CWOD vs nWOD

What's your choice and why?
And don't forget to mention your favourite setting and ed too.

cwod cuz classic masquerade is true and requiem is a pos. And also because some awakening fags ruined my last thread.
VtM Revised (yes I am too lazy to read older editions)

nwod

more options, less bloat of fluff, more scope for creating something more novel, better rules system, better balance, splat crossover is built into the rules and the fluff, you can just run owod games using the nwod rules in most cases too.

nWoD, mostly for the feeling that everyone's out for themselves in the occult underground rather than the world being divided up among ancient conspiracies that control everything. (The ancient conspiracies exist in nWoD, but they seem more limited and vulnerable.) It's very possible that I get the wrong impression of cWoD, though, as I haven't read much of it. Hunter: the Vigil is the coolest splat, though, so nWoD definitely has that going for it.

nWoD, because the vast majority of oWoD fluff is retarded.

>ancient conspiracies that control everything

what about the god-machine, though

NWoD has better mechanics. In terms of fluff:
Masquerade >>> Requiem
Apocalypse >, idgaf what anyone else says Forsaken
Ascension = Awakening
Dreaming < Lost
Wraith > Geist > Orpheus
Reckoning < Vigil
Fallen < Descent
Idgaf about Mummy
Beast is bad

I'd personally interpret the Divine Rube Goldberg Machine as controlling everything just barely enough to work, and sometimes rather disjointedly or at cross-purposes with itself. And I'd probably just treat it as not existing outside of Demon: the Descent, which kind of needs it for all its spy shit.

I remember reading the nwod Mummy book and being extremely intrigued, but I've never even heard about anyone actually running a game

>classic masquerade is true and requiem is a pos
t. brainlet

oWoD for mage and vamp, nWoD for Werewolf, Changeling, Hunter (but only pre GMC rules seriously they fucked everything up)

technocratic union did nothing wrong

oWoD Mage. New mage is too Harry Potter. In fact all of the nWoD feels like some Harry Potter bullshit.

The only improvement was vampire, which became playable, but I'll still use the old fluff. Some of the new writing is good but I just don't give a shit about their new canon and never will.

Apocalypse is unironically better than forsaken. They're also very different since apocalypse is more pulpy.

>New mage is too Harry Potter. In fact all of the nWoD feels like some Harry Potter bullshit.
What does this even mean?

oWoD because daeva and mekheweket or whatever are lame, Lasombra and Toreador and cool.

>Daeva is literally Toreador and Brujah under the same banner and given more scope instead of just "pretty vampires" or "angry vampires"
>this is lame

I remember really trying hard to get into Vampire: the Requiem. I could not fucking stand it. I couldn't stand any of the writing, even if the rules are streamlined I didn't really care for those either. I didn't like the aesthetic, the lore, the visuals, nothing about Requiem seemed interesting to me in comparison to Old World of Darkness. There are a plethora of places and scenarios which you can conjur that do not involve over-arching Methusalah conspiracies. I'll admit that V:tM really lost the plot with Gehenna, and their strange and elusive explanations as to its avoidance is queer. Regardless, Classic World of Darkness is hometown while Requiem always felt like a fly-over.

oWoD meets nWoD in Unknown Armies, vampires and ghosts as per WoD canon, mages as per UA canon. That's what I'd play and/or run.

Are you me?, Apocalypse might have been retarded and cartoonish with its green aesops but at least it had a point, Forsaken just feels like a furfag fantasy for the sake of itself.

Also, Black Spiral Dancers are an example of a stupid evil villain being more interesting, The Pure are boring garbage.

Awakening over Ascension.
- Magic system is so much better that I can't even look at standard Ascension without urge to find his designer and torture him to death.
- I extremely dislike subjective reality and Consensus. In Awakening, mages look for hidden truths and laws of reality. In Ascension, mages are basically madmen who somehow believe that their magic theory is correct while being presented with direct evidence that it is not.
- I prefer Awakening cosmology, metaphysics and gnostic universe.
- I dislike Traditions, who are basically "stereotypes about mages" and somehow should be "good guys". Even if they isn't. Order/Path combination is just better.
- Overall, I prefer Awakening fluff and have more interesting ideas about possible and actual games. Ascension just don't ping for me.

Ascension over Awakening. New WoD has undeniably better rules, but is not written to unlock the mind of the reader. The so called book of Awakening is a grimoire of entropy. The paths and orders are stereotypes of their own, and ultimately more restrictive ones at that.

To each their own.

This is about how I feel for it. Mostly I just run OWoD lore with me stealing shit from the NWoD things that I think are good, like adding in the God-Machine.

>given more scope
Like what

>adding in the God-Machine.
but the Iterators already had the Computer

What about Promethean?

It isnt really comparable to any oWoD lines with the whole Frankenstein theming.

nWoD, because it lets me run Genius: The Transgression. Which is one of my favourite systems and settings, ever.

Consensual Reality and its implications is one of the largest reasons MtA is one of my favorite settings of all time. You speak of "evidence" in a world where that concept makes no sense. Its an entirely novel metaphysical system. In real life, we have concepts like Uniformity [the assumption/axiom that the universe runs by natural laws that are the same everywhere and have always been as they are now] and Empiricism [the idea that sense-information gives us reliable information about an objective external world].

In the world of Mage the Ascension, the universe doesn't work on those axioms and science doesn't really work. Instead, the universe is created by the Consensus of intelligent beings within a certain point of space-time. For the average person, this is an unconscious process, but not for the Awakened, who can enforce their own reality in place of others.

The entire point is that there is no universal, objective, absolute Truth in the world of Mage. When Mages talk about beliefs they don't mean the things they believe actually exist [in the sense of, phenomena of this character is something I could encounter] they mean the kind of universe they want to exist.

To the highly scientific, modernist thinker [or in other words, the Technocratic mind] this kind of universe is anathema, they can't wrap their heads around it. But its a very interesting concept nonetheless, and the various implications it sows [Marauders, beings whose reality has totally dislodged from other people], [Paradox, the force of contradiction between your reality and that of the masses] are cool.

>The entire point is that there is no universal, objective, absolute Truth in the world of Mage.
And that's why I prefer Awakening, there such Truth exists and mages are looking for it. To me, magic is about secret knowledge and looking for hidden truth, not about belief.

But they ARE looking for it. They don't know everything user just said.

> Apocalypse might have been retarded and cartoonish with its green aesops but at least it had a point, Forsaken just feels like a furfag fantasy for the sake of itself.

And yet Forsaken is the edition without Red Talons and dog raping.

There's literally nothing wrong with red talons

Just 'looking for mysteries and truth' is an okay game idea, but it doesn't appeal to me as much as "Define your own reality"

Mages in Ascension, contrary to what the user 'agreeing' with me says are not looking for truth, they're defining it and creating it. Its a kind of Existentialist ethos and I like it.