/btg/ BattleTech General

Meh. Not a fan of the made-up faction that lasts for all of a decade or so. Could have just as easily done this in the FWL and had you fighting for the Anduriens or the Regulans or the Stewarts or whoever and gone that route. FWL deserves some love and it lets you really play Merc. Hell throw some contracts with or against the FWL involving the MoC, CC, and Lyrans too.

Fan-made but I like it.

This man had got it.

>tfw we could have had an entire generation of kids going "Andurien for Anduriens" and "Regulans gonna Regulan"

It's for the best. They'd have probably fucked it up anyway. Better they fuck up their OC Snowflake faction instead.

I'm not even Purple Burd I just see more logic in that route than what they are doing now. I do love me the Argo though; that shit needs to be canon and part of a Great Spess/Logistics Rework.

I know of a work where someone was getting back at an old Romanian female friend who had gone... gypsy crazy. The premise of the work was that a very intelligent gypsy "gypsied" the presidency and gave herself the title of Princess President of the United Stales. The entire work had fantasy and scifi elements and was off the walls.

It was one of the funniest damn things I have ever read in my entire life, and was upset he didn't finish it. I just imagine some gypsy princess taking some world in the periphery and just running things to comedic results.

Speaking of works, whatever happened to An Entry With A Bang? Did that ever get finished, or did drama killed it off?

A few questions, if anyone has the time.

Does anyone here have any fan made variants of the Arctic Cheetah, Shadow Cat, or Nova Cat?

Are all the Spirit Cats in the reborn Free Worlds League now? Are there any surviving Nova Cats outside of the Clan Protectorate? I haven't read the novels.

I'm not crazy when I think that the Mackie looks like a bigger Urbie am I?

Do any of you have better character sheets than the shitty one that's in A Time of War?

Few different things. First, the Spirit Cats are Nova Cats. They're just descended from the ones who defected to Stone back in the 3070's.

Their whole thing after the Blackout was trying to find a new homeworld because of a vision Raddick had. It's why they went marauding around. After the disaster at Wyatt, some of the Spirit Cats got sick of this and went to rejoin their kin in the Combine. The Drac Nova Cats killed them all when they showed up as they did to all Republic Nova Cats.

What was left of the Spirit Cats followed Raddick around until he took Marik. Here's one of the forgotten plot points though. Oriente intended to wipe them out as soon as they consolidated their gains in the Marik-Stewart and Atreus campaigns. This never happens for some reason, though you can see Jessica trying to grind them down in frontline ops.

As for the regular Drac Nova Cats, the Kurita line was all killed off in a coupe but Warlord Dieron uncovered the plot and also found the last true heir and prosecuted a war on the usurper Warlords. The Nova Cats joined her side as it was the true Kurita side. So when she got wiped out, they got wiped out. Even the fleeing civilians got spaced by the Bears because Bears are dicks.

So the only surviving Spirit Cats are on planet Marik. They have regular Republic Nova Cats there as well, and there are still bits of Republic Nova Cats scattered all around the RotS.

Yes you are. An Urbie is obviously the pair of pants off an Atlas.

You're either crazy or you've never seen the Imp.

>First, the Spirit Cats are Nova Cats.
I know man, same thing only different. I just differentiate them because they do.

>After the disaster at Wyatt, some of the Spirit Cats got sick of this and went to rejoin their kin in the Combine. The Drac Nova Cats killed them all when they showed up as they did to all Republic Nova Cats.
Why? That's insane.

>Even the fleeing civilians got spaced by the Bears because Bears are dicks.
That's a bit much. So 90% of the Cats are dead then?

>They have regular Republic Nova Cats there as well
Yeah they formed a couple provisional clusters under the Spirit Cats, right?

>and there are still bits of Republic Nova Cats scattered all around the RotS.
Are there any indications how many? Are they doing their own thing or is there an effort to reach the Clan Protectorate?

...

Drac Nova Cats saw the Republic Nova Cats as traitors, rightfully so.

>Are there any indications how many? Are they doing their own thing or is there an effort to reach the Clan Protectorate?
They're very integrated in the upper levels of government despite their small population. They're 1/6 of the sitting Paladins. So there's plenty in Prefecture X. It's the ones left outside the Wall who drifted to Marik.

>Drac Nova Cats saw the Republic Nova Cats as traitors, rightfully so.
Why? Didn't the Republic ones follow visions just as the Drac ones did? If so they wouldn't be "traitors" any more than the Drac ones are.

How would you feel about half your Clan sitting on their ass while the Bears tore apart your home in Dominion War 2, Leviathan Boogaloo? Even the Azami nutted up and sent troops to their bros. Republicats didn't do jack.

The main thing though goes back to Bulldog when the Nova Cats defected to the Star League based on the vision of their Khan and most being really leery about it but following along anyway. They were really fucking sick of it when their new Khan tried to do it a second time for Stone less than fifteen years later, and the Dracs had to force half of them to stay. So the ones who stayed were the ones that hated this blindly following vision nonsense. Funny that the ones called regular Nova Cats in the Combine were the most secularized and the Spirit Cats and their ilk were the ones most stereotypically Nova Cat.

I guess I'd feel like it's what my clan does. They turned their backs on the other clans after all, and lost at least three galaxies of troops and tens of thousands of civilians for it.
It is funny though that the "secular" ones got wiped the fuck out for getting involved in spheroid power plays. Should have stayed away from the goddamn Combine.

At least the Spirit Cats exist to guide the clan into the future. I mean they have the friendship of the Space Jews, they own planet Marik, and they're a province in the Free Worlds League (which is a lot better than being an "ally" of the Combine).

The secular ones getting wiped out comes off as so stupid for the Combine. You'd think they'd want clanner buddies, regardless of a civil war.

What you do in a situation like that is just have all their leaders executed and get newer more cooperative leaders installed.

>Does anyone here have any fan made variants of the Arctic Cheetah, Shadow Cat, or Nova Cat?

Aside from pic related there's not much ground to tread.

For the Nova Cat all you can really do is weapon swaps, like putting LPLs in place of the PPCs on the Prime or replacing the ER LLs with a pair of LPLs or PPCs. Pretty much everything else has been done.

I guess you could put an Ultra-20 and a pair of HMLs on the Shadow Cat though.

The Combine has always had short-sighted, excessive leaders.

And with the Black Dragon Society apparently permanently embedded in their government for eternity I'm sure there was a big push to get "payback" at Clanners, any Clanners.

Were any Cat factories captured intact?

Yeah you hit the nail on the head.

The Black Dragon society is invariably the problem behind any Draconic Combine plotline

>The secular ones getting wiped out comes off as so stupid for the Combine.

Why?

Literally all the Nova Cats have done since they moved in is cause trouble. Fight Combine regiments, trigger the Bears, fight the Combine some more, and then try for a coup.

Wiping them out is an entirely sensible reaction. The Nova Cats should have just moved wholesale to the Republic when it was born.

>Were any Cat factories captured intact?

CGL is averse to giving out hard information these days. Since fact-checking is hard it's easier for them to have things produced at the speed of plot and leave details as vague as possible. I wouldn't bank on it being cleared up any time soon, if ever.

They own 1/4 of Marik. Orient owns 1/2. They gifted 1/4 to the Space Jews for the reinforcements they needed to win the battle against the Silver Hawks and that left 1/4 for themselves. They're not really a proper province either. The Clan Protectorate is just a grouping of worlds that the Spirit Cats protect. They have no settlement rights or voting blocs based on that in Parliament.

So they're a Galaxy and change of Spirit Cats on a quarter of a world that the Captain General wants to annihilate but needs the Space Jews for Warships and likes keeping clan forces in her back pocket for the inevitable renewed fight with the Wolves. No way in hell will they let those furries keep Stewart and Kalidasa.

And you know, I rather like the Spirit Cats. Rikkard "I'm never taking a Bloodname until I make peace with my past" Nova Cat is actually a pretty cool guy. His duel with that cunt Alexi Triple Agent Holt was one of the best clan duels I've ever read. But clanners need to stay the fuck out of my FWL.

>Were any Cat factories captured intact?

The ones that produce the Wendigo and the Avalanche at least.

>BDS
total morons

>The 'Mech plummeted. Buffeted by the howling winds of its passage, it fell at terminal velocity through the gloomy skies of a rain-washed afternoon on the world of Alshain. Only five kilometers distant, the ground rushed upward to crush the falling machine. Cocooned in the cockpit in the 'Mech's head— fashioned in the likeness of the mythical demon for which it was named—Chu-sa Jennifer Kiyaga knew fear; a pulsing, throbbing sensation that suffused her being and threatened to block out every other sensory input.

>It wasn't the combat drop that frightened her. She had participated in a number of near-orbit drops in which her AKU-1X Akuma was jettisoned from a DropShip. The drop pod protected it through the fiery interface with a planet's atmosphere, allowing the 'Mech to descend safely on jump jets that were either integral to its design or had been attached to it for that purpose. The maneuver was dangerous, but she was confident in her ability to bring her 'Mech to the surface of Alshain without mishap. It was what she had seen in the last several hours that had evoked her dread.

>As commander of Second Battalion of the Fourteenth Alshain Avengers, she had waited for this moment with barely suppressed excitement for almost four straight weeks after leaving Courchevel. As they entered Ghost Bear territory—which she would never think of as the Ghost Bear Dominion—she knew that the exhaustive training given all the Avenger regiments would finally pay off. After ten long years, they would finally avenge the injustice of the Clan invasion and take back their homeworld. Knowing the terrible fight that was to come, but supremely confident of victory, Kiyaga—like all the Avenger warriors—had strained against the enforced inactivity of space travel, yearning to wreak havoc on the unsuspecting Ghost Bears.

>Then the cherished dream had been twisted into a nightmare. Knowing that the Ghost Bears would have WarShips guarding both the nadir and zenith jump points, the Avengers had used their intimate knowledge of the Alshain system to plot a pirate point. What would normally have been a transit time of nine days from jump point to planet was reduced to a scant two days from the pirate point. Having synchronized their arrivals, all the Avenger regiments should have arrived within hours of each other.

>The first shock occurred when the Eleventh Alshain Avengers did not arrive as scheduled at the rendezvous point. When three more hours passed without any word or sign of the regiment, the other three could no longer risk detection and began their high-speed run toward Alshain.

>With an aerospace fighter escort composed of a full regiment of some one hundred fighters and the inspiring sight of the Tatsumaki Class WarShip The Dragon's Last Tear, the three combined-arms regiments had pulled a punishing two gravities to make planetfall as quickly as possible.

>The invading Combine troops were surprised when the Ghost Bears did not respond to the attack with a batchall, the challenge of combat required by the Clan rules of warfare. Either the Ghost Bears had renounced the Clan way, which was unlikely, or Alshain was simply too important for such niceties. The doubts had begun.

>As they neared the planet, swarms of aerospace fighters pushed through the atmosphere to meet the incoming invaders in the deathlike silence of space. Following close behind were Clan DropShips, bringing more fighters and their own weapons to the fray. The Tatsumaki was unable to target ships as small as the aerospace fighters, but it made short work of the DropShips, which scattered like minnows before a whale.

>The second shock of the day appeared on the far horizon of Alshain. Cocooned in her 'Mech's drop pod, Kiyaga and all the other battalion commanders had been patched in to visual feeds of the attacking DropShips. Magnification brought a sight like nothing she had ever seen, and silence filled the commline for a full minute, broken only by distant explosions muffled by the DropShip's hull.

>Where before there had been no naval shipyard, one now floated above the world of Alshain. Massive in proportion, it was easily as large as the Combine's Wakazashi Enterprises shipyards at Chatham. It was not so much the size of the facility that struck dumb the invading fleet, but the ship berthed in the unpressurized repair facility that spanned the length of the shipyard.

>The open metal latticework of the facility looked like the rib cage of some monstrous mechanical beast, each rib thicker then the largest of the incoming aerospace fighters and some thicker than a DropShip. The Alshain warriors were given an unobstructed view of the largest WarShip the human race had ever constructed. There had been rumors and speculation about the Leviathan Class, of which only two were said to exist, but the WarShip stretched a mind-numbing one point six kilometers in length. Even more terrifying was its mass. The ISF had been unable to obtain complete reports except that the Leviathan was rumored to mass almost two million four hundred thousand tons. Now it was more than rumor, and the rumors were true.

>Staring at the behemoth, Kiyaga was stunned by the colossal technological edge and military advantages of such a vessel. The Tatsumaki, the pride of the Combine fleet, was insignificant beside such magnificence.

>What finally broke through the battalion commanders' stupor was the realization that massive sections of armor were absent all along the side that was visible, giving a glimpse into the cavernous interior. This ship would not be used against them. Why such a new vessel would need an extensive overhaul so soon Kiyaga couldn't even imagine.

>Then the view of the naval yards was suddenly blocked by another WarShip, this one much closer and moving at all speed toward the invading Combine ships. Turning toward it, The Dragon's Last Tear positioned itself between the approaching vessel and the Avenger DropShips.

>Watching her screen closely as the DropShip captain punched up the magnification on the approaching WarShip, Kiyaga's heart sank. Unlike the Leviathan, which no one in the Combine had seen until this moment, the approaching WarShip was known. The Nightlord Class was more than double the size of the Tatsumaki, and Kiyaga knew this fight could have only one outcome. She prayed that the Tatsumaki's valiant stand would buy the DropShips the final minutes they needed to begin the combat drop.

>The Fifteenth Alshain reached the drop zone first and began to jettison 'Mech drop pods as quickly as possible. Exactly three minutes later, Kiyaga's own Fourteenth began their drop. Completely cut off from the outside world for another handful of minutes, she was deaf, dumb, and blind, impotent to affect the unfolding battle.

>When her Akuma finally passed through the upper atmosphere, it emerged from the exploding drop pod into a scene from some infernal nightmare. All around, Clan fighters dove at the descending Alshain 'Mechs, destroying many still in their pods. Though the Avenger aerospace fighters were making a heroic attempt to hold the Clan OmniFighters at bay, her trained eye estimated that the Ghost Bears would have air superiority in less then an hour.

>The final shock was the thunderous and fiery entry of The Dragon's Last Tear into Alshain's atmosphere. She had known that the Tatsumaki was simply and completely outclassed in this clash of titans. But seeing the graceful ship plummet out of control into the atmosphere that began to tear it apart, she mourned the loss of it and the two hundred-forty warriors who had given their lives trying to take this planet back from the Ghost Bears.

>It hurt even more knowing that they had given their lives in vain. Kiyaga, only a fair MechWarrior at best, had been given her command and made executive officer of the Fourteenth Alshain Avengers because of her skill at high-level strategy. Several of her suggestions to the original plan of Operation Batsu had, in fact, been implemented.

>Now, as she fell through a sky filled with fire and death, she knew they had gravely underestimated the importance of Alshain to the Ghost Bears. With a shipyard like that and WarShip protection, she had no doubt that an entire Galaxy, possibly two, of elite Ghost Bear Mech Warriors awaited them.

>Together, all four Alshain regiments just might have plucked victory from the jaws of defeat. But with the unexplained absence of the Eleventh and half of the Eighth destroyed in their DropShips by the Nightlord before they could drop, there would be no victory this day.

>Still, she would fight and die like the samurai she was. If today brought her death, then she would take as many Ghost Bears with her as she could. She only hoped this defeat would not result in a disastrous reprisal against House Kurita.

Iunno. As a purple burd fan I'm fine with giving them some stuff if its a small province, and stays a province that doesn't get any more important than any others.

>Clearing her mind, Chu-sa Jennifer Kiyaga freed herself of all fear by composing a death haiku. In the cockpit of her Akuma, she spoke the words aloud as they came to her:

Blue-white cold engulfs
Dragon slumbers in twilight
Rouse, fury unbound.

>Then she smiled. Perhaps this day would be the start of a great awakening. Once the ultimate sacrifice by the Alshain Avengers became known, perhaps other warriors of the Combine would remember that it was the Dragon's destiny to rule the entire Inner Sphere.

>Yes, she would die like a samurai.

Fin.

Dracs, man.

I loved that manga, great story and lovable characters.
The only bad things is the promise of a sequel at the end that don't pan out, but you always want move of things you like, isn't it.

>total morons

What you have to remember is that the only value the Dracs really have to the game is being the Orcs to the Suns' PC Paladins.

Under Theodore they were threatening to actually get their shit together and be a legitimate rival to the Suns. They still had a *really* long way to go, but that was the path that was starting to be laid down.

They had to be neutered again so they *looked* threatening but were actually as dangerous as an toothless, incontinent chihuahua.

The Black Dragons are just what happened to the Sons of the Dragon Society, which is almost as old as the Combine itself. They didn't start fucking with the top too hard until Teddy betrayed them. It pissed them off so bad they went full samurai tard. By the DA, they're much more the old Sons of the Dragon again.

Besides, the Alshain Avengers are no dumber than the Goon assault on Mars or Case White.

Only 240 crew on a starship. Dafuq.

What was the Black Dragon Society thinking?

>Zane understood. Yoshio wanted to know how the Nova Cats had known about the Alshain Avengers' plan? He decided to tell the truth. "You will not accept the answer, but I will tell you anyway. Simply, it was the vision I had on Tengoku Mountain. Though it took me weeks to understand the strange images, I finally saw the meaning and realized that the Alshain Avengers would attack the Ghost Bears. And though it might cost me my life and has already claimed the lives of many of my Clansmen, we had to stop you."

>His voice echoed across the field of battle, but Yoshio did not answer.

>"Do you have any idea what you could have done, Yoshio? I have heard you speak of Clan Ghost Bear with respect. And yet, you take their reticence to expand their borders or involve themselves in the power struggles around them as a sign of weakness.

>"Do you not understand the nature of the Bear? For months he sleeps in hibernation, but do not dare disturb him. The Bear's anger is unforgiving once provoked. The Ghost Bears did poorly in the invasion, yet look at them now. Strong and whole where others have been broken and destroyed."

>"We know well the strength of Clan Ghost Bear!" Yoshio retorted angrily. "That is why we are just one of the regiments sent to take back our homeworld. We know what the Ghost Bear can do, but it does not matter. The cave they occupy was ours long before your Nicholas Kerensky was conceived! That is why we fought this night. We must return Combine worlds to Combine hands and cleanse ourselves of the Clans!"

>Zane sat speechless, too stunned to fully register the vulgar slur against The Founder. The death of almost the entire Dragoncat Cluster had been for naught. The Eleventh Alshain Avengers were just one of the regiments planning to attack the Ghost Bears. How could they be so blind? An attack on Alshain would rouse the sleeping bear, and there would be blood to pay.

>Ninyu paused again, as though ordering his thoughts. "There is strong evidence pointing to Black Dragon involvement. In fact, it now seems obvious that Tai-shu Uchida and a good portion of the Avengers were members of the Society. I am also certain that high-level, non-military aid was arranged. There is no other explanation for how four DCMS regiments could turn traitor and attack a foreign power without our knowledge."

>Theodore continued to gaze fixedly at his most trusted advisor as several scenarios occurred to him. "Duke Ricol," he said finally.

>"Hai."

>"You believe he has become a member of the Black Dragon Society?"

>"We both know his past. He only holds his current position as Duke of the Alshain District because he gave the Combine the Gray Death memory core to get it. Considering his aspirations of the past, it is highly like that he assumed a leadership position."

>"Is there evidence?" Theodore asked, knowing the answer. The Red Hunter had always been a careful one.

>"Iie, Tomo. Nothing that links him to any of this."

>"Then we must let him be for now."

Was Theodore fucking retarded? Takashi would have just had Ricol's head and been done with it.

Maybe, but they should be out by bumfuck places like Lurgatan or Watermael. Them having the DA capital of Marik-Stewart is just offensive.

Even the Dracs dumped the Cats out in Pesht which was so unpopulated, that Takashi was having people forcefully relocated there from Galedon to build up any kind of infrastructure in the 3020's.

>Besides, the Alshain Avengers are no dumber than the Goon assault on Mars or Case White.
Respectfully I disagree. I'd say three regiments with one warship trying to jump a couple galaxies supported by several warships and expecting a batchall is slightly more dumb.

The goons took five regiments and two warships to Terra and expected warships, nukes and eight regiments of WoBM on the ground.

The old League, House Marik and the old Marik province are all dead. What difference does it make now if some Clanners occupy part of a planet? The Marik pretenders obviously don't care enough to make them leave.

Yeah you have a point.

I'm just willing at this point to take any benefits.

I thought it was planned as a punitive raid and they expected one division (according to FM:U). Did some BattleCorps story retcon that?

>Besides, the Alshain Avengers are no dumber than the Goon assault on Mars or Case White.
The Dragoon attack was stupid but desperate since the Dragoons thought that they could take whatever troops were in the Terran system, and Case White was caused by ComStar being hopelessly compromised by the WoB ROM and believing they could take on the defenses around Terra. The former happened only because the DA material talked it up, really.

Have you even read the FWL Reunification series? Why Marik was so important? Why Captain Gmilf cucked her loving husband for Thadeus?

I won't spoil it for you, but your assumptions are wrong.

To be fair, the Tatsumaki is a small WS without a lot of guns. It's about a third the size of a Star Destroyer.

>What was the Black Dragon Society thinking?

"Things are going way too well for us! I mean, we're now the second-best military in the Sphere with a recovering economy and high level of access to Clan tech! Quick, do everything we can to fuck this up! We need to plummet back to being the fourth most powerful state with a shit economy and minimal access to any kind of advanced tech again!"

Making Ricol a Black Dragon was entirely retarded. He was Theodore before Theodore got fully fleshed out and was one of Theodore's closest supporters.

Problem was that almost none of the Dracs ever got real characterisations so all of the characters we knew about turned out to be Black Dragons since those are the only ones anyone gave a shit about.

The only BDS member who made sense was Kiyomori, since they'd laid the foundation for that as far back as FM: DC.

Yes, I have. And my points stand. If you'd like to cite anything to refute them, you're welcome to. Jessica Halas's marriage to Thaddeus and what transpired subsequently, as well as the lack of an attempt to rebuild any Marik province, reinforce my points. So what do you have?

Yep. So like we said. Black Dragons are the cancer that kills Draconis Combine plot writing.

First the entire speech on the importance of Marik in the first book, and how owning it is key to leveraging legitimacy for other provinces in the League, and how second prize denying it to everyone else by letting the clanners sit on it is an okay solution until the time comes to wipe the clanners out. Marik is second only to Atreus in world importance to a legitimate Marik reformed League. That and the tie to blood and name of Marik were critical to plans for the reformation of the League. Somewhat similar reasons the Capellans made such a big damn fuss over Liao in By Temptations and By War.

Second, how Oriente has never broken up any of their conquests. They just keep expanding and the only provinces that remain whole are the ones that surrendered after losing wars or formed an alliance. In regards to any current retardation in behavior, you can probably blame that on Nicol.

>Was Theodore fucking retarded?

Yes. He's the reason there's a Black Dragon Society in the first place. Even Takashi was all like "You should have killed me you weak fool!"

Fair enough points. I'll be interested to see what happens to the Clan Protectorate going forward.

Theodore is also the only reason that the Combine survived the War of 3039, much less the Clan Invasion.

At least according to the OOC statements in the SBs. Thanks to retcons and the authors generally being morons, they've made it look as though Theodore didn't do a damn thing, which in turn makes it appear both IC and OOC as though the BDS has a legitimate point and that Theodore was the real problem.

>They had to be neutered again so they *looked* threatening but were actually as dangerous as an toothless, incontinent chihuahua.

Good. Remember your place, Drac.

The Sons of the Dragon saw all that. They thought he did such a good job, they were going to make him Coordinator in 3039. Instead he foils the plot, and a load of his biggest supporters in the Society get purged. And had the rest like the head of the ISF turn on him. He had everything and he threw it all away. The last couple chapters of Heir to the Dragon are just painful to reread when you look at the historical implications.

What does /btg/ think of the Lao Hu?

It's a stupid-looking but solid 'Mech tainted by Xin Shit.

Impeded Right Front Quarter Vision/10

Too cool for school, and one of the few CCAF mechs I unreservedly love. It does need chicken legs like in MC2 though. And for this variant to exist.

Xin Sheng trash

>Cat factories
Tough question to answer for the reasons other anons have listed. What I can find:
Avon - Huntsman, Sphinx, Wendigo; TRO3145DC has the factory (the Wendigo part at least) partially destroyed during the civil war, with the the DC trialing off what was left to the Sea Foxes, who dismantled it for parts.

Coudoux - Arctic Cheetah, Morrigan; haven't found any Dark Age sources that talk about this one. The MUL, crapshoot that it is, has the Combine using Morrigans in the Dark Age, but not Cheetahs. Morrigan production was split between the Cats and the Combine, so they'd have some of those whether the factory survived or not. Wars of the Republic Era has a line saying the Cheetah went to both as well, but nothing more about it.

Irece - lots of things; completely destroyed during the 2nd Combine-Dominion War. Era Digest: Dark Age's entry on the Cave Lion says the industrial damage to the Nova Cat holdings is so bad they rely on pre-war materiel and salvage for 20 years, with the Combine unwilling to help them rebuild. The Foxes get them started again, some strings attached, with the Cave Lion in production by 3122. No mention I can find if they ever rebuild any of the other production lines.

So the answer appears to be "no, not much" then?

Capping this for the next time that guy who loves to rant about the Dracs having a metric crapton of Cave Lions and Sphinxes pouring out of perfect factories shows up.

>Heir to the Dragon
It makes me mad every time.

Rebuilding and expanding the DCMS is a good idea given the enemies of the Combine are teamed up and the furries will be here any minute. Let's not found any new training academies though. Let's get a bunch of knife wielding shakedown artists and diaper wearing croupiers and make them Mechwarriors because my drug pushing pimp BFF thinks it's a good idea. It'll be just like the FedCom RCTs that are peopled with military veterans, instructors and Nagelring grads.

It's a small wonder the Combine loses so much given the brilliant thinking that typifies their leadership.

Problem was that traditional training results in dumbass glory-hound warriors rather than soldiers.

Crims could at least think ahead bettr and work with each other better than typical Drac soldiers, which is pretty telling.

Okay, I'll grant you that Theodore's whole purpose was to fix the idiocy of Combine's design i.e. we're a "military" powerhouse who does not believe in ambushes, a battle drill so old it predates sticks and stones. A faction that prefers light mechs and stand up attacks on the enemies main concentration should rightly be a tinier Taurian Concordant. Their shtick as a faction is fail miserable at copying competent formations.

Good mech that is saddled with terrible looks and XINSHENGXINSHENGXINSHENG nonsense. It doesn't deserve the shit it gets because of that idiocy.

Dracs can think ahead just fine. It's the glory thing like you said. And shit, sometimes they pull it off. Remember that they would actually face Clanners in duels in the early invasion and win sometimes. Like that Sun Zhang kid that aced a Vulture in his Panther. Shame we don't see more of that. The Clanners really took the super warrior honor spirit stick from them when they showed up.

It should also be pointed out that the Dracs actually had Lyran syndrome before Takashi. Good lower troops and stagnant strategic fuckups. He started all the glory hound shit with the officers and warlords as a way of cracking the stagnation of the upper levels.

Big fucking mistake.

Eh prime I don't much like, it runs dry fast. Rest are pretty darn fun. I'd like to see a bit more energy based one, anyone want to cook one up?

Factional infighting is fine if you're the FWL, because you're on the ass end of nothing and your enemies mostly get screen time as the Suns' punching bags. The Sengoku Era is cool and all, but it wasn't one where foreigners were invading constantly. Jags should have fought Sandoval's DMM for control of Luthien.

Thunder upgrade in a different dress. They should have just pulled a JM6/JM7 and called it a day.

user, I... Look at this:

It's part of the fluff to fix the thunder.

Yea, I like and saw that I like the big gun energy but still feels not enough pew pew, like a twin HPPC or a brace of LLs or something... I can't say it would be good, but for some reason feels like there should be a not boat but, energy heavy version with one big gun.

Imagine if the clans had invaded on their original exit path through the Sphere
>You will never see Jimmy rally the boys on Tancredi IV because the outer marches are the only guys who care about their sections of the Outback
>You will never see old man Aaron and Takashi duke it out Waco/Wolf style at the gates of the Imperial City
>Last stands on Bad News and Galedon that make Radstaht look like a joke
>Halting the invasion just short of Benjamin and Robinson
>The Alshain boys and a coalition led by the Sorensons reintegrating Rasselhague to make up for the gut punch of losing most of the GMD
>Sandovals moving to take control of the Sarna March to make up for their similar losses and Hasek to integrate St Ives into the Capellan March and lock down that industry

>Dracs can think ahead just fine.

Not according to the fluff. Everything Takashi did played right into Hanse's hands, frex, and the DCMS was easy to maneuver into fighting the way both the Lyrans and Suns wanted them to.

Individually Dracs are supposed* to be the most skilled on average but that means nothing when a third are in Bugs, a third are in Dragons, a sixth are in Panthers, a sixth have something else, and everyone is so retarded they want to run screaming straight into the enemy's guns.

*Turns out the Suns have better pilots, because yeah.

It's not really a Lao Hu if you go full energy, and even that version is edging to not actually being a Lao Hu.

>Everything Takashi did played right into Hanse's hands

And the entire war apparatus was all "Takashi, you fucking moron. Quit fucking around with the Goons." to the point they wanted him assassinated so he would quit dragging down the country. It's why the ISF let that faggot Marcus sabotage his dropship back right after the war ended.

Yeah but the only time the Dracs were ever a threat before that was the 1st SW. After they lost their momentum and numbers it was nothing but ass whippings 24/7 for the next three SWs, the War of 3039, the Clan Invasion, and the Jihad.

It's also not like Theodore covered himself in glory with the 4th SW. At least not after the later novels and H: Wo3039 made it clear that every minor success he had was the Suns going "Ehh... we'll let them have this one. It'll make pushing their shit in later even more fun."

Honestly, all the dracs REALLY need to be a genuine threat in 3025 is a note saying that they have hardly any bugs, and use Jenners and Panthers instead. That's really it

Amen

The standard answer to the question, "How do you beat the Lyran Recon Regiment" is by raiding, looting, and exfiltrating the AO before their mechs are off the Overlord i.e. the one thing that would make sense for a fast bunch of lightweights & is in no way allowed by Drac bullshit-do.

They actually should have less bugs than everyone else. I don't know where that user is getting a third bugs from. The only one they even make is the locust and bugs have an insane turnover rate, to the point scout pilots were awarded their machine if they made it through a twenty year career and saw combat without losing it. Reminds me of the Fireball pilots that are usually on their fifth machine by the second combat tour.

>I don't know where that user is getting a third bugs from.

The TRs. Bugs account for a staggering proportion of all 'Mechs between them, even if they rarely get used in novels or tabletop because they're so boring.

Attrition rate on them is headcannon too. According to the fluff, salvage is common and soldiers fall back rather than risk destruction. Fights to the death are common on tabletop, not so much in the fluff.

Hopes on the new releases? Will it get new players into the game?

>Hopes on the new releases?
I hope it actually comes out. That's about all I can hope for at this point.

>Will it get new players into the game?
No, I don't think it will. The new box sets are maintenance, purely to keep the current fanbase happy.

The TR's say everyone has bugs, but I've never seen anything that says the Dracs are 30% bugs. They've got more lights than anyone else because of their huge preponderance of Panthers, built at three factories. But at 40% lights, if a third of total mechs are bugs, that shakes out to less than 7% Panthers and everything else, and that just don't add up. Feel free to give a reference though.

>Attrition rate on them is headcannon too.
Not for bugs. You're thinking of standard mechs. Bugs even when babied have the highest attrition rate of any other mech, both because of their vast commonality and their fragility. That quote about scouts is canon too. They're the only type of machine I know that a state does not actually expect to last longer than a lifetime in service. Even Shadowhawks and Dragons are expected to last at least a hundred years on average, despite combat.

I think if it manages to come out around the same time as the video game or be available on shelves when the game comes out, then yes. They'd be morons not to grab at that free publicity.

It might be closer to 20-25% but the basic point still stands. Bugs are *extremely* common according to the TRs, to the point that they occupy the majority of slots states are supposed to have for lights. People then try to hedge by saying the Bugs have to be in the hands of planetary nobles and militias or used in training because surprise sur fucking prise, the consistency of the fluff is borked on the issue, with supposedly massive numbers of bugs in the TRs that are unsupported by the depictions given elsewhere, especially novels and SPs.

All this aside, I would be extremely surprised if TPTB decided to write the Dracs as having large numbers of Jenners in place of Bugs, since Dracs or having nice things, pick one.

Bugs are super common. But Dracs have the least bugs of anyone. 10%, maybe. Probably more like 5%.

Massive numbers of Jenners in place of bugs is even more stupid as they're out of production until the 3050's. It's actually a pretty similar example to the Bugs in Combine space in that it's around and one of their more well known lights, but hasn't been made in forever and is pretty darn rare compared to something like a Panther.

Basically should be Panthers>>>Locusts>>Jenners>All other lights including oddball bugs, Stinger LAM's and imported Spiders

You know, I'm tolerably certain that we'd be having maybe a tenth as many of these dumb arguments if, thirty years back, FASA had actually had the various folks writing BT sourcebooks actually consulting each other for consistency's sake.
Let this be a lesson to all y'all AUfags, I guess