/osrg/ Old School Renaissance General

>But the game itself certainly doesn't do that.
Gary couldn't write.
>It's such a bizarre rule;
The only justification that gives me trouble is monster hirelings losing darkvision.

>Teleport traps, map damage, shifting walls, pits/elevators, thick smoke, aggressive redecorators, one way doors...
just being a fucking idiot...

>So don't use it? It's not mandatory.
Skerples, I don't understand how you can read my posts and completely miss the point every time.

youtube.com/watch?v=I8sUC-dsW8A

NAYRT
Curiosity is fine, but they sounded incautious.

If the party is always super safe, the occasional straight up gotcha is OK.
The goal of lethality is to give a sense of stakes, after all.

>monster hirelings losing darkvision.
I never understood how that made any sense.

Welcome to the Mythical Underworld™

>Skerples, I don't understand how you can read my posts and completely miss the point every time.
Pic related.
But nah, I think I get it. I just don't get why it bothers/bothered you. Lots of rules out there; pick ones you like, ignore the rest.
>If the party is always super safe, the occasional straight up gotcha is OK.
It depends if they are safe by being smart or safe by being dumb.

Safe by being smart means sending scouts, mapping, and moving like an OCD Swat Team. Safe by being dumb means just missing all the danger by luck. No plans, no systems, just dumb luck. Dumb luck gets skeleton centipede traps.

They wear sunglasses.

You know all those odd monsters that kill people who do really specific things? Those all killed smart people the first time they showed up.

youtube.com/watch?v=X2LTL8KgKv8

Same reason you can use cocaine to keep a scent dog from noticing your jews. Sensitive faculties are easy to overload. If you want darkvision, you have to put out the torches, or send the monsters ahead as scouts.

Interesting analogy.

>Same reason you can use cocaine to keep a scent dog from noticing your jews.
Hey , what'cha got to say /now/?

I would rather blame it on ghosts.
Teashades are pretty cool.
I was also I'm still waiting on that statblock.
Hyperzine > Cocaine up yours, treefags

>lose 1 HP per hour due to sleepiness
>25% of 1st level wizards are severely narcoleptic

>25% of 1st level wizards are severely narcoleptic
Could lead to a very interesting game. Stimulants become a resource like torches.

Is preventing damage / hit point bloat a big part of OSR philosophy?
I've been homebrewing monsters for 5e lately and I'm impressed by the sheer amount of hp they have. And when I play I am impressed by how quickly that hp goes away.
I also think that hp / damage bloat is a big part of why 3.5 martials ducked, because a badly built martial trying to use a crossbow or a weapon he couldnt Power Attack with, was basically doing fuckall.
I feel like if weapon damage was d4 to d10, flat bonuses were minimal and tightly-controlled, and monster hp was based on being about double the average fighter of the "Challenge Rating" it's meant to be, it'd be a tough fight. If 50% of the attacks hit, it's taking damage from 2 PCs per round and dealing damage to one of them at 50% rare. So it will hurt one of them to 50% up by the time it's dead. And it's up can be much lower and "boss" fights can actually last longer. Damage will go up slightly by level, with magic swords maybe, but overall remain the same.
After the insane imbalance of damage amongst parties that I've seen in 3.5 and 5e (and even 4e to an extent) I am starting to feel that this is the best solution. What do you all think?

It's a part, but not a big part. High level fighters can get away with ignoring their own hp.

>wizards are severely narcoleptic
Sounds like modern games to me.

(WTF is a "skerples"?)

>The dungeon is actively malevolent
exactly

gameswithothers.blogspot.co.nz/2013/06/other-frontiers-dungeons-megadungeons.html

Resident shillposter. He blends in better these days, but you can only blend in so well in a general.

Say what you will about Skerples, at least he doesn't post the same thing twice in a row.

Say what you will about me, but at least I don't draw attention to deleted posts.

...

>You catch a message in a bottle. It says, 'This underground river flows to a sunless sea, where ships ply black waters carrying grim and unspeakable cargoes. If you get this note, please send me one grim cargo.' An address follows.
What would you send? What would you expect in return?

Ability scores! What are they good for? They give you modifiers, but can't we just roll for the modifiers? why do we need ability scores to get us there? You can roll under them, but then 18 is almost guaranteed success and 3 is almost guaranteed failure (compare with the saves that centers around ten). Rolling against 10 + modifier seems superior. Or using the skill system (Open Doors for feats of strength etc.) which seems to be the intention of games like LotFP. I can see two reasons to keep ability scores:
*The "Crown of +2 intelligence" and other effects like that, but that's pretty boring already.
*Ability score loss, which is interesting but to complex IMO. I like how Into the Odd does "strength as meat points", but for B/X D&D this just becomes a fiddly subsystem on top of the real game.
What am I missing?

Just use SotU and quit bringing this shit up

That seems excessive. I'm thinking of running B/X but replacing the ability scores with modifiers (scores are rolled for as normal, but never written down on the sheet and forgotten after character creation).

But I can't be the first one to think about this: Have you seen this discussed before? What are the arguments against doing this? I'm afraid that this is armchair-GMing that won't work at the table for some reason.

We have this discussion twice a month. The 3-18 range is nice for informing your role as an actor.

Ok. Sorry for bringing it up again then, the thought of removing ability scores was new to me and I couldn't remember seeing it somewhere except in ultra-lights like SotU.

I guess 3-18 is easier to "get" then different modifiers. I'll play-test my ideas and report the results.

>What are the arguments against doing this?
Mainly that there's not a lot of point in rolling the score and then discarding it. It's a sort of impulse to tidy up that doesn't really make logical sense -- I mean, what harm is it realistically going to do by being written down on the character sheet, even if it's never used? On the other hand, there are at least minor potential benefits: stat increases can go to the score instead of having to be modifier increases, you can roll against the score on d20 or, for really unlikely shit, on d100.

I don't see your point here. Keeping the character sheet nice and clean is important IMO. Stat increases that doesn't effect the modifiers are useless anyway(?). Rolling against the score seems inferior to rolling against the modifier.

Do you have a rations tracking sheet?

Here are double sided torch/lantern cards

google.com/amp/s/rpgcharacters.wordpress.com/2017/10/16/torch-lantern-cards-for-bx-dd/amp/

Some rules i'm thinking:
You have a 1 in 6 chance to do doable things.

yor stat mod is added to this chance (-1 to +3)

Certain classes might give you an extra +1 to some actions and/or enable what you can attempt.

You may be interested to know that there's at least one user around here who does something similar to what you're suggesting. I believe his system works like this:

To roll for a stat modifier, roll 3d6. Each 6 rolled gives you a +1. Rolling a 1 with no 6s gives you a -1. (If you roll no 6s or 1s, then your stat is 0.) Seems fairly straightforward, plus it skips the step of rolling the stat number and then converting it to a modifier.

really makes you think huh

I was told to come here to ask about Godbound.

It's Exalted, but B/X™ just like everything else Sine Nomine publishes. What do you want to know about it?

What's the most bad taste, trashy, all-around-awful OSR module?

Probably one of LotFP's publicity stunt edgefests like Blood in the Chocolate or maybe Fuck For Satan

To be honest GP > XP conversion makes earlier D&D games a much better game of accumulation than later ones.

D&D 3e and 4e are absolutely about accumulating lots of shiny trinkets that are the exact right shiny trinkets you need and are worth extreme amounts of gold, but that works less for the game than just needing to get extreme amounts of gold (or equivalent) in the first place.

In a way it's the same result: accumulating gold value increases your character power. But whereas that was just normal level function before, in 3e it's an additional power track that must be gained in a specific way. Which is way worse, for some people at least, to play through.

I checked out Fuck for Satan but it seems too intentionally comedic. I also looked at A Thousand Dead Babies and Come to Daddy but while the former is a good module it's got that kind of wink-wink nudge-nudge to its trashiness and the latter just wasn't all that interesting.

Knowing 3e's endless splats, did anyone ever try to write GP=XP for it? Would it even be possible?

I'd probably give it to Death Love Doom, at least Blood in the Chocolate inspired me to want to make my own Willy Wonka dungeon and FFS made me laugh.

Then check out Blood in the Chocolate. Inflation fetish and subhuman south american pygmies (no idea how they didn't get fucking grilled by the SJWs for that one) working in not!Willy Wonka's factory, if Willy Wonka was a fat (but still VERY BEAUTIFUL mind you, the module makes a point out of that), cartoonishly evil industrialist woman who makes physically addictive, body-horror-inducing chocolate

Don't forget that she's a lesbo and that garbage was nominated for an ENnie

I've considered the idea. It wouldn't be hard. The books have the wealth-by-level guidelines anyway, I'd just use those. Also means your characters will have the right amount of gold for their level.

So, since people were talking about the Mythic Underworld earlier, how compatible is the Mythic Underworld with a hexcrawl? Can you have both?

The Mythic Overworld?
But yes, I think you could easily have a "the further you get from civilization the crazier shit gets" sort of thing.

Honestly, I'm more on board with that than the mythic underworld.

Three Hearts & Three Lions already did it.

If we can't do stuff that has already be done, we might as well all pack up and go home now.

I agree. I mean, I already have that. I'm wondering specifically for dungeons, though, because it seems like the Mythic Underworld thing is more of a megadungeon thing.

I'm just saying that instead of trying to re-invent the wheel every week maybe you should try reading something that isn't D&D or a clone of it every once in a while.

Whuh? I thought you _were_ looking for dungeony things. I think the Mythic Underworld would work with a smaller dungeon. An underground hexcrawl like VotE would work too.

What? So bringing up an idea is something people only do when they aren't aware it already exists?

So should I scour every piece of media in existence before commenting on anything to make sure I'm not repeating something someone else said 50 years ago?

Well excuse me but the whole "DUDE Veeky Forums INVENTED A NEW CONCEPT LMAO" tends to get a little boring.

>every piece of media in existence
3H&3L is in the back of the 1e DMG, retardo.

>3H&3L is in the back of the 1e DMG, retardo.
Obviously, but that still doesn't validate your argument of "You can't talk about anything if someone else came up with it first."
And you make it sound like if anyone has ever read anything other then D&D they would immediately know all things that have been thought of before.

I find it's best to not say anything at all and just nod sagely while reading threads. This is what I do instead of actually playing as well.

I'll check it out, then. TY user.

Blood in the Chocolate is very much intentionally comedic. It is also pretty easy to make it PG13 (remove the rape (it only exists on a random table and wont show up in most games anyway) and tone down the body horror). I don't really get what people are so upset about, but I suspect the usual "LotFP so EDGY".

>DUDE Veeky Forums INVENTED A NEW CONCEPT LMAO
No one was claiming that, and this chain of posts was nothing but a thinly veiled excuse for you to act like a retarded twat

So uh, Thac0 or To hit tables?

Is Dungeon Robber (the flash game) a good example of how to run a OSR dungeon?

>intentionally comedic
The introduction of the module tells you to avoid running it on normal fantasy settings because it would undermine its themes of human cruelty and greed, which I'd take as a sign that it was at least intended to be taken seriously. I'm not sure where you're seeing the humor, other than the body horror itself

I have the book, the character sheet, and the 16 Sorrows. I was wondering if anyone had links to the other adventures and/or materials.

I've tinkered around with it, but the standard XP/GP doesn't really line up in a way that's friendly to a quick fix. You'd need to rewrite experience tables and whatnot, and ain't that a bundle of fun.

I'll see if I can put together a quick graph to show what I mean - experience vs. Wealth By Level vs. non-magical wealth. (The last one is the trickiest to put together.)

I haven't read, nor for that matter run, many modules, but I would say either Blood in the Chocolate for the blatant magical realm or The Forest Oracle for managing to have worse writing than some modules written by literal teenagers.

There's 3 supplements in the trove but 2 say they're examples of game mechanics. Godbound isn't even in Da Archive, so your guess is as good as mine. Sorry.

Well, it's a good conceptual representation. It's missing most of what makes OSR good by being a computer game, especially with its limited mechanics. Bear in mind it's built with the dungeon generation tables from 1e or something like that

>nominated for an ENnie
WON, user.

WON an ennie. The module about subhuman African Pygmy rapists working for a fat, lesbian Willy Wonka expy rubbing a chocolate factory that, in spite of allegedly servicing the wealthy as a luxury goods provider throughout most of Western Europe, still produces chocolate that has a 1-in-10 chance of permanently disfiguring you won best adventure of the year.

But don't worry user, as soon as it leaves the factory, it doesn't have that 1 in 10 chance? How? Why? How do they take care of rich aristocrats touring the factory? It's a game man, just chill !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just some opinions before I finish this and gather my players:

daylands.blogspot.com.es/2017/11/1d6-osr-ultra-lite-small-dungeon.html

I'm thinking on:
1. Breaking the fighter in two: the tough fighter (heavy weapons, add level to break things) and the lithe fighter (light or ranged weapons, add level to reflexes)
2. Thief becomes the specialist; who can produce inventory and contacts according to the chosen background (roll under lvl to do it). To get ninja gear, choose the ninja background.
3. As it is, the combat is just a hair too deadly. To prevent this, both contenders deal damage at the same time, then the difference is dealt to the lowest roller. Then they can choose to attack or try and flee.

Any thoughts?

I got some people in my group complaining about enforcing the female stat rules from 1e, how do I tell them to fuck off?

The Mythic Underworld is just the idea that the mechanics of the game suggest an actively malevolent dungeon that protects its inhabitants and repels intruders through various methods. People also tied in a bunch of actual mythic stuff like Orpheus and whatnot for obvious reasons, but that's the core of the reasoning.

It's "The Implied OD&D Dungeon", basically.

The Mythic Overworld, then, is ascribing the same general philosophy to the wilderness - read through the rules and see what it implies. For OD&D specifically, since it's the most relevant one with its mechanical weirdness, I'd recommend reading Semper Initiativus Unum's OD&D Setting Posts.
Some additional notes that SIU didn't bring up, though:
>Rolls for wandering monsters are explicitly at the end of the day, rather than something like AD&D's morning/midday/evening/three night watches. In other words, monsters come out in the dark. The night is dark and full of terrors.
>OD&D's castle lords and ladies are neglectful. They do not repel the monsters living within their lands as the rules suggest PCs should, and only patrol a fraction of their nominal lands.
>Law is scarce. Of Men, only Dervishes and Patriarchs hold to it - of others, only Elves, Ents, Werebears, Gold Dragons, Centaurs, Dwarves/Gnomes. The only ones that are always Lawful are Dervishes, Patriarchs, Ents, Gold Dragons, with the rest being just as likely to be neutral. Most Men are either Neutral or Chaotic.
>The only explicit structures are the towns and castles on the Outdoor Survival map, the assumed 2d4 villages of 1d4*100 people in PC baronies, the castles of the Frost, Fire and Cloud Giants, and the fortified villages of the Orcs.
>The Martian encounter tables are probably better used for actual trips to Mars (cf. Cursed scrolls).

It's worth noting that the Mythic Underworld is called that because it echoes actual mythical underworlds. A Mythic Wilderness would by necessity be different, probably more drawing on fairy tales.

My perception of BitC is that it contains lots of over-the-top body horror in a splatter film way. Look at the JustOneMoreFix let's play Kiel GMed recently for example: there lot's of funny accents, over-the-top NPCs and one inflated PC being rolled around by the others. Good fun. Also this line from the sales pitch at DriveTroughRPG:

>The villain's henchmen, magically mutated tribesmen, engage in all sorts of candy-inspired silliness and mayhem with the intruders they catch. Including the "berry orgy", which in the publisher's opinion is just simply ridiculous, but some readers might have different opinions.

I think you can play BitC as horror if you really try, but lots of the stuff is just so silly that it's hard to keep it straight. It's the Bad Taste of RPG adventures.

Tables with only the relevant line and Weapon vs. AC modifiers pre-applied.

What is the OSR thing that is like fantasy Vietnam? I have forgotten.

Kenneth Hite's Qelong.

What, limiting Strength to 18/50 for female humans and down to 14 for female halflings?

I'd suggest literally just telling them to "fuck off". Translated into whatever's appropriate in your local language, of course.

Fan ta dem.

's the setting, probably, but more generally "Subterranean Fantasy Fucking Vietnam" has been used to describe the more Tomb of Horrors-ish style of hyperparanoid gameplay.

I love all your post

>It's worth noting that the Mythic Underworld is called that because it echoes actual mythical underworlds.

the trick is to make the mythical overworld also mirror the mythical underworld

not a typo

Basically, in short, run dungeons over land; the only difference being that there is a (weird and unsettling, if possible) sky over the PCs heads.

I read your post as suggesting that there's sort of a "civilization is safe, but the wilderness is Actively Malevolent" type of thing, the further out you go the more dangerous it gets. Which I already have. Did I misread?

Anyway, it just seems like smaller dungeons wouldn't really be big enough to matter, and might well have something about them that makes it weird. Like a legitimate full-on dungeon, sure. But a small church that's been sacked and is now inhabited by goblins? I'm not so sure that is quite the same deal.

Though thinking about it now, I suppose I could make the smaller ones "lairs" or something, and have legitimate dungeons as well that followed the Mythic Underworld patterns. That might work.

All interesting stuff. I will definitely keep in consideration when designing the actual hexcrawl part.

"If you don't like it, run your own game."

IIRC over at Hill Canton's he's got a whole Law vs. Chaos "reality gets weird when you go into the wilderness" thing going on that you might be interested in.

It's the basic idea behind shit like Fever Dreaming Marlinko, Slumbering Ursine Dunes and Misty Isles of the Eld.

Hell if I know where you'd find a good summary post for it all, though.

The OSR Ain't free. The blogosphere's gotta be litterd with the blood of storygamin' hipsters. Zak "(((Zak Smith)))" Sabbath is not a talented content creator. He's a narrativist ex-pornstar and a leftist shill as well :DD. BASIC and EXPERT not rehashed houserules ok. praise Holmes.

>The Mythic Underworld is just the idea that
*The Mythic Underworld is just a way of fluffing the idea that

There are plenty of other ways.

If you can be too pretty to be an orc, you can be too strong to be a woman.
Nevermind that, in almost all cases, you can play a woman if you play a fighter.
Is it *that* important to you that your 17 strength chick be a sorceress?