THANKS FOR BETA TESTING MTGFAGS

So, Hearthstone is already so completely out of ideas they're stuck doing a 1 for 1 copy of Magic cards despite having their hurr randumb effects that Magic can't do?
And this is supposed to be a good thing?

It can't just die for the ability to trigger. It has to hit the graveyard as well (from the battlefield) in order for it to trigger the effect.

For example if my opponent plays Symbiotic Wurm and I Doom Blade (kill spell) it on my turn while having Rest in Peace, the ability won't trigger. This is because Rest in Peace states; "If a card or token would be put into a graveyard from anywhere, exile it instead."
This is what I love about Magic so much. They have such clear and precise rules and texting about everything. And everything has an answer to it.

People don't have to understand hearthstone cards, just play them. You never have to call a judge in hearthstone, if a card doesn't do what you wanted it to do, you just misunderstood it. MTG rules have to be written like legal documents because that's how players are going to treat them.

Hearthstone
>Has a limit to the number of creatures you can have out on the field
Magic
>Lets you have 37,842 Goblins

>It can't just die for the ability to trigger. It has to hit the graveyard as well (from the battlefield) in order for it to trigger the effect.
That's exactly what "dies" means in current MtG rules.
>700.4. The term dies means “is put into a graveyard from the battlefield.”

>not infinite elves

I create 52! Elves

>using a function with only factorial growth

I’m pretty sure 8.0658175e+67 is enough elves.

I pay RB for rakdos charm

>using RB colorset when there's GB

why do you need the mystic here? wouldn't any creature do for this?

Yea, it’s unnecessary.

You can get it down to just 2 colors if you wg instead of wu

Because there isn't a graveyard and exile pile in hearthstone IIRC, so you don't need to state that the effect only goes off from going from battlefield to graveyard.

There are cards that take rules and such from cards in MTG so you need to state that the rule only effects the symbiotic wurm.

Deathrattle is a keyword that pretty much states 'when this creature in put into the graveyard/exile pile from the battlefield do X'

The creatures it summons are either not intended to be beasts or specific class creatures or anything so they don't need to specify creature types or colours/class.
Or they are beasts but it doesnt really matter as the game does half the playing for you, you get what you get no arguing.

Tokens aren't a thing in hearthstone IIRC.

Summon is essentially a keyword that states 'put Y onto the battlefield.'

>Simpler game
>Simpler rules text

I'm shocked.

>15 years in the making
>still shitty

...

"If a card or token would be put into a graveyard from anywhere, exile it instead."
>Instead
RTFC.

You're welcome man, it's a great fun card that gets beginner players excited and advanced players comboing with it. I hope you guys make better use of it than we can; hard to get an 8 mana GGG restricted creature on the board and be relevant.

It was even designed by the same guy.

It only dies if it hits the grave

He literally says in that post that he didn't design that Magic card. HS has gotten shameless in their cardstealing. Not only do they steal the effects and stats, but even the fucking names of the original cards.

If it's exiled, then that means it never died. The point is that this statement:
>It can't just die for the ability to trigger. It has to hit the graveyard as well (from the battlefield) in order for it to trigger the effect.
doesn't really make technical sense.

>mfw I realize that Hearthstone is genuinely superior than MtG

Fuck Rakdos and Simic. Izzet all the way.

>not orzhov

You do understand that
>When Symbiotic Wurm dies, create seven 1/1 green Insect creature tokens.
is literally the current Oracle text for Symbiotic Wurm? Please don't argue about rules if you don't actually know them, "dies" replaced "is put into graveyard from the battlefield" more than 6 years ago.

Only in the sense that it generates more streaming revenue. Kripp would drop Hearthstone in a heartbeat if another game got him more subs

And most hearthstone players wished descriptions were like that, because the ambiguity of certain cards makes figuring out the game so much harder

I always wondered why deathrattle and battlecry aren't keywords in MtG. They happen as often as other important keywords. Maybe add a third one for cards that trigger when leaving the battlefield even if exiled or bounced.

Because that effect isn't just a natural evolution of the evolve concept on a card game, and unstable isn't a generic word used in tons of rapid evolution stuff.

Dies is the keyword for was put into the graveyard from the battlefield,

I meant a keyword for ETB/LTB effects.

Did this guy only shave the left side of his face once? Why does he have very little hair on that cheek and a bunch of hair on the other cheek? Is that why his head leans that way, because it's unbalanced by only one side having pubie hair?

They wouldn't be keywords as each effect is different for each permanent. They would be those italicized "ability words" like:

Morbid -
Radiance -
Raid -
Spell Mastery -
Revolt -

All of which are, in my opinion, completely unnecessary and restricts design space by making that effect exclusive to that particular flavor, plane, or event; it's also incredibly ugly to see cards that have formerly keyworded abilities printed without the keyword due to the aforementioned reason.

If they gave that to every ETB card and every "dies" card, it would be abominable.

Enter the battlefield hasn't been keyworded because of the amendments they can slap onto the end of it.

This is a man that plays a digital children's card game live on camera for an audience of 12 year olds.
Why are you holding him to ridiculous standards

>restricts design space
It doesn't though. Ability words are only put on cards in sets where they are a major theme. The abilities can and do appear in sets without the word preceding them.

>basic grooming achieved by even the most indifferent adolescent.
>ridiculous standards.

>not Golgari

>simpler game
>when you have priests copying your deck, the jadely reminder of jade, quest mage, and the new rogue legendary weapon of 1 mana 5/3

You are correct that it doesn't techincally restrict design space, however, the fact that being able to remove "ability words" from the cards altogether while impacting 0% of the gameplay suggests that they shouldn't be there at all.

Take Rally for example. It wasn't there for Zendikar while being mechanically identical to its "return" in BfZ. Even the reprints of old Zendikar cards haven't had errata to give them Rally and it's incredibly unsightly in supplementary sets that provide pic related.

That might actually be a bad example as BfZ was a design blunder on multiple fronts, but that's just how I see it.

>haven't had errata to give them Rally
>haven't had errata to give them something that has no impact ruleswise
YOU DON'T SAY?!

I think that's the point. If it has no mechanical impact, then what's the point of the ability word's existence?

Technically Rally and the original Zendikar allies aren't the same - Rally effects that apply bonuses to creatures apply them to all your creatures (they just TRIGGER only on allies), the original Zen allies only apply to your allies.
The reason they put ability words in is because if they don't, people bitch and moan about sets not having new mechanics since they aren't explicitly called out as such. Also makes it easier to discuss them, to be fair - it's far easier to say 'morbid cards' than 'those cards that do stuff when something died that turn'

To draw the players' attention to the theme. It's a "hey, this thing is kinda important in this set."

You are all like little babies

that's correct, not Golgari

What's the point of the Hearthstone Wurm making seven 1/1's when your opponent can still attack and hit your face directly and ignore your 1/1 grubs?

so you can attack for 7 after your wurm gets btfo.

But a moderately sized Taunt dude will just trade off with the 1/1 grubs and just hold them off and kill off a bunch anyway. It seems really weak in HS compared to MTG.

FIRST WARHAMMER WITH STARCRAFT AND NOW MAGIC WITH HEARTHSTONE

BLIZZARD IS STEALING EVERYTHING FROM Veeky Forums! WAKE UP!!

Blizzard doesn't actually lift too much directly from us. Not blatantly anyway.

Yes. Which is why they adjusted the mana accost accordingly to compensate for game balance instead of just blindly copypasting all of the stats, which is what a bunch of numale untrained inexperienced devs working on "the hot new game for streemin and meemin!" would do.

new pauper deck idea

>new

how did starcraft borrow from warhammer?

That marines where heavy body armor? Thats about the only thing in common

wear

Ikr

Protoss are obviously Eldar, Zerg are Nids

>stealing the two least interesting factions

Never change Blizzard.

The mystic specifically accelerates into the turn two 3-drop though. Which any mana dork could do, but that's why they picked a mana dork in the first place.

What are you talking about?

Tyranids are based on Starcraft!

Look, I have photographic proof.

>They wouldn't be keywords as each effect is different for each permanent. They would be those italicized "ability words" like:
>Morbid -

No. Nonono no. You misunderstand the whole point. The whole entire point is to shorten card text. Deathrattle and battlecry type effects appear in nearly every magic set, and especially "when this card enters the battlefield" takes up a lot of space on the card. It would be so much more convenient to have that condensed into one word. Same for "when this card deals combat damage to a player".

Hardly the same thing.

Also Neutral creatures are more akin to artifact in mtg. You should be comparing a hunter or druid card.
So your comparison falls a little short.

MtG typography doesn't support shorthand for it that are intuitive or any simpler than what we've already got. Hearthstone lacks activated abilities and can thus getting away with using shorthand before a colon. Magic can't, because a colon is part of how it defines an activated ability.

user you might be retarded

I hate Hearthstone so much

Tokens are... sort of a thing, but the digital nature of the game means they're basically no different from a regular creature, they can be returned to your hand and stay there and everything.

You should understand that Blizzard does not create things, they change existing ideas and market the fuck out of them.

Actually, come to think of it, they'd better fit the idea of "playing a card from outside the game" then anything.

in all fairness the gameplay differences are really neat

Hearthstone is a fucking terrible game and it's obvious Blizzard has no idea what they are doing

And so are 80% of the MtG players so that's one hell of a market potential.

I used to think this as well, but as time has gone on I have realized that it simply has different priorities. Since the game is digital only it can do stuff that MtG simply can't, like have damage on creatures be permanent, buffing creatures while they're in the hand or in the library, and have abilities that trigger off of your deck is constructed, and so on. The combat I used to think was terrible as it favored the aggressor far too much, but I now believe it's just provides a different type of challenge where you need to create a board state where you want your opponent to feel like he has to trade with your creatures but don't give him the opportunity to do so profitably. The one thing I still don't like is the large number of RNG cards, "deals 2-3 to all enemy minions," "deal 9 damage divided randomly between all targets," and so on, because I don't think they provide a fun environment (I at least don't feel clever when they work out the way I wanted them to, and I only get mad when they don't), but I suppose the casual crowd actually does like them.

And....?

I can list a few arbitrary complex rules interactions from mtg if you'd like but maybe you should just google them yourself.

I can tell you're trying to insult people who play magic and defend WotC, but you don't actually make any coherent sense, so I'm going to call you vice president of global brand strategy and marketing.

Thats because hearthstone is a digital only game you mong. On mtgo there are no judges either. Physical magic (or any other physical game) needs judges because there isn't a computer doing the rules interactions.

this. I think hearthstone has a lot of potential, and I especially love the cards that take advantage of it being a digital format.
However, I feel like they constantly keep going back to rng. Discover is more controlled rng, but still rng, and the new recruit mechanic is again, rng you can control through deckbuilding, but still rng.
I get that rng effects are fun and make exciting moments, but kinda getting sick of seeing them all the time.

What pissed me off about Hearthstone is that in it's quest to be as intuitive as possible it hides or omits important info that males learning to play frustrating.
When does it ever tell you there's a limit to how many minions you can have at one time?
Oh this spell puts a random beast into my hand. Where is the list of beasts? Is this list inclusive of all beasts ever printed? Do new beasts that are printed get added to this list?
Ah druid summons a random totem. What are the possible totems I can summon?
It's so many gotchas that feel infinitely worse than the ones that happen in MtG oh, if I kill the source of an ability the ability still resolves? Great I'll use that info to make better plays in the future. Oh I have a minion summon limit? Guess I fucked up this game, I can't wait for some opponent in the future to make the same mistake.

>brainlets incapable of understanding that Magic's very specific effect phrasing allows for a deeper metagame than any other card game

Yeah, the argument against this would be that you can check it online, but quite honestly, you shouldn't have to, this is a modern game. if you are looking at the card in your collection, there should be a sub menu to show what kind of cards it could get.
again, I can understand simplifying stuff for the sake of comprehension, but at least put the info somewhere in game, for the people who want to know.

this, maro pointed out that the sets which did not have a keyword but still did have a theme, were confused for themeless sets at first sight.

How can MTGfags ever recover?

Warcraft 1 was a warhammer license game at first, but the deal got cancelled and they used what they already had in the game to start a new IP.
They realized rebranding stuff works and have been repeating it ever since.

>Meaningless non-mechanics
>Influencing the metagame whatsoever

jej

I'm waiting for good AoS game form Blizzard.

You really want to get into a game of comparing the most complex decks from hearthstone to the most complex decks in magic? Really? The Synbiotic Wurm has so much more text because it needs to specify things like "into the graveyard" and "from the battlefield" because the rules for how things can be gotten rid of are more complex in nature. In addition Hearthstone is computerised: It can get away with not telling you that the grubs are beasts because the computer handles it, magic cannot. The fact that the Hearthstone card is more condensed isn't because of more nuanced writing; it's because more is handled for you.

But then we'd need to differentiate between keywords for dealing damage to a player and dealnig combat damage to a player. And possibly "attacks and isn't blocked."

ETB as a keyword is a solid concept, but the opportunity to change that has probably already sailed as the effect we know of as a triggered ability has been roughly the same since around 4th edition.

There are about 59 cards in Ixalan alone that use "When ~ enters the battlefield", including non-creature permanents. Flying occurs 23 times, Trample occurs less than 15.

Shortening "When ~ enters the battlefield" to a keyword is possible (See Fabricate or Exploit), but it's impractical to do so for every single card that has a unique effect, resulting in 23,586 keywords; this kills the new player, and probably annoys everyone else.

Of course if it were another time, Wizards could very well introduce what user suggests, which would look something along the lines of:
(ETB)
Pseudokeyword - you gain 3 life
Pseudokeyword - destroy target creature
Pseudokeyword - return target creature you control to its owner's hand.

As opposed to :

When Aven of Enduring Hope enters the battlefield, you gain 3 life.