn't grant hardness against energy attacks and such.

i think 3.5 is going to be stronger in a match up than 4th will be.
3.5 has more broken stuff than 4th.

>Yeah, the trigger is hard to come by, and the solution in that case also might not be clear-cut, since a Wizard would certainly be expecting a magical or psionic mind attempt, rather impossibly skilled Diplomancy.
>impossibly skilled Diplomancy.
Solar charms are magic.
And regardless of that, this would count as mind affecting.

Actually, Hardness applies to any attack that deals damage. GSP doesn't add a caveat to that, but it does add a specific additional protection against Decisive energy-based projectiles that even applies when Crashed, i.e. when completely vulnerable to an attack. That's an ability that specifically adds a lot of protection for a high Essence Solar against a volley of low-damage energy-based projectiles.

That's debatable. 3e has the Extraordinary/Supernatural/Spell-Like distinction, and it's not entirely clear which of those a charm would fall into. Undead, for instance, are supernatural but not Supernatural.

Regardless, the difficulty here is that a Solar's social influence can take so many forms that it's hard to word a Contingency that would cover all of them without some major false positives. A Solar that creates a letter with magic doesn't leave magic in the letter. A Contingency based on reading something that convinces the Wizard to do something would get set off if the Wizard was hungry and saw a sign for a restaurant.

Out of curiosity, since, Contingency essentially lets you cast fifth level spells out of turn sequence, what fifth level spell is the Wizard using to get out of the social attack?

Social attacks can be blocked with Mind Blank, but thats unrealted to the contingency spell.
it's also a better choice than the contingency for coutnering that stuff

The highest lvl spell you can store in contingency is (1/3rd your caster level), maximum 6th level. The wizard is only level 17, (but he could use an Orange Ioun Stone to increase his caster level to 18.)

A contingency wording for that would be something like:
"when I am affected by a(n enemies') mind affecting ability."

a few Spells that might be usefull to be triggered are:
"Break Enchantment".
"Remove Curse".
"Magic Circle against evil" (or good or chaos or law).
"Protection from Evil"(or good or chaos or law).

...

There's the matter of initiative to consider. Solars not only get crazy boosts to their roll, IIRC they also have a charm that straight out says "You win initiative." They can end it before the wizard gets a chance to cast their quickened teleport or planeshift.

Then there's initiative in the broader sense. If these are two characters that happen to exist in the same setting somehow, then the one that's taking the fight to the other would have a massive advantage from preparation. They'd figure out whatever tricks the other party has and account for them.

>Then there's initiative in the broader sense. If these are two characters that happen to exist in the same setting somehow, then the one that's taking the fight to the other would have a massive advantage from preparation. They'd figure out whatever tricks the other party has and account for them.

This guy has some good points.

In vs.debates certain enviromental things can change the outcome heavily.

how far do characters start from each other. do they have prep time, what do they know about eachother? What enviroment are they fighting in. etc

the Vs. debates forum in spacebattles is a shithole, but it does tell you how to make a decent guideline for a debate.

>There's the matter of initiative to consider. Solars not only get crazy boosts to their roll, IIRC they also have a charm that straight out says "You win initiative." They can end it before the wizard gets a chance to cast their quickened teleport or planeshift.

Wizards have Celerity, but that isn't in core.

Quickened spells can be cast "out of turn order".

outside of that, you could get a contingency to teleport you out.

If you really want to get stupid, just go to 2E Solars, who have a Charm that triggers the moment initiative is declared, and responds with an attack that would kill anything.

Nevermind the fact that a Solar in D&D terms is at least a Demi-God. As in, 3.0 Deities and Demigods, I-Have-Divine-Levels-And-Always-Roll-Natural-20's Demigod, which obviously outranks any mere creature like a D&D Solar or regular old Wizard through sheer bullshit extra rules to begin with before you even try to translate any of their abilities over.

Conversely, shoving a Wizard into Exalted rules ends up with...A Heroic Mortal Sorcerer, at best. Congrats, you can cast one spell, it took most of your mortal life to do it, and all of your magic can be casually shattered with a single, reflexive, counterspell.

That is load of crap

>Nevermind the fact that a Solar in D&D terms is at least a Demi-God. As in, 3.0 Deities and Demigods, I-Have-Divine-Levels-And-Always-Roll-Natural-20's Demigod, which obviously outranks any mere creature like a D&D Solar or regular old Wizard through sheer bullshit extra rules to begin with before you even try to translate any of their abilities over.

Solar's don't auto hit or auto succed at crafting tasks. They need to spend motes to do that.

Solars don't live forever, they will die of old age without specialized powers.
Solar's durability relies on them using charms and is as squishy as a human other wise.
Solars need to eat, sleep and breath.

Gods don't need to do any of that.

Solars aren't naturally immune to to a ton of stuff.

A divine rank 1 deity is immune to:
form altering attacks, energy drain, stat loss, mind affecting abilities, electricity, cold, acid, stunning effects, sleep effects, disease, poison, paralysis, death effects, and disintegration.

>Conversely, shoving a Wizard into Exalted rules ends up with...A Heroic Mortal Sorcerer, at best. Congrats, you can cast one spell, it took most of your mortal life to do it, and all of your magic can be casually shattered with a single, reflexive, counterspell.

lmao.

>That is load of crap

Yeah, and your own ideas are shit too you mincing faggot. Protip: By an Exalt's very definition, by D&D rules, they would literally be Demigods. They're even referred to as such by the Exalted game itself. You're trying to mash up nonsensical rules with each other and produce liquid shit, I'm looking at the fluff and themes behind those rules and trying to produce something of worth, because neither will ever translate to the other's system well based on rules.

Fact: A Wizard in D&D would be a Heroic Mortal. You cannot change or deny this, because Exalted doesn't HAVE D&D style Wizards in the slightest. And they are explicitly mortal. The closest correlation is a Heroic Mortal Sorcerer.

Fact: An Exalted in D&D would never and could never be a PC, because their abilities are literally natural extensions of their being using the innate power that existence is made of, in Exalted. Motes aren't magic, everything in Creation has Essence and motes, they simply can't use them (unless they can, like spirits, Gods, demons, Exalts, etc). Charms are literal natural abilities they have as a result of what empowers them. It's as natural for them as swinging a sword is for a Fighter. At absolute worst they'd be considered some kind of Demigod with ridiculous templates and abilities that make them superior to most in-setting Gods, because in Exalted, the average Exalt can and does cock slap the average God in every single possible area.

tl;dr This shit does not mix, in any way, shape, or form. Trying to do so is fucking stupid, and the best thing you could even try-And it's not even a good idea to-Is to look at the overarching themes and try to apply them, and even then that will fail.

I would argue that the closest analogue to a Wizard would be a Heroic Mortal who was cheated to know every single sorcery regardless of circle, since we are talking pure hypothetical here, but even that should be a good example of how a D&D Wizard wouldn't be that scary, since even summoning armies of demons or using the various blasting spells wouldn't threaten an Essence 5 Solar very hard. You might be able to trick them with the more utility based spells, but it's still just going to be a baseline human with a dozen highly powerful but relatively narrow effects up their sleeve.

The funny part is, is that the first tier of sorcery is the mortal cheating his way as high up the magical totem pole as he can go. Normally, all they'd get is Alchemy.

Like I said, there is absolutely no way to compare the two. Trying to bring either into the others world doesn't work, and their abilities are pretty much a crap shoot of "I say X works over Y in this matchup because it's what I think".

These kind of threads need to be fucking banned already before it reached "WoD Mage VS Exalted" tier of shitflinging about whose special rules of faggotry outrank the others in a game of "my dick is bigger than your dick because I say so".

And nb4 some faggot comes in saying Mages/Exalts win because exactly the reason above with no actual hard proof no matter what retarded shit they say because the systems don't match up in any way at all.

If Optimized Nemesis Technician, the Solar is hosed pretty solidly, courtesy of "No, you can't spend that resource" abilities(which would heavily depend on what Essence counts as in A:BF), and the Technician having access to really nasty Techniques(because they gotta do something with that 1000 base Martial Knowledge[not counting the extra 370 they could get from Martial Mastery 3 and spending DP into MK]).
If Mentalist, probably hosed by the Solar.
Optimized Wizard is borderline-Sidereal in terms of Reality Screwing Bullshit, and is also probably planning to drag the Solar into the Wake/rape the Solar in their own dreams, because there they can pull the Dark/Light Ascension Combo BS to turn themselves into a Gnosis 50 "I have carte blanche to piss all over your character sheet, and you can do shit all about it".
An Optimized Summoner COULD be hazardous, depending on what Arcana or pets they have. Special notice goes to World Reversed, wherein every attempt to do anything, by literally anyone, is a fumble, including the Solar's activated Charms. But if a Solar can catch the summoner before they complete their ritual, the Summoner is hosed.

Wizard with all core spells is more threatening than a sorcerer with all circles.

This is due things like wish,gate, simulacrum.

do perfect defense still exist in 3rd edition?

Even then, you are comparing apple seeds to Apple pies.

Fuck any actual rule interpretation, by sheer setting qualification of what either is capable of, a "full build"/"End Game" essence 5 Solar is vastly more powerful than an end game wizard in D&D.

Nemesis techs are fucking madness to deal with, and the sheer scaling in Anima is retarded.

Yeah, you can level to 20, but some of the most powerful beings are around level 13.

Take for example: C'iel Dragons, of which there exists 7 in total, also known as the SEEDS OF LIGHT created at the birth of the universe, which has the description that few can survive more than a few seconds in a fight with them. These creatures are almost incomprehensible to even the Gods who created them. Level 13.

Players can reach level 20. No GM should ever let a party reach higher than 10 unless they they plan on going for a campaign where the players become literal Gods.

And while we are at It, Anima Wizards make D&D wizards look like street level magicians, once they reach the last spells. Even wish is low tier.

>Fuck any actual rule interpretation, by sheer setting qualification of what either is capable of, a "full build"/"End Game" essence 5 Solar is vastly more powerful than an end game wizard in D&D.

they are more relevant to their setting, but that doesn't automatically mean more powerful.

its a fight between them.

It is not a comparison of how much they change their world.

their power relative to their native setting isn't what matters in this case.
It's like how a large ant might be the strongest type of insect in it's natural habitat, but an average human could step on it and kill it by accident.

the point is that relative power to the setting doesn't really matter, not that the ant is wizard/exalted

>No GM should ever let a party reach higher than 10 unless they plan on going for a campaign where the players become literal Gods.
...Or if the GM wants the party to square off against the Powers.
Anima GM, and guy you were replying to, here. Players are 15 WarSum(RealHOLST/Seiryuu combo)(married to a C'iel Dragon)[/spoiler] and 14 Mentalist(600 Damage Returning Railgun)(banging a cougar bandit queen that's the reincarnation of Saint Helena), and they stand a chance to level up next sesh provided they survive fighting an Agent of Jurgand and Lucifer..
I plan on, if they survive, taking this campaign to levle 20 just for shits and giggles, maybe throw them against some Disgaea characters once they've dealt with Barnabus and his "Kill the Gods" bullshit.
Also, the chargen on Animaunico allows levels up to THIRTY! What you're fighting when you're that high a level is beyond even me to comprehend, because that's that's sixty levels in D&D terms. Which is as many as six tens, and that's terrible.

I see your campaign mentioned a bunch whenever Anima comes up. Anybody's think you're only guy running it.

Solar would act faster than the quickened greater teleport with thunderclap rush attack.

If it is a long term game where they get to prepare the solar cast demon of the third circle to Summon Ligier and order him to kill the wizard and the Hecatoncheire.

I wouldn't be surprised if I was, honestly, though I know there's at least one other GM on once in a while only because we both discuss characters in our games who are... Intimate with Manah Razz.
The problem with Anima, is people who've spent a long time playing D20 variants(D&D/PF, etc) see the percentile dice, hear about it involves some light multiplication, and immediately assume it's more complicated than D&D.
I mean both have their complexities, but at least with Anima you don't need to a) remember what spells you prepared today, or to even prepare spells, and b) worry about what dice you need to roll.
>Base Damage one hundred, modified by how well I roll plus my attack/projection, the enemy's defense plus their armor
Is a lot simpler than
>Okay, I rolled. Beat the AC? cool, now lemme roll... 2d6 plus strength for the greatsword, oh and the dice for the fire enchant, and this other enchant, and this situational bonus from an ally's buff, and because I crit I have to double the amount of dice I roll.

At least D&D can be easily macro-ised for online play. I don't know how you'd get Anima's explosion system into R20. It's like Hackmaster's Piercing Explosion system but not.

I'd try my hand at running it myself, but I'm an incompetent who cannot into personalities. Write up your whole campaign and post it as a PDF or something, I want to live vicariously through descriptions of others' games.

Dude, no. It's been two and a half years of mayhem and bullshit. I can only remember bits and pieces by having recurring npcs show up.
Like the Catholic Sect following the Warrior Summoner after her Persuasion roll explosion.
Or the fact that their go-to boat owner absolutely doesn't trust the Mentalist after he damn near killed everyone by teleporting a pirate ship out from under the pirates who owned(and the WarSum, who was fighting the pirates at the time) it to a MILE above where they were fighting, causing their ship to nearly capsize.
Or the realization that Essence Sheele can transform into one: Level 9 Dragons, which made a fight against a Demon Prince followed immediately by a fight with a Lord of Darkness an absolute cakewalk; and two: The Gurmah FUCKING Garus, the five-mile long, level THIRTEEN, Sandworm of "fuck the entire Azur Alliance's front battle lines by having the damned thing ROLL OVER."
And the WarSum's Totem Familiar Stoat that she got from Rafael, who is basically Kharn the Betrayer levels of omnicidal tendencies, and is decidedly the least Rafael-like creature to ever exist, as his go-to for dealing with most problems is RAGE followed by RIP AND TEAR YOUR GUTS!

>Solar would act faster than the quickened greater teleport with thunderclap rush attack.

"Thunderclap Rush Attack" does require the enemy to be nearby, but the OP didn't think of telling the starting location.

Why would it act faster? They both are basically Instant actions.

Even ignoring that, the wizard can still set up a contingency to teleport away when he would be injured.

>If it is a long term game where they get to prepare the solar cast demon of the third circle to Summon Ligier and order him to kill the wizard and the Hecatoncheire.

Ligier can't actually kill the Hecatoncheire, he isn't going to have the right power.
(Infact using ligier in a fight is kind of weird, since he isn't really defined at all.)

The wizard would be in a far away place and sending them to attack, and nearly no one in exalted has planar travel or teleportation.

If we are doing long term, the wizard could just swarm them with superpowered monsters.

Summoning a demon of the third circle requires it to happen on calibration, which is a once a year thing. Its' heavily timing dependant, and casting that spell takes a while.

>Garus, the five-mile long, level THIRTEEN, Sandworm of "fuck the entire Azur Alliance's front battle lines by having the damned thing ROLL OVER."
Ah yes. That monster is always fun to throw at your players when they start to feel like they are tough shit.

Forcecage. No save. Unbreakable Force. Then hammer until out of essence. Can't stunt much in a fucking 10x10 cage. The Solar will run out before you.

But if the Solar goes first, which he can by just deciding he wants to, you become wizardpaste(tm).

Far too many assumptions, to be honest.

The wizard relies on having specific contingency spells in place, but you always talk as if the wizard just happens to have several different contingency spells active at once, which;
1. Block any mind altering abilities from affecting him
2. Makes him teleport away on being harmed
3. Somehow negate what would amount to a several hundred bonus to a persuasion check, which has the ability to straight up mush the mind of a mortal (which a wizard is, like it or not).

Hey, I like wizards, and playing them is a ton of fun, but every time I see your kind go on this autistic ramble about how they can beat anyone, you always fall into the trap of making a million assumptions, and always assumed a wizard has the best possible spells and contingencies up and running, regardless of whether the wizard had any chance of expecting it to happen or not. A wizard is not omnipotent and all-seeing. Wizards are still my favourite, and from a pure fluff perspective, a wizard is far superior to a Solar exalt, because a Solar is inherently overpowered, meant to fuck over literal Gods. A wizard is a guy who learned to unravel the universe through hard study. I would always door for the Wizard, t from a sheer power perspective, a Solar exalt is always significantly more powerful, but because of his personal power, as well as his social influences. A wizard cant compete with that.

I also think people in these kinds of threads have a bad habit of wanting their favourite to be more ridiculous, as if that is somehow better. An Alpha level Psyker from 40k is ridiculously more powerful than a 20th level D&D wizard, but that is because of childish retardation on the part of the 40k writers. Being better than that is retarded and dumb. You are free to try arguing otherwise, but that is like arguing with your teacher for giving you a good grade, and demanding he lowers it by 3 ranks. You can do it, but it doesn't really make any sense.

You drop the force cage on the solar, and then the solar uses iron raptor technique to throw his sword through your face.

That's not how force cage works.

>Even ignoring that, the wizard can still set up a contingency to teleport away when he would be injured.
Actually, Solars have several options of making things straight up undodgeable. Being hit and then "dodging" using teleport/gate/whatever would be impossible. It wouldn't work until after taking the full force of the attack, which a wizard is extremely unlikely to survive.

I actually forgot about that.

The worst part is, that you cant even make a case for the wizard on the mechanical translations. Exalted have a multitude of ways of dodging, but in the end, any mechanic that lets you avoid an attack that should have hit you (IE he rolled the dice and beat your AC if we are talking DnD) is either parry (which doesn't apply to a wizard) or a dodge. Teleporting out of the way is a dodge. Gating out is a dodge.

Combine with auto-winning initiative, the wizard literally cannot win, if initiative is ever rolled between them. His only chance is never taking a fight with the Solar, which means he literally will never win a fight against the solar. Yeah, he can send a million minions after him, but a Solar is a social animal, and likely has armies not just of mortals, but greater beings as well.

It will at best be a stalemate, unless this essence 5 Solar is somehow retarded enough to walk into a trap the Wizard wizard has had time to prepare. And even then, the Solar likely has a slew of charms that lets him bullshit his way out of harm, and win anyway.