/swg/ Profundity Edition

I see you are a man of taste.jpg
The Nebby has been my favourite SW capital since I saw ESB forever ago.
Gotta love her.

I will never understand why you hipsters like that retarded ship. The rebels only use them because they have no choice.

My favorite part about this cutouts is how whenever there's a bit on the end that doesn't really make sense, it's sensor arrays.

Like the jowls on the AT-M6.

I just love the design.
I cant even quite articulate why, but I think he got it right - its clunky, blocky, has exposed pipes and plating and weird bits. It has a sort of ugly industrial beauty to it, and I've loved it since I was little.

Mon Cala, and CEC and KDY ships are all beautiful too, dont get me wrong.

This piece of shit has only 18 turbo lasers and 18 ion cannons while the sexier Resurgent class has over 1500 turbolasers and ion cannons

>while the sexier Resurgent class has over 1500 turbolasers and ion cannons
Which is literally impossible, and Resurgent isn't sexy at all. It's a piece of shit.

Why? Because it has the intelligence of an embedded command bridge?

Yeah but how many of them are heavy? Checkmate.

It just looks ugly as hell, which is fine for the First Order since I imagine they'd be building ships that work over ships that look good, so I could imagine the Resurgent starting off as splicing ISD and prototype designs together to get something working.

I'd posit that most of those 1,500 guns are point-defense guns or the equivalent of smaller AA guns, but given how ineffective Star Destroyer anti-fighter defenses appear to be, I'm not sure.

A 3km ship is NOT going to have 1500 point defense guns. I'd say 120-150 at most for point defense, 170 on turbolasers (heavy and light) and then add in some concussion missiles and ion cannons. These stats I'm giving come based on the ISD, which is 1600 meters and has the following guns:
>Heavy turbolaser batteries (50)
>Turbolaser batteries (50)
>Additional turbolaser batteries (26+)
>Heavy ion cannons (20)
>Octuple barbette turbolaser or Ion cannons (8)
>Phylon Q7 tractor beam projectors (10)

Dumb edgy shit, like the rest of Nu-Canon.

Are you guys more of small ship universe, or big ships?

I don't know, user, the Iowa managed to fit ~130 Anti-aircraft guns (150 if you include DP guns) onto just 270 meters of length even leaving aside its main guns, and it was only defending against the top half of the ship. At 2915.84 meters it's definitely possible to fit 1500 AA and DP guns onto the resurgent. especially given its height.

Those guns don't have the firepower of nukes and don't need a reactor to power them up, als owe have something to go off of as a standard, they need to stick to that standard, considering those ISD stats are legit in both Legends and Disney canon.

I want to like the Nebulon, but that thin section between the boy and the bridge is fucking ugly

>1500 turbolasers
so why did the xboxhueg dreadnought at the beginning only have like 8 or 10 quad turbolasers and not a single point defense gun?

>1500 guns
>struggles to shoot down a single tie-fighter

Those were the point defense guns, we use turbolasers for point defense now son.

>if your not supposed to use it, why have it?
The Force shouldn't be X-Men style superpowers but rather something you need belief and understanding of to utilise.
youtube.com/watch?v=8EwcYwax4Oo

Jetpacks are cool.

I'll also point this out in the new thread, but the CIS were intentionally set up by Sheev as mustache twirling bad guys. They were a fabricated enemy for him to seize power, so they were to act as overly evil as possible under Sidious through his influence over Dooku. They might have had noble goals at the start, but even Dooku during ROTS thinks the plan is to throw the CIS under the bus and have himself defect to the Republic while all the atrocities of the Confederacy are pinned on Grievous and the Separatist Council.

from the dying thread

First Order Stormtroopers > Clone Dummies
Prove me wrong.

How would things have turned out if Sheev reversed the roles?

Droids and the industrial capacity of the CIS seem more useful to an empire than clones and the Kaminoans. Plus "The Clone Wars" never sounded like a war where the Clones were the good guys/winning side.

Individual factions withing the CIS did nothing wrong, however the major financiers and arms suppliers of the CIS were actively planning for a war of aggression. Most of the worlds in the CIS were only interested in securing their own independence though.

Businesses with an AnCap train of thought and Battle Droids designed around an alien species' appearance won't work for a centralized Empire.

For sure, I can imagine the idea of sectors' rights is around, but a big part of it would be if another movement came up, it would insist really hard that they're not the CIS and avoid cozying up to the likes of Neimoidians.

The canon answer is
>>>>>>>>>>First Order
But if you were to force people to try to come up with an almost-logical explanation each point defense gun may need to reach through the armor deck to a reactor that powers them, so the designers may have considered this a liability that compromises the Dreadnought's armor protection against heavier weapons and simply expected the First Order to be escorting such an asset with ISD/cruiser/fighter cover.

Compare the Dreadnought with modern US carriers. The Nimitz class only has 3-4 AA turrets at most and its missile armament is aimed at defeating enemy missiles first and enemy planes second. It has no anti-ship weaponry whatsoever. This is because the designers intended the carrier to always be escorted by destroyers and its own carrier wing, so it sacrifices AA defense to do more of what it exists to do, carry planes.

Contrast this with its Soviet equivalents, which are generally heavily armed with anti-air missiles and point defense guns. The soviets don't expect their carriers to be as well-escorted in operations, so their carriers are a little more self-reliant. In exchange, though, they carry a smaller air wing.

Running by that logic, it's possible that the First Order knew that their dreadnought would always be well-escorted by ISD/FOSDs and simply focused on making as powerful and well-armored main gun as possible. Hux just didn't get Canady's memo about putting up fighters.

Daily reminder that the Confederacy of Independent Systems did nothing wrong.

Why would anyone try to prove you wrong? Aside from issues of defection, it's true. If you care about nu-Canon. And why would anyone do that? The very idea of millions of kidnapped children being literally brainwashed is silly and retarded.

CISfags make less sense than Empirefags. At least what the Empire did was in the name of order, what the CIS did was in the name of being a designed bad guy for Sheev's plans.

Sounds like Janizaries to me, not that weird if you know history.

Anybody else hate how games like KOTOR use vibroblades?

They're not daggers or anything but fucking 4 foot long swords, which is just ridiculous and awful but for some reason everyone has one and they're apparently all capable of parrying lightsabers.

It's not cool to give everyone in the universe a sword, it's fucking stupid.

Yes.

It was 4000 years ago. Get over yourself kid.

Then why does it look like yesterday? Checkmate, athiests

>umm, excuse me Captain Canady, why didn't we establish a Fighter Screen as soon as we exited Hyperspace, as protocol would demand.
>and why didn't we cover the very vulnerable center of our Dreadnought with additional layers of armor?
>and why didn't we cover it with countless point defense cannons like the previous supersized Empire ships?

during the time Kotor is set, Jedi and Sith were a common occurance, having melee weapons capable of parrying lightsabers in such an enviorment iss quite logical.

Yeah, but they have a kick-ass emblem

...

You can probably just chalk it up to sci-fi writers having no sense of scale and pulling random numbers out of their asses.

Although, if you wanna be autistic about the Raddus’s weapons, that might just be after the Resistance stripped the ship down to it’s bare essentials so they can operate with a skeleton crew.

Overrated non-character that people seem to love because he at least looks like an officer, not a dickhead kid

>It's not cool to give everyone in the universe a sword, it's fucking stupid.
Man, I've never seen someone with such excessive degrees of wrong.

Also, the Sith brought with them personal shield technology which reduced the usefulness of blasters. Melee weapons were sometimes more effective.

Wait a minute, those FO caps, do the guys in the background have them turned down like kepis or something? that looks even worse. God, the worst order sucks

>overrated non-character
not yet in this movie, they cut the extended scene where he discovers his force sensibility and floats back into the bridge.

Personally? I actually like the use of vibro weapons in the KOTOR era. It is explained in game in a reasonable fashion (Mandalorian focus on melee combat and the introduction of short-usage personal shielding), and the ability to parry lightsabers (again, explained using pre-existing materials from canon) meant that non-lightsaber combatants remained relevant on a battlefield where lightsabers were present, which was an important concession to the gameplay mechanics.

Except the Separatists didn't know that. You're an omniscient observer, characters within the universe is anything but.

>Implying half of that wasn't Hux's fault

Canady did nothing wrong.

Fuck off

Ah, fuck the pair of you, shit taste cunts

Janissaries were far from perfect, though, and there really weren't that many of them. Really, the idea of taking millions of children and the logistics to raise them, and the idea of successfully brainwash them all is ridiculous. There would be huge defection risks involved. Janissaries never had that opportunity because they were not sent to other, literal, planets.

It makes sense. Jedi and Sith were a lot more common, and recent advances in personal shield technology in relation to blaster effectiveness meant that cutting someone down could be more effective, since it sliced right through the shield.

The real question is why people didn't just use slugthrowers.

>The real question is why people didn't just use slugthrowers.
Because Star Wars.

Slugthrowers in the setting really aren't that great overall compared to blasters, and logistically are much more difficult to work with. Two hundred fifty shots with a blaster rifle is essentially just a few battery packs (weighing in at roughly 0.1kg each), two hundred fifty shots with a slugthrower will be several kilograms and much more space.

Wonder why a Mandalorian version of this has never been done, The Super Virgin Commando vs The Neo Chadsader.

Jedi in canon can use their sabers to defend themselves from slugthrowing rounds as well as they could blasters, so they weren't giving you a boon to fighting them, and making bullets out of saber-resistant materials was prohibitively expensive - and that's if tehy even had a saber and didn't go full pic related.
Armour could stop a lot of slugthrowing rounds from doing serious harm.
It was considered widely inhuman and barbaric (doesn't stop some people, see Aurra Sing).
If you're fighting regular guys with shields, you're better off just using a disruptor, ion or a few other ways of punching through them for reasons stated above.

With Legion coming out, I need paint schemes for Vader and Storm/Snow Troopers that aren't the movie canon.

Unfortunately, I'm finding these to be *shockingly* under-explored areas. Vader's always drawn black, and Stormtroopers are always white or maybe black/red.

Whatdya got, /swg/?

Armada newbie here, can I ask for a bit of hand holding?
What are some common imperial ship builds that are good for learning the game? I am afraid I will take too many upgrades and lose sight of the game with all the options. I got everything except the Interdictor and the Imperial

I don't think the center was particularly vulnerable, it's just that not an awful lot of armor is going to survive getting hit with over a thousand proton bombs on the same spot at once.

I have an idea for some fairly unique enemies I want to throw at my players- blastomechs, non-combat frames that have had weapons kludged onto them in a feat of space hillbilly engineering

Most of them are going to be ineffectual but some of them I want to be surprisingly dangerous, like GNK droid with a WEB heavy blaster bolted on to its back. Any suggestions?

>Compare the Dreadnought with modern US carriers.
>compare an orbital gun platform to a carrier
Are you dumb?

>Janissaries were far from perfect
Given the performance of Captain "Chrome-dome" Guzma and Finn I think we can all agree that the First Order's training isn't perfect either.

From the last time someone asked:
Pink Vader just to fuck with EA
White Vader from infinities
Vader with Brown cloak and trim, blue saber if you can, because Redeemed Vader
You could try giving him Galen Marek's "Vader" colour scheme if you wanted.

Don't remember what suggestions for stormies there were beyond Shadowtroopers and Beachtroops, but the former are just an inversed colour scheme and the latter are in movie canon, so I don't think either help you.

In Star Wars: Infinities: Return of the Jedi Vader got a pure white version of his standard outfit. That's the only alt-outfit that isn't battle damaged that I can think of.

There's plenty of alt-coloring for stormtroopers though, depending on their role, but nothing as individualistic as the clone trooper paint.

>running an EotE game in which players are aiding the rebels
>first arc culminates in them drawing the ire of an Inquisitor, one character loses an arm distracting him so the rest can escape
>over the break, a different player put together a big list of gear he wants to buy to specifically fight force users, most of which revolve around memes and really shitty logic
>shit like
>>a twin linked blaster/slugthrower that fires a second bullet a split second after the blaster bolt "he won't be able to dodge it or deflect it"
>>automatic shotguns "lol can't block shrapnel"
>>grenades designed to detonate if they're suddenly stopped "lol he'll catch it with the force and it'll blow him up"
>>fucking everything made out of cortosis despite having no in-game knowledge of lightsaber proof materials

I appreciate his ingenuity, but it's pretty fucking annoying that he thinks these are all trump cards to an Inquisitor, and I just know he'll have a shitfit when they don't work perfectly.

Just pick 0-1 upgrade per ship, and take 4-5 ships plus some squadrons.

I'm comparing two large capital ships intended to deal damage from far beyond the range and ability of most conventional weapons to respond.

Seeing as large surface combat capital ships are no longer operated by any navy, the Aircraft Carrier is the closest analog by which comparisons can be drawn in any capacity.

That's kinda why I think the models for Legion not being pre-painted is dumb; there's very little room for customization when it comes to the Empire.

Plenty for Rebels of course, we've already seen a pretty cool variety of Rebel paint jobs, but you could also just do that with pre-painted models.

Best I can figure is maybe giving the Stormies a color scheme that resembles the clone units. I wouldn't say it's particularly "canon," but I also wouldn't say it's unreasonable. You could also do something like the 181st Imperial Fighter Wing and give them a colored stripe down their arms to signify an elite status.

Didn't think of that. Thanks, simple and elegant solution

>no longer operated by any navy
That's because star wars isn't untended to represent modern doctrines in any way. It's WWII in space.

The sad thing is all of these are less effective than your run-of-the-mill flamethrower, a belt of grenades, or a breach charge and a ship. Sure, those might not kill the Inquisitor, but they sure as shit might slow him/her down.

That or just give everyone on the team decent weapons, the ability to shoot straight with gear or skills, and good vigilance, if they can go first and have 1 or 2 dedicated damage dealers and anybody with the ability to take a hit or two they'll probably bring the guy down with concentrated fire within like 2-3 turns. I ended up having to make a team of Inquisitors to fight my team for FFG because literally nobody alone could survive them rocking the top of the turn order and pouring blaster fire onto anything with a pulse - maybe I just rolled like shit though. Forced me to come up with very creative ways to actually have anything pose a challenge to them, at the very least.

>Pink Vader just to fuck with EA
>White Vader from infinities
>Vader with Brown cloak and trim, blue saber if you can, because Redeemed Vader
>You could try giving him Galen Marek's "Vader" colour scheme if you wanted.

All decent ideas. If I was a better painter I'd probably have a better time visualizing schemes without having to see them on the model, but I'm pretty crap at visualization.

>Don't remember what suggestions for stormies there were beyond Shadowtroopers and Beachtroops, but the former are just an inversed colour scheme and the latter are in movie canon, so I don't think either help you.
>There's plenty of alt-coloring for stormtroopers though, depending on their role, but nothing as individualistic as the clone trooper paint.

I should clarify what I meant - it can be anything, I don't care about canon at all.

I just definitely *don't* want movie canon colors. EU inspired stuff is fine, random stuff like Pink Vader is fine. Whatever looks good on the table.

>Best I can figure is maybe giving the Stormies a color scheme that resembles the clone units. I wouldn't say it's particularly "canon," but I also wouldn't say it's unreasonable. You could also do something like the 181st Imperial Fighter Wing and give them a colored stripe down their arms to signify an elite status.

As above; but also most clone schemes won't carry over well. They either involve freehanding, which is hard, or they rely on breaking up the white by virtue of the clone armor having more plates and various pieces. Clonetrooper "breastplates" are more starkly elevated over the torso bit, for example, whereas Stormtrooper chestplates are visually one piece.

flame thrower or a sonic weapon.

i know sonic weapons aren't really that common but they can't be deflected by a lightsaber

I like to think the Mandator IV was designed as a siege monitor and the First Order fucked up the dimensions, but since it had already been laid down they decided to just roll with it and call it a dreadnought.

>It's WWII in space.
It's heavily influenced by WWII in space but it definitely isn't WWII in space, as the Resistance Bombers demonstrated. Something are the same, some things aren't. When they aren't, you have to look for analogous examples elsewhere.

Seen the stickie with the canon materials and legend references.

Is there a meta of legends either the books or audiobooks?

>it definitely isn't WWII in space, as the B(/SF)-17 starFORTRESS demonstrated
Thanks for confirming it. You're just dumb.

>as the Resistance Bombers demonstrated
The resistance bombers are basically B-17s in space though, down to the uninsipired name and the dubious performance in naval combat.

That's my point, though. The Resistance Bomber was a literal porting of a World War II Strategic Bomber into Star Wars. And, as everyone on /swg/ confirms, it was a fucking stupid idea because strategic bombers play no role in space combat. There's no way to port the advantages of strategic bombers (high operational altitude to limit exposure to AA fire, relatively high durability) into Star Wars.

Sure thing.

I always feel like new players over focus on fleet building. Just throw whatever on a table and get game time in, you'll learn what works and what you like with time.

The advantage of strategic bombers is their strategic bomb load. The high altitude flying was to make it harder to intercept them because despite the memes they were not all that durable.

If you like 40k you could do them up like the Imperial Guard - dark green chestplate and helmet and boots, khaki everything else; or if you prefer, dark green armour and khaki underlay.

Thinking about it, even if you don't like 40k you could probably do worse than looking up some of the Space Marine's colour schemes and applying them to your Stormies.

If all else fails, just pick a colour combo you like, Stormtroopers are only 2 colours (white armour black underlay), so just replace the two with something you like.
Personally I quite enjoy white and red or black and blue.

Finally, you could pain them red white and blue to go full Patriotism for any one of like 4 countries.

The links in the OP to oggdude's char gen thing aren't working for me. Did something go wrong/need to be updated or is it an issue on my end?

>The advantage of strategic bombers is their strategic bomb load.
Their main advantage was their range, though the bomb load was also of great importance.

>The high altitude flying was to make it harder to intercept them
Which would have helped the resistance bombers had altitude ever been an issue in 3-d space combat. Nor does the First Order lack VT fuzes, making hitting them much more difficult.
>because despite the memes they were not all that durable.
Proportionally significantly more durable against their fighter contemporaries than the Resistance Bombers, fucking obviously.

The big difference between Stormtroopers and Guardsmen is that Stormtroopers have very, very little of their underlay showing. Guardsmen are more underlay than armor, which serves to break up the color and add contrast. That doesn't translate to Stormtroopers, who have only a meager amount of black poking through the white.

That's something they do have in common with Space Marines, but the issue there is Marines have far more armor segments and other bits and bobs that, again, break up the color - their armor is more segmented, with rivets and trim and random channels.

Hence, why I'm trying to track down art. But as has been noted, it's a pain, because there's actually very few people making any (and it's drowned under the veritable mountain of art in the traditional colors).

I've always wondered this since I've been a kid. Where the hell do Y-Wings keep their bombs? There doesn't seem to be any interior to the ship where they're kept, so are they held on the bottom of the hull?

I've never been able to find a reference for it.

>crew compartment blown wide open
>"Why isn't a space ship this durable?"

>comparing flak bursts to plasma bolts
>FIGURE 296.-Location of flak hits on 2,961 B-17 aircraft, plane surfaces only.

>Galen Marek Vader
I really want to love it, but I reslly fucking hate those claws, they ruing the whole thing and just makes it look edgy.

And fuselages only.
Obviously something getting scattered withflak is going to seem more durable than something getting blasted by concentrated superheated gasses.

> Individual factions withing the CIS did nothing wrong

Some made a good case for making war on the Republic.

I think Grevious may have some of that in his peoples backstory.

>crew compartment blown wide open
Oh wow, what are you going to ask next, whether the B-17s had their shields up? When I said proportionality I was keeping in mind that one of them was flying in the air and the other was flying in space with fucking Energy Shields.
Either way, that B-17 landed with at least one member of the crew alive. Remind me exactly how many Resistance Bombers survived?
>Obviously something getting scattered withflak is going to seem more durable than something getting blasted by concentrated superheated gasses.
Well maybe that's fucking why you shouldn't be using strategic bombers in star wars and pretending it's "Space World War II," like I said several posts ago.
>Flak
What flak? The Fulminatrix's point defense guns were down. The only things that could have shot the bombers were the space equivalent of 20mms and machine guns. They were still annihilated when the "Black Day" of the USAAF's day bombings still ended with 70% of the bombers still alive.

Yeah I'm of the opinion the Y-Wings, B-Wings or K-Wings could have did a much cleaner job against that Dreadnought that the Fortresses with missile and torpedo strikes.

I think Rebels even had a B-Wing that fired a massive energy beam that could have probably dealt with that thing fairly easily.