MTG Standard

I fucking hate when that happens....

I have some shit take almost three weeks to arrive in the mail.... and it's being sent from the same fucking country I live in :(
The postal system in Denmark is the fucking worst ever...

> playing
W/B Vamps
> hating
Shitty opening hands, people who play Temur Energy slowly.
> brewing
See above.

First things first. Never put Tezzs touch on ornithopter. In response to the spell I could shock the thopter or even just push it after touch has resolved. A 3 mana Artifact is the best thing to put it on imo

Never thought about it being shocked in response. It usually resolves and I can get it back in my hand when it does because of the touch.
Turn 3 5/5 flyer is pretty brutal, but I get wht you mean.

I'm playing UR enigma drake (miracle grow)

I don't want to play green cus of a childish resentment towards the colour itself (green gets all the best shit all the time)
I've recently added 4 dive down to the deck. Loving this card but it means I have to put negate in the sb right? I have enjoyed having 4 negates to keep my creatures well and tilt protected. I don't know what I'm asking really. Like what do I do against control if I don't have negate? Unless I get soul scar on T1 or T2 I'll never resolve a creature. Do we just lose game 1 and take game 2?

Dive down is awesome. It's the blue blossoming defense.
Don't know if I'd totally swap the negates out for it. Depends on what you want to protect yourself from

U/W Favorable Winds

Mind giving a list for your W/B vamps? I kind of want to build a token vamps and use Bishop of the bloodstained as a finisher (a drain theme with Bontu Monument/skymarch bloodletter) but am not too sure how good it'll be

The only list I have is massively untuned. The issue with Bishop of the Bloodstained is that we're in a format that is really good at either killing your shit or just plain outvaluing your board. I don't know what advice to give you as a result.

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/vampire-monument-1/

Trying to make mono black aggro work cause I'm hipster.

>playing
nothing, gave my brother my g/r pummeler shell
>hating
That the money I was supposed to finish my deck with went towards my new puppy
>brewing
Gruul dinosaurs with fling instead of samut. Kinda want to splash white for another cost reducer but that would require four attune and the deck is pretty tight as it is.

Sounds like it.

I really wanna try and make UR work
what do you guys think?
tappedout.net/mtg-deckpaste/17-10-17-Mks-deck-paste/

>Playing energy
>Complaining about approach bs shenanigans

Yes, I fucking hate approach
Even after sideboarding in a shit ton of anti control cards, I still don't ever draw a single fucking negate or anything like that...........
I really hate approach....

I'm working on the U/B metal deck so I can get off the band wagon

Woah, it's like staring down a hydra
Both decks are cancer, but energy is too perfect, and needs a counter that is non existant to energy itself.

Whatever man
Temur is at least fun to play because of the versatility. I just want to play something different.

>temur cancer hating on decks with class

disgusting

>Approach
>Class

Pick one

>control deck that struggled to climb from trash tier

the only people who bitch about control are retards who cant play around it, Ive fought through every kind of control deck there is and its the match up that separates worthwhile players from FNM memelords

look at what happened to modern when control stopped being strong, deaths shadow makes shit as cancer as eldrazis the format
thankfully controls getting better over there as well

Don't get me wrong, I love playing control decks myself and I'm happy seeing them come up.
I just hate approach. I'm cursed against that fucking deck...

What are the basics around playing around control?

t. FNM memelord

know the deck and know its limits

the best way to figure out the matchup is to play the deck its self, do it on cockatrice for a few games just for the knowledge

honestly out of all the UW control iterations Ive played against in standard approach is one of the most vulnerable, its board wipes are shit, its cantrips are shit, its big draw spells are lackluster compared to older stuff, its spot removal spells are some of the worst ive seen out of the archetype

>> playing
RW dorfs n vehicles
>> hating
Rhonas and Carnage Tyrant not being cheaper
>> brewing
Some sort of midrange Bogles meme based around Tyrant

depends on your deck, don't play shit into open mana unless you can overwhelm them.

This seems incredibly unhelpful, because most of the time 'overwhelm' just means you get wiped the turn after, and then you get 2/3 for 1'd.

This seems a little bit better as far as advice goes.

also the reason despite all those points against the deck approach of the second sun is one of the best wincons UW has ever had in standard that doesnt force a game to 100% draw out like theos-rtr control with its elixir of immortality wincon
and doesnt have to jump into another color to supplement the weak parts of the deck like innistrad-rtr control (murrican control being the strongest control will ever be allowed to be in standard)

also cant overcommit with attacks/boardstate when you know theres a wrath coming soon while still applying enough pressure so that they cant just ignore your boardstate and try to draw their wincon

Cards that make you want to kill yourself

if they're not dead by turn 5, your aggro deck is shit

UB doesn't run board wipes, if you're losing to UW at all your deck is terrible.

I made some changes to this one can anyone give me some tips on the brew?

sh-shut up!

approach is so strong a temur energy player is bitching about it

Playing mardu vehicles. Cant help it. Loved it at the last gp turin and I will push it through rotation

I fucking hate mono red

Brewing nothing since im pretty happy with my deck choice. Making a cube tho

>Playing
U/B Treasures. List below, still adjusting card numbers and no idea what to do with my sideboard yet. Also considering to maybe shift it over to full control, just need another Vraska for that since I pulled 2 Azcanta.

>Hating
Scarab God prices, Scarab God in general and only pulling 5 Mythics from about 60 Ixalan packs, 2 of which were Overwhelming Insight and one was Star of Extinction.

>Brewing
Trying to get my Mardu Reanimator deck going again. Ran it as Madcap Reanimator with Hulks, but not only do I die to Ramunap's speed now but also get shit all over by artifact and graveyard hate.

U/B Treasures list, feel free to critique:
4x Fatal Push
4x Contraband Kingpin
3x Dire Fleet Hoarder
4x Treasure Map
2x Bontu's Last Reckoning
3x Sailor of Means
3x Tezzeret the Schemer
2x Vraska's Contempt
1x Yahenni's Expertise
2x Revel in Riches
3x Spell Swindle
2x Marionette Master
1x Vraska, Relic Seeker
2x Herald of Anguish

4x Drowned Catacomb
4x Fetid Pools
2x Field of Ruin
4x Ifnir Deadlands
4x Island
6x Swamp

How is abzan tokens at FNM? I like it but I'm worried the games last too long.

use sanctum seeker as your finisher, 1 mana less and gives you back life which you need in this format (mono red being top tier)

Have you considered both decks are shit tier? Uninteractive goodstuffs vs Uninteractive stall, control is about well controlling your opponent until you can break them, second sun is just delay, delay, delay, free win con.

I dont think you should be using words you dont understand

I get that you wanna shit on archetypes but you shouldnt call them uninteractive because they arent, you might as well call them nazi decks if you wanna just make up bullshit

>uninteractive
A grindy stax deck is uninteractive. Control actually needs you to respond and answer shit as its happening. Hell, almost all control decks are more interactive than Timmy or Aggro decks that literally just consist of turning sideways at the right time.

What is that deck trying to do? Torment of Hailfire is a meme card.

I'm guessing fatal push is too expensive for you to want to use along with other cards like Hazoret.

One card I think you're missing is Ruin Raider, he's great in any aggro list and he's also a pirate to fit your theme. March of the Drowned is too slow to probably make a difference.

Well good thing boardwipe x10 then play an insta-win card isn't control right?
Almost like u/b, locus god and other decks are control because the goal is to CONTROL what your opponent does.
Approach doesn't give a fuck what their opponent does as long as they don't die before they cast sun.

These decks have completely different ways of winning almost like...they're different play styles?

How do I sell these Hazorets before the price drops?

>Approach counters the shit out of cards and nukes the board regularly to control whatever gets past their counterspells until they manage to drop Approach twice
>U/B uses counterspells and a metric assload of spot removal to keep anything their opponent brings out from staying out and recycles it with Scarab God eventually to grind out a win
Just because a control deck doesn't kill stuff with spot removal doesn't mean it's not a control deck. Counterspells and boardwipes are the epitome of control cards.

the guy is just trying to shit on approach because he doesnt like losing to control decks that play for value over 1 for 1s

Except it does matter. If I make a deck that looks to kill you by turn 4 but one method does it with haste creatures and the other does it with a one shot you wouldn't call those the same play style.
Winning a game early with high damage spells and aggression is the epitome of aggro so would you call both decks aggro?
Both decks look to extend the game but it is for completely different reasons.
Control extends a game as a matter of consequence, the game must be extended because my high value creatures are expensive therefor I must make it to a later turn.
Approach extends the game because they can cheat the board state, what you have or what you've done is irrelevant as long as they get one turn to cast their one shot win card.

Not caring about your opponents life, board state, mana, creatures or hand size is pretty different from the things control has to think about.

>Control extends a game as a matter of consequence, the game must be extended because my high value creatures are expensive therefor I must make it to a later turn.
>my high value creatures are expensive
>my high value creatures
>creatures
>control

oh boy I didnt realize this is the kind of retardation thats being argued, alright pack it up boys no need to feed the troll any more

How is a deck that would literally be unable to function if it wouldn't control the board not, per definition, a control deck? The wincon is absolutely irrelevant to that, both grind the game out for 40 minutes, one wins on the spot, the other slowly overwhelms the opponent after telling him "NO" for half an hour. U/X control decks of the past always were about slowing shit down to a halt and then eventually winning. A Scarab God deck also gives no fucks about the opponent's life total until they're eventually dead. There's no reason to care about it if your entire deck is supposed to buy you time and you can be sure you will get that extra time.

U/W Approach in its current form is a classic control deck in its colors in every sense of the word. An uninteractive deck would be the Approach Turbofog deck that was around for a few weeks during HOU and literally did not care what happened to the board since they had enough fogs.

It's still control, they literally "control" the game until it reaches end game where they want it.

Just because it's not le only counter spell control doesn't mean it isn't.

judging by the entire post he seems to think midrange is the only true form of control and if youre winning with a delay like approach, or mutavault, celestal colonnade, elspeth then it isnt control since its not "interactive" to not be playing anything you opponents are going to want to use their removal spells on

still I would consider scarab god control as I would a jund or abzan midrange deck for modern

What do you guys think about Crested Sunmare in Abzan tokens lists?

You think claim//fame might be better over March of the drowned?

but wait, turbofog is control?? It ran aoes and counters, those are the epitome of control cards so it is control and interactive.

unless of course that definition only applies sometimes.

Turbofog isn't reliant on wipes and counters to survive. Those things are literally the only way U/W is even able to live at all. Take away the ability to counter spells in a U/W control deck and it can not win anymore.

Just because you don't like your spells being countered doesn't make counterspells not control. By your logic, a mono-blue mill deck with half a million counters and an instant-win combo like Fraying Sanity/Startled Awake is also not a control deck because it controls by controlling what cards hit the battlefield.

Not for standard, it's good in Modern because it gets back an 8/8 or Snapcaster. More creatures is probably just better.

Also, Blue/Black is probably just the best color for pirates since you get Hostage Taker which is the best Pirate in standard ATM.

I know but this is what I have, I’m not trying to invest in standard. I just happened to have most of these cards.

Hostage taker is also a billion dollars.

So the definition of control is board wipes and counters? Why is U/B pirategod called midrange then? They maindeck board wipes and counters?
If this is all it takes to become a control deck then I think we need to redefine a lot of deck names that are out there.
Let's start by getting them to change the name of mono-b mill to mono-b fraying sanity control since nobody on the fucking planet calls it that.
Clearly they are not getting the memo here that it's really control.

the point is approach can be control if you wanna spin it that way I don't really give a fuck, it's uninteractive because believe it or not it doesn't interact with your opponent in any way to win, even mill has to care about 1 of your opponents resources (cards in deck) but approach is a free win so by it's very nature it does not need to worry about what you play as long as their life total is above 0.
Your resources do not matter, only theirs.

>playing UB
>your life total doesnt matter as long as its above 0
>your resources do not matter, only theirs

youre actually fucking retarded

the definition of control is to CONTROL what the enemy player is trying to do, whether thats by countering or removing all their shit 1 for 1 or wrathing away a ton of shit its still control as long as you establish control of the game

you literally dont understand the meaning of interaction nor control so you should stop acting as if you know jack shit about the fucking game when you cant even top 8 a god damn fnm due to your lack of game knowledge
theres a reason its called approach CONTROL you fucking moron

When the ENTIRE fucking gameplan of a deck is "Control EVERYTHING your opponent does to somehow prevent dying until casting my 7 mana spell twice" then it's obviously a fucking control deck, holy shit, how can anyone be this retarded?
What the fuck do you even define as "interacting" with your opponent? Control decks, like Approach, respond to almost every card or action their opponent does, because they'd die otherwise, and interact with all those cards, rarely ever leaving stuff on the side without getting it any attention. In addition, they care about the single most important resource in the entire game: their own fucking life total. A control deck doesn't aim to kill the opponent, their plan is to not get killed first. That's all there is to it and all they need to achieve.
Please, do list me a few "interactive" decks, control or not. Dealing damage to a player or milling their library without any input on their end is not interacting with the opponent, it's nothing more than a slugfest where each side just keeps taking turns kicking the other in the balls but never actually directly fight.

Storm fleet arsonist 3 of?

You can try, 5 mana is pretty high though.

The others guys pretty much covered it, but damn, this is one of the dumbest posts I've read on this board.

>Playing
Temur Prowess
>Hating
My LGS is closing down and I have to find a new hole to play card games in
>Brewing
Adding Ixalan cards to my cube, Trying to think of new EDH decks to build.

I would be playing 4 copies of Lightning Strike and Shock in a deck like this, you clearly need the reach to close games. Torment is fun but this is not really the deck for it. Sword Point Diplomacy might work in this deck if you wanna try some jank.

>Playing
G/B Reanimator

>Hating
The fact that 'explore' might not return in the upcoming expansions

>Brewing
G/B Reanimator. It's a fucking blast to play and I bet you'd get a kick out of it. tappedout.net/mtg-decks/re-energized-re-animated/

As we know, no control deck ever plays creatures.

UW definetly wasn't playing Serra Angel alongside Moat and Counterspell to win at the dawn of time. UW definetly wasn't slamdunking Torrential Gearhulks to rebuy Glimmer of Genius or Disallow just last standard.

What fucking game are you playing, dude?

It isn't exactly miracle grow without Deeproot Champion.

And why are you having a moral conundrum about a color that has nice things? Stop half assing yourself

So what's your opinion on Vance's Blasting Cannons?
I really like them so far. Put them as a 3-of in a UR spellslinger deck with Baral because Baral, Enigma Drake as a late game finisher and Azcanta because it's Azcanta and otherwise exclusively Instants/Sorceries to counter, kill and cantrip myself through the game.

The amount of card advantage Cannons give once they're flipped is far more impressive than I anticipated. In this meta, unless it's a Carnage Tyrant, you can basically kill everything in the game for 1 card + 4 mana, often even just using the Cannons' 3 damage. Love the card so far, definitely giving it a try in some other control decks, though flipping will be hard without Opt and Baral to make everything super cheap.

im playing UR cause I dont want to pay for 3 sets of dual color lands

I dont really run dive down tho nor mainboard negates, I guess I run more of a delver style tempo with censors and supreme will as counters and then a burn package

I pulled a foil in the first week of Ixalan and have been playing the one-of in the Sideboard of my Temur Miracle Grow deck. I have not flipped it yet, but when I have played it the card usually dug up the last couple cards I needed for lethal.

Can we free Copy Cat?

How do I sell all my commons and uncommons efficiently??

bring it to the store, sell it for 5 dollars.

literally just google "pulp paper buyers"

how do I buy poor condition cards on the cheap? I wanna get back into magic but I dont have a lot of money

I'll sell you playsets of commons and uncommons for $.10 each

>Playing
B/W servo treasures
>Hating
That I cant play my U/W embalm and eternalize deck now that I have taken it to a first place. Everyone is gonna show up with answers for my graveyard shenanigans.
>brewing
Treasure ramp with torment finisher

ya got censors, aether hub, supreme will, and glimmering genious?

>Death's Shadow

Just play burn

Temur battle rage is kind of their foil to this response, but you get the point

sick of not knowing what's in my opponent's deck. It would be like playing a game of league of legends, but you don't get to know who the other team's jungler is until you're getting ganked.

It doesn't break anything either. If you play a settle the wreckage and I had no fucking idea you had in in your deck, that wasn't a nice play. That was a stupid gongshow and you need to neck yourself. Knowing you have boardwipe doesn't even have to ruin it, imo it actually makes strategy deeper and more complicated. There will be more bluffing for example, and certainly less random horse shit.

You know what's IN their sideboard, but they don't have to announce what they sideboarded in.

This is how the game needs to be. Needs to be enforced at Standard Showdowns.

>Target opponent sacrifices a tapped land
Good going m8

I have censors :)

git gud, if you get fucked by secret tech you deserve the loss or rather they deserve the win for bringing something so unexpected the enemy player (who is presumably playing something decent or else they dont have the right to bitch about losses in the first place) didnt predict it and got creamed

lol

I legit didn't pull any of my sideboarded cards every time I played against approach.
And I shuffled that shit a million times.

Say what you want, but I fucking hate approach and that card has cursed me

Standard babies thinking ds has a bad burn match up. They just don't hit themselves and wait for burn to do the work.

You just sound like a bad player who jumped on the temur energy band wagon but is getting salty he doesn't get free wins. Learn to play your already cancerous deck and you'll be fine. If you were playing some random jank I'd understand the resentment for approach. But you're actually playing the best deck in the format and losing to some control jank.

I'm new to competitive playing, but I still stand by what I said.
Yeah I'm on the band wagon right now because I basically had all the cards for it when it starting gaining popularity in the meta and it's fun to play, but I'm building a different deck to get off it becuase I prefer artifact heavy decks.

It's not just with my temur deck I've lost to approach though. And yes, I had the proper sideboard options to combat control decks every time I went to FNM. I just never seem to fucking draw any of the anti control cards when I fucking play.
Call me a whiny bitch all you want, I don't care.

I'm kinda sad temur is the main band wagon though, because it's a fun deck to play, I just hate one deck taking off so much.
I don't think it's cancer. It's just got the versatility to go up against any deck in the format and people hate on it because it's popular.

You're new. So I'll give you benefit of the doubt. People hate on it because it is objectively too good for standard. It is just the best spells for cmc cost wth very little synergy. Has very few weaknesses and its resources can't even be attacked. It's not popular because it's fun and versatile. Because that's an opinion. It's popular because it's objectively the best deck in the format.

Stand by your opinion all you want. Approach isn't that hard to play around. It's also really easy to race. And you're most likely just a really bad player playing a really good deck.

Unless you have a a welsh of experience with this game what you think hardly matters. People who live and breathe this game have decided it's slightly cancerous. Therefore it is slightly cancerous.

Final point. If you are getting pissed at shitty control decks while playing the actual best deck in the format you're gonna have a very sad time when you brew your piece of shit artifact deck.

aw man that last part was mean cmon

Has there ever been a competitive standard deck that just forces people to discard all their cards? I pretty much only play limited, but i've been tooling around with a mono black deck that just denies opponent any cards and then slowly wins. But I've never played proper constructed, is this actually a viable idea?

yeah mono b discard is fine - finisher is like torment of hailfire or some shit. blue black version going around as well with a scarab god as alternate finisher. definitely viable just not top tier I guess.