/wfg/ Warhammer Fantasy General

They don't hate civilization, they just don't really like it. There is a subtle difference - they don't see a need to tear it down, just like priests of Taal and Rhya don't call for civilization to be torn down. They can even coexist fairly well even in larger cities, at least in Talabheim.

The Beastmen are not only anathema to nature on some level, being twisted creatures of Chaos and not really of the natural world, but they corrupt nature through their presence - it's not just tearing down buildings and desecrating temples, it's tainting the land and murdering creatures for food and amusement on a scale that no human would.

Not much, just tweaks to lore.
Explore what expatriate Dwarves and Elves are like. Are there any born and raised in the Empire? What are they like?
Expand more on the Halflings, they don’t really have much going on other than being a joke race. Orcs can be funny or scary. Halflings can’t really be serious, even with blood soaked fertility rituals or something
It always bothered me that Steam Tanks are this lost technology, that nobody know how to build. It’s not like the Dwarves who had thousands of years to rise and decline by “present day”. Magic is already mysterious and arcane, technology should be more firmly rooted. I’m not against clockwork horses or primitive submarines or explosive malfunction, I’d just think inventing one shouldn’t be a incomprehensible miracle. Engineers should be arguing about patents and who made it better.
Give each province a unique unit or unit upgrade, just for fun.

I’d be interested to see a time of Empire disunity, we see a lot of what it’s like for the Empire to unite against a foe, what’s it like when they’re squabbling and the Emperor is weak. Maybe as the setting of a campaign or similar.

Crunchwise?

Empire Free Company are Skirmishers, and can take Pistols. Huntsmen can buy Traps to lay down as Dangerous Terrain.

Make Pistoliers a "generic" Fast Cav core that can be built as "Spear+Pistol+Shield", dual pistols, or with Crossbow (ala Roadwardens). They can take Heavy Armor, but lose Fast Cav if they do this.

Rather than "Inner Circle vs Reiksguard," you can have customizable Knightly Orders. Core Knights get one trait, Specials get two.

Bring back War Wagons. Allow them to either be used as a transport for smaller units, to mount a Wagon Howitzer (akin to a lighter Galloper Gun), or a platform for an Engineering School. Heck, bring back Engineering School apprentices, mancatchers, hookhands and heavy blunderbusses and all.

Make the Steam Tank customizable. Make it able to swap out its Hull Cannon for an Armored Prow or mini-Helblaster or a pair of Swivelcannon Sponsons, and to replace the Steam Turret with either a Mortar, Helstorm Battery, or Passenger Platform. A Master Engineer may take a Steam Tank as a mount.

You nominate *one* target for your Witchhunters at the start of the game. When that target dies, you nominate a new target. No fiddling with keeping track of individual targets for individual witchhunters.

Bring back Aldred's Casket of Sorcery for the trollfu. Allow a Captain or General to ride a Demigryph. Allow a Grandmaster to take three Order bonuses.

Stereotypically, Dwarfs get a rap as the "easiest" to use. They don't move much, don't cast magic...they just shoot, shoot some more, and wait for you to bounce off them in melee before they shoot you more. Skaven are similar (the "Shooty Army of Death"), except they actually have Magic, shit leadership, move faster (though they have no cavalry) and their melee is more a sponge to tarpit stuff while they shoot into melee. ("Pin stuff in place with Skavenslaves, shoot with Warp Lightning Cannons.")

TOMB KINGS FUCKING LEAKED BY INTEL TOMB KINGS LEAKED BY INTEL! ALL ABOARD THE SETTRA TRAIN IT"S FINALLY HAPPENING!

thanks for responses, i'm new to warhammer

skaven are hard
ogres are easier

I've only ever tried WoC but they are quite straight forward and thus easy to get grasp on. You take the big scary things, enough warhounds and warriors to fill out core and then you point them in the direction of your enemies.

I want to model Squigs for my Mordheim O&G band, but don't want to hunt down metal or fuck with Finecast. What modeling advice would you recommend for building Squigs?

I am also interested in converting up some Birdmen of Catrazza, and was wondering what would do well for their helmets.

Care to explain why it's less balanced?

That's cool, helping new folks learn is good. And it's better than a question that's obviously become more of a meme that's been asked thousands of times.

So from the TK leak confirms bird people, jackal people, Khaldia, and the badass snake cav. In the background there's a monster of some kind, does anyone know what it is?

No big hats.

noice user, thanks

the tomb kings 8th ed army book in the pastbin is a good bet, you might enjoy what lies within user

Ind, Cathay, and Nippon don't really have a lot of canon info around them, right? running an RP game soon, and one of my players is building a DnD monk and fluffing it as a dude from Ind. Just wanna make sure we're not contradicting any concrete lore

pretty much none
ind beastmen are tiger people
thats all I know

Shame that the TKs will probably be given all their retarded 8th edition shit, Necropolis Knights,
Necrosphinx, Hierotitan, renaming the bone giant, etc.

SETTRA DOES NOT SERVE, SETTRA RULES!

Look at the red/blue triangles. It's either a Khermrian Warsphinx or a Necrosphinx as my picture shows.

t.butthurt spear and archer army.

what else are they going to give them user>? have them have the roster they had just after the undead army split?
wow such army variety.

8th brought a heap of cool looking monsters for megabucks and then made them easy to blow up with cannons. the video game adaptation ironically made cannons less effective at that roll and will likely cost 20ausbuckaroos . All the downsides of 8th ed monsters negated to me.

>It always bothered me that Steam Tanks are this lost technology, that nobody know how to build. It’s not like the Dwarves who had thousands of years to rise and decline by “present day”. Magic is already mysterious and arcane, technology should be more firmly rooted. I’m not against clockwork horses or primitive submarines or explosive malfunction, I’d just think inventing one shouldn’t be a incomprehensible miracle. Engineers should be arguing about patents and who made it better.
THANK YOU, Reverse Engineering shit is *not* that hard for someone trained in the discipline.
Super Duper Hard to make, to the point where its *almost* impossible? fine.
*Literally* Impossible? Now im annoyed

It's canon that Tileans are smarter than Imperials.

the steam tanks are reverse engineered
the orignal 12 are lost but the best of the 12 was reproduced and is the one they use

well user here is a real life example.
How do you make greek fire, why is it that the mysteries of the aquaducts were forgotten for centuries

what about the laser that could set boats aflame.

how were the pyramids made?

In all seriousness leonardo da vinci but warhammer died before he could share all his shit, the steamtanks can be repaired to an extent but are never as efficient as they were initially. The marienburg landship was an attempt to 'remake' the steamtanks and it goes into the problems the engineers had in lore.

All I'm saying is it's more likely than you think

Question for lorefags: how big of a deal would it be if the dwarfs took back Karak Ungor?

I hope it's the Warsphinx. The Necro one look super edgy.

spear, archer, cav, chariots, scorpions, catapults, ushabti, vultures, insect swarms, bone giant...

I do love the giant snake dudes though, it's more a dislike of the specific designs of the knights and necrosphinx that GW went with so hopefully CA will dump the knights and come up with a better design for the sphinx.

The sad thing about 8e monsters was that you could clip one by the toe with a cannon and instantly wound it and kill its rider.

I am a fan of: A cannon does Damage = 2d3 max across all of its targets, and in the case of a ridden monster, the defender allocates wounds.

huge fucking deal. The Dammaz Kron, the book of grudges, would need like 8 pages torn out of it from all the vengeance that would give. IT's the VERY FIRST lost dwarfhold, before they even met the empire.

Huh neat. Might make a nice mega-campaign, huh?

mega is right. Not only is it old as dirt, its DEEP too- some of the lore ive read, not sure if canon, has it as reaching down to the fucking mantle
And you'd have to purge every last one of those Red Eye grobi scum.

Oh but what a way to go, eh?

What would be a good idea for a small skirmish campaign; I'm thinking about thirty to fifty models a side at the most?

Journey to Khemri. Build pyramids and shit, set up caravans and oasis and stuff. Alternately, an Ivory Road campaign.

I can't wait for you fucking Chaos Gnomes to get BTFO when CA unveils the CD faction using Forgeworld models. Such faggots.

I'd like to suggest a Forum Quest to you, that I think you'll be interested in: A Dynasty Of Dynamic Alcoholism, on the Sufficient Velocity forums. It's basically OstlandQuest, but through the power of Plot, our character winds up as part of a campaign to take karak ungor. (and gets the shit kicked out of him, but thats normal for him) most recent update just had the KU campaign finish after 92 updates, and we're finally back to regular CK2-style turns
Just be warned: Its long as fuck. Still a really satisfying read.
forums.sufficientvelocity.com/threads/warhammer-fantasy-a-dynasty-of-dynamic-alcoholism.13745/

We all agree that the engineers of the Empire know how to make wheellocks and flintlocks and stuff, right? They're skilled at that, trained, probably know the theory if not all the physics. If you handed them a bolt action rifle, they probably wouldn't be able to recreate it - or if they did, it'd be somehow flawed, because they wouldn't know exactly why some parts came together they way they did.

That's probably what happens with the Steam Tanks. They are just too far ahead of their time, built by a genius working with stuff that no one else in the Warhammer world seems to have done. They might know enough to keep them in repair - a fuzzy idea of how the parts of the tank function, the level their steam engine works at, and all that - but there's no single craftsmen like their not!Leonardo da Vinci that can pull all these desperate parts together the same way.

does anyone have inormation on the celestial dragon monks or are they "No-Nook-Published Limbo"?

Because Beastmen are LITERALLY WHFB'S VERSION OF BLACK PEOPLE.

What about the dudes from Araby? Or Nekehara, lack of skin notwithstanding.

Don't take the idiot seriously.
Especially since most beastmen dealt with in lore come from the perfectly white Norscans.

They are merely other variations of humans, as humans are a diverse species.

I'm talkin bout black people here.

Oh you shutty.

I get that it's hip and cool to be politically incorrect these days, but come on.

It would be kind of cool to see some examples of Beastmen that don't have brown fur and vaguely tanned skin though. Or other kinds of animals.

>Or other kinds of animals.
tfw No Ind book and therefore no tigerhead beastman rules
>The people of Ind regard these [tiger beastmen] as noble but fickle beings, as likely to fight off attackers of an Indish village as raze it to the ground. These creatures are rarely seen, and their motives are unfathomable, yet cautionary tales are told up and down the Kingdoms of Ind, and offerings of meat and rice to keep them at bay are made at roadside shrines wherever the path passes through, or near the shadowy forest, in the hope of appeasing them.

Pale-skinned beastmen aren't exactly uncommon.

Here are some pig-beastmen anyway.

Some kind of bird on the right.

The big hats were dumb.

I want nightmarish industry, not funny-looking Mesopotamian dorks.

>not funny-looking Mesopotamian dorks.
then whats the fucking point

And a dog.

There's a balance to be made though.
Mini chaos warriors are just shit.

Green Ian Miller beastmen.

Spot the cat beastman.

The relentless march of daemonic industry by a race of sociopathic arms dealers?

They’re the grimmest thing about the setting and sit in a very lucrative niche as bad guys among all the other bad guy factions; nobody else is as... I want to say cold? As them. Focusing on the bio-horror and calculated ambitions over the big hats is the way to go.

Lion?

>Focusing on the bio-horror and calculated ambitions over the big hats is the way to go.
i love how these are the only two possibilities, apparently. You can either be a serious, mesopotamian, evil faction, or have a big hat. there is no compromise.

At least the tall helmets that we see sometimes actually are Mesopotamian....wait, I think we only see those in T:WW, so I guess we should be thanking CA for that.

I'm referring to the helmets we see here, just for clarity. I don't think it's unfair to give the Chaos Dwarves a level of oriental flavor.

The big hats are silly and detract from the image Chaos Dwarves have cultivated in their passages.

I guess it’s just personal opinion, but when I imagine the people that keep flayed Elves alive simply to harvest their blood for alchemy, it’s not as the non-FW models present them.

The Mesopotamian helmets and beards are fine - hell, Hashut is reminiscent of Moloch in the Phoenician pantheon, down to demanding human sacrifice. Keeping that fits.

And think what you could do with other elements of armor and weapon design - it's pretty much an untapped market as far as Warhammer is concerned, even if you exaggerate them and add some chainmail and plate.

...

>ind beastmen are tiger people
Not exclusively.

Add Kislev and Tilea to its territories, while also making the differences between its states more aparent. Combine Bretonnia and Estalia and make the conflict between the 2 nations much more severe. Get rid of the whole “90% of our land is actually beastmen infested forests lol.” Make their gods a bit more aparent, like on ancient Nehekaran gods level. Get rid of the retarded 12 steamtank limit and instead make them a unit that is relatively common. And more like Pic related in both fluff and crunch terms

I would make the different principalities a bit more varied in type of governance and maybe in size

I was going to start arguing against your first points and then I realized I didn't agree with a single thing you said, so we're just looking for fundamentally different things in the Empire and that's okay.

Amber wizards are /an/, beastmen are /d/ and /mlp/

Considering starting a new Fantasy army in the new year. I play 6th Ed, and currently have Lizardbois, Clan Skryre-themed Skaven, and Empire. What should I go for out of Beasts of Chaos, Hordes of Chaos, (which God? Or Archaon's horde?) Naggarond-themed Dark Elves, or Chorfs? I'd consider Tomb Kings too, but no chance finding models for them.

Beastmen are not natural, they're a product of Chaos.

Mossmen.

Papa Nurgle is always the answer user.

I think it might be both as CA did say that they want more complete rosters.

Only redundant units like Tomb Swarms, I would expect to be missing.

The death lazer is probably bullshit and greek fire is special because we can imitate the behaviour but we don't actually know what the liquids were.

It is by far easier to reverse engineer stuff you have than it is to do the same from tales and accounts.

It's 100% possible to make cool looking assyrian/mesopotamian evil dwarfs with big hats though.

>I just loved the over the top esthetics

>How do you make greek fire?
No one knows because it was lost(as in if we discovered the means to make the exact substance we would probably call it something else and say it is similar to greek fire just because there is no actual recipe left so we just have accounts of how it behaves)
>why is it that the mysteries of the aquaducts were forgotten for centuries?
They weren't.
>what about the laser that could set boats aflame?
I believe this simply is a tall tale.
>How were the pyramids made?
In this case it isn't really a case of "HOW COULD THEY BUILD THESE THINGS?!" but rather just people being disagreeing on the method used because there are several ways to build them and the way they did evolved over time so one pyramid might not have been constructed in the same way as the other.

Once you have an actual item to study the reverse engineering becomes vastly simpler by the fact that you have actual items to go by (unlike greek fire) but that doesn't mean you can reverse engineer them at the time because you might lack tools or the material needed like the case of Damascus steel.

>Damascus steel
Damascus steel was a special type of steel made from wotz steel which was aquired in India then forged in Damascus and these two things gave it a beautiful pattern but it had an unique property in the steel, modern Damascus reproductions aren't actual Damascus steel but rather knock offs that just mimic the appearance.

Did the laser, by any chance, happen to involve using a giant mirror? Cause using a fuckoff-huge mirror is hardly ancient lost tech compared to not knowing the Greek Fire recipe.

RP: second edition or third edition?

I think it tries to tap into the feel of some other renaissance people looking at a Leonardo da Vinci sketch and going: Oh la la, look at those smug shits over in Tilea flying with their helicopters and tanks and trying to build it and wondering why it doesn't work?

Yes, the laser they're talking about was Archimedes' mirror. Which Mythbusters showed COULD work.
With modern materials and polishing techniques and dozens of mirrors aimed at a stationary, dry, black target on a cloudless summer day.

calm, polite disagreement?
on MY Veeky Forums?

Nigga what? Second edition.

thanks

as someone whos never done RP, whys that?

>WE

Dwarfs are the worst. Elves are the best.

It's made worse by the fact that the Empire is still mostly skilled artisans. Efficient distribution of knowledge and theory is not quite a thing yet, though Nuln sits on the brink of its industrial revolution.

Third is a board game pretending to be an RPG. You might argue for 1st instead of 2nd, but 3rd is worthless.

>Based on the Germanic fighting style of the Germanic tribes of Germania
>with emphasys on the Teutoburg ambush
>and extra chariots, like the celts, for good measure
Yes, so fucking black you almost don't notice the blue warpaint.

>Bait

All this talk makes me want to see an industrial era empire
Massed gatling guns mowing down greenskins and beastmen

no orcs are.