Mutants and Masterminds thread.
I'm new and I'm trying to create a Captain America type super soldier, pretty great at everything but not really 'super', unless you count some sensory powers. What should I prioritize, abilities, powers, skills, advantages? I put a 6 in STR, STA and AGI and a 4 in everything else except PRE. Are those decent attributes for that kind of character or could I go higher? Other than that, any advice for creating a captain america ripoff?
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If you have 6 in strength, that means you can have as high as +14 to attack rolls (PL10x2). I would put as much as you can into close attack or even more into Fighting in general.
Also, Power Profiles has a whole section on "powers that aren't actually powers" called Talents.
>What should I prioritize, abilities, powers, skills, advantages?
Your first priority should be meeting your PL caps in defenses and at least one attack. Some of these you can buy directly, and that's often more efficient than taking high attributes.
Purely for efficiency I recommend putting everything that contributes to your attack bonus into a power, so you can have alternate effects for a melee and ranged attack without wasting any points. Thematically, though, a couple points of Fighting and Dexterity probably make sense for a super soldier.
In the Talents Power Profile, one of the example Powers is called Hurt Anything. Its listed as Penetrating, Variable Descriptor (any Damage Effect you wield), 1 point + 1 point per rank. Obviously it costs one per rank of Penetrating, but where does the additional 1 point come from? Could someone explain the listing to me?
Also, for the Hurt Anything power, it says any Damage Effect you wield, does that include Damage afflicted by mundane unarmed punches and kicks? Are normal, mundane attacks considered Damage Effects, or would that only apply to actual Powers?
What ability scores do you think a captain america type would have, anyway? 4s? 6s? Very high physical scores and average mental/social scores?
The 1 point base comes from the Variable descriptor: there's a Power Extra called Variable Descriptor... the 1 point is basically that extra. The extra allows the Damage effect to apply to any weapon you wield. Typically, the Damage effect only applies in a specific instance (i.e. as a bonus to unarmed attack only--it wouldn't apply if you picked up a lead pipe and started beating someone with it), so the Variable descriptor covers anything you might use to make an attack.
Note that the Damage effect is itself pretty flexible--it can represent anything you fluff it as: claws, focused hitting strength, the ability to "see" weak points on a target... but once you choose it and apply a descriptor to it, the effect only applies to that particular use, and not to any differently described/fluffed attack you make.
Cap himself should have 7s in all ability scores, that's the unofficial (but officially recognized) benchmark for "peak" human, 8+ is the beginning of true superhuman stats.
Made a Aztec death goddess for a game that never happened. What she lacks in defense I wanted to make up for in her inability to actually die. Rate/Hate/Masturbate.
Thanks for pointing that out. For some reason when I was looking at the modifiers on the SRD, I just never saw that on the list.
Maybe I will just give him 7s in everything. So expensive though. What should I prioritize my points in after that? Are advantages particularly useful? I've heard I should prioritize Defenses next, then Powers, then Advantages, then Skills. Does that sound about right?
Wood fugg. Why is her Intellect so high, does she really need it? Why and how is her Treatment so high?
>Why is her Intellect so high, does she really need it? Why and how is her Treatment so high?
High Intelligence mostly to reflect the insane length of time she has been around. She is smarter than your average mortal. High Treatment to reflect her ability to halt death whenever she feels like it.
Take a look at the next-to-instant heroes part of the rulebook. You probably want to check out the Paragon and Weapon Master for inspiration
>Mutants and Masterminds thread
Wow.
I'm excited to see one of these.
>Maybe I will just give him 7s in everything. So expensive though
Look at what you actually get from each attribute, and then decide if Cap should actually have 6's or 7's in all of those things are if you'd be better off buying some of the effects independently.
Strength, Stamina, Fighting, Agility, and Awareness probably make sense to buy at a peak or near peak level.
Peak human Dexterity is plausible, but you might want fewer ranks of the attribute and a couple points of the Ranged Attack advantage.
Maxed Intelligence is kind of weird on Cap, since he's not a super scientist or anything. Buying his int based skills independently would make more sense.
Presence is honestly not a very good attribute in terms of payoff, but Cap does actually have a lot of it. I wouldn't buy it at the same level as his physical attributes though.
But attributes, powers, advantages, and skills can all contribute similar mechanical effects so it doesn't really make sense to make those your categories for prioritization. A character can have a good Fighting score, a close combat skill, the close combat advantage, or the accurate power modifier and they'll all increase the same melee attack bonus. Don't worry so much about which category the points come from, as long as you're meeting a few basic benchmarks you should be okay.
Those benchmarks, in the order that I'd prioritize them, look something like this...
>Can my character take a hit?
Usually this means capped defenses, but if you want to be tanky (or just unusual) you can add or substitute stuff like regeneration, immunities, insubstantial, or other defensive powers.
>Can my character hit back
You'll want at least one attack at your PL cap. For a powers-based character like a blaster it'll probably be a big 30-50 point thing with lots of alt. effects, but for a guy like Cap this might just be attributes, skills, and advantages that give you a capped melee attack.
>Can my character get around?
You might need to fight flying enemies, chase a villain, rush to the scene of the emergency, or get back in the fight after being thrown through a building. Flight, leaping, or speed (with wall climbing or air walk) work for super guys, but a swingline or some kind of vehicle is an option for mundane heroes.
>What else does my character contribute out of combat?
For superpowered people this is often defined by your superpower. The electric guy can short out machines or recharge batteries and that kind of thing. For characters without parahuman abilities this will often be where you look at the skills and advantage, but don't be afraid to write up a more mundane effect with the power rules. Or skip this bit on purpose to take more extras and alt. effects on your attacks. Some people just hit stuff.
>Does my character have any important gimmicks?
Once you've got your combat stuff capped and your niche developed, you should still have a decent number of points to use on any quirky fun stuff that seems appropriate to the character's identity. This is also around the time where I'd start spending points on 'bad' effects like growth/shrinking, deflect, improved trip or whatever other advantages don't clearly contribute to the previous points, and attributes like dexterity and presence that aren't really worth their full cost.
Cap is at “Peak Human Performance”, which means at LEAST 5 in his physical stats. 6 is “just barely into the superhuman range”, as you can see in the core boom; a person with Strength 6 can bench exactly 1.5 tons, which is well outside the human range physically.
His Agi and Dex might be slightly higher though; while technically that puts them into the “superhuman” range, the official 3e stats for guys like Nightwing gives them just-barely superhuman agility.
Theoretically Cap’s mental stats are at Peak Human as well, but this is EXTREMELY inconsistent in comics (not to mention a meaningless statement in itself), so I’d avoid it. I would give him great Charisma though because usually all he needs to do is BE there and suddenly everything gets more hopeful and awesome.
That was 2e only.
How would his Shield work?
I'd generally put Cap at the 'Just barely superhuman' as Comics Peak Performance sorta makes a joke of real life peak performance.
>I would give him great Charisma though because usually all he needs to do is BE there and suddenly everything gets more hopeful and awesome.
I'd think that this is the Inspire advantage or even some kind of luck control (Check required: Persuasion) fluffed as a dramatic speech and striking pose.
Mostly because there are only three Presence skills in the game so you're literally always worse off buying the ability than you'd be by buying the skill points separately.
Easily removable device with strength-based ranged damage and some defenses. Maybe the Interpose advantage.
I would NOT make the defenses and the throwing attack alt. effects of each other unless you really need points, since it makes your character worse and usually Cap's shield bounces back to him just in time to block something anyway.
The Shield is a far less astounding thing statistics-wise then the guy using it, which of course is why when basically anybody else uses it it’s suddenly less helpful or cool.
It’s probably a Strength-based Ranged Damage 2 or 3, which at PL10 would bring Cap’s Damage +8 and Attack at +12, though I would argue that Cap himself is at LEAST PL12. Give the shield the Unbreakable extra and you’re done.
This would allow Cap to hurt invulnerable or really strong guys by making use of Power Attack quite nicely.
While this is true, I am only going by what is well-established canon here. If you want to speculate then ya don’t really need any suggestions from anyone.
Also, Strength 5 is still CRAZY fucking strong in 3e, letting you left about 1600lbs above your head unaided. This is pretty close to the biggest weight we’ve ever seen Cap bench in the comics.
I had one guy try to tell me that it would also have Deflect with Limited Range, but I was able to point out that if this was true then ANYONE picking up The Shield would have Deflect, and mostly when anyone other then Cap tries to use it they use it WAY less effectively, so if anyone has the Deflect ability then it’s Cap himself and it’s Limited to holding the shield on him.
Like I said , it’s a lot less impressive but for the guy holding it.
Wait, does Cap even need to work out?
Yes actually, and that’s been a point openly made on page as far back as his earliest Avengers issues in the 1960’s.
Cap’s powers are not per-say “super”; it’s more like he was subjected to the craziest and most efficient steroid regimen of all time, and just like any steroid regimen if you stop working out then you loose the muscle mass eventually.
And contrary to the movie’s statement, Cap actually CAN get drunk. The issue is he has the alcohol resistance and drug tolerance of literally the greatest human drinker on Earth, so for him to actually get fucked up he’d need to down something like 100% proof alcohol in considerable quantities for it affect him.
Once when he was injected with heroin because....I dunno, because it was the 90’s and shit like that happened, to actually get him high the villain has to use enough of a dosage to kill a regular man three times over for example.
Also, if anyone wants this to be a random Actual Comics Facts thread, I am down for it. I can’t do it on /co/ anymore because that board has fallen to the Dark Side even faster then the rest of this website has.
>Also, if anyone wants this to be a random Actual Comics Facts thread, I am down for it.
Okay then, some other weird Cap stuff I always wondered....like, I heard other people had the Super Soldier Serum treatment too, so why did it work so much better on Cap?
Because the S3 Formula was only HALF of what Cap got, which is something everyone forgets but ironically the movie spells out rather explicitly. Cap was literally a 90lb athsmatic, but he both got the Super Soldier Serum AND a treatment of “Vita-Rays” that dramatically improved his muscle mass and bone density, in effect boosting his capabilities way beyond just what the Serum would actually provide.
Normally the S3 Formula just makes the “Peak human version” of yourself; you don’t get any taller, but if you took it your health is improved to basically be the absolute best possible just-past-Olympic-level version of a person with your build and physique could be. Even then this is more or less temporary, and the human body metabolizes the S3 Formula over time just like any other drug, which at one point was a plot point in a very early Cap comic where he had the S3 Serum “removed” from his system and he began to need to work out far more to maintain his physique then he used to.
In addition there’s Steve Rogers himself, who has a lot of practical training but most importantly a LOT of even more practical field experience in a frankly stupid number of situations and conditions.
What are good campaign hooks for a new party, Anons?
First of all; it’s “team”, not “party”.
And what kind of team? What scale are we talking about here?
There’s a lot of variables in superhero teams, not the least of which is their average level of power and their sphere of operations.
The Traditional Team
>All happen to be in the same place and same time an otherdimensional warlord or alien dude or other world-wrecker shows up. They all fight him at once and discover they need to work together to win.
>They are assembled by an existing political or civilian organization to achieve an existing goal with the funding and backing of said political or civilian organization.
>A mysterious guy from the future collects them all from their various solo careers and says they MUST join forces to preserve the future from an oncoming threat.
>As above, except Mysterious Future Guy is a liar and he IS the threat from the future and is manipulating heroes who defeated him there into being his secret goon squad in the past to change things this time around.
The Superhero Team-As-Surrogate Family
>Your parents were all superheroes and knew each other. Now you’re on a team like were or perhaps they planned to be, but never managed to find the time.
>You’re all in Superohero High School Together, like Hogwarts with more punching and lasers and shit
>You all got your powers from the same source that makes out outcastes/puts you in danger, but also creates a common bond between all of you.
>You’re all actually part of a literal extended family that had superpowers. Like the Royal Tanenbaums, but with more punching and lasers and shit.
>As #1, except they were superVILLAINS and all of you collectively decided that you didn’t want to be evil and formed a team.
Continued
The Street Hero Team
>As the first traditional team example where you are assembled to fight a common threat but the threat is something like a powerful crime lord or evil corporation that controls much of the city that you can’t seem to find enough incriminating evidence on alone.
>None of you have powers (or if you do they are low-key ones) and were all trained by the same guy or group to be heroes. Maybe you usually work solo, but sometimes you form a team.
>You all served in the same military unit together where you got your training and/or powers before conspiracy/crimelord/black ops program/evil megacorp/Cobra tried to kill you and only you guys survived.
>You’re all ninjas wearing different colored ninja pajamas/bandannas.
>You all go to the same gym to work out.
The “God I Hate You Guys” Team
>As traditional team example #2 only you’re basically paid to be there by said organization and would leave if you could get a better job.
>You’re all basically “Capes for Hire” who only do superheroing stuff while officially on the clock. It’s good money but you hate your coworkers.
>Mysterious Guy gathers you all together to fight a threat because literally he could find nobody else at the time and you were the only ones available. Coincidence keeps throwing you together and so now everyone seems to think you’re in a team no matter how much you protest otherwise.
Supervillains Team
>You all meet in lockup when you are interrogated as suspects for a crime that for once you didn’t actually commit.
>You all meet in lockup for a crime you actually DID commit and you break out together.
>You all meet in lockup because the warden is putting bombs on you to make you do what s/he wants for whatever reason.
Sensing a pattern with the villain team one....
It’s just easiest to have villain PC’s meet in prison because they tend to make real psychos when you ask them to make supervillains.
>You all go to the same gym to work out.
Best origin story ever. Krong the World Conqueror's evil plans are foiled when some dudes from Orlando's Gym & Boxing Studio decide they aren't gonna evacuate like a bunch of pussies.
Each one has a super power that corresponds to their most ripped muscle group.
Does That Guy that always wants to play an antihero or villain in regular campaigns make a wrongfully imprisoned champion of justice in supervillain jailbreak campaigns?
I just thought it would be a funny origin story because usually those low-powered Batman/Daredevil-types gotta work out and logically they can’t ALL be so wealthy that they afford their own gymnasium so basically they all just happen to have the same gym membership Gold Card or whatever.
No, he just makes the worst and most edgy villain of the punch.
That Guy never does anything positive or helpful on purpose because That Guy in most games is kind of either a social misfit who refuses to communicate even with his friends or because he plays the game for power trip reasons, both of which dovetail nicely into being a supervillain.
>where you got your training and/or powers before conspiracy/crimelord/black ops program/evil megacorp/Cobra tried to kill you and only you guys survived.
...why would a cobra try to kill a whole military unit?
Not A cobra. Cobra.
Or you know, setting equivalent fictional paramilitary terrorist force/cult led by megalomaniacal weirdo.