/5eg/ - Fifth Edition General

>I have a friend that swears up and down that Wizards are the worst spell castors until lvl 20
Why do you keep friends with the mentally handicapped?

>Wizards are the worst spell castors until lvl 20
What the actual fuck

Why do they think wizards are worse?
They probably don't understand how wizards work.

>but I can't help but feel skeptical
that's because you have a functioning brain.

>Wizards are the worst spell castors until lvl 20

thats exactly the problem with bladelocks. you can outdamage blast if you use gwm or sharpshooter and smite, but you give up a lot to do that. hexblade is a bit better because curse doubles your crit range which makes the smite very powerful.

Wizards are bad only when played by retards. Our loremaster uses his arcane might and reality altering powers to just lob fireballs and disintegration ray everywhere.
And of course dimension door if anything gets too close.

>our loremaster
>lore master wizard
>allowed

Oh wow, I'm silly. I just realized I accidentally read Branding Smite as part of the Celestial expanded spell list. So ya, my melee looks like it won't be that great.

That's a shame, I kind of wanted to do the Warlock equivalent of Deus Vulting, but I'm still committed to Celestial Warlock.

He wanted to be the strongest member of the team. I only allowed loremaster for him because I knew his real life INT score would balance his character, it's still banned for everyone else.

How do I roleplay a lawful good character? I just imagine myself as coming off as a goody two-shoes.

Started a new campaign as a Dwarf forge cleric obsessed with weaponsmithing and idk how to make him all that interesting. So far I've been going with the shtick that I give/make weapons to the poor and defenseless but that causes the artisans guild to hate me for losing them money and causing sudden armed uprisings, while I just thought I was trying to do the right thing.

>He wanted to be the strongest member of the team
That's a dumb wish. D&D is cooperative storytelling - it's not competitive.
If he's a retard it doesn't matter what he plays though. Unintelligent people don't play full casters well.

Lawful good is the 'goody-two-shoes' but neutral good is the 'generic good guy everybody's supposed to like'.
Goody-two-shoes aren't always likable people. They're like parents. They'll tell you off for not following tradition and being a rebel. They do it out of the good of their heart, but that doesn't mean you'll like them.

Giving weapons to everyone doesn't really sound very lawful, that sounds more neutral good or chaotic good if you want to go that way. Maybe you should stop thinking about your character concept as an alignment.

But in any case, make sure to give them flaws and quirks. That's all you really need to do.

>genie will grant the party one wish
>mystic player jumps in and wishes to eat the genie's ass

Should I let him?

I want to play a Paladin of Conquest, making a character like a Fire Emblem character like Walhart, and go True Neutral.

Why? Because the Emperor is the law. There will be none above, and none below him. He shall end all wars by conquering all beneath the sky, and reign supreme for as long as he lives.

Is identify worth getting at all?

Yes. Genie's ass is made of fire and smoke.
The mystic burns to death while literally eating the genie's ass.

Its essential if you're playing with SJWs. You'll use it several times per session.

Lawful Good? Think Roy from OoTS. He's, deep down a good guy and tries to follow the law as best as he can. That does not make him boring in the slightest. In fact, he's a sarcastic combat scarred son of a bitch who fights smart and well.

Being lawful and good does not make you stupid, nor a goody two shoes. Same way being Neutral Good doesn't make you dumb. Spider-Man is Neutral Good and he is one of the most interesting superheroes in terms of story telling and choices, so it's all up to how you execute it.

...

Depends on the DM and your class. Wizard? Yeah, you can have that chilling in your spellbook for the one adventure where you need to figure out what the fuck is up with that amulet. Sorcerer? Nopers.

Depends on how your DM runs the game. Obviously it's useful if they use the variant rules that don't let you identify magic items without the spell, but it can also be used to check any active enchantments or spells on a creature, which comes in handy identifying cursed/dominated individuals and people who are currently being scryed.
If you never run into that shit then it's pretty useless.

what

Every time I see that I'm triggered.

You have to go back

But why tho

That sounds more Lawful Neutral than True Neutral. Maybe Lawful Evil depending on how many innocent people you're willing to hurt.

I played Scout when it was UA and it was exactly what i wanted - i think it is my favorite archetype.
I am also looking forward playing Divine Soul some day.

>5e is designed that way. Having a character fire 12 shots from a crossbow (while reloading inbetween) is immersion breaking but its supported by the system

How can you fire 12 shots from crossbow in one turn?

Read it.

Anyone got any words of advice for Warlock building?

It is beneath a true conqueror to harm the weak and the defenseless. Warriors shall battle me, and be given a warrior's death, and those conquered shall unite under our banner.

(So, most likely Lawful Neutral. Don't see him being willing to trample many innocents, at least without a solid reason. If you kill everyone there's nothing left to conquer so what's the point? You want as many soldiers as possible to want to actively join you.)

Gygaxian prose, that's why.

Hexblade's very good, reccomended.

With action surge and crossbow expert, a level 20 fighter could shoot 9 time in one turn.

Not sure about 12 though.

I want to make a healbot without actually taking cleric because I don't want none of that baggage that comes with cleric. Should I go celestial warlock, divine soul or celestial2/divine soul3+?

Having full access to the cleric spell list sounds really gravy, but I'm in a party where everyone is terrified with more than one encounter per day, and they're all fucking martials. Even the rogue is a fucking martial. So I thought extra healing per short rest with warlock might help. But then again, sorc points cheese lets me spam off-combat healing for everyone.

Wat do?

Pick good spells and not shit spells.
Do not build around melee, and never go into melee voluntarily ever.

>Step 1: Take Eldritch Blast
>Step 2: Take Invocations that effect Eldritch Blast
>Step 3: Use Eldritch Blast

Shepherd druid.

druid's your jam buddy

Have you tried a 2-level paladin dip? That's enough deus vult and healing for everyone. Healing word as pact magic is pretty gucchi to stabilize anyone at range.

Divine Soul, definitely. Take Catnap and Prayer of Healing for 10 minute super rests. Your Fighter will love you.

If your DM doesn't allow autoidentification on short rests, it's practically essential if you have access to it.
Otherwise, it can be pretty useful to use in general as an alternative to detect magic. Detect magic is still better for that sort of thing (Finding magical traps and objects), though. Much better.

At-will false life is good at low levels to have a constant 4+spellcastmod temp HP that's also great for checking traps and doing stupid shit.
Repelling blast is good with a ranged party. You can keep enemies away. You can also blast enemies away from allies, or completely break grapples by moving enemies. It works even on massive enemies.
Agonizing blast is a must.
If you don't want to be an EB turret then hexblade exists but hexblade also still works with EB so good luck with that. Focus on EB unless you know what you're doing.
You better hope you get some short rests.

>The level 20 martial being better at martial stuff than any living person alive is immersion-breaking
But it's not immersion-breaking when the wizard wishes for an infinite clone army because they're a wizard, right?

Would it hurt to have 2 levels with warlock go to with it? 3 d6 healing dice at the range of 60 feet and two level1 spellslots to fuel my sorc points seems like a good deal. If I take warlock3 and book, that's two level2 spellslots and 3 cantrips, preferably from the cleric and druid lists.

I actually never looked up druid. Tiefliing druid sounds pretty cool though, even though I have no idea how the druid works mechanically.

It's a divine full caster. It works identically to cleric with spellcasting.

>But it's not immersion-breaking when the wizard wishes for an infinite clone army because they're a wizard, right?
No, it isn't.
I mean, in real world, we have crossbows and we know how fast you can reload it. If your martial somehow does something that shouldn't be possible, something is wrong. (And by "something is wrong" i mean it puts strain on my suspension of disbelief. He's a guy. Really good, but still subject to laws of reality.)
If wizard does something that should not be possible it is magic. It is, quite literally, his job.

I am not even trying to start the argument, i just want to show you that reasoning. And i am martial player.

You are retarded.

>You are retarded.
Is it because i am martial player, or is there more to it? Could you elaborate?

>Is it because i am martial player
>m-m-m-muh racists!
Pathetic

So prepared spells? I'll pass. Don't want that kind of bookeeping.

You can prepare more spells than sorcerers ever have known at any level. You can literally pick spells to prepare and never change them, and still have more options to choose from than sorcerer or warlock.

A level 20 character is by default no longer natural. A fighter is not bound by any conventional rules any longer.

He can attack a fuckload of times in 6 seconds, because he is THAT GOOD. A highly trained weapon master will watch him in sheer disbelief, as he pulls off a feat that seems physically impossible to accomplish.

Refer to the threat amd scale table for what a given charavter level is up against. At level 20, you have fought brings that threaten the planes, not even just your own shitty world. A normal, restricted by the laws of physics, martial would never be relevant in such a scenario.

You are actually an idiot, if you think a martial doing superhuman feats is "immersion breaking", but that same martial being even remotely a threat to a multiplanar being is A-Okay.

>. If your martial somehow does something that shouldn't be possible, something is wrong. (And by "something is wrong" i mean it puts strain on my suspension of disbelief. He's a guy. Really good, but still subject to laws of reality.)

FUCKING LORE WIZARDS

HOW THE FUCK DO YOU TURN WATERY SPHERE INTO A INTELLIGENCE SAVE

IT MAKES NO SENSE

>And i am martial player.
Because either
1. You are lying, and just trying to force the "shit on martials" meme that some faggots want to enforce, or
2. You have no idea of how game balance work, nor any idea of what scale a level 20 character is (AKA; Read the book black man)
3. You have been brainwashed to such an extent, that you actually think martial being shit and wizards being OP in comparison is OK.

You are retarded no matter which of these options you choose.

Why you would ever use that archetype or play with anyone who would allow it is beyond me.

They dont unless they give me a good explanation for it.

I allow UA as long as my players can justify why, and actually put fluff and flavour into how it works. They stopped playing Lore Wizards because they could never cone up with solid reasons for it. Not even because I denied the reasons they gave me, but often because they just straight up had none, or at least never presented one to me.

It's a cool feature, but you have to give me *something* to work with here.

Ok thanks for the tips.

Prepared spells aren't that much maintenance at all. Since you can switch them out on a rest, you don't have to think about spell choice anywhere near as hard as, say, a sorcerer. If you really want minimal maintenance, just pretend you're a sorcerer and never actually change your prepared spells.

Which giant lord do I not make my players struggle through?

What?

>level 4 half orc battlemaster
>deal 58 damage in a single turn unaided

FEELS GOOD

How would you fluff your Path of the Zealot Paladin?

I am thinking of something like when Roland went batshit insane in the chansons de geste, but was still a kickass badass mofo. Thoughts?

>Make an AT Rogue
>Pick Ritual Caster for fluff reasons, and for some ritual utility since we dont have any wizards.
>GM is letting me copy ALL wizard spells and cast them as rituals
>ALL OF THEM.
I... I feel like I have to be very thankful for this gift, and should probably be VERY careful what I use it for, or I will very quickly lose this insanely good perk.

What non-ritual spells, especially lower level ones, would be made instantly better as a ritual, without being obnoxious and likely to make my GM angry?

>Path of the Zealot Paladin
??????

I guess i just prefer lower level games, where fighters are strong, but not unbelievably so and wizards, while powerful, need to save their spells and be careful not to get shanked by goblins.
My original point was mostly made mostly to explain point of view - i am in no mood to argue about it.

>Loremaster Wizard
I just read it over again. I didn't remember it this being this bad. I'd imagine it'd be pretty fun in a solo campaign since you're already God.

Approximately speaking, what class/level would a 40K Space Marine be? Or do they transcend such narrow archetypes?

Guy you responded to here

I think it's unreasonable to get into the game with the mindset that martials should be mundane in what they do. If martials must always stick to the mundane, they will always be out-done by wizards unless you give casters unholy limitations on their powers.
D&D is a power fantasy, and high levels should be very anime-like or wuxia or whatever the shit.

If we made martials as mundane as possible, fighter wouldn't even have action surge, and then what would fighter be? 'I gimped myself on purpose for a challenge'?

It's all fine and all but the reason people might get angry at you for this mentality is because if you were a DM, you'd be the sort of person who would say 'No, expert ranger, you cannot shoot that fly out of the air' when the enemy druid turns into a fly and buzzes away.

I can understand that there's nothing on fighter that says 'Action surge is magical' or anything though and it doesn't quite explain how the power works, but magic isn't well explained either. You're supposed to fill in the fluff gap instead.
Maybe he fires multiple projectiles at once? Maybe you can use multiple weapons at once? Maybe you use a bolt that splits into three? Maybe you're just that fast at reloading? Maybe you have some sort of repeating crossbow? In any case, you should fluff it depending on how you feel is appropriate, just be careful not to rain on the parade of martials too much if you do DM.

He's letting you cast non-ritual spells as rituals? What the actual fuck?

Barbarian my bad lmao, how do you fluff a Zealot Barbarian

>GM is letting me copy ALL wizard spells and cast them as rituals
There's no way in hell you didn't mishear him. No one is that stupid.

Without being obnoxious? Little ones, like Ice spike or Levitation. But if you want to be a bastard wait until you get Animate Dead, because oh BABY is he gonna be pissed

>Path of the Zealot Paladin

You mean barbarian? But to answer your question, doomguy.

They made theurge, got feedback for theurge, and then afterwards released lore master.
Mull that over.

Duh, which lord (of giant size) shouldn’t he send his party to struggle through?

Nani the fuck
The DM had better have a good reason like 'Everybody gets some unique perk to make themselves feel more distinct'
Otherwise
Just what the fuck
Mage armour, false life, longstrider, disguise self... Anything that has a long duration should be good.
>Casting wish as a ritual

My Half-Orc Zealot is just a typical Gruumsh worshipper.

Any ideas for a Celestial Pact of Chain familiar? I was going to use a dove, but is there anything that's a bit flashier maybe?

>how do you fluff a Zealot Barbarian

youtu.be/bEfCCLBkkf8

Yeah he doesn't know what he's talking about. Not as long a sorcerers exist.

Force the Loremaster to explain everything he does, and how it works. STR save Fireball instead of Dex? Sure, why is it now targeting Str? If he cant think of any good reasons, too bad, it stays as dex.

Also has to have this shit prepared, we are not going to wait at the table for some autistic wizardcuck to stammer out some poorly thought out reason for the new damage type or save target.

>Raise every enemy you encounter as a ritual
>Keep them all maintained as a ritual
>Have them raid villages and bring the dead populace to you
>Ritual up in that bitch
>Keep going until the local warlord hears of your shenanigans and sends his men to stop you
>At this point you have an army of thousands, all your waking hours are spent ritually maintaining the dead on a zombie-powered conveyor belt
>Can't stop or they'll all go feral and eat you
>Knights BTFO by sheer weight of numbers
>The zombies spread out in search of new prey
>Entire realm becomes a zombie and hive as they search for more corpses to zombiefy
Nice

>Casting wish as a ritual
good luck finding 9th level scroll

If I ever had the chance to play as one, all I'd really do is just blast things really. Big lightning balls and lightning rays sounds fun.

It only takes a year and 250000 gold to make. It's fine.

My fire ball is shaped like an ogre that challenges them all to an arm wrestle. If he wins he explodes otherwise they just get hurt from touching a ogre made of fire.

Peacock

I'd refuse to play one because an archetype that literally tramples over every other role by allowing you to do everything better than them is jarringly antithetical to a cooperative game.

Fireball takes the form of a meteor that tries to bowl enemies over. Strength save to avoid this similar to effects that involve trampling.

...

Are you fucking serious? You can't be this retarded, you just can't.

>It's like Shiva and Shrek had a baby