/btg/ BattleTech General

It's not structurally mounted in the ST, but on a spar integrated into the CT structure.

Could be stored in the hull the rear of the gun seems to be more of an ejection system than anything else

>worrying about where BT things store ammo
Anyone have the Thunder pic?

That's an awful lot of structure just to eject some casings.
Yes, please. Tanks with and without drive sprockets would also be nice. And aerospace fighters with cockpits clearly mismatched from the vehicle size.

>And aerospace fighters with cockpits clearly mismatched from the vehicle size.
The F-22 Raptor. 20 tons unloaded, 30 tons loaded.

Deathstalker. 80 tons. Estimated pilot height: 8 meters.

If we're being rational about this CTs are probably going to get wrecked more than the L/RT because one of the basics of combat is to aim center mass. That and even the existence of neatly divided separate torsos as they are is heavily a game construct, given mechs aren't really all that big. On a lot of mechs each torso "part" would only be around a 1-1.5m.

its not unheard of honestly heres a decent example the rear of that gun ejects the shells and if i remember right the hull is where the ammo is stored

I liked the quickdraw from it. The Steiner casemate tank seemed pretty fluffy to me (built from spare HGR/LFE lying around, instant armor hunter)

When does Catalyst's licence expire? Wiz wouldn't be stupid enough to make it permanent, and there's no way Catalyst can afford to extend it given they have so little money it's legitimately amazing they haven't been shut down yet.

I don't know that we actually know this and honestly, I can imagine CGL scraping together enough money to satisfy WizKids (which shouldn't be too much, given the age of the franchise and its history of mediocre at best profitability).

They'd probably throw up a kickstarter, milk the grogs for their money (there are a lot of retarded old men who will throw money at them for no good reason) and have enough to renew the license AND build a new porch.
We're stuck with them, unless someone better decides they want the license.

I seriously don't think that's a likelihood. I suspect that CGL has more money than we think they do, they just don't spend it on BattleTech for reasons that defy understanding. They have enough to keep licenses, go to GenCon every year, make Shadowrun and D&D products (not to mention getting the D&D license for that card game, that couldn't have been cheap), and otherwise keep the lights on and porches under construction. I think CGL just pretends to be super poor to garner sympathy and to explain why they aren't doing anything with the BT license: if they "don't have money" we can't complain about BT stagnating when the truth is they don't know what to do with it and don't want to cop to it.

I think multiple people can work on an AU as long as we keep the notes for it around. I think at least a few things made it to the 1d4chan.

>someone better
You mean literally anyone? Because I'm pretty sure literally anyone could get a half dozen plastic mold injectors up and running. Fuck I have pretty much no capital and I could get a production line for a lance pack up and running in my garage within a month.

>the truth is they don't know what to do with it and don't want to cop to it

Didn't they say a new box set was coming some time ago to come out along side the new video games (Battletech and MechWarrior 5)? I mean sure, they've said nothing about it and released nothing of note for 2 years now, but ffs how hard is it to get a box set out?

We missed the 30th anniversary, looks like we'll be missing the 35th as well.

Then do it.

Unless I sell it on ebay (which we know how reliable that is) do you really thing CGL won't send CnD orders if I tried?

The point I was making was that if someone wants to do something with the IP, it wouldn't take much resources to do it. Fuck I'd take cardboard cutouts at this point.

Yeah, they did say that, but let's be serious: CGL doesn't give a fuck about BT. They could have diverted cash to BT instead of getting that stupid D&D card thing out but they didn't. They could give BT a year in the sun instead of Shadowrun (which has had plenty of time recently, what with a new edition and everything that goes with it) but they didn't.

If they cared, they could get shit going without too much trouble and reap a whirlwind of returns but they just don't care enough to put cash into it.

Already exists in the form of Warhansa.

>Anyone have the Thunder pic?

I'm guessing that we *all* do, but nobody else wants to be the guy who posts it. Either that, or we're all being crafting and saving the requested pic for a needed bump as we approach page 11.

>I'm guessing that we *all* do
You'd guess wrong. I have legit never seen that (fairly amusing) picture before. Thanks for posting it.

>You'd guess wrong. I have legit never seen that (fairly amusing) picture before.

After I wrote that blurb, I opened up my "Battletech" images folder expecting to find this in there, and when I didn't, I backed out to my general "Pictures" folder, and it wasn't there, either! But I knew which one was talking about, so I googled it and it came right up.

>Thanks for posting it.

You're welcome.

I always assumed that the 'large drum' ACs were sort of like that "Metal Storm" gun thing that like shoots a million rounds per minute, lol.

I don't see any ejection in that image, and if there is it's dramatically smaller, with the rear overhang on that turret housing other equipment including counterweights. In the OP image it's not even clear how ammunition would be fed into the gun.

youtu.be/dYOP94-KBXA?t=53s 53 seconds in if the link didnt work

What you don’t understand is that cockpit is The Elusive Man-tier with floor to ceiling glass walls + roof and the blister behind the “canopy” has a king-size bed, galley kitchen, and a full bath.

Okay but that's still nothing like what's seen in the OP image

That would be because the OP image is a work of fiction you autistic retard.

>The person not saying half the gun is a reasonable casing ejection system is the autistic retard

Unlikely

that guys not me im saying that a system similar to the pic exists you bum

Yes, clearly I thought it was dumb that casings would be ejected but had no problem with the system for doing so being the same size as the rest of the gun. Good job.

It's from Topps now WK, and nobody else wants it.

They constantly bitch about not having enough money to do the most basic of productions and use it as their explanation as to why everything is so shittily fact-checked and proofed.

Reading a discussion on bombers during WW2 recently, with fighter pilots commenting on how viciously agile those lunky things were up there where the air gets thin and how sluggish their own machines handled in the same enviroment, I really began to wonder why nobody seems to be building conventionals specifically geared towards intercepting Aerospace assets right at the edge of the atmosphere.

I mean they're so much cheaper to build that it would totally be worth catching aerospace fighters with a machine that excels exactly in that stretch where both the spaceship and the aerofoil parts of the AS work suboptimal.

>And aerospace fighters with cockpits clearly mismatched from the vehicle size.

They aren't aircrafts, they're basically weaponized space shuttles, so it figures that they'd be a good chunk larger than a conventional.

>They aren't aircrafts, they're basically weaponized space shuttles, so it figures that they'd be a good chunk larger than a conventional.
What does this have to do with the cockpit size not matching stated vehicle size?

>I really began to wonder why nobody seems to be building conventionals specifically geared towards intercepting Aerospace assets right at the edge of the atmosphere.
ASF can carry many times a Conventional fighter's armour and weapons, and they're faster for the mass since they don't use ICE or engine shielding.

I mean, you could do it but there are less expensive ways to commit suicide.

>They constantly bitch about not having enough money to do the most basic of productions and use it as their explanation as to why everything is so shittily fact-checked and proofed.
What's more likely: they have literally no money despite having multiple active product lines they're producing products for -or- the company with a known history of embezzlement misuses and misspends its money in order to claim the moral high ground over its fanbase? I'm going with option 2.

ASFs don't have engine shielding?

Regardless of how much money they have in the end, I am pretty sure currently much more comes from Shadowrun sum total. Barring licensing for Battletech I'm not really sure how they even make enough money from it to cover the losses.

It would be interesting to see the numbers.

It's a vicious circle: BattleTech doesn't make money, so they don't print stuff for it, so it doesn't make money. If they took some of that Shadowrun money and poured it into BattleTech, I bet it could at least cover itself. New minis, new maps, IlClan, etc, would all do well.

Nope, built like BattleMechs instead of combat vehicles.

"Conventional fighters multiply fusion engine weights by 1.5 (round up to the nearest 0.5 ton)." Per Tech Manual. Proper ASFs don't.

But what about all of the fast neutrons?

They don't pay an extra 50% engine mass for it like conventional fighters do.

ASFs use 'Mech engines but calculate their engine rating on (Safe Thrust-2)*Unit Mass so a 6/9 50-tonner uses a (6-2)*50 =200-rated engine.

It is really an unimaginably bad idea to try and tangle with ASFs when you are in a conventional fighter.

And that's just on a per-mass basis. Conventionals are limited to 50 tons, you do not want to see what happens when they have to try and take on heavy fighters.

The engine has shielding, ASFs just don't have to pay for it like conventional fighters do.

Why?

Because.

ASFs are to Coventionals as Mechs are to vees.

Also Doug Chaffee made some beautiful ASF art.

What is different about mechs and vees that makes vee engines heavier?

What would it be like to be a ASF jock?

What are the best 3025 aerospace fighters?

Why does it have major surfaces for both the tail and canards? Why aren't those surfaces swept for improved supersonic operation?

Chaffee is a good artist. So is Loose. It's just they both had bad art direction give them a bad rap. I mean look at Loose's stuff for the new HBS game. And yeah, look at Chaffee's ASF art and Dropship stuff.

>game balance why?

Because fuck you that's why.

>realism why?

Because fuck you that's why.

ASF are basically built around the axiom of "more thrust = better" and a basically fusion rockets with wings strapped on.

If he's so good then why are there so many errors?

-No room for a decent off-road suspension
-hatch in the missile turret would intersect a missile
-The fuck are those hubcaps?
-those rings (not sure of the technical term) are not arranged properly for airlifting
-ladders to nowhere

Certainly better than that CGI though. Why would they replace a sensor with a 70 mm rocket hive?

How does making vees have heavier engines improve game balance?

That's pretty much how conventional fighter aircraft are designed, minus the fusion.

Why does it feel so good to take down mechs with tanks, Veeky Forums?

youtube.com/watch?v=RSz7nKYNSTo

Reactor shielding weights in BT vary hugely by application. I assume ASF have enough heavy material and shielded areas in them that they can just put a lightly shielded reactor on the other side of the ship from the sensitive components/people and get the flux down to allowable levels, while conventional fighters don't have the space and bulky shit to put in the way, so they need to go heavier on shielding material.

Battlemechs and ASF get away with lighter shielding on reactors because it's far away from people/sensitive electronics. You need more in a vee where some poor bastard's duty station is on top of the reactor.

Oh, so conventional fighters have lower structural weight then?

The reactor on an ASF and other small/large craft is proportionally smaller than those on an equivalent 'mech or combat vee. The reactor on those just produces power for the craft itself and the weapons. The actual means of propulsion is through combusion still.

Why would you do that when you have a perfectly good source of heat for nuclear thermal propulsion?

Metal Storm gets that ludicrous rate of fire by stacking a lot of caseless rounds in a single barrel. The individual barrels are disposable one-shots. If you look at that pic, you can see that box has quite a few barrels mounted inside.

BT autocannons don't work that way.

I don't want to blame it ALL on art direction because I'm sure he isn't perfect either, it's just that he gets a bad rap for a lot of things that aren't his fault, like the Bushwhacker (and most of 3058 for that matter). A lot of artists that have done Battletech work have suffered the art direction, and it shows. Designs don't look the same from image to image, and that happens a LOT. I have to imagine they didn't want the suspension because it's going to be a moving target made of explodium they didn't want to dedicate a ton of resources to. Just a cool silhouette for the most part. Also, I don't think that's a hatch; I think it's a sensor dome but it doesn't even show up on the model so... who fucking knows?

tl;dr - Loose gets a bad rap. Not perfect, but not the demon devil shitman that everyone likes to claim. You can deride me as the DLDF if you want but it's kind of the truth. Art direction in this game has been as spastic as Alex Knight gets when he's proven wrong.

No, they just don't have design considerations intended for fusion engine application. If you are going to spend the money to buy a fusion reactor you are better off building it as an ASF from the beginning.

>What are the best 3025 aerospace fighters?
Cheetah

Then why would ASFs have shielding already factored into their weight? Especially when conventional engines don't need any shielding?

...

ASF and Mech reactors use less shielding, making them lighter but more dangerous to be near when they operate.

Less shielding than ICs?

No, IC's don't incorporate any shielding, but have 1/100000000000th the fuel efficiency and lower thrust/weight ratio then a fusion rocket or electric jet.

But if I put a fusion engine in a conventional fighter it's heavier than in an aerospace fighter?

yes, design rules state fusion engines in conventions add 50% weight

>What are the best 3025 aerospace fighters?
Corsair, Stingray, Transit, Transgressor, Stuka.

Cockpits and distance from the reactor. Also how open the construction is.

Because heat is not enough for suitable thrust. Heat emission is a poor reaction. Using too much heat from the reactor would cool the reaction down too much to sustain it.

>tank crew working as a team to defeat a single, larger and far more deadly opponent
You tell me.

In atmosphere they pull in air and heat it, along with reaction mass, then expel the resulting jet of expanding mass.

Exoatmospheric (where conventional can't operate anyway) they do the same, but purely with reaction mass.

No combustion involved.

For very short bursts and very short distances. It's not suitable for sustained, constant thrust which is necessary for flight. You'd also melt the jet nozzles if you tried flight; this is explained in the lore.

That's literally how jet engines work, my sweet friend.

Air is drawn in, compressed and heated by mixing it with fuel that is ignited. The heat causes the air/burnt fuel mixture to expand and exit the engine in a hot stream.

A thermal jet works the exact same way, you just heat the reaction mass electrically/by injecting plasma instead.

Jump jets can't operate constantly, and are what you are thinking of, because they are very small engines that produce a giant amount of thrust. They lack the cooling and support to operate for long because they are built to fly only very short distances.

>mixing it with fuel that is ignited
>heat the reaction mass
You mean just like how BT Aero engines work? Whodathunkit.

Please. Don't guess.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_thermal_rocket

He's right that a chemical rocket have a lower reaction chamber wall temperature, but wrong that this is a major limiting factor.

...

I am so confused

For all the shit that people give him now, I did and still do like Loose's stuff.
The main reason being that his artwork, in spite of the badly designed joints and looking very boxy, do an excellent job of feeling like technical drawings of war machines that you'd see in a military training guidebook. TROs have lost that a long time ago, going for a comic-book'esque art style that makes me think of it more like a Monster Manual for mechs.

I really wish that future projects would go back to that industrial design aesthetic and ditch the action poses.

As am I, but I like it.

I'm either looking at a Sorenson, or looking at the progeny of if Victor and Omi had wed.

I think I'm two or three threads behind.

Someone suggested Spike would pilot a Jackal because it has a big shoota that fires blue stuff; but does that also suggest the Jackal itself should also be blue (like Spike's suit), red (like his Swordfish), or ...?

red with arms out and fairings to make it look more swordfishy

enjoy your shs

what if TRIPLE HEAT SINKS

You fool! Everyone knows heat is sunk at a quadratic rate.

You're not thinking big enough: we need triple heat sinks that take only a single crit, but for IS only. That'll finally even the fight between the Clans and the IS.