Middle Earth SBG/mesbg

que?

Drums are now a unit upgrade like banners and horns and can be carried by warriors if the wearer is slain.
What changes?

losing more hero choices is bad

>muh Easterlings.
I imagine we'd see more drums on the table due to the widened access, but the fate point the hero versions come with can be quite handy. Only familiar with the Uruk drummer so perhaps others are less points efficient.
Its that time of day/night.

its a shame the hobbits art direction was so lame

>he doesn't like his Wizards covered in birdshit
wow get a load of this guy

is it legal to voluntarily go prone to hide from enemy archers? how does LOS work if you can?

Fuck guys, I have been away for a while. Anything that need to be uploaded on mega?

Its legal. TLoS

how does it work with bases?

Thranduil was superbly fabulous though.

I like most of the Haradrim stuff. Raiders seem fun. Not interested in Mahud as much though I know how strong they are.Umbar I'm really only a fan of Dalamyr and the Knight of Umbar.

Are Hasharin any good?

Golden King seems expensive, wouldn't I be better of with a Nazgul and a cheap Captain?

We're those the beta rules from the recent Throne of Skulls event?

Fuck autocorrect. Were* and off*

Aye. The actual rules are less important than the faction split though. The rules are likely to be tweaked before becoming official, but the factions less so.
Can't go wrong with a Nazgul in any list really, but the Golden King is very good. As a general rule, stay away from Captains. Named heroes are almost always better options

nazguls are so much more interesting than "lol free immobilize" every turn. and them being 1W is even cooler imo

Golden king is a decent fighter and can pay off enemy heroes to run if they break.
Might want to try both him and the betrayer since Harad troops are so cheap, even though half your points in a 500 point match just went towards heroes.

Will I not be a letter to bring Half Trolls? I like the looks and stats of them over Abrakhan Guard, but everyone seems to like the latter due to how cheap they are and how hard they hit.

Am I penalized for using a mixed force of Harad and Umbar? I thought I could build it as I wish so long as the leader of the warband is from the respective force?

1 W? Will?

1 wound ie. you die from one shot or strike unless ofc you've paid for fate points

>Am I penalized for using a mixed force of Harad and Umbar?

If you only bring Harad models, you get a 50% bow limit instead of 33% If that doesn't bother you, you can actually mix and match Harad and Umbar (and far Harad) models in the same warband since they're from the same army list

Right, but I was curious if I would be worse off if I had brought a pure Harad force with Haradrim Raiders, Watchers of Karna, Abrakhan, and sprinkle in some heroes.

Trolls have 2 W vs the Abrakhan with 1. So don't they Outlast Abrakhan despite being worth almost two of them?

>worse off

It's really up to what you want to play, you can do well either way

Half-trolls are worth 3 Abrakhans, and the latter don't get -1 to their duel rolls with their two-handers.
Honestly would recommend mahud raiders over them, both take you out of scorpion sting, but they are very dangerous cavalry even after their hard nerf.

Works for me! Now I just need to get my hands on some Haradrim Raiders and a few Half Trolls. Gonna use a plain Nazgul as either the Knight of Umbar or the Betrayer not sure yet.

I'm not worried about that bonus if it's not really official yet. Especially when I'm just starting out.

I was looking at the old battle games in middle earth magazine and saw in the first issue they had a page of cutouts of the fellowship and a few other heroes. I lost all my minis a few years ago in a move and haven't touched lotr since, so I was wondering if y'all knew if the other issues also came with cut out minis I could print out? I would like to try getting back in the game but as of now the cost is too prohibitive

thanks

Harad is one of the few armies were the bow limit thing essentually is official. Its definitely something to consider now as it affects list building significantly (bow limit).

>not official
It is, look at the fallen realms source book. All that's missing is making serent guard worthless since sourcebook ST doesn't make your base warriors re-roll 1's in melee.

>making their base warriors into serpent guard because they stopped making serpent guard models

I... huh

So... Maybe something likes this?

Betrayer
6 Watcher of Karna with Bow
3 Abrakhan Guard

Golden King of Abrakhan
4 Haradrim Raiders with War Spear
6 Haradrim with Spear

Hasharin

Comes to 499.

I guess I could drop the third hero, take another Raider and another Haradrim with Spear in the second group. First group could have more Haradrim with Bows or Spears and another Abrakhan.

Too many points in heroes?

user, the golden king is infantry.
If you want to go with that army composition swap him out for Suladan.
He's almost the same points with a horse and a bow.

I can't have a flanking group of Raiders with my infantry block? Weird.

>Pay a point
>Get F4
All seems fine to me. Considering how minor re-rolling 1’s to wound is, you’d still want to take Serpent Guard unless you knew you were fighting elves.
Perhaps. Even their elites are relatively cheap so you’d expect Harad to have a fair amount of models. Dropping the hasharin to fill out your warbands and perhaps mount the Wraith would be my suggestion

I just think it's weird to have a fairly vulnerable and expensive model have only 6 squishy troops to guard him.
Making it Suladan allows you to put the 6 warriors with the Hasharin and using them as a more tempting anvil or diversion for your cavalry while a mounted hero lets you call heroic combats and press the advantage of your small cavalry force.

Redpill me on the Lake Town house terrain?

looks nice but you can build something similar with carbboard and coffestirrers yourself.

Does anyone have scans of the rules for Battle of the Five Armies boxed game?

Are Banners ever really worth their points?

Yeah, helps out if you're fight 4 or better, or are cavalry.

Has Specialist Games announced there’s a new core rulebook coming out this year or is that still a rumor?

Everything’s announced besides specific models returning/coming out
Cavalry is debatable. You obviously really want to win on the charge but it also doesn’t affect very many due to the base sizes

Cool, so when is the release date supposed to be?

This year

Is there a Warhammer Community announcement somewhere with that info?

Nope. All comes from Twitch and Tournament seminars.

Damn alright.

So Harad is being broken up into 3 sub factions? Interesting.

Like in the Harad sourcebook, as things should be.

Effectively. It's largely only however as actual Harad loses a little but gains a little, while the other two only gain.

Prevent cherry picking I guess. Would it be unwise to try and get some Mordor units in there?

Of you don't care about army bonus, mordor can give you black guard and trolls. The cool thing is, the betrayer counts for CotBG for the dark lord rule and boosts his courage to 6, so an elite contingent of him, some blackguard, and a troll would go nicely with a haradrim horde. You really don't want to be taking their regular orcs since your southrons already cover the cheap troop aspect, and strength 5 or better is a godsend. Also mordor cavalry sucks compared to yours.

If I bring Khamul as leader of a Mordor warband with some mordor troops will he still benefit from a war priests fury?

I'd say no because it's Mordor Khamul and not Easterlings Khamul, if that makes any sense.

I was gonna take a Troll Chieftain... Thats probably pushing it on points.

Betrayer (120)
-4 Watchers of Karna with Bow (40)
-7 Haradrim with Spears (49)
Troll Chieftain (140)
- 6 Morannon Orcs with Shield (48)
Mordor Uruk-hai Captain with Two Handed Weapon (55)
-5 Mordor Uruk-Hai with Two Handed Weapons (45)

It's surprisingly not covered in any of the FAQs but RAW probably has the right of it, as War Priest's Fury also affects mounts. Without an exception being specified for Khamul, if you were gonna allow him to benefit when taken in a Mordor list, you'd also have to allow all Horses, Armoured Horses, and Fell Beasts mounted by anyone and everyone.

At that point you're not even playing Harad anymore, but Mordor with a Harad contingent. Which means you still have scorpion sting.

Because that contingent is only made up of Harad models?

If I had a box of Harad Raiders I'd take them, but the plastic kit is so hard to find. I've scoured eBay, Bartertown, and my LGS group.

The bow limit special rule only works if I take Harad units for every Contingent correct?

Yes, if every model in the force or every model in an allied contingent follows the rules for scorpion sting then it has 50% bow limit. So if you take a third force from say Isengard you still have ST, but another Harad warband with as much as a single arbalester or mahud gets rid of ST.
Confusing, I know.

So I could have more Bowmen despite having Mordor and Isengard units, but if I take a Harad detachment and it has any Mahud or Umbar units I lose Serpent Sting and the bow limit ability?

I guess I'm trying to ask that if I bring only Haradrim I can still have 50% bow limit and reroll 1s to wound, right?

I guess I mean like this if it makes more sense.

Haradrim Contingent
Mordor Contingent
Isengard Contingent

50% Bow limit and Serpent Sting

Haradrim Contingent
Mahud Contingent
Mordor Contingent

X 50% Bow Limit or Serpent Sting

Problem is there is no mahud army to make a contingent out of since them and the corsairs are lumped in as part of Harad.

That's why you lose the army bonus

In the current rules, pic related applies. IE. You can have 50% bow limit in your Haradrim contingent as long as it doesnt make use of Umbar or Mahud models (which are currently in the Harad faction).

In the new rules, as it stands, you will get 50% bows and re-rolls to 1's but only if you use the models listed. Anything else removes your army bonus.

Lol so a single hero and 12 warriors warband still gets their rules so long as their contingent is only Haradrim. Even if I bring a Mordor Contingent.

Wow that's convoluted in a way.

how long can this go on?

The only real reason for it is that you get 50% bows in a box of Haradrim Warriors and Raiders

Where are those new rules you are referring to?

See the top of page for the experimental Harad rules and faction split. See TaBA for how they work

They gave it to Easterling too since they give you 4 archers out of 10 models

2 pikes in an Easterling box is stupid

No actually, if you play harad but ally in mordor you lose serpent sting because your whole force isn't the allowed models, but playing mordor and allying in harad does let you keep your haradrim allies within scorpion sting territory.
Yes it's that stupid.

what's the difference

There isn't one. user is being silly. If you have two different factions in your army then they are both allied contingents. There is no such thing as a main contingent

Are there any beta rules for Mordor Angmar, or Isengard?

All non-Hobbit factions got their own.
Obviously the rules are all subject to change, based on the feedback at the tournament and on the Facebook groups the team frequent.

Similarly, Goblin-town get 18 Warriors to their warbands as they get 18 Gobbos on a sprue

Actually pretty ok

have you ever fought against a mumakil? i did once. it was horrible. couldn't stop it because i rolled badly with my ballista

My brother used to use one all the time back in the day. Heroes are its main weakness. Get a hero near it and it gets neutralised pretty handily

>Friendly Moria Goblins involved in a Fight
where their opponent is trapped receive a bonus of +1 to their Fight value.
you have to win the fight/duel roll before an enemy is trapped though?

By definition, a model is considered trapped if it cannot back away an inch. Not technically anything about having to actually be backing away to be considerd trapped. Feel free to contact Jay or Adam if you think it needs clarified in the final version though. May as well give them the feedback now rather than later

you have determined the winner of the fight before being trapped is checked, thus fight values don't matter at that point. that's how i see it atm

Guess it should read "if the enemy would be trapped upon losing" or something

getting trapped is not always certain. you can opt not to make use of the make way rule. also playing it like you say slows the game down because you sometimes would have to measure very strictly if there is a full inch to fall back on

You can be trapped and win a fight user. Being trapped is not being able to back away, not losing the fight and then not being able to back away.
>getting trapped is not always certain. you can opt not to make use of the make way rule.
Is the only real issue I see here.
Bit of a shit rule anyway for all but Prowlers.

>You can be trapped and win a fight user
when

and how are prowlers relevant here

Prowlers would have a Fight value that might be relevant if boosted by one and a special rule that means you are probably already jumping through hoops trying to trap opponents.

>the khandish
>described as squat, broad men that were dwarflike and wielded great axes
>those don't get the burly special rule

don't be retarded

That would have been a neat way of encouraging a pure Khand force. Unfortunately they instead only allowed you to use a pure mounted Khand force. Shame the cavalry is OOP

Well, Mordors isn't terrible so that's good.

I thought being trapped meant you had more Strike coming your way.

>“You are Men of Gondor. Whatever comes through that gate, you will stand your ground!” - Models from this Army List increase their Courage value by 1.

I'll take it I suppose. Courage 6 denethor seems pretty dope