Land, go

>Clearly doesn't understand how tempo works
UB pirates is weak against cheap interaction. Chupacabra is great value but it's not particularly fast, so pirates may still get over the finish line. As for Scarab God, he's a fucking nothing against the deck because he'll either eat a Mana Leak or Unsummon.

Have you never played against an aggressive deck before or something?

sup

Not a turn 1 play. What's your point?

land, ornithopter, enter the unknown

>inb4 ornithopter ban

At this point I really don't have the confidence to say that any card is safe from a ban.

Swamp

Enables casting Chupacabra.

>Attune With Aether is kill
>Can't run my janky Electrostatic Pummeler deck anymore

I guess I can replace them with Greenbelts but damn man, I just wanna punch shit for lethal

Try hadana's climb?

I unironically hope everyone who runs pummeler decks gets fucking cancer, for real
you too buddy

I just want to play a deck with giant robots who punch things, is that so wrong?

retard alert

it's wrong because there are 8 one-mana spells available that protect your stupid thing and spells that give your assholes trample at instant speed making it impossible to play against the deck unless when the deck runs poorly and basically kills itself
also please don't compare big o to your shit meme deck thank you

There's Blossoming Defense and I guess Heroic Intervention (Which is a 2-drop, and I don't even run it), but the deck easily gets fucked over with all the artifact hate being churned out after Mardu Vehicles dominated the format until Abrade showed up, and with Naturalize being reprinted it'll be even easier.

Also the card art is a robot with a large arm punching the ground with a pile bunker, the comparison is easy to make.

>both standard decks have been banned out of standard
WotC, fix your fucking R&D department

>Protecting your wincon in a turn 7 haymaker deck is impossible to play against
Surely this is bait

>Energy
>Enabled decks to have easier manabases at 4c than 2c decks which weren't running it.
>Ban one card that was enabling the mana base, as well as a value creature that traded well.
Okay. Not really a good sign for design, but okay.
>Ramunap Red
>A really good aggro deck that was keeping every deck but Energy honest and smart, because it could wear down all those control builds without them taking over the game unopposed.
>Ban a hate card against a deck that was its worst matchup, a deck that has a hard time against control in the meta regardless, ultimately smashing both decks flat.
>Ban a land that acts as a finisher if they're sitting at 4 or so life.
Yeah, good fucking job wizards. Fuck right off. You don't get to ban because you don't like the direction the meta shifts. Banning is a cover-up for your mistakes and nothing else.

The ramunap banning is an obvious desperation move. They didn't dare to take the risk that the meta would not change after the energy banning.
The ramunap matchup data is worthless as decks other than temur energy and rr where basically 60 card sideboards against energy with 15 more sideboard cards against rr. Naturally non energy decks would do badly against rr.
Ferocidon ban is particularly pointless. Black and white are getting several cards that are great against rr and can be played in their mainboards.

Exactly. I don't even play Ramunap Red, but I wanted it in the format. I play monument, and by using Red to keep the format honest and from allowing Scarab God Control, Gift, and Approach to run rampant, I had room to play mine. A format with a fast red deck is a healthy format, and I hate that Wizards managed to kill all of the decks I want to play by thinking they get to dictate what decks are the correct fun.

I'm fucking mad.

>I guess i'll buy the new set and make a tribal deck now

I meant dive down as the other 4
the problem is that when you finally manage to kill the pummeler (which you are trying to do at sorcery speed, actually interfering with your gameplan) they still manage to bend and fuck you over with bristling hydra which has built-in hexproof and kill you anyway.
i had games where i took down 2 pummeler before they could attack and my opponent managed to 16 to 0 me with hydras in a single attack, sure that's fun.
and don't even get me started on the assholes who run fling

surely you meant turn 5
>attune
>voltaic brawler
>whatever
>pummeler with blossoming defense backup
>dead
and that's not even the perfect draw
>attune
>servant
>pummeler with blossoming defense backup
>dead on turn 4 with a single pump spell

Turn 1:
Forest, Attune. E=2
Turn 2:
Aether Hub, Servant. E=5
Turn 3:
Aether Hub, Pummeler. E=9
Turn 4:
Forest, Larger than Life, Larger than Life. Three pumps, swing for 72.

This right?

Is the matchup against approach that bad for red?
Do you think that the new cards will help at all?
Phoenix dodges removal, Tilonalli summoner can flood the board and functions as a mana sink should the opponent use settle the wreckage, and daredevil can recycle the opponents card draw and counter spells.
Or are these too slow and weak to removal?

pummeler wasn't even that good...

wtf broken card

I have no clue why Wizard's didn't make energy more flexible and let players steal opponent's energy or destroy it.

It was MaRo's pet mechanic, and he didn't want anything messing with it.

I'm not making that up, either, that isn't hyperbole. He'd been trying to jam energy in since Mirrodin.

It's wierd, especially when coming up with fun anti energy cards should be easy. Red could've for example had a spell that gives target player 3 energy counters, then deals 1 damage for each energy counter the player has.
I also don't understand why they don't design hate cards for out of control mechanics and then include them in the next set. It doesn't even have to be a new card, they can just slap some specific hate on a vanilla creature or add an extra mode to some draft fodder spell.

He hadnt been trying to "jam" it. Also they're careful.about not hosing any set's mechanic, but you cant really reference energy outside of sets with it, and it doesnt make sense to have a lot of spells that removes counters (though we ould have had one I guess and they didn't) , and they made a spell that prevents you from gaining any and nobody played it.

This will always bother me.
They had the perfect occasion during Aether Revolt, a set about going rogue and stealing energy from the city. They could have added some cards to remove/steal energy on etb or when dealing damages or just having stronger effects when the opponent has more energy.

Couldn't agree more with the first part, like in the story gremlins and renegades steal energy all the time. Imagine if Kari Zev and the token she created had "if this creature deals combat damage to a player, that players loses 3 energy counters" or there were gremlins you could sacrifice to steal energy or destroy an artifact that uses energy. Sadly energy seems so specific to Kaladesh that it wouldn't make sense to print answers in other sets.

I think Kaladesh was the easiest block ever to go 4 colors into, between fastlands and aether hub/attune.

Cheapest, too. Attune was 20 cents at best, hub like 1 buck.

Tarkir/BFZ standard was not that long ago fella

An energy deck's manabase costs less than one fetchland.

This is probably irrelevant semantics here, but an energy deck's manabase costs about as much as two fetchlands back during Tarkir standard.

>Sadly energy seems so specific to Kaladesh that it wouldn't make sense to print answers in other sets.
I really can't see the harm done in putting hate against an out of set mechanic on some bulk commons. It balances the meta without affecting the powerlevel of limited. The only downside is that it might look silly.

The cheaper thing was ps at the end of your post. The primary point was about being easy to go into 4 colors.

but user, that would be a flavour fail!!!

Thing is, core sets would let them do that, Origins has tons of Kaladesh cards on it, they could have made a core set with energy hate while Kaladesh was in standard

You can always just attack players that have counters on them.

Hoard of Sand
>1W
>Sorcery
>Split Second
>Remove all counters from target creature or player.

Succumb to Greed
>2R
>Instant
>Split Second
>Succumb to Greed deals damage to target creature or player equal to the number of counters on that creature or player.

What I found interesting comming back to magic was to find out how energy have pretty much no cost.

Finding a basic land and putting it on your hand for 1 is just fine, so why adding 2 energy have no mana cost added?

Some of the energy cards I have seeing seem to be pretty solid outside giving energy and then others get crazy buff with that energy...

Why is that?

>Finding a basic land and putting it on your hand for 1 is just fine,
No ita not. Lay of the land is a super weak card.

>four fucking bans at once

how are they screwing up this hard

Imagine how much better this thing would've been if it was
>XB
>1/1
>Flying, Lifelink
>When Aetherborn Marauder enters the battlefield, remove X counters from target oppenent or permanent an opponent controls. Put that many +1/+1 counters onto Aetherborn Marauder.

Retrospect I think these cards would be better if their mana costs were flipped, especially since the red spell just straight up can't kill 95% of creatures which have counters (which are +1/+1 counters in that 95% of the time). I was just spitballing though, and trying to fit them into the Amonkhet theme, and -1/-1 counters were present there.

well, it isnt good, but there is not such a thing as "Half mana" in normal magic.

but being able to get your fix for next turns and also getting your energies.

>pay 6B for a 1/1 flying lifelink, trigger on the stack as it ETBs.
>In response I pay 6 energy into Whirler Virtuoso to make 2 1/1 flying Thoper tokens.

>well, it isnt good, but there is not such a thing as "Half mana" in normal magic
There is, it's called Phyrexian mana. The original problem was making the color payable with life and not the generic.

Thats why attune exists. Because energy is more granular than mana (1 E is worth less than 1 M), they tried to make a lay of the land worth its cost by having it make energy. Turns out it was apparently too much for standard, but the principle was fine.

This whole game has been deep in flavor failure territory for a while.

making 1 energy would be to weak, having 2 energy was to much.
There is always this middle points

They literally introduced a race made of energy, some of which are able to steal lifeforce. I have no idea why none of them can steal and destroy energy.

Energy wouldn't have been half the problem it was if Amonkhet and Ixalan weren't underpowered pieces of shit and if there were other types of viable decks than Aggro and Midrange.

Maybe Timmy would have been able to play his dinos and pirates if the cards weren't trash and less value than energy in a meta where value oriented midrange play is everything

Any strong creature would work better in an energy core. One of the main problems with energy was its ability to have perfect mana and play whatever it wants.

Energy abilities should have been sorcery speed

fucking this
people don't seem to understand that attune was banned not because it's a good card (it's not) but only because it made the best deck in the format possible, and why is it the best deck? because the other cards suck ass

>Any strong creature would work better in an energy core
No, it doesn't.
Read ripjaw raptor, the card is stupid good, is it better than bristling hydra in a vacuum? Fuck yeah it is, but it happens that doesn't sinergize at all with the rest of the deck so there's no point in playing it.
Regisaur alpha? Fuck, that's a 7/7 for five mana on two bodies, and 3/3 of that has haste, and it happens to be worse than a whirler virtuoso in energy decks.

This seems like what they're trying to do yeah.

And if ripjaw was better than hydra enrgy would have played it and dinos wouldn't have been any more competitive.
Had there been no bans, energy could have played Ghalta more effectively than dedicated dino decks.

I don't agree with your card comparisons. Firstly evaluating cards in a vacuum is useless, but more specifically hydra and raptor differ very much in their abilities. Hydra has built in protection from targeted removal and ability to grow, while raptor has better initial stats and build in card advantage ability. Comparing Regisaur to a random energy card just because they create tokens is stupid, as their abilities, costs and functions are really different. Moreover Regisaurs playability is affected hard by glorybringer who shares the same mana cost and thus the same slot in nondinosaur decks, not whirler virtuoso. Regisaur also has the problem of matching really bad against opposing glorybringers.

Attune also isn't a bad card, people just like to drop the gain 2 energy part from the card when comparing it to lay the land. The energy gain is half of the card, just like the scry 1 is part of Opt, which would be really mediocre without it.

Wizards is just bad at balancing the game and printed 4 sets of shit after 2 sets of strong cards.

They had a whole new creature type which lore says that they are made from Energy.
And the plot of Kaladesh regarded the goverment issuing a decree which stopped invertors from using energy.
And they could have had pirates being energy thiefs or things like that.

They had a lore reason to put cards that hated on energy on every color but green, but they decided that new players would cry if the game were interactive.

>Any strong creature would work better in an energy core

You made the claim, and now you're moving the goalposts. Just kys retard.

kaladesh:
>unplayable in modern
>banned in standard

Has there ever been a bigger failure of a set? Why would they do this? Why release it at all? Really sad for anyone who cares about the integrity of the game.

lol

greenbelt, highspire infusion