Poorfag edition

Men of taste.

I'm also torn between the main three. I would have considered Hydra if GW didn't drop the ball on the wording so that it never affects 1-model units, though.

First for the death guard!

Kronos artillery force of exocrines, tyrannofexen, dakkafexen, and hive guard supported by behemoth stealers and broodlords. We scare because we care.

No preorder is Nov-4 (IIRC) and full release is nov 11th.

Question: Have they released all the hive fleets rules?

It's in preview week.

"Hurr durr nids copied star craft"

That picture says a thousand lost worlds. Forge Worlds are one per 100 at least, around 10 are lost, therefore this is consistent with other lore. This is evidence for the "rift is dangerous but only assailed a small number of planets" theory, and 1000 worlds is 0.1% of the Imperium even if every single one of those thousand worlds was Imperial and/or inhabited, which is very unlikely by your own admission.

The entry describing the lost forge worlds is called"the great rift" and in fact it says that's the total number of dead FWs in the last century, so the Great Rift killed LESS THAN 10 if the other threats to the Imperium killed any at all.

You have offered no proof at all other than the dramatic art, which could just as easily show the clouds of comms-fucking warp static rather than the actual Rift m literally every lore entry and number so far supports my theory. You need some actual counterevidence now Carnac.

And planets have survived in "daemonic hellholes" before. Agripinaa, the planet from Dark Adeptus, Xana II, just off the top of my head.

My maths for the survival rate has been explained twice. If you can't be bothered to make the most basic read of my arguments then you've pretty much already lost this one.

Is it me, or do they need to rework the LR Executioner a bit? The fact both it and the Battle Cannon are using D6s makes it feel like a discount battle cannon, NOT an ancient design from the Dark Age of Technology. Maybe boost it's strength and damage values up by 1, then increase the cost to 30-odd points? Or maybe that would tread on the Demo Cannon too much?

Kraken because I love their color scheme.

The fuck model is that, it's rad as fuck but I'm confused...is it a carnifex?

Thanks.

Tyrant with fex head

Sounds fun, what are you planning to use for Kronos synapse and Behemoth deep striking?

This. Though they took 2 cannons and a single devourer.

Looks rad as fuck, so I'm basing my scheme off of that, but it's an abhorrently illegal loadout.

Seems intentional to me. The tactic favours swarms rather than big melee beasts, which is fine.

>Question: Have they released all the hive fleets rules?
warhammer-community.com/2017/10/31/codex-tyranids-preview-hive-fleet-adaptations-oct-31gw-homepage-post-2/

ANYWAY

Topic of discussion: do you guys think psychic offense should be a viable army build in 8th? Currently, the casting rules for matched play mean that the only power that can be spammed is Smite -- each army can only attempt other powers once per phase, let alone each caster. The only way for a single caster to have any meaningful solo psychic offense is to run Smite and other offensive powers, which are usually a) rare, b) hard to cast and c) worse than Smite. Or you can be Magnus and roll an 8+, but even he, the best caster in the game, does the bulk of his damage in melee.

So currently the only way to deal significant damage with psychic powers is to spam the cheapest psykers with full Smites that you can get. Funnily enough, the various units with gimped Smites (Astropaths, Warlocks, Horrors, GK in general, Aspiring Sorcerers and Wyrdvane Psykers) are all better served spending their time casting other powers if they're able to, which is funny since the various abilities are fluffed as enabling their psychic offense. In other words, the units that are fluffed as contributing by mind-blasting enemies are usually shit at it, and are best used for support powers. Zoanthropes get hit by this pretty bad -- with the upcoming Neurothrope change, there'll be zero incentive to ever run them.

And if the rumored CA changes are implemented (maximum of 3 Smites per turn), then psychic offense will be truly dead. And for armies like Grey Knights or Thousand Sons, which fluffwise should benefit from using psychic powers to blast their enemies, this kinda blows. Then again, any time Smite spam has been abusable (pre nerf Horrors, current Primaris Psykers, Malefic Lords) it has been used heavily in tournaments, as mortal wounds are just that good.

So what do you think? Should there be changes to allow single units to do significant amounts of psychic damage (allow multiple casts of the same power at increasing WC for instance)? Should psychic offense be axed wholesale?

Gorgon. Gimme that hyperadaptive hypertoxicity.

Kraken is the objectively best hive fleet for winning.

New thread who dis?

Jormugandr, my army is made up of snakey bois and warriors anyway even though I'm black and purple

>That picture says a thousand lost worlds. Forge Worlds are one per 100 at least, around 10 are lost, therefore this is consistent with other lore. This is evidence for the "rift is dangerous but only assailed a small number of planets" theory, and 1000 worlds is 0.1% of the Imperium even if every single one of those thousand worlds was Imperial and/or inhabited, which is very unlikely by your own admission.

Fuck sake what's with you and Forgeworlds. That's goal shifting of the worst kind.

And the Great Awakening has nothing to do with the Great Rift. And it happened upon 1000 Imperial worlds which had its psykers explode into daemons.

>You have offered no proof at all other than the dramatic art, which could just as easily show the clouds of comms-fucking warp static rather than the actual Rift m literally every lore entry and number so far supports my theory. You need some actual counterevidence now Carnac.

So goal shifting to Forgeworlds and then trying to say the stain is artistic thing. Stange you didn't say that about the Eye of Terror or the Maelstorm before.

>And planets have survived in "daemonic hellholes" before.

No, they didn't. Worlds inside the Eye of Terror are daemon fodder.

And your math is shit.

It affects like 5 or 6 units in the whole Codex, and still has a condition to do so, while almost all other adaptations affect everything or at most don't work on 3-4 units.

Deepstriking nothing, just a fun wall of 50 stealers with 2 Broodlord for maximum FUN.

Synapse is 2 malanthropes centered around the artillery beasts. Stealers deployed on the line, fex behind them with guard in cover. 2 nodes on each side of the field with a Malanthrope exocri e and tyrannofex apiece. Hoping that after points pricing drops it comes to 2500. Otherwise I'll need to drop some bugs.

I think Magnus needs to be nerfed, he is so fucking stupid right now, otherwise I'm fine with everything psyker related.

Thanks, I missed it when it first appeared.
>From Genestealers with extended carapaces claiming a 3+ save, to Exocrines with a 2+, this is the go-to Hive Fleet Adaptation for defensive players.

The return of 2+ saves?!?!?

No, the psychic phase should only be for supporting your proper units. Smite spam shouldn't exceed GK levels.

I welcome it. I'm running a kronos tyrant anti-psyker and I want to fly around nuking all of your dudes.

This image is 980 by 768 pixels. So has an area of 752640 pixels. The Great Rift is about 35675 pixels. So about 4.74% of the galaxy.
The milky way is low balled at about 100 billion stars, so Chaos swallowed conservatively 4.74 billion star systems. This is an underestimation though, since Chaos swallowed the galactic core, where the concentration of stars is greatest.

Will you still pretend this is a small feat?

Press F to pay respects to the Skellybros.

The problem is that it's an adaptation that ups the killing power in melee of units that you don't take for the killing power in melee.

The only units that are going to consistently benefit from it are Hormagant, Termagaunt , gargoyles and Genestealer.

Genestealer are already extremely killy, so you don't need it. Gargoyles and Terma aren't melee units, so while it can be useful a bunch of S3 hits aren't going to do much.

This leave Hormagaunt. Which again, are just a bunch of S3 hits, and you already reroll 1 with those.

Fuck off and leave it in the other thread.

>Deepstriking nothing, just a fun wall of 50 stealers with 2 Broodlord for maximum FUN.
If that's the case I would advise going with Kraken for sheer table-crossing speed instead of Behemoth for re-rolling the charges. Either that or Gorgon which mathematically gets the most wounds per attack with Stealers in the Broodlord aura.

Exactly!

That's my scientific friend.

So take those units and not other ones? It's idiot strong on models that have access to it, so I'm fine with it not affecting the bigger creatures.

Cover bonus gives +1 to saves, yes.

Starting a deathrattle army just for them now.

I believe that Psychic powers should be used to supplement some of an armies faults. So no i dont think that spamming powers should be viable. I think that you should have to use psychic powers to fill holes where you may be lacking.

>Genestealer are already extremely killy, so you don't need it
You don’t need extra killing power in a unit whose sole purpose is to kill the fuck out of shit while the rest of your army goes objective-hunting? Lol.

You haven't accounted for the vast swathes of empty space. The galaxy isn't just a literal nonstop sea of stars and the rift doesn't just swallow up pure stars, there's tons of empty space.

>It's idiot strong on models that have access to it
No it isn't. It's bad. Hormagaunts are the only things that get any sort of benefit from it and it still leaves them as garbage worth less than half of an Ork boy for the same points.

Leviathan seems pretty okay,
I'm going to enjoy the extra 6+ save for everything. I'm Currently running 90 guants of some type, a hive tyrant, a tervigon, zoanthropes, warriors, and 2x exocrine at 2000. Not an exact list but that's pretty much it.

Hadn't thought about kraken at all really. That movement boost really helps, behemoth has been my knee-jerk choice for stealers, having them blitz across the table only to flub their charge rolls, leaving them in the open to die.

They get more killing power out of the Broodlord buff and Gorgon tactics, and that actually helps your melee monsters too.

Rolled 2 (1d4)

Rolling for which Hive Fleet to start.

1: Behemoth
2: Kraken
3: Leviathan
4: Some other piece of shit hive Fleet

And now they get even morer.

You need survivability. The way that combat works this edition, you actually don't want to win your combat. You want to tie up as much as possible for as long as possible so your dudes can't get shot off the board.

With Kraken you can get consistently high advances, plus the stratagem lets them double the advance bonus, so you can end up with 20" of movement pretty regularly and still charge. I feel like that probably makes up for the charge re-rolls. Behemoth is really good if you're alpha striking out of reserve because you always have to be 9" away for that.

>You haven't accounted for the vast swathes of empty space.

Yes I have. I've taken the galaxy as a whole as presented by the galaxy map. The Rift covers about 5% of the whole galaxy. It has eaten a lot of empty space, as well as billion of star systems.

Rolled 3 (1d4)

When that units is already on the level of "everything I charge die?" Not really. What are you going to do? Make it more dead? Genestealer benefit a lot more from buff in other fields, like getting into combat (kraken, behemot) or resistance (jormundgar). And even if you want killiness, Gorgon is still better than Hydra.

Reposting because there seems to be more people on now, thanks again to those who replied earlier:
I want to convert my breachers into vespids but dont know what I should use to do so and I would like to avoid spending any dosh unless necessary. Any Ideas?

Winar winar chicken dinnar
That's the hive fleet I have already. GG Boiz.

Are Hormaguants and Termaguants trash?

You can't take Hydra and Gorgon at the same time, stupid. Hydra is literally worthless until they FAQ it to count all models in combat instead of counting on a unit-by-unit basis, then you can charge a bunch of gaunts in alongside your Haruspex/Carnis and get re-rolls on everything. That would make it viable.

I'm using Forge Worlds because we have concrete numbers for the casualties caused directly and indirectly by the Rift, and we also know roughly how many Forge Worlds there are in any given sector/number of planets. Hence we can get rough numbers by multiplying that up. Even if the 1000 worlds were all Imperial and did all get utterly destroyed all that would mean is the Rift proper has done statistically very little other than be a Warp Travel wall or miraculously missed any major Imperial systems due to the total casualties for the Admech being exactly what we'd expect statistically from the loss of a thousand worlds..

I had no need to say that about the EoT or the Maelstrom because there was actual evidence for their potency and I had no figures for their destruction anyway.
You haven't actually provided any counterexamples for my planets in the warp, or pointed out any flaws in my mathematical approximations, so telling me "you're wrong because I say so" means jack shit.

As for the artistic thing, if I showed you a map of early WW2 and there was a big arrow going west from Germany it does not literally mean the Germans formed millions of soldiers into a giant arrow and marched them west, nor would a scary glow around the world map on that picture mean the world is surrounded by a diffuse cloud of Wehrmacht. It is fairly obvious the Great Rift was mostly restricted to the Warp or it would have done far more damage.
Anyway, I need to sleep now.

And you didn't account for the fact that the Great Rift is continuously expending and consuming more worlds. The Great Rift posses the greatest threat to the galaxy because at any moment it can explosively expand and crumble the walls that keep the galaxy afloat from the Warp.

Now which faction has the power to end everything in a heartbeat? Chaos and then the Necrons. Tyranids? Not so much.

You are giving an equal distribution of stars to pixels when that's not how it works. The rift could literally swallow ZERO stars if you snake it enough but your generalized method would still yield the same amount of stars consumed.

See

It's settled. Go home, Tyranid scum and know you would never be this cool.

They will get shot off the board because the unit you almost killed will retreat from combat and the rest of his army will shoot the fuck out of you. This is if you didn’t multi-charge (which will cost you models) and even then it cannot multi-charge his whole army. And finally this is before all of the codexes are out - the new codexes for the remaining armies will give buffs to help them deal with tyranid swarms.

The idea of this rule is to help you mitigate the lack of survivability - your models do more damage, meaning you need less models to do the same overall damage. If you play smart and/or are lucky then you will get more models into combat than normal meaning you kill even more shit than you should.

>Are Hormaguants and Termaguants trash?
For killing things in melee, yes. Hormagaunts are basically Guardsmen. They're only saving grace is being fast and tying things up with bounding leap. They are for trapping stuff so it cannot shoot and nothing else, don't expect them to ever kill their weight in models unless you get lucky rolls. Hydra improves this by only slight margins, not enough to be worth losing adaptation benefits on everything else in your army. Hell even if Hydra made Hormagaunts re-roll all of their wounds too I don't think it would be worth it unless they got more attacks per model.

If Hydra had a great Stratagem to counteract the weak adaptation, it might still be worth taking - however the Stratagem was designed shittily so that it costs reinforcement points, unlike Tide of Traitors.

Unless it gets FAQ'd it isn't worth running ever.

What glue brand should I use for resin? "The Original Super Glue" largely failed to work on my Taurox conversion kit, and was actually still wet after 12 hours. I'm pissed off because I wanted to basecoat tonight and now I can't.

>Tyranids haven't even destroyed a single star system, just licked the slime from a few rocks
>Chaos has destroyed literally billions of star systems

Oh my.

You.. want to make them into vespids the units, or make the breachers look like vespids the species?

How do I hide an entire reply chain again? I'd dearly like never to read anything by Carnac ever again.

Zap-a-gap or loctite, use sparingly, it has to evaporate so if you blob it on it take longer.

we don't know that the hydra strat costs reinforcement points. Given the guard fiasco, I doubt it does.

>You are giving an equal distribution of stars to pixels when that's not how it works.

I said this. But I also said it underestimates Chaos' deed. Since the Great Rift runs through the wheel and specifically the galactic core, it has engulfed many more stars than it would have other wise done given an even distribution of stars in the galactic map.

Just hide each of his shitposts as they come up, that's what I'm doing.

Just learn to recognise his posting style and the times he’s usually on. It’s not difficult.

we've been over this carnac. Using your numbers, chaos has only destroyed 125, maximum.

Jormungandr. And I know how it works:

1. Does your bug have wings? If it does, it can't burrow.

2. Did your bug advance or charge? If it did, it isn't burrowed.

3. If it moved without advancing or charging, it is burrowed and automatically counts as being in cover

4. This doesn't stack with existing cover, but if your bug isn't burrowed then it can use existing cover instead if it qualifies

5. Stratagem allows for an infantry unit to be kept in reserve alongside a tunnel digger unit(Ravener or any type of Trygon) and deep strike next to it when it deep strikes

This means I can deploy Carnifexes with spore chimneys so enemies get -1 to hit shooting them, 2+ save vs shooting due to automatically getting cover, enhanced senses for +1 to hit shooting, and four assault 6 S6 devourers and wipe entire squads of infantry off the map while being almost impossible to kill with small arms. I can also pop up 3+/5++ genestealers next to 2+ save mawlocs. Sounds good to me.

>meaning you need less models to do the same overall damage

Except that rule explicitly require you to have lots of models to work?

And again, Gorgon does this better for Genestealer while also having a much better stratagem and buffing every other unit in your army. There is no contest.

>we don't know that the hydra strat costs reinforcement points. Given the guard fiasco, I doubt it does.
It creates a new unit, and works exactly like the Guard strat which they just FAQ'd to require reinforcement points.

If GW smartens up and does otherwise, then Hydra will be worth taking, otherwise it is hands down the worst Hive Fleet. Which is a shame because I love Hydra.

But he is on all the time.

Nah, 5% of the galaxy.
So about 5 billion star systems.

Veeky Forums X, Recursive Hiding
Rids you of the shitposter and anyone stupid enough to propagate his stupidity.
Just don't be surprised when a thread turns into 90 stubs and 4 memes.

dr guardsman im nid

Do something else while he is here.
Not much else you can do since he'll never take the hint.

Thanks, one more question if you don't mind. I noticed that the resin and plastic parts have white dust on them now, is that the result of a chemical reaction with the glue?

he's pretty dedicated, but he usually goes away for months at a time.

thousands of cubic light years is less than a thousandth of a percent of the galaxy carnac.

Yes but how many of those can support carbon-based lifeforms?

Leakers confirmed it's worded exactly like Guards. Also the codex are printed months in advance so there is no chance they changed anything about the Tyranid codex because of IG feedback.

Why the fuck is HF Kronos such a shit color scheme? It’s so fucking uninspired.

Then it doesn't cost reinforcement points until an faq. Though I haven't seen that confirmation.

5% of the galaxy entire would not be that many stars since that isn't how space works.

>I can also pop up 3+/5++ genestealers next to 2+ save mawlocs.
You were correct until this point - we aren't sure yet if the Jormungandr stratagem works with Mawlocs and logic dictates it won't be allowed. Furthermore those 3+ stealers stop being 3+ the second they charge and if they don't charge they are literally just dead weight as purely melee units.

Yes, it's like on cop shows, the cyanoacrylate vapours adhere to your greasy finger spots.

No, I'm saying it's a very pretty feat that was useful for Chaos as basically a warp highway and isolated a lot of worlds but only attacked a very few or spread the assaults extremely thinly as it's done a very small amount of permanent damage. The fact there's a big patch of "danger!" on the map does not mean that's instant death.

I'm not a nid player, I don't give a damn, I'm just wondering whether you've actually got any evidence, text or SOMETHING besides "look at the scary blob". I can find a map of radioactive fallout after an accident with loads of dangerous looking colourful blobs, doesn't mean everything under any one of them is instantly melted into black goop rather than just at an increased cancer risk or something. Literally every source points to the Great Rift being a diffuse warp storm that cuts off travel and some communications but leaves all planets other than the ones right at the heart physically intact. It could easily have put extra static into warp comms from 5 billion systems, but it only destroyed about 120, plus the misc. thousand from that Awakening thing.

Are you retarded? The Guard stratagem costed point even before the faq. It creates a new unit, which going by the rulebook require reinforcement points. The faq just confirmed this.

Today on Veeky Forums I learned about galactic mass and star distribution.
And also that Carnac is a retard who can't grasp Cosmic scale at all.