Which option is better

Perfect example - Star Wars: The Last Jedi.

I'm doing a fantasy in space (basically Eberron's ships: Space Edition) and I absolutely have space elves and space dwarfs. Dwarfs mining asteroids and vegetarian elves getting butthurt that there's no plant life on 99% of the worlds.

I'd personally go with the last one. You can use tropes to give people a quick understanding of the setting but still have enough room to create your own

The last one is probably the best, but also the riskiest. Some people get really, really pissed when their elves/dwarves/etc aren't PHB standard, and will never let you forget how mad they are

This is why you create a setting document and have people read it.
They either read it and like it enough to play, or they didn't read it and waive their rights to complain when it diverges from their expectations.

Pretty much this.

Any of those is good if executed well. From a worldbuilding standpoint I would tend toward number 3, but thats because I'm not creative enough to invent all new races.

From a gamemaster perspective I'd go 3 as well, as long as you advertise to your players your changes very clearly.

IF EVERYONE'S A SNOWFLAKE
NO ONE'S A SNOWFLAKE

>Players
>Reading setting documents
Quite an imagination you've got, user

I usually use the last option, I find that players are usually not that disappointed by a subversion that much, but that is only my experience.
I would warn against mixing and matching the options though, since that way is harder to make them work together.

We had this exact thread a little while ago, just with the first two options. Why repost it?

My response remains the same- You do a mix. Use a few standard races who are mostly recognizable with a few subtle tweaks to make them feel a bit different, use them to make the world familiar and contextualise the more unique races, letting people understand them more easily by contrasting them to things they already know.

The last thread got posted at like 3AM and got maybe six responses. It seems to be a controversial topic on Veeky Forums so I thought I'd repost it for the day crowd, slightly reworded, and see what people think

Just pick one and do not worry about people not liking it. Worry, or rather take care of, the people who do like it.

first version is the best.
Third is ok unless you go too far like "my elves are actually monkeys
Second is the crap option.

Actually I think elves as monkeys could be kind of a neat option, or at least using monkey-men to fill your elf niche. They're an ancient offshoot of humanity's ancestors and have been sentient for longer, really love the forest and are much better at moving around in it, are being edged out by their much more adaptable plains-dwelling cousins. Maybe make them a combination of Sun Wukong/Hanuman and Tolkien elves

First option is the best.

>snowflakey

Literally no one will accuse you of this other than joyless Veeky Forums neckbeards who don't actually play RPGs.

Using monkey men to fill the elf niche is good.
Making monkey men and calling them elf is not tho.

You'd be surprised. I've gamed with some hardcore grogs who are basically the "Why can't we have classic fantasy races, why can't you be a anglo-saxon human fighter?" guys IRL.

Strong arms and a large draw would mean they'd be great archers.
Hairy elves/monkey people what's the difference?

I prefer standard races to a fault. Like, everyone knows WoW to an extent, so I’ll use that. Draenei rub me the wrong way being a unique race, but I’m fine with Tauren and Worgen because those are just Minotaurs and Werewolves.

Any particular reason? I mean the genre is called "fantasy", so to me it doesn't make sense to avoid weird , fantastical things.

Well i did have a guy complaining about the lakc of dwarves in my campaign ( i did let him pick one, but they arent prominent in the setting, they are foreigners basically)

but ive never had anyone complain about one of the other players picking a weird race.

I guess I'm just lucky for never encountering guys like that.

I did have one friend who had a vocal distaste for Elves. He never got spergy, but he made it clear he didn't like them. He never included them in games he ran, but he did always offer a large selection of homebrew races like Yeti or Minotaurs. So it's obvious he wasn't caught up on hating "snowflake" races for cool guy points, he just didn't like Elves.

Any attempt at originality is snowflakey

I've had several, unfortunately. I had a guy try to get everyone to bully/kill the character of a guy who was playing a tiefling-equivalent (who were reasonably common in setting and more pittied than anything. They're people who survived being possessed) and give him shit, despite playing a dwarf like your traditional gimli clone and expecting all other dwarves to be the same despite being told in the setting doc and in person that that's not really how dwarves in this world act. When people basically told him to shut the fuck up and play the game instead of being a fag, he threw a fit and bailed.

well thats probably the best outcome for such a situation anyway.
fucks that have their autsm triggered by stuff like that realy shouldnt be playing anything other than TDE

The setting I'm GM'ing has over 40 unique playable races. Before you say anything I didn't make it, that's how it is.
The entire point of the game is to be as snowflakey as possible, but when everyone is a snowflake nobody is. A player can be a dullahan deathknight paladin of the crow queen with jedi powers as exalted power, but when on a daily basis he is going against beings such as a vampire fairy that wields the legendary spear gungir or a vyzard (shy-guy in human form) conjurer magician with a stand that crosses to the umbra then he won't be so special.

How the fuck do I fix this shitfest lorewise? My solution is to make differences based on nation or country rather than race. An elf that lives in a huge hive city has the same routine and similae behavior than a human or warforged living there while he has fucking nothing in common with another elf living in a jungle of werewolves among lizardmen or rakhasas. Of course some countries and enviorement have one races or another, and I can always bullshit some stuff by being really fucking good a making stuff on the fly

Dungeons the Dragoning?

imo making race and nationality two different aspects is a great way of handling it.

having certain nations amde up of multiple races filling different functions in society has a great effect on the believeability of the world.

Exactly

Its really fucking hard to do tho. I'm more of a guy who is good at writing an interesting story with politics and plots and a fuckton of characters and their interacions (and how they would react to the players) rather than the world around them.

I prefer the last, but am working on a setting that has the first method. The ideal is evoking the lore of the world and it's creatures through mechanics than fluff. Also curious how many races is too many to choose from, as choice paralysis is also a thing.

There are particular character archetypes a player may expect to be able to choose for their character, and you should have some races that cover said archetypes.

How about
>No playable non-humans.
?

Because that'd be pretty boring, not even from a player perspective, from a DM perspective and a narrative perspective it'd be really damn boring.

It sounds like they mashed up every anime under the sun, Bleach included. If you can't have fun enabling your players and their story, you should bail out. You're wasting everyone's time otherwise.
Think not just nationality, but lifestyle and upbringing. An elf that spends their time smithing and working their muscle might have a chance of going toe to toe with brawny humans for strength. Traditional high-elf culture might look down on that sort of work, so few traditional elves would end up being strong, and elves would get stereotyped as weak.

/Thread

>Make unique races bespoke to your setting and baked into the lore from the beginning, but risk being snowflakey and alienating to players

You can make this without making snowflakes, you just have to give them flaws that matter and dont just shove humans to the sidelines

>Use traditional fantasy races in their standard form and stereotypes and build the setting around them, even if it winds up not being what you wanted

You say that as if the races had an actual rigid line to follow for them to be what they are, sure they do have some basic expected requirements but beyond that its a gray area

>Take the archetypes/tropes of the standard races, and bend, warp, and transmute them to be fitting to your setting, but risk disappointing both people expecting the classical versions of them and people wanting something completely new

Same thing as before, what makes an "elf", an "orc" or a "dwarf" is different to different people, some people like orcs being always evil and some like them being more complex than that, someone will be dissapointed no matter what you do

>all narratives where the main characters all are human are boring
Hmm... No

That's not necessarily what everyone wants. Nonhumans can add a fantastical element to your setting and be fun , even if they're just window dressing

if your players complain about your races being "snowflakey" or bad because they're not the standard fantasy races, they have no imagination and probably only play rpgs to boost their ego whenever they get a good roll. Ditch them.

Pic related is confusing as fuck and makes no sense but anyone at any level of intelligence or intoxication should be able to have fun with it.

I prefer this
This enables you to make nonhumans a bit alien, have their minds work differently from ours in ways that players just can't pull off, thus truly making them fantastical like wants.