Infinity General: War for the Dawn of The Rise of the Planet of the Morats Edition

okay IG, my local group is looking into this game and I'm trying to figure out which faction to start out with. I've looked over the models and the basic faction outlines, but was hoping somebody here could give me more specific advice.

The factions that have things I most like the look of (across the faction) are Yu-Jing, Nomads, and Aleph. From the faction descriptions I've found around the internet, it sounds like Aleph and Nomads probably fit better with my general playstyle than Yu-Jing.

Things I usually like in strategy games are buff-stacking and denial. I like to have usually one or two strong 'anchor' units/models that I can fall back on as general threats for most of the game while the rest of my army is being cagey/supportive, then being able to use abilities to suddenly project a larger than expected amount of threat from any given direction.

I don't have any real preference between cc/range, nor for high/low model count forces. I generally like the look of the REMs more for Yu-Jing and Nomads, and the Troops for Aleph (though the aleph remotes are still great). I don't really care about the learning curve for a faction, since I'm fine with losing all the time while I learn how to play the game.

Of the three, which would be the best for me to start with?

I'm having fun with nomads, but boy they are tricky. They benefit as hell from "buff" stacking (there are not many buffs, but the way you have to maneuver them to be in the most favorable point to shoot is similar, I guess), but so do others, so you will always be using the right tool for the job, keeping your enemy either too close or too far to shine.

You'll have access to a ton of fun and different units, and the best toolbox (imho) for shenanigans in the game. You can hack like no other, you can infiltrate pretty good, you have nice tags (not spectacular tags), and you have a ton of shenanigans.

Be ready to lose just because you roll shit with your burst and your enemy crits. It happens, bite the bullet and go on. Always have another plan. Always know what they're going to do. Always keep your enemy from doing their best thing, but be ready for when they inevitably do. Smoke Grenades are awesome, and with nomad you have a couple of units that bring them to the table, and you can't shoot what you can't see. Remember, though, that there are visors that pierce smoke (and one of your best combo is having an intruder shooting through a smoke grenade to a blinded target.

Nomads are fun.

Well, buffing specific units is mostly done through Supportware on Remotes and both ALEPH and Nomads do this. Nomads with Tsyklons and Lunokhods, which are quite well armoured for Remotes, and ALEPH with Dakinis and Garuda, who are much cheaper, but annoying to deal with as they have Mimetism. Either of those with a heavy weapon and Marksmanship Lv2 through a Hacker is a pain to dislodge. Note that Nomads usually have a better Repeater network, so they can buff things without Repeaters (like Reaktion Zonds) easier, while with ALEPH you need that Rebot to keep close or have a good Pitcher shot with Danavas. Also non-humanoid ALEPH Remotes are the same stuff everyone else gets, so you're not missing out on them by going Nomad, while Tsyklon, Lunokhod and Meteor are Nomad specific.

The difference between the two factions is in everything else: ALEPH units are usually tough and come with either Dogged or No Wound Incapacitation and the army is more elite. Nomads are mostly rag-tag with Light and Medium Infantry being their core (thus more fragile), but their board control is superb and they love fighting dirty.

Welcome to this wonderful game first of all.

With any faction the challenges are gonna be pretty different due to how much variance there is between the factions. It really depends on what aesthetic you prefer and what your play style is. Nomads as you said have a lot of shenanigans and a very extensive tool kit, Yu-Jing have a lot of cheap HI and Aleph has amazing rambo units and the ability to form unlimited 4 man fireteams in the steel Phalanx Sectorial along with some pretty unique stuff, like Proxies.

Seems like you're pretty much set with Nomads though, so don't know what your struggle is.

I've been out of the loop on Infinity news for a while - has there been any mention of Acheron Falls? Last I heard of it was in, like, 2015.

Next year, supposedly.

here, I'm not the same guy as , i mas merely giving advice.

but thanks for the welcome anyway!

Sweet. Can't wait to finally run my Tunguska sectorial

Pls have the Securitae not suck anymore

Thanks a lot, definitely sounds like Nomads are what's right for me.

Our local group was planning to all start off with the starter boxes, what would be good things to look at branching out from there? It seems like Intruders and Interventors come up a lot, and the Tsyklons, Lunokhods, and Salyuts were the biggest things that drew me to the faction visually.

Done that to Moiras, does that count.

It was kinda janky when I used it. Also no general Infinity topic forum? At least I couldn't find it.

I hope at least the rules forum gets saved somewhere.

The more something suck, the more OP its next iteration seems to be. Post-Humans, Jammer, Symbiont armors fire vulnerability...

I suspect Tunguska is likely to come earlier than the next book. They stated they were probably going to release 1-2 factions early like they did with Onyx and USARF. And Tunguska has been getting new models lately.

I can't wait for Godcuriate.

All those, and if you plan to use Intruders best, take up something that throws smoke, like Jaguars or Morlocks.

And Chadaconda.

Intruder with HMG and jaguars to smoke I'd say are a must. Interventors make a solid Lt option and they're the best hacker in the game. REMs as far as the eye can see. I'd also pick up a Zero or two, great unit.

It also depends if you want to get into Corregidor or Bakunin later on, I prefer Bakunin (yet I don't play Nomads). If you go Bakunin get 3 - 4 Zeros, Riot Grrrls or Moiras as your fireteam option, and definitely a Sin Eater or two.

The lists work, but it's not the Nisse link that does heavy lifting, it's just that Jotums are amazing.

It's possible that Tunguska, TAK, Varuna, or whatever other sectorial will be out before the book the same way USARF was released before HSN3

Soon...

I hope :(

Intruder HMG: one of the best Nomad gunfighters especially paired with smoke.
Interventor HD+: Great Lt, good hacker, brings access to white noise.
Jaguars: The best Nomad cheerleaders and also bring smoke. The 13 point .5 swc panzerfaust is also a decent throw away ARO piece.
Remotes: All the Nomad remotes are good, Total Reaction HMG bot is great, Tsyklon and Lunokhod are both good if a little pricey. The 17 point Sensor FO bot is a huge toolbox of options you probably wont appreciate until you're more into the game.

Mission specialists: I think Zeros and Tomcats are best in faction. Spektres are good but pricey.

Morlocks are a ton of fun but can be difficult to use for a newer player.

Forgot to mention the support pack for a basic doctor and engineer. If you go remote heavy you'll want the clockmaker that comes in it.

Hey Veeky Forums

I'm just starting out this game and looking into buying some more models - I have some FRRM to start.

Whats confusing me a little is my friend keeps telling me that its important to have all specialists covered - have a Hacker, Engineer, Doctor and Forward Observer in a list. Is this really important? Should I like, get two of each? The options in the Ariadna lists are a little small which is why I ask.

I was hoping to get an excuse to buy the Anaconda TAG but I'm worried it won't fit in a 300pt list, since I've had veterans assure me I want a full core fire team, but also to get as many Chasseurs as possible.

>Whats confusing me a little is my friend keeps telling me that its important to have all specialists covered - have a Hacker, Engineer, Doctor and Forward Observer in a list. Is this really important? Should I like, get two of each?
It depends on your list, but usually one is more than enough, if ever. For example, if you don't have a lot of TAGs/REMs you can avoid bringing an engineer, and if you have a lot of cheap infantry a doctor is not really useful. Also the forward observer is useful for some trick but quite situational (you can use it to spot enemies to attack with a smart missile launcher), and you can always bring a cheap defensive hacker and not really invest a lot in hacking

It depends on the mission. The reason people recommend having the full specialst spread is due to Classified Objectives, which could potentially require any of those.

That being said, in the new season classifieds are less important, and remember you can always substitute one of the classifieds for Secure HVT instead, so I feel it is pretty safe to just ignore them on most of the missions.

Chasseurs really are amazing. It might be tight but you should be able to make a list with a full link, Chasseurs and Anaconda. Maybe the link might have to be Metros.

Thanks for the help! That makes things a lot more clear. Maybe it was the Classified Objectives he was referring to.

So if I have one TAG is it fine skipping the engineer?

I've also heard great things about Chasseurs but am still parsing the rules on them. So the benefit of Minelayer is you start with the mine deployed in camo?

It depends on the TAG, but usually if it's expensive shit it's better to have an engineer nearby to repair what's basically a 25% of all your points

Every single new CB forum has been for the worse and the new one continues the downward trend. I fully expect it to burst into fire at any time.

>So if I have one TAG is it fine skipping the engineer?
I usually bring an engineer if I am bringing a TAG. You could probably skip an engineer with the Anaconda since it is not super expensive for a TAG and it only has 2 STR to make use of the Escape System.

Yes the minelayer profile lets you start with a mine deployed in camo within 8 inches. Generally Chasseurs are taken as Minelayers or Forward Observers for the camo specialist.

Hey. I wanna replace new Tarik's long spitfire with the old compact one* and give the bigger one to an HMG Ragik. Anyone know a good metal saw that's thin enough to not have to rebuild half the weapon?

*because he doesn't have to compensate

Engineer is not that essential now that Retroengineering is out of the Classifieds.
In general people tailor lists for the scenarios and for the units. Engineer is pretty much mandatory if you're taking a TAG and a bunch of Remotes, but otherwise you can live without one.

As for having a full link team and a TAG: Anaconda is cheap and so are Metros. Ariadna is points-cheap in general.

>So the benefit of Minelayer is you start with the mine deployed in camo?
The benefit is that you place two Camo markers near each other, but one of them will explode. Place a Forward Observer Chasseur in close proximity and now you have 3 Camo markers, 2 of them with Flamethrowers and the third will explode.
And now check that Chasseurs have AVA4... Combined with Zouaves they can really stop a force from advancing.

>So the benefit of Minelayer is you start with the mine deployed in camo?
You are facing Ariadna and see 10 infiltrating enemy camo markers. Ariadna can field up to 13 camo infiltrators that don't have to roll for deployment as per Inferior Infiltration rules.

So, how many of those tokens are mines? How much are you willing to pay to find out?

This is how Minelayers work.

One aspect of engineers that also beneficial in Classifieds is that they almost alway come with a d-charge. FRRM is pretty well covered in that regard though, with the cheap infiltrating metros.

You'r turn, Creep!

The dice betray you, because they belong to me!

Posting more models. Taking a break from Hassassins and repainting Joan

What are ya'll working on?

I'm working on my desires, I'm not sure if I want to start PanO as my first infinity army or continue working on chaos conversions.

You should play Infinity. I mean what advice did you expect from an Infinity thread

Nice part about infinity is a single army box can cover you in most cases.

It's shit but here.

>TAK
user, I...

Dirty Kazak scum will get their sectorial long before they deserve it.

But not in this book. It'll be FRRM.

Depends, they might get both in. Kazaks don't need many new units.

I'm holding out hope for Vet Kazaks being unable to join Line Kazak core teams, so we can see how the Kazak players compare to Neoterrans when it comes to spoilt brattiness.

If it's roughly the same size as HSN3 they'd be able to have two sectorials for most factions.

I am pretty sure they already said Vets would join lines.

Where?

If so that's a shame. Because whatever fancy new linkable unit they bring in will have absolutely no chance against that 90 point can of bullshit.

I'm assuming you haven't actually painted any irises yet and it is just an unfortunate angle that makes her look cross eyed right?

She's looking to her left

Sixth sense is a mess holy shit. Help me here.

Let's assume a Kitsune approaches a Fasid from behind.

Firstly, Stealth still works right? Fasid doesn't receive an ARO to change facing.

If the Kitsune proceeds to make base contact with the Fasid from behind and declares a CC attack against the Fasid. Sixth sense lvl1 would allow the Fasid to respond with a BS attack despite no LOF because it's a face to face roll.

However, Sixth Sense would not allow the Fasid to place a mine as an ARO, because placing the mine isn't a face to face roll, and the Fasid can't use Intuitive Attack as an ARO to generate a face to face roll.

Did I get all that right?

Stealth doesn't function against anyone with Sixth Sense.

Ok, so that bit's wrong. Everything else correct (assuming the Fasid fucked up his roll to turn around)?

It doesn't need to be a face to face roll, unfortunately. You can shoot a flamethrower or lay a mine in response to someone behind you with sixth sense. This is clarified on the official forums, the rule itself needs to be rewritten =/

Got a link to that discussion at all?

forum.corvusbelli.com/threads/dtw-from-behind-vs-a-model-that-has-ssl2.458/

Thanks

So there is absolutely no possible way to effectively attack a user of Sixth Sense like the Fasid or a Link Team in CC. Good to know.

CC is fucking garbage as are most models that try to rely on it

You can do it, it'll just be FtF. So if Kitsune runs in on the guy his shots will be FtF with her ridiculous CC, and he will probably lose.

Link team has high BS, multi dice vs 1 dice, and ignores shit like surprise attack.

Stuff like the Fasid can throw a mine down to fuck your CC models even if he dies.

If it's a FtF roll, KItsune will win. Even a BS 14 Knight link w/ boarding shotgun (14 Base +6 range +3 fireteam -6 TO camo -3 MA) vs. Kitsun CC 28 w/ martial arts level 3, Kitsune's gonna win.

Mines are a problem though and you should plan around them. One of the nice things about the ninja killer hacker is it can go into impersonation mode (which gets you around mines).

Statistically speaking the Kitsune is better off attacking with her combi rifle against any non 2W link team. Take a Unidron team which is fucking cancer to fight, she's got better odds by simply using the combi rifle than MA3 and won't expose herself in the middle of an entire link team while doing so.

CC is just shit. Period.

All the bells and whistles for close combat and yet you're better off using a fuckin combi at BS11. baka

Are Morats the sledgehammer brute force army that I was lead to believe? Looking at starting boxes of the different factions and need to make a final decision.

Is there a better army for being a sledgehammer than the Morats or is a sledgehammer army in Infinity an oxymoron?

PanO can sledgehammer pretty hard too.

Wu Ming pain train is pretty up there too.

WTF are you talking about. None of your claims about Unidrons make sense; Kitsune has less than a 50% chance to deal one wound with her combi rifle, and like an 80% chance to kill one with CC.

And since Unidrons are dogged it's actually good to use the MF CC weapon against them.

You mean the Knight Orders? I did look at them, and it does appeal to my Deus Vult side... I may need to reconsider my choice.

What? Never heard of that.

I'm trying to balance a play style that supports an aggressive sledgehammer approach with the fluff of the faction. I thought Morats would be that. Well, shit.

Yu Jing. 2 wound HI 5 man link team, base BS13, has access to probably the most accurate speculative fire in the game you can blow shit away without it ever seeing you.

Math, obviously. Assuming you're not a retard and use the Kitsune's hidden deployment to facilitate approaching the link team from a position they can't gain cover from the Kitsune has an 81% chance to inflict at least 1 wound on a Unidron from within 16".

Many factions can do a sledgehammer style. Ariadna is the only exception I can think of, and maybe some sectorials. MAF is a good choice for that, you can link 2 Sogarats together with Kornak and make a truly nasty and hard to kill team.

Nobody really sledgehammers "harder" than Morats. Well technically PanO does, but the Morats are more pure of a sledgehammer. Let me explain.

Morats are lacking marker state units - nobody who can be camouflaged or anything like that. The only unit with that ability in their army is a human defector named Bit. They do have models which can start further up the field (infiltrators and drop troops) and these are useful.

So they're a brute force army, which is something they stereotypically share with PanO - they like to solve their problems by shooting them, mostly, though since they have smoke grenades and warbands they can do some bullshit.

The main advantage that Morats have over PanO, though, is they are (compared to PanO) much more resistant to attempts to disrupt their battleplan. PanO, strictly speaking, typically has more powerful and more accurate firepower by a small amount, but, for example, enemy attempts to disrupt Morats by hacking are limited due to the fact that they cannot be isolated. So sometimes you brick the radio inside an enemy power-armored trooper, disorienting them and more or less taking them out of the fight unless an Engineer can get to them and repair it. Morats don't give a fuck, they just yell loudly to coordinate or some shit.

The other big advantage that Morats have is that they don't care when their lieutenant dies. Normally if your lieutenant gets killed you spend a turn in disarray while your dudes get their shit back together, and since this is a 3 turn game, that's a big setback. Models who are actually Morats (not attached robots or human defectors) are unaffected by this, they just shout "Promotions!" and keep fighting.

My assessment of Morats is that compared to PanO, they hit slightly less hard but are harder to disrupt. They are still a brute force army.

You forgot to account for the fireteam bonuses, I think. If you have a Unidron w/ plasma carbine in a full fireteam out of cover (while retaining cover yourself) your chance to deal *1* wound is 65%... which is not that good since they'll probably just go dogged. In order to take it out for good it'll take you probably 3 orders, actually. Or you could go for that 80% chance to kill with CC if you get close enough. With smoke grenades you can engage the Unidrons one at a time, even if you're out in the "open."

Here ya go.

Keep the memri memes coming lol.

I'm thinking for this one, keep the captions, but put PanO in upper left, Yu Jing in upper right, Nomads lower left, Ariadna lower right. Maybe switch the economic axes (depending on what "economic left" means to you i.e. liberal or not).

Opinions?

So PanO is more fragile, but theoretically can hit harder but the Morats can take a licking and keep on kicking more regularly? That makes sense.

Thanks for the assessment.

When you say PanO, do you mean vanilla or one of their subfactions? The Knight Orders look pretty attractive, Deus Vult makes me smile.

Might come down to who plays a better close assault game.

>You forgot to account for the fireteam bonuses, I think
Nah, even that's only around 77%. For the 82% you need to have a completely unopposed roll with no ARO from the Unidron. And in that case the mono CCW is working with 92%.

I just ran it on ghostlord's calculator. It could also be that you're not setting the range bands right for the reacting Unidron.

Dammit, spelled Grrls wrong.

???

For PanO, I mean them in general. They all have high-BS linkable troops with good guns; MO focuses on power-armored dudes, each other sectorial does its own thing.

They both do close assault well, honestly, though since MAF has access to smoke grenades it's actually easier to get close. They have a couple units - one of them is called Daturazi Witch-Soldiers, they're like Morat religious crazies who worship Facebook and know space kung-fu. They use smoke grenades to cover their advance and fuck people up once they get there; they can also blast away at close range with these futuretech blunderbusses they have. The other unit is called "Hungries" which are basically zerglings lead by a morat handler, who conveniently also has smoke grenades to cover their advance. They aren't as skilled in CC as the Witch-Soldiers but they're super cheap and can explode when they die.

OTOH Military Orders does have some troops who are absolutely nuts in CC, like Joan of Arc (who's actually an AI-designed cyborg supersoldier).

Forgot mah pic

Not more fragile really (the to-hit penalties on a lot of PanO units make them some of the hardiest in the game) but less vulnerable to fuckery. If a hacker isolates a big PanO or throws an E/M grenade at their fancy link team, they're completely fucked as they can no longer supply those units with orders.

MAF is by far the better stabby faction. Even knights only have that shit as a secondary tool in PanO, whereas MAF has several very nice CC units.

I mean those are functionally the same, so sure. -3 cover, -3 range and -6 TO camo put that BS at below zero.

>I mean those are functionally the same, so sure. -3 cover, -3 range and -6 TO camo put that BS at below zero.

Within 16" a Unidron should be getting +3 range for shooting its plasma carbine, same as you with your combi rifle. So Unidron should be at +3 range +3 big fireteam -6 TO camo -3 cover for a total of 8.

Yeah, that post was talking about when the range bands are put in wrong to get the 82%. It's the same as having no ARO at all.

With correct AROs the combi is working with a 66% to cause one wound (assuming Kitsune is in cover and the bot is not), while the mono CCW has about an 81% chance to instakill.

Yeah, that's what I see too. Given dogged... I'd rather throw smoke grenades and eat the fireteam up close.

That meme's a little too complex for my blood.

Don't say that around Domaru

I fucking love this one.

Fuck Salad man, ALEPH dog

>Morats shout "Promotions!" and keep fighting.

Fuckin 10/10

We don't know the degree of control Aleph has over each of its "gifted" recreations.

Didn't Salad and Sun Tzu have a secret meeting about how much they don't trust Aleph?

I am getting into Infinity. I wanted to run a general Combined Army force, and my friends and I have all agreed to initially start out with starter packs to learn how the game works. Which CA starter pack would be a better starting point? I was looking at either Morat Aggression Force, or the Combined Army starter pack that comes with 3 Unidrons, a Fraacta, Maakrep and Reaper?