/tgesg/ - Elder Scrolls General

Eastmarch Caldera eruption when?

It might just be easier to go a decade before the events of Skyrim desu

This reminds me, the one thing that the team is missing, at least from what I've seen (I've been thinking about asking on the forum about it) is the Aalto region which is the original volcanic region.

I'm not exactly looking for easier. The game HAS to be set after Skyrim because of the way i'm writing the quests and NPCs and the players want a game set after Skyrim.

Not sure how you could show such an outcome

>10-20 years after the events of Skyrim
Why?

Seriously though, it just seems like a hassle. Go the Daggerfall route, with widespread destruction, an equal stalemate, and no one really knows how it happened. Ulfric's battered Stormcloaks rule in the east, and the Legion-supported Jarls rule in the west, both sides locked in a cold war as they lick their wounds. Or something like that, it's not very hard to handwave the situation in Skyrim itself.

What you should spend time doing is thinking about what happens to the Empire after Titus Mede II's death.

Does it really matter? You've already decided to go the lazy Dragon Break route so you basically have free reign to set the situation up anyway you want.

You may as well just say one side or another won, and shape the world accordingly. Or say that it was a stalemate.

How do the Dunmer feel about Orcs? Are they particularly hated, because of their association with Malacath/Trinimac, and associated Anti-Lorkhan-ness?

>How do the Dunmer feel about X?
Cold hatred.

I wonder where the Dwemer went.

>his parents didn't give him the Dwemer talk

I did not do a good job wording what i said, what i meant was what it was like when they used the tools on the heart of Lorkan, as in did it create a portal that they were sucked into? or rather were they all just vaporized instantly?Furthermore how is it that one Dwarf managed to survive the cataclysm in Morrowwind, whereas all the other people of his race disappeared.

They turned into brass but Jagrum was in Oblivion so he didn't. There might be more.

Dunmer hate anything that isn't a Dunmer and they hate Dunmer who aren't from Morrowind as well.

In that regard, roleplaying a Dunmer in the Tribunal years would be fun on tabletop in a group of non-Dunmer.

How realistic would an Orc warrior becoming a high-ranking Redoran because of his immense skill and riches gathered from his career of adventuring? How would such an Orc be viewed in society?

>Furthermore how is it that one Dwarf managed to survive the cataclysm in Morrowwind, whereas all the other people of his race disappeared.
Like anything that isn't fully explained but obviously contradicts some minor point of the more esoteric aspects of the lore: I assume 99% of MK's fever dream garbage is extremely embellished at best, outright propaganda at worst, especially when there's a political motive involved.

Imagine a foreigner who makes it in Japan.

Individually respected for assimilating well, probably still some low key passive aggression implying he's not and never will be quite as good as they are.

FWIW that should be the lot of orcs in most of Tamriel.

>>How do the Dunmer feel about X?
>Cold hatred.
Not every dunmer is the fucking Camona Tong. I know this is a tes lore thread but tone down the autism.

Realistically, not very likely, unless the Orc is unbelievably staunch and dedicated. Like devoting his entire life to House Redoran, and displaying in many instances he is more than willing to put his life on the line for his House. Extreme dedication. Someone who really proves themselves as an exceptional member of the House to which the House nobles take a liking.
Even at a high rank there would be those who show extreme disdain about your race, especially from the legions of envious underlings who believe your position rightfully belongs to a Dunmer (one of themselves), though they wouldnt dare show such disdain in your presence (unless they were a higher rank).
That said, having proven yourself enough to be an outsider worthy of such a high rank in a House would garner you a huge amount of respect and prestigious reputation.

Wait, how tall and big is Whiterun actually supposed to be? Cause in the game it's a little taller than a mountain and as wide as one if you look at it from the outside.
Is that just the scale of things being fucked up in skyrim?

Only ways to bring back the dead gods is to have another kalpa reorder everything, or (more reliably) to undo the Marukhati selection with another Tower-based ritual.

>tfw lore autists assume everything esoteric must absolutely be prima facie true because they're immune to figures of speech irl

Games scale shit way down. Whiterun should probably be at least 5x as wide.

How big would the underworks of Vivec be? Could they connect between cantons? In lore, that is. And I suppose, how big is Vivec too? It's such an interesting location, I haven't ever seen a city in fiction quite like it. All the various factions in one location, the history with Baar Dau. It has a certain Mos-Eisely-ness to it too, makes me imagine crowds of Dunmer with strange foreigners interspersed between them, selling wares and seeking employment. And of course, the underworks just seems like such a good opportunity for dungeons, perhaps even a megadungeon of some kind.

That's the worst part of TES community. People consider everything a puzzle piece of some grand esoteric mystery to be solved. No one wants to let metaphors be metaphors or let the mysteries remain mysteries.

I always imagined them being close to if not equal in size to the sewers under the Imperial City, albeit separated. I imagine some would be connected, but not all of them.

They have a lot of potential for development in my eyes.
You could have the Thieves Guild and Camonna Tong battling for supremacy within them, due to their value for smuggling and as a place for hideouts. You would also have various Daedra worshipers and other heretics persecuted by the Temple. In fact I know there's at least one Daedra shrine in the underworks. Perhaps even the Hlallu being involved, at least by proxy, in the (literally) underground black market of the Underworks.

>I have noted that Heartlanders like myself, and assimilated Imperial Citizens of other races, tend to impersonal and formal relationships with their gods and spirits. For us, cults are first and foremost social and economic organizations. We typically think of the Eight Divines in the most abstract terms -- as powerful but indifferent spirits to be propitiated, and do not think of their relationships as personal. Notable exceptions include minor charismatic sub-cults of Akatosh and Dibella. The Imperial Cult of Tiber Septim also has a significant charismatic sub-cult.
>With the exception of the Alessian Order, which Heartlanders regard as a dark age, religious cults have played only minor parts in Heartlander and Imperial history. The Septim emperors have made it a policy to limit the influence of cult authorities in aristocratic, military, and bureaucratic affairs. Cult worship is regarded as a private and practical matter, and public pronouncements by religious figures are not welcomed.
>Nordic hero-cults provide a strong counter-current to the dominant secularism of the Empire. The Imperial cult of Tiber Septim is just such a hero-cult, and among the military, provincial colonists, and recently assimilated foreigners, the cult is particularly strong and personal.
>Cuseius Plecia, Reflections on Cult Worship in the Empire
I find this really interesting. The rest of it is great too, but I find the Nord-Heartlander split when it comes to spirituality particularly interesting. It sort of gives the Stormcloaks a Jihadi-esque flavor, retrospectively.
It also makes me imagine a parallel uprising in Cyrodiil, one also religious/sectarian in nature, perhaps at home in Colovia. Talos-worshipping Legionaries, disgruntled by recent events and believing the Mede Empire to be cursed, rallying around a charismatic spiritual leader, perhaps a General going AWOL with his Legion, or something. Has some Apocalypse Now vibes too.

Ohio. Unfortunately.

But
Why unfortunately?

The entire aspect of Cyrodiil as being so varied is something that gets lost in both Oblivion and in fan-renditions of it focused on jungles and nothing else.

Cyrodiil should be vibrant and exciting and sometimes I wish the makes of TES had a bit more knowledge of some of the places that they base their lore off of. Like, even the old Pocket Guide of Cyrodiil just kinda leaves off at "jungle" and doesn't dip deeper into how crazy Cyrodiil could really be. Jungle Fantasy Romans isn't as exciting as all the crazy shit Med' peoples had that could be juiced up for fantasy in addition to other stuff.

Any advice for playing Daggerfell? Gog version if that matters.

I figure more of the regulars here have probably played it than the guys over in the Veeky Forums thread.

What about a Non-Dunmer in the Temple? What is the Temple's positions on not just outlanders, but Non-Dunmer actually worshiping the Tribunal, the saints, and perhaps the ancestors? The ancestor aspect gets a bit wonky, after all, how can someone with no blood relation to them have any spiritual connection, but that's why I ask.

...

Would you a Tiber Septim?

>Any advice for playing Daggerfell?
Save often. Raid graveyards to get started. Get good gear fast. Use Recall. Cry a lot.

Anything in particular you're wondering about?

What heresy is this? First of all, It's TALOS, not 'Tiber', okay? Or Hjalti, or maybe Ysmir. Second of all, Talos ain't no wimpy looking Cyrod poof like whatever fool's costumed up in that picture. Everyone knows he's a golden-haired, blue-eyed, ivory-skinned Nord.

Look up a guide on how to deal with the dungeon map system, which is very confusing to a novice, but rather simple when you get it explained + get some experience with it.
Change the controls. Almost every keybind can be changed, and the game is much more playable once you've done that. Again, look up a more detailed guide on how to do that.
For your first time, Minmax. Once you've gotten a grip on the game, you can choose to experiment with weaker builds for RP/Immersion purposes. if you're into that.

Wasn't Hjalti Early-Beard born in Alcaire? That's in High Rock right? So that would make him a Breton.

Pfft, what? Stop talking nonsense. Those Dirrenni knife ears have been working their sorcereries on you, poor fool. How pitiful and tragic, the Manmer are. Everyone knows Talos was born in Atmora. Hjalti is just a nickname, like Ysmir. I don't know where those Imperials got Tiber from, though.

>Anything in particular you're wondering about?
Just general tips and tricks really. Things I should do and things I should avoid.

>RP/Immersion purposes

How much roleplay value can you get out of this game anyway? Best parts of the later games is just walking around and pretending to be someone I'm not while I eat, sleep and try to stay alive exploring the world.

>How much roleplay value can you get out of this game anyway?
Not much, frankly. It's fun for dungeon crawling and such, maybe do the story and read a few books for some retrospective on the series' roots.

Start with the Ebony Dagger.
Figure out when which time limits apply, so that you don't lose a quest or become unable to complete the main story.
Investing time in fiddling with all the control binds is very much worth it.
Character creation is easy to exploit if you want a easy time.
Making "training spells", cheap spells that you can spam, is a quick way to level up magic skills.
Don't bother with language skills.
Buy a horse and a wagon.
In some cases, and most notably for Daedric equipment, buying enchanted items from the Mages Guild is cheaper than buying a non-enchanted version. Use this to get good gear early.
There's something that causes prices to fluctuate between regions, meaning you can find that certain places are better to sell loot than others, though getting money generally isn't very hard.
Pay attention to the text prompt when you enter a store, it describes the store's quality. A good store will have expensive items buy pay little for your loot, a poor store will have worse items and pay more for your loot.
Certain enemies are immune to lesser metals, which is why you want the Ebony Dagger.

To the best of my memory, the best weapon types for each skill is:
Short Blade: Wakizashi
One Handed Long Blade: Katana
Two Handed Long Blade: Dai-Katana
One Handed Axe: Battle Axe
Two Handed Axe: War Axe
One Handed Blunt Weapon: Mace
Two Handed Blunt Weapon: Warhammer
Archery: Long Bow
Generally I'd say Long Blade is the best weapon skill.

Digging through Project Tamriel forums has rewarded me with some great stuff.
>pic related

Daily reminder to you N'Wahs that any hope mankind ever had died with Reman

these are explicitly contradicted by the content of Morrowind, in which your race served as a potential obstacle to hurdle but ultimately did not preclude reaching a high status in the three houses that were properly represented.

Dunmer are explicitly xenophobic, and some are outright racist, especially Ashlanders and the Tong. But Morrowind society is in many ways a meritocracy, and the implicit disadvantage of any given race just means you need to be a little more incredible and a little more valorous to win their favor. Ultimately, there's only a handful of characters who would absolutely refuse to accept you, and most of them have ulterior motives coloring their perceptions.

I think it was a gameplay compromise to an extent. A non-mer Nerevarine should be an improbability and a beast Nerevarine an impossibility. The Houses, too, should be far more restrictive.

user I answered beginning with the word 'realistically.' I'm sorry but Morrowind's a game and its not going to be able to portray things exactly as they would be. I mean in Morrowind an n'wah is able to bring themselves to archmagister status in literally a couple of days, I think you can agree that is a bit ridiculous.
Likewise I was answering from a perspective in which said n'wah was NOT the Nerevarine, and mind you I said that it WAS possible for said n'wah to gain a high ranking place in House Redoran so long as they really, really, prove their worth and dedication and bite the bullet hard enough to show they really do honour and serve the House with staunch faith.

Daily reminder that you are the outlanders now, so you better start to practice polishing nord boots and trimming argonian nails.

>A non-mer Nerevarine should be an improbability and a beast Nerevarine an impossibility. The Houses, too, should be far more restrictive.

Part of the Nerevarine prophecy specifically states that the Nerevarine will be an outlander and associated with the Cyrod empire. Further, the houses *literally have non-Dunmer councilors*, particularly Hlaalu.

>I mean in Morrowind an n'wah is able to bring themselves to archmagister status in literally a couple of days, I think you can agree that is a bit ridiculous.

In the sense that it won't take years, but it'll take more than a few days just to do a couple of low level quests because of the way time worked in game. Nevertheless, as I just mentioned there's indisputable examples of non-Dunmer participating in the Great Houses and even achieving leadership roles, so "It's just a game" doesn't really check out here.

It might be believable with House Hlaalu but as I've said, it's largely a compromise between gameplay and the setting (that wasn't shown with much nuance desu). A Khajiit or Argonian rising up as the Nerevarine sounds a bit absurd.

As far as in game representations are concerned, it's actually House Telvanni that has the most non-Dunmer members, and Hlaalu that has the most non-Dunmer in leadership roles. These are indisputably canon; you cannot explain the presence of figures like Crassus and Yngling away as gameplay conceits. Further, most of the native Morrowind factions have at least some non-Dunmer members among them, including the Tribunal and Morag Tong.

This also ignores the potential outlined in-game to bypass the Hortator and Nerevarine trials by being so (in)famous that everyone just rolls over and accepts it, or by killing anyone who opposes you. Hand waving this as gameplay conceit also strikes me as sloppy, frankly. There's ample in-universe examples that Dunmer society recognizes might and merit, and that being from an unfavored race just makes it much harder, not impossible. This interpretation can coexist with the idea that Dunmer are generally racist and xenophobic, because it turns out that it's a big place with a lot of people who hold a lot of disparate viewpoints. There's Dunmer abolitionists, ffs.

Have you ever been to Ohio?

During the peace council Ulfric and Tullius talk about the Massacre at Karthwasten and the butchery at some other location before being cut off

Any idea what happened?

Orcs are followers of a God who tried to stop Dunmer from leaving Summerset Isles and was subsequently eaten and shat out by one of the Daedra these Dunmer worship.
Do the 16-dimensional math.

>Nevertheless, as I just mentioned there's indisputable examples of non-Dunmer participating in the Great Houses and even achieving leadership roles
First of all, are you even reading my posts? I've literally said twice now that it is possible, just fairly unlikely.
Second off the only House with genuinely high ranking outlanders is House Hlaalu, which given the fact the House is pretty much commonly known to be run by foreign interest, I kind of assumed it was fairly illicit nothing I said applied to that House
House Redoran on the other hand has very few outlanders even in its low ranks.

they're stuck there

what was the point of clarifying if you weren't contradicting me, exactly?

Alrighty guys first time caller, long time listener.

Some months back I finally gave Daggerfall a try with some mods and updates (onboard since morrowind) and I was really pleasantly surprised. As a part of buffing up on lore, etc., I've started going down community rabbit holes and, well, yeesh. I see a lot of "unreliable propaganda" chatter which I think is pretty healthy but out in the field if I were to propose a game that deviated too far from established norms? Like, if I, just for example, knocked out an established guild and replaced it with something, or added a new participant to the aetherium wars, or something of similar scale, how much autistic REEEing would there be? Once I proposed a current edition Planescape game but with the assumption that Factions were HQ'd in their homeplane instead of Sigil and the asspain was incredible despite the fact that I planned on winging that unwritten adventure where you get them all back. Fucking, anyway, what's the TTG response to ESO? As honestly even if it's considered essential to lore at this point (which I've hardly bothered to look) I still probably won't play it.

I know the links in the OP are popular but if you're just kinda sick of the FF system has anyone played or would anyone play Runescape and/or a Runescape reskin?

How influential was the Alessian Order at its height? All throughout Tamriel?

Cyrodiil, Skyrim, High Rock.

They're probably enjoying all the fucking amazing Polish food and wondering why they ever bothered with Tamriel.

Ulfric was sent in to quell Reachmen in Karthwesten some decades ago. He went a bit overboard.

So I was reading the firmament and in it it says that a person's sign is determined by the closeness of the sun to the costellation. If all the stars and sun are fixed due to being exit tunnels to aethurius, how does this work then?

At its height, the Alessian Order was the reigning authority on nearly every religion in Tamriel. Obviously elves weren't very fond of it but even they recognized (and grew wary of) the power and influence Alessianism held over the continent.

If the sun changes position, they must not be completely fixed. They don't have to be literal holes in the ceiling

>exit tunnels
They are holes, but not holes in the ceiling. They go through Oblivion, they go through an entire infinite plane/reality. They are more like black holes, but very bright.
Light holes, if you will.

pastebin.com/d2ZyFZTD

Have writefaggotry I forgot I made

Don't forget if we go by the "Bear of Markarth" book, he also is the cause of all the Thalmor agents actually being in and around Skyrim and most of the Empire by publicly declaring Talos worship legal there.

Why would I believe that biased account?

The author is upset, but nothing in it really reads too outlandish, we know that Ulfric's campaign was brutal and he is upfront that he wanted to wave his dick about. The only thing that's really up for grabs is how much it had to do with Thalmor agents being more prominent in the Empire.

You mean besides the fact ta its also corroborated by the Jarl and many other eye-witness accounts of the event? Or the fact that Arrianus, the guy who wrote, was an Imperial Scholar who had more to gain from Ulfric reclaiming the city tan otherwise? Further, in his other writings he did say that the stereotypical depictions of the forsworn being savages living in dens filled with pelts and bloody entrails was indeed accurate, and that while they are indeed brutish and savage, their feelings of animosity against being discriminated against and subjugated in their own homelands was also very much real to them as well.

Basically, from what the feeling regarding them was like in his writings, it wouldn't be to much of a stretch to say that the relationship between the Nords and he Reachmen is not to dissimilar to the Japanese and Koreans respectively from our world

They hate and fear them.

They are ancestral enemies of the Dunmer, same as the Nords but even WORSE due to their patron and creator Daedric Prince being one corner of the House of Troubles, which is their Quadrunal Satan.

So they are literally demons antithetical to your religion that have tried to destroy your nation in the past.

Pre-Red Mountain explosion Orcs are easily considered to have no soul by 90% of Dunmer population.

I highly doubt average Dunmer miner Trevor Seraslyn knows all that shit

Not him, but the fact that Orcs are created by Malacath, and Malacath being a corner of the House of Troubles, both would be very well known. Like, as basic as a Catholic knowing the basics of the trinity.

Okay, so is there any reason why there are no primitive firearms in TES yet? I mean, considering that they've had the technology for full-plate armor since at least the times of the Alessian Empire, which was invented later in the real world and required more intensive and advanced metallurgy than basic firearms, and also the fact that cannons were referenced in both Daggerfall and Redguard and that explosives and such existed then too.

You'd think that at least by the time of the 4th era, someone would've probably figured out how to make at least something primitive like an arquebus or something. Heck, I'd love to see even something super primitive a fire-lance possibly appear.

Seriously, its the Fourth Era. You'd think there would be more technological advancement by now, especially with people like Reman and Sotha Sil already giving people a leg-up on science and technology

No, that's just you being an asshole apropos fuck all.

TES religion has always followed a theme of taking the forms of IRL myth and remaking them as something actual. In IRL myths and religions you find figures who have been conflated and merged into a single deity just by stories getting garbled over the years, while in TES you get three people becoming a single deity in actuality and not by the simple evolution of stories. In IRL when the names and properties of gods mutate over the ages, again TES has that as something actually happening to real deities rather than being down to human vagaries. There is nothing unusual or objectionable about following that line, and you complaining about it just makes you the contrarian asshole in the room. If you actually had something interesting to say then that might at least mitigate it, but you don't even have that, it was just "muh vidya factions". You're not as smart as you think you are and never will be.

Technology doesn't advance in TES

Just designs

Don't think too much it's high fantasy and Firearms would ruin aesthetic desu familia

The only reason is because it's aesthetically ugly, and not fitting to the feel of the world. And that's the only reason needed.
That, and most of the benefits of modern technology can be achieved with high magical infrastructure. Extremely fast travel via teleportation, instant communication across near infinite distances via telepathy and other means, etc. And that is more interesting than real world technology, which we are used to.

>Altmer have spaceships
>giant robots also exist
>"Hurr durr noguns plz xD"
Wew.

That's a hot opinion. I don't want guns in TES. There are enough gun games out there, TES doesn't need to be one of them.

Real spicy comment lad

There's a pretty cool mod that adds arquebus of Dwemer make

tl;dr The Elder Scrolls world is one of decay, not growth.
Technological advances aren't made, only technological devolution. Hence why the Battlespire wasn't reclaimed, no one's created anything close to the Numidium, and you don't hear about megalomoths or firebirds anymore. Dwemer were a forward thinking race, but they're gone.

There's a pretty cool mod for Skyrim that adds arquebus of Dwemer make. Just make them single shot affairs that require complex reloading. No autoguns or anything.

>arquebus of Dwemer make
Except the Seemed would probably be the least likely to make firearms, as the loud bangs would probably interfere with Tonal Architecture

>Aesthetics
>Implying magic guns aren't cool and rad as hell
>Implying they wouldn't fit in with the psuedo-asian mystacism of the setting despite them being a big thing in 9th century China

I love magic guns as much as the next guy but I just don't feel like they fit TES' overall aesthetic

We don't have spaceships. Well, not cool ones.
We don't have giant robots.
We have guns.
Giant Robots and Spaceships reasonably fall into fantasy.

This is generally fine, except for two points.

- you can learn drawing in a lot of places lmfao
- Clockwork city and, if they tickle your fancy, c0da, subvert the notion that TES necessarily experience decay.

Did someone say guns? In TES?
We'll see about that in 2018

Clockwork City is pretty much separated from the outside