Pathfinder General /pfg/

>encourages bringing in the most uber-min-maxed combat monsters possible
Not to mention Pathfinder PvP is terrible in its premise, optimized or not

The 'villian' in this situation has zero control over what comes forth. Their job is using a few abilities granted, as well as their own abilities, to sabotage the party over the course of the game- while being heavily discouraged to directly fight the party.

Being exposed as who/what they are should otherwise be the equivalent of "losing". From that point the story would continue with them either converted to the 'good' side, or dead. (Or both?)

Can you please use that idea for a system that supports it properly instead of Pathfinder?

I'm using pathfinder because I have no reason to think it can't properly support the idea with the right tools, and doubt any other system would be any more "suitable" for something like this anyways.

"A player is a villain" games have been done before and can work well. I just want to see how to do the "hidden villain" aspect.

Slow night it seems.

Tell me, /pfg/, when was the last time you played a class or a build that /pfg/ has lambasted and thought "huh, this ain't so bad because I am not competing with my party on who can be the main character of this primarily cooperative game system"?

A Swashbuckler/PhytoKineticist/Vow of Poverty Monk tristalt.

He was somehow one of the most effective characters in a party made up of initiators and spheres users, and honestly probably one of my favorite characters to play while the game was still running.

Unchained Rogue using poisons

zen archer monk/ merfolk with 5ft base land speed. damn he was so much fun, and he was the only one in the party with any common sense. our forever gm had a great concept too. we all based on magic cards of our choice, and were lackeys for a plansewalker who had made a machine to transport people to and from his demiplane. If I remember correctly I was his personal chief.

Currently recruiting games:

app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/93553/a-wizard-tower
app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/93719/welcome-to-north-high
app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/94913/pointy-hats-or-gods-blessing-on-this-wonderful-tower

Is 29 hit points at level 3 decent for an Oracle?

I'm curious whether you built especially well or the rest of the party built especially average.

Sounds like the former if you intentionally chose that.

That’s pretty good.

strawpoll.com/r6h249eb

Reposting before I cry myself to sleep. When SoM errata comes out, which class should get a guide? I'm already mostly through with Conscript and Sentinel and am going to add more to them before re-releasing them when the Errata hits

Honestly, it just turned out to be complete random happenstance in how the DM ran the encounters and how quickly we were leveling. Trapped doors made of wood? At-will warp wood. Fighting a swarm? Just happened to level up and get an AoE ability. Walls filled with a substance that causes disease? Happen to level up and get immunity to diseases.

That character had literally no reason to live beyond the first session, but he was the only one who survived the entire thing.

I guess you could say he lived a Charmed Life.

out with ye, heathen

Some way to make scholar not a completely useless piece of shit

Vote in the poll.

It looks like Striker and Technician are the ones anons want a guide to the most

As a GM I got a two day notice that the whole party was unexpectedly available this weekend, but I am not actually prepared

What do I do; work through the night to get something ready, suggest an alternative game night, grab a level 4 AP and re-flavor it?

>work through the night to get something ready
This one. Do the work you ought to have finished earlier and learn from the experience.

Sorry this took so long. Updated paste: pastebin.com/LbntBvNH

Cracked Crown Strike (Combat)
You have learned to open your opponent's defenses with supreme skill and act with immeasurable swiftness.
Prerequisites: Two Riven Hourglass maneuvers known, two Scarlet Throne maneuvers known.
Benefit: Whenever you use a Riven Hourglass counter to successfully negate an opponent's attack while maintaining a Scarlet Throne stance, you can make an attack of opportunity against that foe.

What's the cheapest way to grab immunity to fear? Even just temporarily?

Ring of the Sublime. 2000 GP, constant Remove Fear.

What wondrous items would you recommend for an assassin/bounty hunter?

What do you consider mid-lvl?

5-10

Dang. That's what I thought, but I don't have Forge Ring and for the time being all the magic item shops have closed.

>doubt any other system would be any more "suitable" for something like this anyways.
Just play Paranoia, faggot.

How do I force a low nobility half-elf evil banker who acts as a loan shark and a mafioso to join the party and become a PC?

I just started a campaign with a combat Druid again (Goliath this time). How he fuck did they think Shifter was even passable design? I have a goddamn dinosaur that I can make large sized spontaneously, why is full BAB and a d10 hit die considered so precious to all D&D designers?

>Is a quest giver/supplier and wants to oversee his investment

>Wants something or someone the party has

>Got run out of town and needs to seek his fortunes elsewhere

Ring of the Sublime is just +4 morale against fear.

Our Wizard sucks (halfling wizard with a wasted lvl in druid). Give me ideas to make a better wizard/caster.

Instructor Wizard.

Golemancer.

archivesofnethys.com/MagicRingsDisplay.aspx?FinalName=Ring of the Sublime

d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/remove-fear/

"If the subject is under the influence of a fear effect when receiving the spell, that effect is suppressed for the duration of the spell."

You are constantly receiving the spell, therefore any effect is suppressed.

No, you receive the spell when you put the ring on. The DURATION of the spell is constant.

Pathfinder is so stupid

No.

What you're describing is a spell with a duration of "permanent" which is different than a spell with the duration of "constant" in exactly the way I described.

>3.5

>What you're describing is a spell with a duration of "permanent" which is different than a spell with the duration of "constant" in exactly the way I described.
There are no spells with the duration of "constant". There are only magic items that grant a spell's effect constantly as long as the magic item is worn, effectively making the spell permanent until the item in question is removed.

Not the point. Remove fear only suppresses spells already in effect. New fear effects hitting are not suppressed unless the person takes off the ring and puts it back on.
It only provides a +4 to new fear effects, not immunity.

You get to suppress the fear effect only if you take off the ring and put it back on.

I want some advice on building this investigator. What is the best method/site of "filling" a sheet out and posting here?

Do you abuse cover and concealment?

How useful is improved initiative for a Slayer. Are there other ways to boost it?

My report on the voyager () continues. Today's session was shorter at a mere five hours long, but we did go through a single battle. Our characters were expecting a fight with a pair of archers in the outdoor section of an 85-by-85-foot floating island ( i.pinimg.com/originals/60/a9/83/60a983b06910fcfc032c94ff6515aec4.jpg ). They already had a Inertial Armor up at 7 points for +7 AC. Through the psionic power-sharing mechanic, they further buffed up with Defensive Precognition at 7 points for +3 AC, Skate, Concealing Amorpha, and, for the melee non-firearm voyager, Offensive Precognition at 7 points for +3 attack.

Unfortunately, the two archers turned out to be a pair of zuishin kami ( d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/kami/kami-zuishin ). These were variants that used constant Mage Armor rather than breastplates for the same AC, treated all intruders to the area as evil for the purposes of Detect Evil and Holy weapons, could not re-merge with their ward while they were still in combat with conscious enemies, and had Symbol of Mercy as a bonus feat. They also had land speeds rather than fly speeds, which, I suppose, effectively made them more CR 9-ish.

The variant zuishin appeared atop the cottage's roof and opened up with a surprise round. They had See Invisibility and could thus see the voyagers' Inertial Armor, which the zuishin promptly dispelled. Even worse, once the PCs identified the zuishin with Knowledge (planes), it became clear that Improved Precise Shot would completely obviate the miss chances from Concealing Amorpha and the pause parallel action. Things were looking grim for the voyagers as usual! It is such a shame that the voyagers opted against Deflect Arrows as a bonus feat (though I suppose I may let them swap to it after this battle).

What direction are you going for with your Slayer? Archer? TWF?

Fortunately, the 7th-level characters' extreme mobility options promptly got them up on the roof, which is where the rest of the battle took place. The voyagers did not have to worry about attacks of opportunity while the two zuishin had their bows out, so the voyagers were free to move around with impunity.

The PCs both used power channel to manifest 1-point Inertial Armor. The melee voyager liked to activate accomplished accomplice to add +3 to their attack rolls, while the voyager (crossfire) favored spamming power echo to manifest Destiny Dissonance at a low power point cost of 0, until it finally powered through the enemies' spell resistance. The melee voyager also liked to corner one zuishin by the edge of the rooftop and threaten it with an attack of opportunity, thereby forcing it to settle for a Dispel Magic (on a Destiny Dissonance or an Inertial Armor) and a Dimension Door away.

Even with only 1-point Inertial Armor up, the voyagers proved frustratingly difficult for enemies with Point-Blank Shot and Rapid Shot. Defensive Precognition on top of +Intelligence to AC is no joke, and the zuishin being sickened did not help their accuracy either. The PCs had cold iron weapons and ammunition, and so were able to penetrate the enemies' damage reduction. The zuishin liked to use a healing arrow loaded with Heal or Breath of Life as the final attack in their full attack sequence and were able to successfully do so a few times, although they had some misfortune with their attack rolls while trying to hit themselves, and Symbol of Mercy helped prevent an annoying Breath of Life.

After a staggering 12 rounds (including the surprise round), after some very close calls and many power points expended on Deflect, our voyagers proved victorious. Only one of them was left standing with 3 hit points, while the other was under a Symbol of Mercy, and both of them were completely tapped out on power points.

We learned during that battle that although power channel is quite niche beyond Destiny Dissonance, it can be a life-saver in certain situations, such as when Inertial Armor is dispelled.

We also saw that accomplished accomplice really is too strong a parallel action. Not only is it a scaling bonus to most skill checks, but it is a scaling bonus to attacks on demand as well. I could still see people taking it if it was just an aid another to an attack; it would be a go-to parallel action for "nothing else is useful, so I will make my attack more accurate." Having it apply to most skill checks outside of combat, which happened many times this session, is extravagant.

Only four rules quibbles came up here:
1. Does power echo's cost reduction apply to the momentum cap as well on augmented attacks? In other words, if a 7th-level voyager manifests Destiny Dissonance for exactly 0 power points, can they then shove 7 momentum onto an augmented attack?
2. The pause parallel action provides a miss chance "attacks," but it is not quite concealment. How does it interact with effects like Improved Precise Shot, then? For that matter, given the bizarre definition of "attacks" in the core rules ( d20pfsrd.com/magic/#TOC-Special-Spell-Effects ), would it affect a Stone Call or a Dispel Magic?
3. It occurred to me at one point that Sensitivity to Psychic Impressions would have been an extremely useful power to have at a certain point, but it is strangely missing from the voyager's power list, despite being time/history-themed. Why does the voyager have Object Reading but not Sensitivity to Psychic Impressions?
4. Power echo will completely break Shunning of the Material by making it all-day, and it is already a broken power (e.g. wrap yourself in a bedsheet for cheap etherealness).

Mainly archer, with a reach weapon as backup.

GMing for these voyagers has made for the most entertaining Pathfinder combat experience I have ever had as a GM. Battles really are quite dynamic and mobile ala wuxia.

Throughout all three of these battles, there has been not a single moment wherein each of the voyagers lacked their full +Intelligence to AC and Reflex, though this may be skewed by Narcissism (The Skirmisher). To that end, I do not see defensive precognition at 8th level (a terrible name for a class feature, by the way, given the overlap with Defensive Precognition) being all that exciting a class feature beyond just +2 AC and Reflex against a single enemy... and that is assuming the voyager is willing to cough up swift actions and willing to stay within close range, rather than darting well out of range.

He's approaching middle age, and has to prove he's still got it.

Why does every game only make it to level 3 or 4?

Because you are shit at choosing the games you join and people give right the fuck up as soon as they can if things don't go exactly the way they want.

Speaking of TWF and Slayers, I have been thinking about making one that goes with the Butterfly Blade archetype and using Butterfly's Sting together with a Gun Chemist. But I know little about how to build a proper TWF-er.

Wrong.

My Agriculture game made it to level five last month. Now that they've left Rusty Dagger Shanktown, they're going to a slice of life session during the Highharvestide celebration in Chessenta.

Seems more logical that I see people not making games that far and it happening to me, that it likely happens a lot. Rather than being 'wrong'. lmao

Then run the game yourself, and use fast xp growth. The PCs will gain a level almost every session. Once they make it to level four or five, ask one of them to take over for a session.

Start it in January. This time of the year, people will try to travel spend time with their families. After that, they will know their schedules.

Is Orator broken or am I reading it wrong?
For the price of two feats it turns any shut-in Wizard into a master of lies and intimidation.

Guess you are at the mercy of your DM as to when you are allowed to use it.

There is a rider on Bluff, Intimidate, and diplomacy that states there are points where the skills simply fail. You can't make Dimplomancers that can turn enemies into mindbroken slaves through use of skills anymore. 2hu's +30 diplomacy build is great, but it doesn't make people who hate the characters guts friendly to him.

Is there anything wrong with playing a bard and bringing a speaker to the table to play music from?

only if the music fits the setting and isn't annoying.

What's the power difference between Wizard, Sorcer, and Warlock? Like, what's the most potential for damage?

For better or for worse I'd play

I'd say Sorcerer likely, if you wanna just say fuck it and give up spells known to go crossblooded, pick dragon and orc bloodlines, and then take blood havoc at level one, then get a bunch of CL increases and you'll do like 5d4+15 flaming hands by level 3

Although it's worth noting you don't generally pick them just for the damage. Casters bring alot of useful shit like invis, flight, haste, battlefield control, etc.

Yo, I heard SoM recently had its Errata come out.

Is it any good?

It looks like it was mostly format fixes, but the sentinel class was nerfed, while the darkness defender archetype was boosted.
Here is a link to one persons summary of the errata: giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=22601466&postcount=822

>sentinel class was nerfed,
Good lord why?

It was actually way too goddamn tough, to the point of being nigh unkillable

> Rapid Placement can no longer be combined with Trap wielder
This is bullshit

So I will be playing Pathfinder for the first time this coming Thursday. I'm putting the finishing touches on my character (a 3rd level human Oracle) right now, but I'm conflicted on some points. Those points are feats and revelations.
My mystery is The Dark Tapestry, my curse is Ghoul.
For feats, I have chosen, so far, Toughness, Great Fortitude, and Extra Revelation. I'm not sure about these choices though. I want Toughness and Great Fortitude for survivability. My character is going to be a close range fighter with medium armor and a heavy mace. My ability scores are 18 Strength, 15 Dexterity, 14 Constitution, 10 Intelligence, 12 Wisdom, and 20 Charisma. I can easily hold my own damage wise, but I'm concerned about dying. I am attached to my character and her backstory and I'd rather not die super early, but I want to be able to take risks. I'm not sure about Extra Revelation, and I might swap it out for Power Attack but I don't know. I need advice there for sure.
For revelations, I have Pierce the Veil and Many Forms, with my extra being Gift of Madness. I like Gift of Madness for flavor, but is confusion really that helpful over hitting them with my mace? Pierce the Veil seems very important, as I came over from 5e and darkvision was almost necessary there to not be at a disadvantage. Though my group is mainly humans so they'll have torches anyway, so perhaps it won't be needed. Many Forms I thought sounded bad but I love the idea of it after reading up on Alter Self. I can change into any humanoid basically, and gain some nice boosts. The duration makes it really nice for combat too. Any advice here? The other revelations are either terrible, or can't be taken yet.
In closing, my traits are Ghoulish Affinity, Broken Mind, Defy Madness, and my drawback is Foul Brand (hand). My spells are Create Water, Detect Fiendish Presence, Guidance, Purify Food and Drink, and Read Magic, Bless, Barbed Chains, and Divine Favor. any advice here would be appreciated.

Has anyone played with Worlds of Power Paragon system?

But wasn't the Guardian Sphere kinda shit and inferior to the Warder's Aegis ability?

Real talk: Pathfinder XP tracks are eye-bleedingly slow. A game of 5e goes 1-20 in a year of weekly games, Pathfinder requiring a billion XP drags that shit down - especially when you have to pre-plan builds for a decent character.

>people actually use XP tracks and not just milestones

So I know this is a pathfinder general and I apologize for this 3.5 question I have, but it's more a matter of an opinion

I'm in a 3.5 group right now and I like having characters built just in case my current character dies. Anyways there is this feat I just learned about call Ancestral Relic, which allows you to sacrifice at full market value to upgrade your weapon item to +1/+2/+3 etc etc when it reaches the gold value right. The deal is though that is has to be something belonging to your characters family/your religious order etc etc and it's a unique weapon for your character right?

Well I was interested in taking this feat twice for a two weapon fighter character
>Wasting two feats on a already feat starved build
I know I know, wasting 2 feats when aiming for two weapon fighting is an awful idea, but I was thinking of taking swordsage as my class which should alleviate some issues with two weapon fighting thanks to martial abilities

Do you think taking this feat twice for two weapons for more character roleplaying and backstory would worth it as long as I stick with swordsage, or should I just ditch the idea and take it once?

>most games end early
>most games use XP
>most games use modules
No shit, and modules are heavily padded to meet the XP demand.

I've only been in one or two games that actually fucking bothered tracking experience points dude. Most people I've played with use milestones.

Don't know what you're talking about. Guardian sphere feels fine to me, and the default Sentinel functions off the CHALLENGE package, which is separate from the patrol package. Sentinel just takes guardian sphere and cranks it up to the point of it being monstrous, especially with Adamant Guardian and Darkness Defender

Yeah, it's that mageknight arch that uses patrol.

I'm pretty sure the only reason I've had a reasonably okay time with experience tracks is because my DM always runs parties smaller than an AP calls for (3 PCs, rather than 4-5 PCs), now that I think about it. I'm still not particularly fond of it, especially since all 3 PC's have like, a 200-400 exp difference, which comes up WAY too often despite us being well past the point of needing hundreds of thousands of exp to ding up to the next level.

Fuck, does anyone remember the name of that Psionic feat that let your construct stick around for hours at time if all it did was menial tasks and if it entered combat it would go back to being rounds?

Never-mind, it's under Advanced Construct. Could have sworn it was a separate feat. Oh well.

What kind of action would it be to slip a ring off or put one on?

Free, unless your a martial, in which case it's a move action

Two-weapon fighting is shit anyway so if you're committed to doing it you already don't care about optimization.