/srg/ Shadowrun General - [AOL Startup Tone]

I started with 420e
M-maybe 6e will be the one!

What system is there even.

Everything else I've read, tried or heard about is either shit, a settingless system you just slap cyberpunk on or just semi-freeform.

>420e
... I feel like I missed out for never calling it that.

I hope so.
Interface Zero.
I have two groups, one using the Savage Worlds rules and one using the FATE rules. Both work great for the last six sessions of gameplay, and plus I’m not paying to both be ripped off AND insulted as a nice bonus.

>I have two groups, one using the Savage Worlds rules and one using the FATE rules.
So you have a setting that doesn’t even use it’s own ruleset? Come the fuck on.

SR5e uses it’s own custom-made ruleset. How’s that working out for you, user? You tired of reading poorly edited, worse-balanced rules that shove it’s own setting fluff up it’s ass and then shit it back out again onto a page and call it a “product” yet?
I’m sorry, but I’m an oldfag for Shadowrun and even I know when to just drop something. I gave it PLENTY of chances, and even games with groups that went RIGHT were full of disappointment on multiple levels these days. If you wanna bandy about the rules on here because you don’t play and can’t even find a group (and let’s face it; not a lot of folks want to deal with Shadowrun anymore) that’s perfectly fine though since at least it’s not supporting that god-awful bullshit of CGL.

I might come on here and ask questions for non-SR cyberpunk plot ideas though, you guys all have such awesome imaginations to bounce ideas off of.

Oh it's Savage Worlds, completely uninterested in the system then.

I gotcha. How’s your SR game going?

Fine, I run every week and just finished a three year campaign as a player.

Just don't buy CGL books and ignore the dumb shit and it's fine mate.

I’m sorry user. I do not dispariage your choices, but after three and a half editions of this shit I am fucking tired of it.
As GM I spend so much more time setting up the game that I do GMing it that I can’t even hold to the rational “never more then half the time” rule. And that is a rule I GOTTA stick too, because between work and real life I don’t have time to spend all that time looking up shit online.

>never more then half the time” rule.
what?

Honestly I do understand where you're coming from and why you've made the choices you've made.

It is a garbage system in a great setting. It just turns out that right now after months of searching and experimenting with those two different groups, I haven't found something that can replicate that feeling.

Honestly I've been hacking apart SR5 and rebuilding some parts of it for my players, but that's due to my game design background, doing this is fun to me so I understand why most GMs are pushed away by the rabid stupidity of CGL's lack of game design as a whole.

I think he’s talking about the “never spend more then half of the time planning the game as you do GMing the game” thing I’ve heard talked about.
It’s basically to prevent that thing where newer GM’s of various games burn themselves out too fast in addition to having their detailed plans ruined by player involvement.

>Honestly I've been hacking apart SR5 and rebuilding some parts of it for my players
I actually started to do that too, but as it ended up I just don’t have the time anymore. I barely even have time to play and GM with work and all, so I just can’t afford to waste time chop-shopping a system and keep re-adjusting it in mid play because I didn’t have time to rework another section of the rules that came up that session.

Does Interface Zero have rules for making a full-body cyborg, ala Ghost in the Shell?

What about shit like Personafixes, or Skillwires?

Shadowrun's a pretty shit system, but I keep coming back to it because most other systems I've come up against are way more limited in the type of gonzo cyberpunk shit I can pull. The main thing that would get me to jump ship would be a system offering access to things that Shadowrun falls short on.

Funny thing about those generic system adaptations, you're supposed to hack stuff onto it.

>you're supposed to hack stuff onto it
Interest immediately lost.

>I just can’t afford to waste time chop-shopping a system and keep re-adjusting it in mid play
This is pretty much why I wanted to look into Anarchy

And then I realized that was a steaming pile as well

You're already doing the same thing houseruling SR into a playable state.

>>I just can’t afford to waste time chop-shopping a system and keep re-adjusting it in mid play
>Funny thing about those generic system adaptations, you're supposed to hack stuff onto it.

That's why I hate playing universal systems, especially GURPS. I'd much rather adjust a complete system on occasion than I would try and bash together 12 different parts from a toolbox and have people tell me that's a feature.

Yeah, but he already knows SR. Why learn a whole new system if you're going to have to put as much effort into making it work as the system you're currently using?

I, too, would love to have a working system that can do Shadowrun stuff, but until I find that system it's more time-efficient to just homebrew SR extensively.

>Does Interface Zero have rules for making a full-body cyborg, ala Ghost in the Shell?
Yes.
>What about shit like Personafixes, or Skillwires?
Yes.

i0’s setting seems to be a “cyberpunk kitchen sink”. Psychics, androids, replicants, cyborgs, skillwires, all of that shit is there.
There’s also some really minor stuff that nonetheless slightly updated fluff bits that remove i0 from the “cyberpunk is about the 80’s” stereotype, such as the traditional world falling apart due to resource scarcity and ecological damage, and rather then many people being mindless Corporate drones (a way outdated stereotype even in the 90’s with the way computers kept simplifying shit), the setting effectively managed to create the building blocks post-scarcity world with nanofabricators and artificial being slave labor but the people who ran the world economy basically never bothered to change the way the economy worked so all you got was 80% of humanity surviving on basic government subsidies and the rich getting retarded rich.

Currently our group is a Human 2.0 (genetically improved human) hacker, a Hybrid (humans spliced with animal DNA, like Dark Angel or that one Batman Beyond episode) gangster who has bull DNA (we’ve noted that he’s basically an SR troll with the serial numbers removed), a full-body cyborg who is a toned-down MGS cyborg ninja (can still deflect bullets tho), and a soldier Simulacra (Replicant, basically) who for some reason is 3 years past his “expiration date” but hasn’t died and had to flee to earth to avoid notice.

>That's why I hate playing universal systems, especially GURPS. I'd much rather adjust a complete system on occasion than I would try and bash together 12 different parts from a toolbox and have people tell me that's a feature

Yeah, the setting-specific rules are literally in the core Interface Zero book.
You basically need to buy or steal offline one less book then you need to do to start playing D&D, so the work there at least is already finished.
I was hesitant about that myself but the basic rules are in Savage Worlds and the complete set of “setting rules” are in the other book so really I had to do nothing.

Mind you, I’m not trying to get you to jump ship. Just do watchu want user.

Not him, but what exactly kind of “races” are there in the setting, since it sounds like there are some?

There’s only five.
Humans (us), Androids (full-mechanically or artificial synthetic beings, think Dolls from Ghost in the Shell), Bioroids (living body, mechanical brain, lots of rich fucks “download” their minds into these to live forever and some countries use them as slave labor because they last longer and are more stable then Sims), Simulacra (Replicants from Blade Runner right down to the tragically limited lifespan, broken down into Labour, Luxury, and Soldier models), Cyborgs (full-body replacement cyborgs; anyone can get augmentations, but full-body borgs have a lot more ability to install them without their biological systems breaking down), Human 2.0 (humans with genetically “polished” and tailored genes, usually a sigh of wealthy parents, not actually superhuman but often near peak human performance in various areas), and Hybrids (people with spliced animal DNA for increase, most look almost entirely human but a few unlucky ones become Chimeras and develop actual animal features).

Agree to disagree. Shadowrun is largely playable, and where it isn't I'm removing, not adding, things. That takes a lot less effort than a system where I have to mother-may-I with every concept to get something mechanically approved by the GM.

For all the flak it gets, 5e mostly works fine, and where it doesn't work fine the solution is almost always something like 'ignore the Matrix rules whenever possible.'

So, thanks for the system suggestion, but unless it has a survival mechanical framework in place for making character concepts - and not a basic dice resolution mechanic and the vague suggestion to homebrew your own abilities - I'm not even remotely interested. Not for even one second.

That's seven.

He wasn’t .
I’m actually okay with folks sticking with SR because maybe one day they’ll work on fixing it in the distant future and polishing it with the care and love it deserves.
Real life has simply made it too time-consuming for me to spend much time fixing it myself (in addition to feeling burned by it a ton recently), especially when I have someone in the group who loves cyberpunk hacking and I can’t just say “no Matrix” that easily.

Miscount on my part.

>it has a survival mechanical framework in place for making character concepts
What the hell is a survival mechanical framework?

You'd think there'd be a crowd repository for creating a cohesive fix for 5e at this point.

>but unless it has a survival mechanical framework in place for making character concepts - and not a basic dice resolution mechanic and the vague suggestion to homebrew your own abilities
It does as it turns out, otherwise I would have bothered playing it six times.
That said, you should stick with SR if you’ve put so much effort into it so far.

Someone did make up a '5.5' version. The problem is that there's no universal agreement on what needs to be fixed; for example, people want clarity about what attribute you use to fire mounted weapons when jumped in, but will argue about whether it should be AGI or LOG until they are blue in the face.

It’s a side of effect of the rules being so...comprehensive (trying to find a polite way of saying “cluttered”); there’s just so much shit to look at that people will form lots and lots of different opinions on what they like and don’t like.
The more opinions there are, the more likely they are to come into conflict.

At this point i think it would be best for the IP to die, hand it to the germans because they actually give a fuck about it and dial that shit back to 2050 in a cathartic cleansing of umnoving parts of the fanbase and make basically 3.5e.

>but hasn’t died and had to flee to earth to avoid notice.
Are there like, other planets in Interface Zero.

Swype fucking up the word 'serviceable.'

I could go for this. There are a bunch of improvements from later editions, like cleaning up the whole "damage-staging" thing into something that isn't a pants-on-head clusterfuck, and letting people dynamically choose the force of their spells, but for the most part 3e is pretty darn solid.

Only the ones in our Solar System.
It’s been settled in a way reminiscent of The Expanse or Cowboy Bebop I suppose. There’s no active sign of aliens in the setting but there’s hints here and there that they might exist in the setting.

>Someone did make up a '5.5' version.
It sucks.

Yeah, 5 just got too much fuckiness for new writers to handle.
Kinda feel bad for those, just think about it.
Being a young and enthusiastic dude/dudett who gets the chance to work in the creative field and to bring your ideas to paper.
An then you are stuck with fucking CGL where you have to proof read something written by someone even less experienced and have to churn out books for basically no payment, just to cover for the fuck up your boss is/was.

>Kinda feel bad for those
These are the people who knew what CGL was and then worked there ANYWAY, well after word had gotten out about it’s shitty business practices.
It’s like voting for a town mayor who makes his campaign platform openly about buttfucking you and stealing your wallet and then getting mad when he buttfucks you steals your wallet.

Chums, I am looking into GMing SR as my first RPG yes I know it's a bad idea and while I've been reading over the CRB, I've been doing some basic resource gathering as well for things like mats, tokens, et cetera. My specific question is, has anyone tried out the Shadowplans maps out on drivethrurpg? Also, what other SR-friendly p&p goodies should I look into getting other than a couple hundred d6's?

3e had the best art

i don't remember now why i stopped playing 3e

>My specific question is, has anyone tried out the Shadowplans maps out on drivethrurpg?
No.

>Also, what other SR-friendly p&p goodies should I look into getting other than a couple hundred d6's?
Pens and notecards. Flash cards with specific information on them really help players remember how their specific spells or guns work.

>i don't remember now why i stopped playing 3e
Because its rules are worse than both 4e and 5e. Shadowrun's never had a good edition, mechanically speaking.

>Interface Zero.
Have a shareable copy on hand?

to be honest i don't think that the creative market is that well structured that even new poeple would know that CGL is a bag of dicks.
And it's not like CGL writes ads with "Write for us, we are those 800k embezzlement guys".
More likely they write those vauge ass bullshit with entry level job, great on protfolio, well known company.

But maybe i'm just bitter

2e is better than 3e mechanically. 3e tried some new stuff that didn't quite stick, and doubled down on bloat.

>tried some new stuff that didn't quite stick, and doubled down on bloat.
That's every edition

Almost all of CGL's current batch of writers are talentless bargain-basement Shadowrun fans so eager to finally make their homebrew/headcanon officially canon that they're willing to accept barely-getting-paid for their wordcount.

This is one I found earlier searching for free books online, but I’m using the slightly updated 2.0 book which I bought.
4shared.com/office/U5iiV3wR/savage_worlds_-_interface_zero.html?locale=en
Here’s the Savage Worlds ruleset that runs it m.mediafire.com/folder/h4cn63f1qvy7b/Savage_Worlds

Between those two books you have all you need, no extra Houseruling or constriction needed.
There’s also a FATE version, but lots of people don’t like FATE.

2e's still got that weird defaulting web, though.

Thanks for trying to cheer me up user.

I for once belive in the power of german engineering.

Honestly, as someone who is leaving SR for another system I genuinely might be inclined to wait around if I heard the Germans were going to handle everything from now on.

Sorry to give you hope, currently the germans are just fixing the most blatant fuck ups and adding sweet sweet german only splats.

I’m aware.
I was just saying that that’s about the only circumstance that might keep me waiting or excited about SR.

>but I’m using the slightly updated 2.0 book
I'm guessing that one hasn't hit the net yet? I'm not going to try to fine players for a less-than-up-to-date edition. I'll just wait for 2.0 to be available for pirating, if I even remember.

Is Germany really going to accept refugees from all over the Shadowrun community?

>Is Germany really going to accept refugees from all over

IZ2.0's been out and cleaned for ages.

What he said.
I just haven’t found a free pdf myself at the moment. Google it or something.

Trips have spoken.

>Google it or something.
Nah. I'm just barely interested enough to be spoon-fed a copy. Anything more than that is too much effort when I'm not thoroughly disgusted with Shadowrun.

So this is how people end up playing 3.X for 15 years.

Trips are always right and true.

Of course my fellow runners, we will stick it to the man, 3D print our stolen Rifle designs and bring the power back to where it belongs, the people.

This is exactly how, yes. As long as something still functions for you, you put forth the absolute bare minimum effort into learning/acquiring anything else. Hell, I only even switched to Shadowrun 5e after the 4e playerbase finally dried up a little while after Chrome Flesh finally dropped.

But being literate in multiple systems is nothing but good.

It's a mental burden when the playerbase dries up for 90% of them

>But being literate in multiple systems is nothing but good.
Sure, if you have infinite amounts of free time. But I could be doing literally anything else other than trying to track down a copy of a system I might never even get to play.

>being literate in a system with no players
>good or useful in any way
What a fucking waste of time.

Alright, /srg/. Let me pitch you my stupid idea.

>Shadowrun
>but instead of the Sixth Age starting in 2012
>it starts in 1812

>Shadowrun, but steampunk
You were right, it's pretty stupid.

Just play Iron Kingdoms if that gets your boner going.

Thus creating a Wild West fantasy setting where magic is even more OP because there is literally no way for mundanes to catch up, and no cool weapons or cybernetics. I was gonna say no megacorps as well, but I suppose you could do stuff with rail barons and other early industrialists, but Ghost knows how they work if the Natives get the power to not be raped.

If you want Weird West, play one of the several games that do it.

It would lose all of the emphasis on megacorps and a world moving too fast for the every-man to keep up with. You'd wind up with just a regular magical-historic setting.

Not a bad try, though. Keep being creative.

>a world moving too fast for the every-man to keep up with

That part would be preserved pretty easily, imo. Red Dead Redemption is the most recent example I can think of that people would know, but half the fiction about the 1800s is about how advancing industrialism and commercialism are sweeping away the lives people have lived for thousands of years, replacing them with concrete and iron and belching smokestacks. Everyone's life was in upheaval, and the result was a hotbed of revolution and counter-revolution.

It's an interesting setting, just terrible for Shadowrun.

I'll partly echo what's been said, but you could still make it work... if you pushed it forward a half-century, and kept a lot of the cyber but steampunk'd.

Corporations are replaced by robber barons, so there's significant familial ties but otherwise mostly unchanged.
Magic is pretty much unchanged.
Cyber is bulkier and steam-powered, but otherwise works fine.
The Matrix is pretty much gone. No real way to bring this one in.

It's not really Shadowrun, but it has some potential.

RDR is set in 1911

So a Weird West/Victorian Horror/Wuxia Boxer Rebellion sort of thing? Empire and excitement, where the protagonists are Awakened and non-protagonists are Mundane?

Sounds fun, but thoroughly un-Shadowrun.

You're right. I thought the game had a couple of timeskips in it, especially between when you went to Mexico and came back. Looks like it was just a very busy year.

My argument about literary tropes holds up, though.

>not using your understanding of other systems to better understand the pros and cons of your chosen ones
>not stealing ideas from them for use in other games
>not asking your current crop of players if they'd be open to a one-shot in this other system that you'd like to try out
Are you a dumb?

Not everyone's a NEET like you.

Not everyone chose a shitty job where you actually have to do something.

Almost being partywiped by a lone sniper has made me realized I need to look into sensors, tell me about them /srg/

Good news, Yekka: getting Wired Reflexes no longer causes Chummer to crash.

Bad news, Yekka: WR costs no money and no essence. Bonuses seem to apply correctly, though.

Neutral news, Yekka: I just ate a fajita.

Just to be clear, I can use Iaijutsu and Finishing Move as part of the same draw/attack, right? I want to go full anime.

A sensor is just a camera, microphone, ultrasound sensor, or the like. The most common types are as follows:

>Sensor Tag
An RFID tag with a sensor built into it. If you're not planning on doing anything fancy with the, they're a good way to slap a sticker on your gun's magazine and suddenly have 360 degree radar mapping.

>Sensor
A handheld device like a camcorder or the like, they're like a Sensor Tag but with almost definitely higher Ratings, letting you do fancy ECCM shit with it.

>Sensor Suite
If you have a car, you can have a Sensor Suite, which is like a Sensor but it can hold a handful of different sensor types. Turn your car into a spy post with camera, microphone, ultrasound, radar, and laser rangefinder.

How long do you think it takes to read a book?

I don't know omae. I'm 24/7 here and I still find the time to read on commute, when I'm taking a shit or before crashing.

It's dedication you lack.