How the fuck do you put more roleplaying into your campaign?
One of my players complained about how he couldn´t play his character the way he wanted and asked for more "roleplaying" situations. I know for a fact that our sessions aren´t rp heavy, rather a rule of cool dungeon crawling game. But still, I don´t know how am I supposed to please him.
Should I just throw more NPCs at him? Wacky encounters?
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It’s fairly easy. Have stuff that doesn’t involve combat in it. You ever play an RPG? Like a videogame? Skyrim? Final Fantasy? Witcher? Whatever?
Notice how there’s like, a lot of talking to different characters and stuff going on that gives context and reason to the “go here and hit stuff” part of the game?
Well, do that.
If you aren't using morale and reaction tables in dungeons, you are doing it wrong.
What this user says. Also put some characters of ambiguous nature that can be sway into helping the group or fighting them and put moral dilemmas.
Factions for your characters to interact with help.
One DM I had made a separate group of adventurers that he ran parallel to us. They were our rivals and we saw them from time to time while out adventuring.
Have you considered asking your player what the fuck they means? Maybe get an idea of what exactly it is that they want?
I've been toying with doing this for awhile. How'd it go?
I did. All he said was "I don't know" and "you should already know". He's pretty much That Guy, but without him the group would fall apart.
That's a much better advice. Thanks user
I'd like to, but I know how they are and they would probably complain how I "steal protagonism" from them. Might work if I go full Gary Oak.
Encounters that allow diplomacy, allowing the players to play a quest everyway they want (with varying results of course)
If you're only doing dungeoncrawling, make it more NPC focussed, throw in moral dilemmas or some shit. Or create sidequests to distract from the dungeon crawling
>That guy
>wants more rp
good luck to you, user
on a related note, if his rp starts commandeering the table, make sure the game world punishes him accordingly
What is his character interested in? Power? Money/treasure? Lovers? Security (for himself, his friends, or his family)?
Whatever his character wants, there are probably people who want it too, or who have influence or control over it. Put them in his path. It's his job to win over, trick, or overpower the obstacles.
If he's a roleplayer at heart, he probably put something about what his character's goals/wants in the bio, or has mentioned them in character. If it's not there and you can't get him to say something specific about what his character wants, then dangle some bait in front of him and see how he reacts to it.
Advanced technique is to put his different goals/desires in conflict with each other. "I can reach for X, but that may make getting Y more difficult or put it in jeopardy if I have it."
Also - you might want to ping your other players too and get a read on them. You may not necessarily have to cater specifically to the one guy's needs. If there are plot hooks the other characters are trying to pursue, he may enjoy trying to help or hinder the party. Especially if there's a way he can be particularly useful in solving the situation. Plus, that way you're not throwing all the plot stuff at the One Guy and making the other characters background characters in his story.
If you can't put two goals/desires of a character in conflict, then consider putting the goals/desires of two members of the party in conflict.
Hard to say, we would have to know what kind of campaign you're running in the first place.
All have great ideas.
Factions were mentioned already, but they are awesome, especially if you have several with conflicting goals, but without any one of them being obviously evil or good. Let the players choose which they want to help, if any, but also make them live with the consequences - which for added roleplaying shouldn't just be "Faction B is now angry and will attack you!"
He's playing a generic paladin that needs to make himself a hero in order to go up the aristocratic ladder. Though he' supposed to come from far away so it really doesn't matter.
Another player is looking for a way to revive his wife so I could try something with that. But apart from him the rest of the party are supposed to be "do-gooders" but act like murderhobos.
The campaign is all about trying to secure the future of the kingdom. The king is ill and there's a reptilian army trying to take over the kingdom. Yet my players haven't even asked what the fuck is going on and it has been like ten sessions. I am thinking in just info dump them because they won't even pull a random peaseant from the street and ask them. maybe have them encounter an enemy batallion while scouting.
Plus there's all kinds of factions that are trying to seize control of the capital. They were somewhat interesting, but the first thing the group did was try to fuck their shit and run. And now they are complaining that all the factions are made to hate them.
>Yet my players haven't even asked what the fuck is going on and it has been like ten sessions.
So what have they've been doing for the 10 sessions? If they are just murderhoboing around - let them run into refugees on the run from the reptilian army, or if they are traveling to some area, maybe it has been burned and razed by the reptilians before they make it there.
Basically, try to bait them with plot hooks that naturally lead them into the events unfolding in the background. Have some town crier yell something at a market place about the current events - maybe they will notice, maybe not, but don't beat them over the head with it.
>And now they are complaining that all the factions are made to hate them.
Have one of the factions offer them an olive branch - with some strings attached, imply that a faction or perhaps several of them could help the PCs with their personal goals.
>He's playing a generic paladin that needs to make himself a hero in order to go up the aristocratic ladder
>up the aristocratic ladder
That alone right there is pretty fertile ground for roleplaying, scheaming, backstabbing and other underhanded dealings.
For example - have some noble offer him some sort of alliance, you scratch my back and i will in turn help you ascend up the ladder, but such a patron must obviously have enemies as well, both violent and those who simply wish his political plans to fail in a less bloody fashion.
Now, obviously PCs are PCs and sadly there is no guaranteed way they will bite or that they won't just fuck everything up.
...
Boring and predictable. Some "mastercraft." Y'all just suck entirely at roleplaying, huh?
>So what have they've been doing for the 10 sessions?
They asked me for an adventure in the forest so I pulled a one-off off my ass.Turns out I overestimated them and it took them three sessions.
I should have put refugees a long time ago. All of those ideas are gold.
I may have described his PC too well. It's more like naruto or other generic anime protagonist. He just wants to run around until he becomes a knight to kill the evil burgoise that murdered his father. I could still use the noble idea though.
I think if I brought this up in session 10 they would all tell me to fuck off because "it's too late" and "I should have already asked them this"
Dude, OP is new at this. You've got to get him on the training wheels before doing the advanced stuff.
But since you seem to want to be an expert, please share your tips and tricks of how to roleplay better?
Ok, let's give it a shot. List out your player characters, and their goals that you know, what makes them tick.
Then you just get two or three NPC folks who knew some of the people they were involved with that pushes them towards the right direction.
Start by telling us about your player characters, user. Start there.
>tell me to fuck off because "it's too late" and "I should have already asked them this"
Meh, just tell your players it slipped your mind, and ask them to do it anyway, frame it so that doing so gives you more tools to make their experience better.
>All of those ideas are gold.
It's just a matter of thinking how a plot hook can provide some neat activity to the players AND provide some interesting setting information without going overboard with it.
Then, if the players show any interest, or at least no aversion towards the setting info provided in the previous hook just keep offering more plot hooks that build on the information already provided.
By building on, i don't mean they have to continue a set linear plot, but new plots provided by completely new npcs can still refer to elements you've already introduced previously.
>He just wants to run around until he becomes a knight to kill the evil burgoise that murdered his father
You can introduce him to a noble who can introduce him to someone (king?) who might be able to properly knight him - and all of this obviously comes with strings attached.
>He just wants to run around until he becomes a knight to kill the evil burgoise that murdered his father. I could still use the noble idea though.
Have him meet a friend of his father, who gives him some aid, and tells him that he has to show chivalry to be worthy of his father's legacy.
THAT there is roleplaying. You can have that guy give some quests too.
Or, possibly a lover of his father. That tends to go down well. Hell, he could have a half-brother!
>I think if I brought this up in session 10 they would all tell me to fuck off because "it's too late" and "I should have already asked them this"
I posted it more as something to get you thinking than something you should implement literally and exactly. But you could do something less... systematic. Talk to your player about the kind of role-playing experience he envisions. Ask him about his character's motivations and goals, and, putting everything together, try to build some role-play opportunities around that.
In a more general sense, I guess just explore whatever dramatic opportunities arise naturally. Make people--whether allies or enemies, humans or humanoids--behave and react to shit in a way that makes sense and goes beyond just being a set of combat stats. Think what somebody in a similar situation might do in real life. Set up encounters that build off interpersonal drama. Somebody tries to chat a PC up to figure out where they're going (in order to beat them to treasure or ambush them when they're coming back with the booty). An enemy of the PCs (the brother of a bandit they killed, or maybe just a tough guy who doesn't much care for the party's kind) start some shit with them in the tavern (maybe he--and maybe his friends--is just there to beat somebody up, or maybe he has a more lethal intent), and then figure out how the people in the tavern would react to it. Maybe there's a stand-up guy there who tries to warn them, or steps in to help when they're hit by surprise or outnumbered. Maybe there's an opportunity for him to be a longer-term ally or friend. Maybe there's somebody there who is just worried about protecting his goods or money (but who might be grateful if a PC helps him out, providing a possible black market, or regular market connection). Maybe there's a tavern wench who's really impressed with the party. Maybe the tavern keeper is just pissed at the property damage, etc. There are lots of opportunities for conversation.
>Turns out I overestimated them and it took them three sessions.
In my experience, shit in RPGs almost always takes 2 or 3 times as long as you think it will, even after you've corrected for the fact that it always takes longer than you think.
D&D has three pillars: combat, exploration, social interaction (in descending order of number of mechanics dedicated to them)
The simplest formula of a D&D adventure is:
1. Interaction
2. Exploration
3. Combat
For example: players arrive in settlement, and are told about a cave with something interesting in it. Players go to the cave and find some things and traps and hints. Finally, players find a monster at the end and fight it.
This becomes more interesting when you tie the things together: the interaction part can unlock bigger rewards or hints about the later parts.
Another almost as simple variant is to not have a guaranteed combat at the end, but another social interaction AND the possibility of combat. For example: the monster is intelligent and will trade the players for the interesting thing. Players came to save the kidnapped child? The dragon says "sure, we can make a deal, you can have her back if you give me something else I want..."
Well, for one, it's poor form to divide encounters along things that "challenge" or "support" a character's beliefs. That makes the world seem fucking tiny and fully explored. You want to expose characters to shit that they are not equipped to handle and can't neatly slot into their existing worldview.
Moreover, I fundamentally disagree that you should "combine thematically similar encounters the best you can," as that gives rise to every region having a "hat" the way every planet in scifi has a "hat." Instead you should tie thematic elements to NPCs and factions in the game.
Furthermore, if you're "defining the steps required" for a character to reach a goal, even loosely, then you're robbing the player of initiative. Which, yes, that is useful sometimes-- If you have crap players. I don't like to make that assumption.
Beyond that, strictly alternating between "belief" and "goal" encounters means that characters don't get to "go astray." There are many stories about folks using small justifications and getting caught up in the flow of events and finding themselves acting *directly* against their beliefs-- Which is also a prime roleplaying position, frankly.
That's not the extent of it, either-- *Neccesarily* connecting backgrounds elements is just as bad as never doing so, 3x3 ain't any better than "Bob the Human Fighter" in practice because it's still pretty far on the side of inadequate, and finally, as a meta-structure it's so easy to recognize that it is in and of itself immersion breaking.
Finally, if you need to reach this far into the pit to teach the kiddos the basics, then they don't have what it takes to ever be decent roleplayers. Why waste the effort?
And that last kobold that fleed after his comrades got slaughtered, but who the party managed to corner anyway... he's a person too. He's desperate to live and may beg or bargain. Maybe he has some information to offer the party in exchange for his life. Maybe he's just trying to stall the party until reinforcements show up.
And maybe the goblins in the dungeon will be willing work with the party against the common enemy of the kobolds. Or maybe they'll at least be a cautious neutral.
Etc. Etc. Etc.
Really, just take more opportunities to talk in character and see what naturally develops.
>You want to expose characters to shit that they are not equipped to handle and can't neatly slot into their existing worldview.
That's literally the same thing as challenging a worldview.
>You face something that does fit in your worldview
>Your worldview is challenged
>???
>Well, for one, it's poor form to divide encounters along things that "challenge" or "support" a character's beliefs. That makes the world seem fucking tiny and fully explored.
That's not all there is. Not every encounter does one or the other. There are just some that do. And there's nothing keeping them from being nuanced or doing other things as well. I see it as more of a starting point than an ending point.
> *Neccesarily* connecting backgrounds elements is just as bad as never doing so
I think the idea is just that by linking things together, you're creating a a more interactive world, rather than just having a bunch of isolated shit divorced from the rest of the world. But I certainly don't see that any of this (or really anything) prevents you from deviating. These are all ideas that you should ride just as far as they're useful to you, and no farther.
>Well, for one, it's poor form to divide encounters along things that "challenge" or "support" a character's beliefs. That makes the world seem fucking tiny and fully explored. You want to expose characters to shit that they are not equipped to handle and can't neatly slot into their existing worldview.
Uh. What do you think "challenging" someone's beliefs are? If someone believes the law is there to protect people, how exactly are you going to expose a character to things they aren't equipped to handle and not able to slot neatly into their existing worldview? Would it be to... CHALLENGE their belief in the law being there to protect people?
>"combine thematically similar encounters the best you can," is bad because you get hat planets
That's nice but most people don't have the leisure for decade spanning games so compression helps get everyone involved and not just one guy.
>There are many stories about folks using small justifications and getting caught up in the flow of events and finding themselves acting *directly* against their beliefs-- Which is also a prime roleplaying position, frankly.
What part of CHALLENGE BELIEFS don't you get? Are you a moron? Do you not understand why it's being suggested to do exactly what you are saying?
>*Neccesarily* connecting backgrounds elements is just as bad as never doing so
It's a good starting point for new GMs. While it's not strictly necessary, a new GM is going to find it MUCH much easier to get groups working together and not having players have their characters go "what's in it for me?" or "my character wouldn't do that" if the characters are all friends at the start.
Having PvP conflicts as part of the game is advanced GMing.
>if you need to reach this far into the pit to teach the kiddos the basics, then they don't have what it takes to ever be decent roleplayers
I guess you'll never have what it takes to be decent at understanding basic English. Shove it up your pretentious, misbegotten arse.
>The GM has to give me an ok sign to RP
What, are you shouting him down every time he speaks in character? What the fuck does he mean "more roleplay?" Just fucking roleplay, nobody can do that for him. Strike up a conversation with another PC in character, describe what your character does when you have a moment for downtime, add some descriptions that aren't "I attack" to combat. What, does he want you to get a big sign that lights up with ROLEPLAY NOW?
I don't understand how you can ever be pressed for roleplay situations unless your GM is just giving you a slideshow of "you're here, you do this, fight this, you find this, back to town, hooray."
>I think if I brought this up in session 10 they would all tell me to fuck off because "it's too late" and "I should have already asked them this"
While not advocating the pic, I think you can still do it. Just phrase it as a mid game check.
"Hey, we have been playing awhile and peoples characters change, their goals change, even as players where we want to take them changes. So I want to make sure I have a solid idea of where your characters are right now. Please XYZ."
The common usage of "challenging your worldview" is typically "showing the merits of opposing ideologies," rather than "Here are events you did not know could transpire."
>I see it as more of a starting point than an ending point.
Then we're in agreement: The advice as written is fundamentally bad.
>That's nice but most people don't have the leisure for decade spanning games so compression helps get everyone involved and not just one guy.
Keep on making excuses for shitty roleplaying. Doesn't change what you're doing.
>While it's not strictly necessary
You're not talking about the advice as written anymore.
I'm sorry you're too much of a brainlet to get on my level, user.
No.
Challenging your worldview means you are faced with something - it can be an idea, or an event "you did not know could transpire" - that makes you question your worldview, or how you've organized the world in your head, forcing you to re-evaluate. Typically leading to enforcing your worldview, or requiring you to adapt or adopt a different worldview.
>Then we're in agreement: The advice as written is fundamentally bad.
It's a system that you can use, partially use, or just get inspiration from. Nobody's making you do anything, and it shouldn't need disclaimers for that to be clear.
Then by your definition of the phrase, I'm happy to withdraw that one specific objection, even if I do assume anyone needing that advice will handle it ham-handedly and in the manner I described.
It's still a crap image macro that doesn't help anything, though.
>It's a system that you can use, partially use, or just get inspiration from. Nobody's making you do anything, and it shouldn't need disclaimers for that to be clear.
Then it's worthless, because pretty much every modern RPG rulebook does cover the basics of roleplaying as a concept, and they were unable to pull a satisfying amount of relevant information out of it in the first place.
The image is obviously flawed, but it works as a springboard for ideas and inspiration, as pointed out.
Repetitio mater studiorum est.
There's no huge crime done by repeating such ideas on an anonymous image board, if it has use to the OP, then by definition it is useful.
Nice job ignoring the fact that you can't even understand a eight line guidance sheet and got called out by a good proportion of the thread.
Tell you what. You tell me the advanced tips of how to get people roleplaying. I'll ask you again to share with the world how a newbie GM or even a veteran should encourage this stuff, instead of criticizing other pieces of advice. What tips and trick have you used when GMing? Have you even GM'd a game before? You can't say a single piece of advice, can you?
>Pleb mad that has favorite tool got called out as shitty
Kek
So do tea leaves, though.
I'm not claiming there's a huge crime. I'm claiming it's mildly objectionable that advice which isn't actually useful is getting passed off as the holy grail.
So? GMing requires imagination and inspiration, i'm not gonna judge where you get your inspiration if it helps you with your game. As long as you and your players are happy with the end result, it hardly matters where the inspiration came from.
I mean if you actually CAN make a satisfying campaign using tea leaves and bullshit advice, sure, that's great. I don't have any problems with it either.
I just fundamentally don't expect that to happen.
suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com
If you read the original that pic tries to summarise I think it's already supposed to do a lot of the things you want.
The image is flawed, it's not the end all be all of campaign building, and i don't really see anyone promoting it as such.
Can someone take it as gospel and potentially make a campaign formulaic and boring - absolutely yes, but it can just as easily be used as simple inspiration to make something better.
That's nice. Assuming that's true, if that was posted instead of the summary pic, this conversation would be a lot different, don't ya think?
>user cannot contribute to the thread, even when other user attempts to bait him
It's not even my tool, I'm just salty that people call out stuff without suggesting better ideas.
Unrelatedly, a simple method that can get a lot of mileage out of roleplay is getting the party associated with a faction. Allies who both support the party in ways they like and ways they don't like or some who don't support the party at all often proves for good tensions or development.
It also works great when 1/3 of the way through the plot you can rip down the faction with another faction and send the players scrambling to save what they can and take revenge, or to turn the faction the players were allied with into the main bad guys.
Nigga it's trotted out without explanation as "mastercraft.png" and is reeing like a little shit because I dared criticize it.
Though I am pretty happy that the most common response is, "Yeah, it's a flawed image." Some slight faith in Veeky Forums restored by that.
>It's not even my tool, I'm just salty that people call out stuff without suggesting better ideas.
see as you obviously didn't read it, champ. Plenty of suggestions mixed in with calling what I was criticizing crap.
Late to reply back to this so now you have a huge amount of food for thought to digest... Can't help but try throwing on a bit more fat to chew, though.
You say he's far away from his homeland. That doesn't mean there's no way for him to Do Things related to his goal.
Maybe he meets a traveling or disgraced/banished noble from his home court. They could be someone who has information that he can use to help himself... or he can rat on them to gain favor back home.
I also like the idea of meeting his father's (or even mother's) former lover and his half-sibling, just because it provides an interesting situation. Get him to describe his character's relationship with his parent and either play into a bad relationship or disrupt a formerly rosy view of his parent. Place the lover and half-sib in a situation where the PC can either help or hinder, at a cost to him either way - but also possibly at a gain.
Or maybe he runs across people he knows are spies or agents because they worked for his father, or his father pointed them out as working for a rival. Give the spies something juicy to be involved in that the PCs can either interrupt or assist with.
1- Paladin that wants to get famous so his God will make him one of the 200 warriors that his kingdom has. His parents were murdered by the burgoise of that land. The God doesn't give a fuck about the burgoise because he's only interested in defending the people from monsters that come from abroad. He wanted to have a girlfriend that is one of the 200 warriors so he can play her if he wins. Her backstory was the same as the paladin so I at least convinced him that his paladin was jealous of her passing the test. Therefore having an excuse for his stupid decision of leaving all behind just for a chance of maybe speeding things up.
Also his God doesn't let him touch money, yet he is always looking for treasure and once wanted to stage a fight in order to gain money. It was his first time so I gave him a warning.
2-Ork that out of jealousy and rage killed his brother in a non lethal fight for the leadership of the family. He ran away and is looking for redemption. Doesn't want to kill yet he's bad tempered as fuck, that plus he's OP as fuck he ends up with the highest kill count.
Currently has a cosmic curse on his hand which up to now hasn't done anything really. I retconned a player that dropped out after the first session, and now it's inside of him.
3-An alchemist that when he was young lived off lying and tricking people. But one day an alchemist lady had to save him from said angry people. He fell in love with said lady and was fascinated with alchemy. They wanted a child but she wasn't able to make one. One day when the guy comes home he founds her dead know the floor after drinking a potion that failed in make her fertile.
1/?
Eh, you're probably right. I've had a bad day and went off half-cocked. There was some reasonable remarks made about how the guide suggested some steps that would cripple a GM if it was taken as a holy grail as opposed to a suggestion sheet given by a rando user on a osirian neutron-electron-transmission protocol system.
I still think that there's some good advice for a GM starting off, but it should definitely be taken as starter advice than "every campaign should be like this".
4- A bandit whose parents where murdered by the mayor of the town because he wanted to keep his monoponly. He ended up killing the mayor and everybody in his town know it was him yet there's no proof. The replacement the king sent ended up being far worse so he exiled himself again looking for other people in need.
The main idea of his character is that he goes around trying to help but ends up fucking it up even more in the long run.
5-It was the player that dropped out and I am happy he did because he was playing an edgy woman with an ork arm and an ork eye whose parents were killed in a raid. She was taken in by orks who also died by the same raid.
6- And now a sixth player wants to join. He wanted to play a mute Viking because he just wanted to hit stuff. Before I said anything the other players bullied him into not being mute so now he's only a Viking that failed to protect a noble's son so he was exiled.
2/?
And the best part is?
I pretty much agree, because giving universally good advice is actually hard as hell, and the image is a set of shit to try that you can see if your group likes. While I don't want to play with anyone that *actually needs* that, and a lot of that shit very specifically wouldn't work with my group (in part because they'd see it coming), I'm not opposed to other people using it, having fun, and finding what works for them and their group.
They all gathered around when a dead bard sent everyone a letter that invited them to his funeral. There they were asked to protect his hometown. They decided to protect the kingdom as a whole was a better idea.
Because of the paladin's constant nagging I added the burgoise from his island as a faction. There's no way to make him work with them obviously.
Then there's a demon that is fascinated by how mortals think. He even tells the bandit how everything will inevitably end just to see his reaction. They know cultists were trying to bring his lord but they don't know it's the same guy. I am thinking in making the demon convince the alchemist into joining him because he can revive his wife. The only problem is that when he gets into this plane of existence he will enslave everything because he can't put up with so many different opinions so everyone will think as him.
The leader of the reptilian army wants to fuck shit up so bad that the line between the mortals and the dead breaks. There was this one dude that killed his family so he became
king just to kill him. But the dude died in piece, yet he still wants revenge. I am planning in him breaking the line so the demon invades earth.
3/3
So, first off, you've got to think of why these characters are out in the world.
1, 2 and 4 have all got good reasons to be out and about. 3 doesn't seem like they have a good reason, and 6 looks like a big issue and likely to be That Guy. Finding and tying some overriding issue that everyone can get behind wanting to do is a good suggestion. Easiest thing is to put up an external threat that endangers the populace, that will bring fame and fortune from being defeated and may provide wonders like being able to bring back people from the dead.
What's the plot been so far?
Roleplaying is easiest done by giving intermittent allies, I find. Simply having allies to talk to them, ask them about why they're out on the road killing things and wondering about them is the easiest method.
>Also his God doesn't let him touch money, yet he is always looking for treasure and once wanted to stage a fight in order to gain money
This is the guy that asked for more roleplaying opportunities?
Well, it looks like you've already got most of the points in covered.
I think you might need to clarify a bit, because the last part doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.
>They know cultists were trying to bring his lord but they don't know it's the same guy.
???
>reptilian army
???
You've got a good cast of bad guys. Who are the party's allies? Who have they made friends with? Questgivers? Who can they say "these folks will help us out if they can"? They don't need to be great warriors, or magicians, just helpful people.
You need those folks to do easy roleplay. The witty banter done with enemies tends not to be more than a few lines and doesn't go very far. The demon can probably count as an "ally" who can really talk with them and be super helpful as well as give hints that letting him out is going to be a bad idea. But some allied faction or even merchants and friendly folk will go a long way to providing an illusion of safety, people to chat with, and relaxation. It might be that your "that guy" person is after. Friends.
That's everything, if anyone wants to steal something be my guest. I fucking hate phone-posting.
Rivals sound nice, but the paladin will try to steal everyone's fun because
>muh protagonism
So I won't rely too much on them
Yeah I learned that the hard way.
Playing fantasy Gurps if anyone wants to know. But I'll keep that in mind.
They were enjoying the dungeon crawling up to now. He complained out of nowhere that there wasn't enough roleplay.
>does he want you to put a big sign that says ROLEPLAY NOW?
I am starting to think that he actually does
I'm starting to wonder if he's been watching some of those roleplaying shows (Rollplay, Critical Roll; etc) and realizes that a good story is really entertaining, he is not currently doing that, but doesn't recognize that the problem is HIM and not really the DM. (DM seems willing to provide story, just no one is biting.)
Unfortunately, if he's a That Guy, he's not going to realize that he has to make effort and is just going to expect shit falls in his lap and suddenly magically story happens and he can just sit back and reap the benefits.
>"Hey, we have been playing awhile and peoples characters change, their goals change, even as players where we want to take them changes. So I want to make sure I have a solid idea of where your characters are right now. Please XYZ."
I'll say exactly that
I will come back in an hour. Pls don't die
Gotta echo these two, the characters need allies, because interacting with allies is a great chance for some roleplaying. Make these allies obviously useful outside of combat.
Also, try to avoid making all allies shady and potential backstabbers, let them have some allies which are obviously on their side, helps the players relax and actually interact with them, instead of doing what pcs do best - murder npcs.
>They were enjoying the dungeon crawling up to now. He complained out of nowhere that there wasn't enough roleplay.
Woah. Yeah, this is a big thing - if you're mostly only dungeon crawling, there's very little opportunity to roleplay. Get them into a town and have some social opportunities that doesn't involve them just killing things.
Or if they're stuck in a dungeon, have some friendly NPCs pop up, like goblins that are scared and willing to give up precious information and secrets, or prisoners, or folks just passing through.
This, have some central location like a town, city or a village where the characters can go between adventures or dungeon crawls - you need to put some thought in pacing the adventures.
this guy mentioned a pretty important thing, even if it was for DnD, but it does apply to pretty much most games.
Combat/Exploration/Social - with investigation replacing exploration on occasion. These 3 building blocks will help with pacing.
For example, if you've been having dungeon crawls and at least one player complained about lack of roleplaying, it seems like you had more emphasis on combat and exploration and the player was missing the 3rd piece.
To add to this. You don't need to have a single central location, you can have multiple villages and smaller towns and other locations.
And considering there is a rampaging reptilian army skulking around, the characters can assist the smaller villages and farms to evacuate, escort them to some more secure location - you could have some roleplaying with the refugees, handling their problems and still have some combat with possible reptilian forces attacking the retreating people.
Or
The characters can help some town to fortify against the approaching army, again giving a chance to roleplay with the locals
ad both of these also enforce and provide more of the setting information you wanted the players to get.
I don't know what the fuck happened there. I was trying to say that in the first adventure they encountered a bunch of cultists sacrificing children to bring the demon into this dimension. They stopped them and discovered that most of them were being mind controlled by someone. They have been hearing voices that taunted the bandit but of course haven't connected the dots. I didn't expect them to either.
I explained who the leader was. But the lizardmen used to be slaves until the leader called for a revolution and gave the power to his people. They aren't supposed to be very smart so if the leader says that they need to go invade x kingdom they'll do it
>that guy
>wants to actually RP and not just murderhobo
>without him there wouldn't even be a game
Sounds like he's pretty much the opposite of That Guy and you're just a bad GM.
I'll start making allies then. They like to feel like they are legendary heroes so I guess at least one faction will be an army. Problem is that if it isn't gold, armor or weapons they won't care. So it'll be hard to make an ally that isn't Santa.
The worst thing is that they already are in the Capitol of the kingdom. But the first thing they did was bully the innkeeper into giving them a free room, fight the two main factions instead of talking to them and joined a tournament that they wanted me to include. What am I supposed to do then?
Next time they ask me for anything else I'll tell them to fuck off. They always find a way to complain something I did because they asked.
We play in his house which somehow it's between everyone's house, that and half of the group are friends of his. The group would fall apart because of him as a person not as a player.
Yeah, these guys do sound a bit cunty. If they ask you for things like more roleplaying, point out what you've already tried and that it's hard for you to provide what they want when they keep throwing it away.
>fight the two main factions instead of talking to them
How did the two main factions approach them/how did they approach the two main factions?
>Problem is that if it isn't gold, armor or weapons they won't care.
That's alright, the allies are there to help the characters to fulfill their goals, and if fulfilling those goals also pays in money or equipment then so be it.
So the ally itself is not the "goal", but rather the ally can help the heroes with theirs.
Now this help can obviously take several forms, and might even overlap with the ally being a questgiver on occasion as well.
To make the heroes feel like the potential ally is actually useful, have them provide assistance in some form which will actually be of use; information, favors etc. but they have to pay off for the players, otherwise they won't care.
It's in the characters. If you have engaging NPCs, people will want to talk to them, and you can oblige them at your convenience.
The first one was the paladin's dad killer so I didn't expect them to think of them as allies. I had built them as one-dimensional evil as I could, because that's what he wanted. They heard that there were suspicious people gathering at the dock and it turned out to be them.
The second one was a wizard academy which raised divine beings to release them into towns and collect the tribute the peaseants would give them. The players heard a voice calling for help, which was one of the beings, and threw themselves down a well. Went trough the dungeon,avoided traps and when a door opened revealing a dude in a robe asking what was going on, they stabbed him on sight.
Well you kinda backed yourself in a corner, you made one faction evil and the second you made them meet in the end of a dungeon, where they assumed it must be some bad guy.
Next time, just introduce some factions in a neutral way, have them offer the hire the characters for some quest, or some such.
Yeah I should have known better, I was nervous that I couldn't think of anything when they for an adventure in the streets.
Well, thanks everyone for the tips, Now I know where to begin,
Remember:
>Also, try to avoid making all allies shady and potential backstabbers, let them have some allies which are obviously on their side, helps the players relax and actually interact with them, instead of doing what pcs do best - murder npcs.
Add new faction. Have them beg heroes for help.
/thread
Bump.
Op here, that wasn't a very good answer. That may work for video games but not that much in trpg. Other anons helped much more than a:
>HURR DURR JUST COPY SKYRIM
What for? The thread is done, there's not much else to say. I'd like to sage but I can't from my phone.