GURPS is shit

>Why isn't first aid and physician the same thing?

Because they're not the same thing, troll. I'm certified annually in CPR and basic 1st aid as part of my job. Unlike a physician, I cannot diagnose illnesses, inject or prescribe medications, or do a host of other things.

>>Why isn't searching, scavenging and foraging the same thing?

Because they're not the same thing, troll.

Searching is a general ability. Scavenging refers to identifying useful items. Foraging refers to identifying and collecting food. Looking for a lost child is not the same as finding a functioning alternator in the junkyard and both are not the same as find/identifying which wild plants have edible tubers.

Try again, asshole.

They enjoy it for the same reason people enjoy 3.5 D&D/Pathfinder and 5e D&D despite the so many clear flaws in those.

My point is, what is the point of separating those skills? What does this do besides create needles complexity where it's not needed?

>gurpsgen
why would the 3 people who play gurps need their own general?

>My point is...

Your point is on top of your head, troll.

>> what is the point of separating those skills?

Because they're very separate skills which do very separate things.

>>What does this do besides create needles complexity where it's not needed?

It only creates complexity when you purposely use them to create complexity, troll.

You don't have to use every one of those skills in your game, but those skills are available for people whose games do need them.

Stop pretending that you don't "understand" that different games & settings need different skills & rules.

>this is obviously a bait thread!
Glad you agree.

Some of your stuff is blatantly wrong. Gurps is still supported by SJG. The integrated setting is in the second book of the basic set. The name isn't terrible, and the skill lis is diverse because it's a system meant to accommodate lots of playstyles and campaign settings. And if you want to keep things simple, do it and remember that every skill has a default in case a player doesn't have it written on their sheet.

And yes it's not the most played system. Why is that a problem?

>calling out faggot like op
I'm not a fan of GURPS, but I like you. Would have a beer with/10 for sure

>I'm not baiting, I genuinely want to hear why people enjoy this system when there's so many clear flaws
They are not. No one plays it, impossible to find a game.

Show us on the doll where the bad GM touched you.

Maybe more people would play it if it were a good system

How is this thread not deleted

Do your job janitors

E-everywhere

Oh (you)

Can't he have a long day without having long legs?

He's a long guy

You don't get to bring legs.

Tell me about dog, why does he wear the pants?

You're right. I can't and neither can anyone else. The system is a dumpster fire.

Why is GURPS shit? It can't do the one thing any good system can do: Make a stand user. You say it can? Go ahead, make one and show it to me, I dare you faggot, it can't be done

...

> Overbloated skill list with useless shit like "Gardening", "Dropping" and "Connoisseur"
I'm sorry your GM only runs hack & slash.

> No integrated setting makes reading the book a drag
Confirmed for not reading the books, GURPS infinite worlds is the intergrated setting. otherwise, valid critique regarding the basic set. The layout is shit

>No longer supported by SJG
I am OP and what is pyramid?

>Making powers is tedious, not fun and requires too much time
Nice subjectivity.

>No one plays it, impossible to find a game
Yeah XD why does anyone even play something that's not D&D?
>Terrible name
Yes, it really is.

And there it is, pack it in and go home.

Bitch please, popularity has never had anything to do with quality. D&D is the most popular roleplaying game and it's fucking trash.

Please don't so obviously samefag.

Have you actually played GURPS? Because it's fun as hell. Maybe if you're some kind of autist who can't handle choice, then it might be difficult I guess.

Stand Advantage metatrait for humanoid stands:
Ally, Minion, Summonable Sympathy (Death of one party kills the other), Always appears (no roll required).

Stand:
Insubstantial (affects substantial)
Divine Curse: Cannot be more than X yards away from 'stand user'
Walk on air.

(various other modifiers apply depending on the stand, such as super strength, super jump, altered time rate, extra attack, etc).

I said build me a character, not give me some shitty ass rules

Give us a character, then.

I mean I agree with you, but quite a few of your points seem kind of meandering.

The reason GURPS is a bad game is not because of anything wrong with it inherently, but because its easily (if not always) outperformed by a game more specifically designed for a task.

Its the same reason DnD is trash at fantasy - because it tries to merge together far too many fantasy genres and just results in a mess (things like the endless caster/non-caster balance and such stem from trying to get everything in there)

>not give me some shitty ass rules
How do you build a character if you don't allow rules?

Not him but could you stat Star Platinum? It is the most basic stand or C-Moon/Green, Green Grass of Home/ Made in Heaven which are more complitacted

>- Overbloated skill list with useless shit like "Gardening", "Dropping" and "Connoisseur"
Required for detailed characters. Not your style of play? Wildcards exist.

>- No integrated setting makes reading the book a drag
Infinite Worlds exists in Campaigns, but the lack of integrated setting is intentional because it's Generic and Universal. Can't be that with a baked-in setting.

>- No longer supported by SJG
They just released a new book this month, released Discworld and Mars Attacks within the past few months, and Pyramid Magazine is still published for GURPS every month. Flat-out lie.

>- Making powers is tedious, not fun and requires too much time
Your opinion.

>- No one plays it, impossible to find a game
True, so you have to start a game yourself and get others into it.

>- Terrible name
Your opinion. I like it.

Ignoring the mechanics of how Stands come to exist, since there are several ways to do so, each with their benefits and drawbacks (one build is clean in chargen but messy in play, one is messy in chargen but clean in play, and there are various hacks/homebrews floating around), I'll focus on Star Platinum's abilities.

>Super Strength: Can throw a loaded Jeep one-handed
A Jeep's LWt. (loaded weight) in GURPS is 1.6 tons, and you can lift up to BLx2 with one hand in two seconds. That means he needs a BL (Basic Lift) of 1,600 pounds, which is ST 90, which is ridiculously strong.

>Super Speed: Can catch bullets
This is Enhanced Time Sense, which allows you to parry bullets. Easy.

>Self-Preservation: Protects Jotaro from harm
This is a combination of Sense of Duty and Danger Sense. The former means he looks out for someone at all costs, and the later is "Spidey Sense," which gives him a Perception roll even if one normally wouldn't be allowed to get a defense.

>Precision: Perform brain surgery by hand
This is just a high base DX (Dexterity), along with a lot of levels in High Manual Dexterity; somewhere in the 20's to be able to perform brain surgery, by hand, with no formal Surgery training. Still cinematic.

>Enhanced Eyesight: See a dude 4km away
GURPS converts 1.5 KM to 1M, so we're looking at roughly 2.5 miles away. The SSR (Size and Speed/Range) Table says spotting something 2.5 miles away takes a -20 modifier, and the dude was trying to hide, so we're looking at a high base Perception, along with 10~20 levels of Acute Vision, depending on base Perception.

>Star Finger: Thrust with finger up to two meters (yards) away.
This is either three levels of the Growth advantage limited to the fingers with Reduced Time added on to make it instant enough for an attack, or an Innate Attack that has a reach of C-2, meaning it can attack from within the same hex to two hexes away.

And that's Star Platinum.

>The reason GURPS is a bad game is not because of anything wrong with it inherently, but because its easily (if not always) outperformed by a game more specifically designed for a task.
I disagree, Plato. Just because a game is designed for a specific setting or genre, there is no reason the mechanics won't be trash at executing that brief as developer ineptitude vastly outstrips any benefit gained from a tight focus. RPG design is not a points-buy where GURPS bought versatility at the expense of being good at any specific thing.

GURPS doesn't actually try very hard to squash every genre,setting and style into a single system all at the same time. Rather it has a universal skeleton ruleset, onto which additional rules and supplements can be grafted to tailor it for a given game with as much if not more genre specific focus as a another rpg devoted solely to that task. And it does that pretty handily since the base system works well and the supplements are well-written.

Three games about campy Superspies (Action with lots of Wildcard skills), megacrunchy SWAT troops on 22nd century Mars (Ultra-Tech, Tactical Shooting) and Wizard Politics on Yrth (Banestorm, Thaumatology, Social Engineering) are going to play very differently because rules have been added and swapped out like cartridges rather than having one clunky system that attempts everything all at once.

GURPS also does detailed crunchy combat, both modern gear-queer operators operating operationally and more historical martial arts from medieval knights to shaolin monks, extremely well and is probably one of the best rpgs out there for that kind of thing. While also having the option of fast-paced simple combat if that's more your thing.

Alright, gonna try C-Moon next, since I think it's doable. A point to make here is that, in GURPS, you pay for effect, so sometimes you use seemingly inappropriate advantages to achieve the desired effects.

>Gravity Shift: Repulsion area centered on Pucci that reaches out 3km
This is Telekinesis with a shitload of Area Effect, along with Emanation (to center it on yourself) and Repulsion (can only push things away from you) with sufficient levels to be able to push objects away from him. This would probably be a strength equal to or exceeding Star Platinum, haven't gotten far enough to see for myself.

>Surface Inversion
This is effectively a bundle of powers. One of them just kills things via inversion, which is Affliction with the Heart Attack enhancement. The destruction of it is a special effect, like inverting someone's chest. To be able to trap opponents is Binding with optional Engulfing and a requirement for there to be objects that could theoretically trap someone if inverted. Buy as many levels as you want to represent the difficulty of escape. Throwing things is just Telekinesis again, or Throw Anything with a few levels of Super Throw from GURPS Supers.

>Time Acceleration (Minor): Babies grow near him, ice cream melts
This is where things get difficult. To affect organics, it's Affliction with Short Lifespan. This shortens the time before maturity, which means they will age rapidly while within the area effect. There's not really a way that I know of to make things break down around you without again resorting to Affliction with Heart Attack, so I'm going to say it's that. Re-reading Made in Heaven, the ability could also be represented with an area affliction of Decreased Time Rate, which makes you slower, and afflict multiple levels of it.

Of course, as this is a GM only Stand, pretty much, they can do whatever they want without statting it. But it's fun to try!

Green, Green Grass of Home is actually really simple. It's multiple instances of an Affliction with Shrinking and the Aura enhancement, each a lower level with more Area Effect than the previous. As one gets closer (traverses the Area Effect thresholds), they have to roll to resist shrinking even further. I'm not gonna touch Made in Heaven since the spitballing I did earlier already gave me a headache.

Most GURPS complaints are actually DM complaints, something which can be said about any RPG.

That being said, have you ever been part of a group which chose not to play in a certain genre or setting because everyone would have to learn a new rules set? I have and it sucks.

I use GURPS so we can shift between settings and genres with little fuss. We can finish a Trek campaign, shift over to low fantasy musketeers, and then switch to cosmic horror while using pretty much all the same rules. We find playing in new genres keeps interest in our sessions high. It's never a case of Yet Another Dungeon Crawl over the next several sessions.

Of course, other folks will have other opinions.

>That being said, have you ever been part of a group which chose not to play in a certain genre or setting because everyone would have to learn a new rules set?
No, thank goodness. I've been very lucky in my groups and regularly switch systems and try new ones. A few players have had favorite systems they always chose when they ran games and there were times when we played one system a lot for a while but overall people are always up for trying something new if someone is willing to run it.
Being trapped in an endless D&D loop because
trying new things is scary sounds like a personal hell.

I know I'm very fortunate, and I totally see why a group that is more reluctant to branch out would find the modular nature of GURPS useful in granting variety without learning a new system.

...

>I've been very lucky

You have been and enjoy it for as long as you can.

The group I wrote about isn't as reluctant to branch out as much as they short of time. It's a kids, jobs, etc., thing more than anything else. The core of the group gamed together in college and now we try to get together 1 or 2 times a month. It's usually a Sat/Sun involves 3-4 hours of gaming plus a meal. While comfy has a lot of negative connotations, our sessions are definitely comfy in a good sense.

The modular nature of GURPS also meant a couple members picked up GURPS Lite when they joined us and have needed nothing else to play ever since.

So, you have no ground questioning the design of the game system itself so now you are arguing for the superiority of specific preferences? Should have invested in that Internet Trolling skill, my friend, as right now your efforts are just embarrassing.

I like GURPS and I have also played many other systems. That counts as trolling now?

Why do the zero people who play eclipse phase need their own general?

It's easy to make and gets people talking.

>Why isn't first aid and physician the same thing?
Because it's not the same thing.

>Why isn't first aid and physician the same thing?
Imagine your little sister wants to play as a character from ER
Imagine if her friend wants to play a character from Grey's Anatomy
Simply they need different stats.
Now imagine if you want to play as generic doctor. here, here you use wildcards.
Now imagine if you don't wanna bother. now you can use physician or first aid as one or the other based on what you prefer.

GURPS just give you a lot of freedom. you don't need it if you want to do the same thing countless others rpgs already do

>complains about GURPS
>WOW WHAT AN OBVIOUS BAIT
>I'm not baiting tho
>WOW WHAT AN OBVIOUS BAIT
/thread

>Prove me wrong
>Protip: You can't
Y'all uneducated crackers need to familiarize yourself with Karl Popper and the principle of falsification.

>Why isn't first aid and physician the same thing?
Qué?

Lets be real here, GURPs is amazing, but the name's pretty terrible. Pls no obvious shill.

>56930393
>GURPs

>troll
>troll
Methinks the user has hit a nerve.

OP is right though, too much granularity harms a game, it doesn't make it better. This is why most people don't play GURPS.

You're right that a physician wouldn't know 'surgery' and so on, but it doesn't need to be a different skill from 'first aid' and so on. CofD solves this problem very elegantly by rolling it altogether into 'Medicine', and represents specialties through, well, player defined specialties.

That's right, even an RPG system for total faggots does skill variance better than GURPS.

It's not better, it's just to your liking more.

>That filename
GIDF, I love it

Yeah, only Satan would like needless granularity. Those tips check out.

But seriously, if we've learned anything from the past two decades of RPG evolution, it's that granularity is un-needed. I don't need a banking skill when I can write it in as a specialty for Academics. I don't need gardening skill when I can write it in as a specialty for Crafts.

Even something like power creation can be streamlined into simple archetypes as we see in Unknown Armies 3e. I don't need to track the hypotenuse of 1/4 points divided by SIN to make a balanced power in that system.

At the end of the day, if you like GURPS, you like GURPS, it not your fault that you were born autistic. But stop recommending it to people for their games. You wouldn't offer your abacus when we have computers and calculators, don't offer an outdated system.

>But seriously, if we've learned anything from the past two decades of RPG evolution, it's that granularity is un-needed.
Funny, I've learned the opposite. Only GURPS has lived up to the granularity I desire in RPGs. You also miss the part where every GURPS skill has multiple paragraphs written on them so you understand what they're meant to cover, unlike other games where a speciality, at best, gets a sentence or two explaining what it does.

>I don't need to track the hypotenuse of 1/4 points divided by SIN to make a balanced power in that system.
You don't in GURPS either, though? Is adding and subtracting percentages, then multiplying the trait's cost by that somehow too difficult for you?

>At the end of the day, if you like GURPS, you like GURPS, it not your fault that you were born autistic. But stop recommending it to people for their games. You wouldn't offer your abacus when we have computers and calculators, don't offer an outdated system.
On the contrary, GURPS is the computer here, and other systems are the abacuses. Abacusii? GURPS does much more than them, is very powerful, and very flexible. An abacus can do one thing, which is count, and it does so poorly. Of course, if you want to use a computer, you need to be able to program or use software made by others. Thankfully, GURPS is in no short supply of either.

I really really really like this picture

>if we've learned anything from the past two decades of RPG evolution, it's that granularity is un-needed.
How does the entirety of RPG design lead you to conclude that one type of emphasis is un-needed? Can't people argue that instead of taking
>Crafts:___________
They should just be able to roll INT because it's all mental based at the end of the day.

Pick the system you like, nobody is autistic because they know how to do basic addition and subraction.

>He doesn't grow his own magic herbs
>He doesn't have a sentient Enola Gay as a party member
>He doesn't use his knowledge of fine wines to infiltrate high class dinner parties
>He doesn't build off the open ended lore that the books totally have
What kinda shit show you runnin here boy?

Most of these aren't undoubtedly bad points.
What turns me off is that preparing for a game takes as much effort as building your own Linux distributive

>What turns me off is that preparing for a game takes as much effort as building your own Linux distributive
This is a legitimate thing about GURPS and it's funny that you use the Linux analogy because I've been saying that for years. GURPS is a very front loaded system and can put a lot of work on the GM's plate depending on how many rules you bring into the campaign and how many splats you need to consult.

There are ways around it like using GURPS lite and preparing templates for character creation so that players don't have to spend so much time shopping. But really GURPS requires some decent work to get running, but once it's running it is a very smooth experience in my opinion.

I don't understand the confusion.
Dogs pant all the time!

...

I wonder how that dog got pants and shoes on

>GURPS is a very front loaded system and can put a lot of work on the GM's plate
Yes, it is. Again, it's not supposed to be a game, it's a toolset to make a game with.

You don't go like "oh, I want to play D&D, LET ME JUST TAKE OUT MY GURPS." No, people don't do that. I, for one, only DM shit that I build myself, and GURPS is perfect if you like the game building process that comes with each campaign. It's just the right amount of generic with just the right amount of rules. People recomend Fate over GURPS all the time, but I find that GURPS is just more fun to play around as a DM.

>ITT: forever players that don get it.

...

>argumentum ad populum
You're not behaving like a smart person would, user.

I think the biggest flaw is that GURPS (the basic set at least) comes with 0 GM advice on how to use the rules. Yes it's packed to shit with mechanics and all of them are modular but there are no examples of the process of actually putting together a coherent set for a campaign. There are character building examples and examples of play, but these completely miss the point as well. If GURPS is a toolset and not a game, then the examples in the book are the equivalent of a carpentry manual teaching you how to paddle a homemade canoe.

>ITT: forever players that don get it.
I have been playing GURPS on and off since my friend got me into 3e years ago. And I've been GMing GURPS games for almost 3 years. But of all the things brought up in this thread this was by far the most credible complaint about the system. I obviously don't mind it but it's something that scares off people from learning the system when they realize they can't just pick up a premade setting or have a list of character templates already made for them. It's a ruleset that definitely can inflict the Paralysis of Analysis on newcomers.

That's why I'm cool with the new direction SJG is going with all these "powered by GURPS" splats. I hope that a compiled book like Dungeon Fantasy or Diskworld will get people to start using GURPS more and then they can bleed over into basic set to do whatever else they want.

There is the "How to be a GURPS GM" book written by Mook that I think needs to be added to the next edition under Campaigns. There is no reason for that second part of the Basic Set to be so thin.

>the next edition

Jokes on you OP, I played a game yesterday.

Gurps is fun in the way RPG maker is fun, you can use it for anything from a crappy resident evil remake to something like Yume Nikki

All depends on the GM like any other system.

Plus the name tells me exactly what it needs to.

Tell us about your game user

GURPS isn't much fun because you have to play it with the kid gloves on. You can't optimize in it, at all (without breaking the game anyway), and so any sense of tactical accomplishment is tarnished by the fact you know you're not able to actually play your best in it.

Other than that, it's a slightly clunky, overly detailed 80s RPG that offers nothing special if you're not the sort of person that feels the need to outline and differentiate positively every facet of your character. Once you start doing things like cutting out rules and playing with wildcard skills, you're better off using a game that was actually designed to be somewhat light-weight like Fate or Savage Worlds.

Actually have two
1)
Basic Zombie apocalypse game w/ slow zombies. More about social engineering that’s combat.
2) a supers game, in which I am playing a archmage with the personality of Kars and the appearance of David Bowie

A new edition of the Basic Set is totally doable.
Not of the whole game, just a remade BS.

An official 5th edition is probably never going to happen. SJG pumps all their money into Munchkin now, and the little attention it gives to GURPS goes to those supplements to 4th edition. A new edition would be a sizeable project, so unless it's unofficial fanmade BS, I don't think we'll ever see a 5th edition of the Generic Universal Roleplaying System.

>No integrated setting makes reading the book a drag
>no integrated setting
>Generic Universal RolePlaying System
>Universal

hmmm

...

Unless there's a sudden surge in GURPS popularity and a drop in Munchkin popularity, which there won't be, There is no way that an full official GURPS book will ever come out, again, and I don't mean pyramid or small side books like the dungeon fantasy series or thaumatology. I know there was a Dungeon Fantasy box set, but it was only funded due to kickstarter, was just material put into a box with minis and a map, and sold like shit

I will only accept your second game if at some point you play some random bitch like a human guitar

AYYYYY NAT 20 EPIN
*WHIRRRR*
OH GOD NO
*BRHGLPNFKT*
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
*SHUFFLING SHUFFLING*
DEAR LORD SAVE ME
*TYNFGTYTFCVST*
BUT I ROLLED A NAT 20 SAV-
*BRAAAAAP*

Is it wrong that this meme gets me kind of hard
especially the brapp

>oh hey, what's going on in this th-

AM, the Great and Powerful is so vastly removed from reality (well, ours) that he barely uses his massive social abilities (200 IQ and Appearance: Transcendent).

For example, during the vampire yakuza arch the big boss was actually immune to sunlight.

So he teleported him 3 m from the sun.

I am suddenly reminded that for some bizzare reason GURPS 3e put out conversions for oWoD Vampire, Mage and possibly Werewolf. And snuck in their own copycat game Voodoo: The Shadow War into the lineup.

>- Overbloated skill list with useless shit like "Gardening", "Dropping" and "Connoisseur"

It's a universal system. You have to cover all the bases. Gardening is used for tending deadly herbs that you're going to use to poison the king. Connoisseur (you're supposed to specialize) is used to gauge the value of gems, weapons, tapestry, etc. Dropping is a bit of a misnomer, I'll admit (nothing can be perfect). Dropping is used to drop shit while flying. A little stupid, sure, but no system is perfect.

>- No integrated setting makes reading the book a drag

What is Infinite Worlds?

>- No longer supported by SJG

Proof?

>- Making powers is tedious, not fun and requires too much time

That's your opinion.

>- No one plays it, impossible to find a game

I play in 4 groups.

The funny thing is, the original version of mage was so shit, that the GURPS conversion was more popular due to not having shit mechanics

>I play in 4 groups

Oh god please tell me how, I can't even get oen

I go to the GURPS discord to recruit. Helpful people.

I got lucky when I found a group of 5 on roll20. The GM is good, the players are good, etc. My friend and I joined. One of the guys in the group is a GM as well and he just started up his own game my friend and I joined. Then my friend found another game on Roll20 and we joined that one (though it's slowly dying). Then I started my own game that includes me, my friend, a guy from the first group, a new guy, and another guy I got from the GURPS discord.

L-link to the discord?

discordapp.com/invite/89yqtsx