/STG/ - Star Trek General

Those specifically are either garage-casts/3d prints that have been cleaned up or ancient FASA models. Probably the latter.

The discolouration on those Saladins is pretty nice.

>hurtstolive.jpg

No, it's just easy to see when people are fat even when they're professionally dressed to look less so.

That's pretty good.

You know, the original plan was for Discovery to be the linchpin for several spinoffs. Maybe eventually they can keep Discovery as angsty space-Game of Thrones and make a fun series about thick TOS Tilly to compete with The Orville.

Then everyone would be happy, right?

...

Never. Killy is dead senpai.

...

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>ISS Discovery appears in main universe
>Klingon warship attacks
>Killy transports onto the Klingon ship just before Discovery is destroyed
>Slaughters all the crew
>Flies around attacking random alien worlds
>Learns about L'Rell and her bomb
>Decides to kill L'Rell and detonate the bomb
>Tyler gets L'Rell to safety for a while
>Calls USS Discovery to come deal with Killy

>end up hiding the bomb somewhere on Praxis where it will never hurt anyone

...

>implying

Am I the only one that thinks Tilly is an annoying CW-esque meme character?
I don't like that trope of "insecure fast talking awkward but funny nerd".

KEK

She definitely skirts that line but it works for me. I think it's the fact that "insecure, fast-talking socially awkward nerd" are played as negative traits that she is working to get past rather than just painting that as the extent of her character and having everyone else love her. Most of the characters that meet Tilly seem pretty put off by her personality and she is portrayed as someone who is actively trying to be better.

Plus her Captain Killy persona is great.

Hey, we had Reginald Barclay in TNG and VOY, and the fact that he was this imperfect, neurotic, addiction-prone type was a nice change from the usual.

His first episode's holodeck scenes were cringy as fuck, though.

...

Tilly feels a bit too much like a meme character to me especially with the Mirror Georgie Interaction and the Orion bong from the last episode. Barclay felt like a real person imo.

She's just another fat comedy relief character like Hollywood likes so much.

Looking back at Barclay, I'm a lot less fond of the character. The portrayal seems a bit too heavily leaning on stereotype rather than nuanced.

Also holy shit was he ever over-used in Voyager. And managed to lose character development along the way, and was put in positions and got away with shit that shouldn't have happened in the first place.

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I unironically laughed out loud when Tilly saluted Georgiou

Actress who plays Tilly pls go.

t. LCD

>implying said actress even watched star trek let alone remembered Barclay

>insecure fast talking awkward but funny nerd
ezri_dax.holoprogram

And that's why I disliked Ezri. Jadzia>>>>>>>Ezri, deal with it fags.

except atlas is a swift and nimble bruiser.

>Barclay felt like a real person

I find it hard to believe that even in the 24th century Barclay would both hold rank on a starship and retain his holodeck access privileges after it got out that he was turning his coworkers into holodolls and killing/fucking them.

And that's before we get to

>turned into Brainiac just like in everybody's favorite Superman movie
>turned into giant spider
>destroyed a star because he thought he could talk to a different crew he'd also made holodolls out of
>gave a hooker classified information and almost resulted in the destruction of an entire starship

Don't get me wrong, Barclay was clearly played for laughs, but he was not realistic. Tilly's indiscretions are those of a genuine junior officer and - on Q'onos - those of someone who has been given conflicting orders and is too junior and green to either legally countermand or disobey them. And she was picked for that mission on those grounds, by Georgiou.

...

>Tilly is more realistic/less memey than Barclay
'no'

>gave a hooker classified information and almost resulted in the destruction of an entire starship
That one's definitely realistic.

Not to mention that Tilly was most likely picked by Lorca for the Discovery based solely on the merits of her Mirror counterpart anyway. From his perspective he was getting a famous and ruthless Terran hero on his crew easy because she was just a cadet.

>"Hey Captain, remember when you said I could have my own room but now I have to share a room with somebody else, I'm just checking to make sure that's set in stone because you know I have a lot of allergies and I'm kind of self conscious about how I snore and also talking to people makes me nervous."
>Is she fucking serious this woman has destroyed entire planets in my universe

So I'm adapting something for use in an STA campaign, and I need to confirm something.

Is there any specific regulation/edict/etc. against using photon or other torpedoes against a planetary surface? Obviously the ship's captain and probably the rest of the senior staff are likely to get shitcanned for it since such things simply Aren't Done in Starfleet (except maybe in conjunction with General Order 24), but are there repurcussions beyond this? The incident would occur between a Starfleet vessel and a non-major power.

Photon Torpedoes are Exterminatus level (to borrow 40k for a bit) depending on their payload. The only reason Sisko got away with it was because of shitty writing (imo). Any Starfleet officer doing this would be immediately court marshaled and then thrown in prison for life. And not the cushy prison that Tom Paris was in.

I mean, you'd go to jail forever, since you just eliminated a planetary population. They don't really need a special rule that says "don't do this". It's kinda like how the RL military doesn't have an explicit rule about not shooting civilians, it's just understood that you do not shoot civilians or you go to jail full stop forever.

>Exterminatus level

photon torpedoes would be the equivalent of using very large yield nuclear weapons, iirc 40 to 160ish megatons, though we've seen them used to do less than a quarter ton of boom (thanks Voyager).

They're not that level.

I'd still qualify that as Exterminatus. Throw enough at a planet and you will make it completely uninhabitable in addition to wiping out any living life on the surface.

They are supposed to be variable payload with preset levels (though it's unclear where TNG thought the payload would go, or whether this indicated that some torpedoes were always at each particular preset level); the heaviest load Janeway ever took was 200 isotons (but it's unclear whether Voyager ever fired this, as she had to have Tuvok specifically modify a type-6 torpedo to have an 80-isoton yield).

Taking the Technical Manual-derived 2.6 megatons/isoton, a single 2370s type-6 torpedo could have a yield of 520 megatons, more than an order of magnitude greater than the yield of the largest nuclear device ever detonated.

>The Tsar Bomba's fireball, about 8 km (5.0 mi) in diameter, was prevented from touching the ground by the shock wave, but nearly reached the 10.5-kilometre (6.5 mi) altitude of the deploying Tu-95 bomber.

Taking the on-screen evidence (of dialogue and visual effects), the 2.6megaton/isoton estimate is... low.

Also just to add to this: it's not really clear what separates photon torpedoes from quantum torpedoes or transphasic torpedoes, but it's unlikely to be raw energy output, as we don't see the Defiant (or nearby ships with less advanced shielding) or Voyager suffer the shockwaves of such massive detonations, which - to make the devices have any purpose at all - must necessarily be more destructive than a standard photon torpedo warhead.

It's possible that quantum torpedoes exploit the relativistic effects of matter-antimatter weapons (which would explain the "quantum" moniker but wouldn't necessarily mean a higher explosive yield or larger payload), while "transphasic" suggests a penetrative effect (on shields, if not physical matter) that would grant such devices a significant edge without the need to increase payload either. As we've seen multiple times, very few vessels are capable of surviving direct strikes from torpedoes when unshielded. While hero ships obviously get plot armor, background vessels - especially during the Dominion War - don't appear to be particularly resilient to such impacts even with shields up.

Transphasic torpedoes bypass shields and armor by going out of phase with reality before rematerializing at their target. Quantum torpedoes were absolutely supposed to be a bigger boom judging by beta canon, but of course effects teams don't listen to that.

It'll only be a single torp, used to demonstrate to a stroppy little non-aligned world that Starfleet does not appreciate raiders with outlawed weapons preying on nearby colonies and other neutrals. (Although this discussion did just prompt an idea on how to tie that incident with something else that'll be uncovered, so thank everyone for that.) I was just wondering if there was some analogue to the Honorverse's Eridani Edict that had come up in expanded universe or previous edition materials.

>used to demonstrate to a stroppy little non-aligned world that Starfleet does not appreciate raiders with outlawed weapons preying on nearby colonies
That sounds exceptionally un-Starfleet, but if that was the goal why not just use phasers from orbit?

>The only reason Sisko got away with it was because of shitty writing (imo).
1) Sisko didn't immediately exterminatus the planet. Every human colonist had ample time to flee to a new home, and the trilithium did not affect Cardassians.
2) As a result of #1, the Federation and Cardassians were able to simply swap planets, which also solved the problem of the Cardassian planets that had been bombed in an inverse manner by Eddington. Clean, simple, no hassle beyond relocating people.
3) As a result of his actions, and his threat to continue, Sisko was able to capture the leader of the Maquis, who had noticeably taken the Maquis on a much more active, militant and deadly course of action than previously.
4) Sisko is already both a noted and respected commanding officer and the lynchpin of their diplomatic efforts on Bajor, which itself is the lynchpin of any efforts in the sector and along the Cardassian border. Last thing they want to do is piss off the religious fanatics by getting rid of their Jesus figure.

So while Sisko's actions probably did violate a dozen separate regulations, for a Federation that was already weary of the Klingons, Maquis, Cardassians and Changelings, they'll let him go with a slap on the wrist for the much-needed realpolitik victory.

Even Starfleet recognizes the need for a show of force when needed to show they mean business.

Starfleet does not go around bombarding anybody with torps, regardless of who they are. This is just about the least Starfleet thing I've read in awhile. Please user, think of something else to do with your adventure.

They can be fast-tuned to have different payloads of matter/antimatter.

To continue from , Starfleet also doesn't target actual people for their show of force. Find a way to target something uninhabited in a manner where you can get across to the raiders that Starfleet has the means to defend its colonists if the raids continue.

If whoever was in charge really found that necessary, then the most Starfleet course of action would be to precisely target and destroy the weapons/ships used in the attacks with no casualties.

While this is true, not everyone is Picard; some captains are really just sick of peoples' shit and would prefer a more direct course of action to scare people in line. That being said, exterminatusing actual people would still be going too far regardless of the situation.

You'll note that Jellico there didn't even go all out on the Cardassians, despite them being clearly in the wrong and prepping for an invasion. He merely intimidated them into surrendering. And even if he *did* go full "activate the mines" mode, it probably wouldn't have actually killed that many people, just crippled their ships and left them helpless but alive where the Federation could then dictate terms.

Just bombing people isn't a Starfleet thing. If you want to make a point with your superior weapons and technology, have the Starfleet ship use its phasers to effortlessly vaporize an automated mining facility or something else that the raiders put a ton of time and effort into to make the point that "we can own you if we want to, don't push us and we'll stay nice and friendly".

Gotta second this. Starfleet is all about disarmament and intimidating folks by NOT killing them, while leaving the channels that let the situation happen in the first place remain open.

>If you want to make a point with your superior weapons and technology, have the Starfleet ship use its phasers to effortlessly vaporize an automated mining facility or something else that the raiders put a ton of time and effort into to make the point that "we can own you if we want to, don't push us and we'll stay nice and friendly".
And just to top it off, have the ship effortlessly give them a replacement, just to make it clear what the tech difference is.

This is very Starfleet: remove your thing to make a point but replace it (with upgrades!) to make it clear that you're not heartless and won't leave you without the function it fulfills. Hell, inviting that planet to join the Federation would be a great solution to them raiding you. If they're raiding, they clearly need something you have, so why not join up so you can get it easily? Starfleet loves to help people out like that.

lolno they don't
Look to TNG. When Federation outpost was getting raided, they flew over to the raider's neighbors and forced them to fix it.

Some fair points here; the diplomatic and cultural aftereffects of such a disproportionate use of force are a significant theme in what I'm planning. There's more going on than I've alluded to, and figuring it out will be part of the campaign. (Sorry for the deliberate vagueness, but I know at least one of my group browses here.)

On the plus side, the reactions and comments are sparking some additional ideas.

If it's just an air-burst over the ocean or somewhere uninhabited then that would work.

"Hey, listen up chumps, there's going to be a really big kaboom at this time near this place. Look out for it."

Then aim it high enough, bright enough, and with the emissions tuned well enough, that everyone living on the ocean's shore sees a brilliant aurora in the sky and what looks like an unholy sunrise at midnight on the horizon.

But why do that when you could burn a giant Starfleet insignia into the ground right outside their camp with your phasers from orbit?

That's more personal, smaller scale, and easier to comprehend.

The sky suddenly glowing in the depth of night, and long after the glow fades there's a distant rumble that is felt far more than you heard?

That's grabbing hold of whatever part of them that used to be an animal running from thunderstorms and communicating clearly that you send down thunder that can kill worlds.

The key is visceral impact and maximum visibility. You want the number of people seeing this live to be in the tens of millions at least, and you want it to be as vast and impersonal a demonstration of destructive power as possible.

Go full Superman and carve a message telling them to behave into the surface of the planet's moon.

>Modiphius takes down links for the ST:A core rulebook. Look in the archives or ask someone to send it to you via discord. Or... you know... buy the rulebook.
Discord, user, could you give me a link to this mysterious discord server and hook me up with the PDF, please?

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I still don't understand the meaning of Sisko's "And that's why you're not an evil man" quip following Dukat's rant about exterminating the Bajorans.

He was acknowledging Dukat's delusions as to why he wasn't evil. Dukat hated the Bajorans but merely enslaved them instead of exterminated them. To Dukat this meant he was not evil, rather he was exceptionally benevolent and the Bajorans were fools not to see how merciful he was to them, yadda yadda. Sisko was just acknowledging that's what Dukat's rationale was, finally fully understanding Dukat.

You know for all its flaws I think I could have watched another three seasons of Voyager. Especially if Neelix left at the same point regardless.

I recommend you to rewatch the original version of The Day The Earth Stood Still.

"You want a demonstration? Well, at 4:00 pm tomorrow I will give you one."
>makes every car in the world stop working for an hour

i would say Sisko was being satirical with that line. "Oh you enslaved them instead of downright slaughtering them, how noble of you" way. After that he pretty much gives his opinion why Dukat is an evil prick.

Ezri wasn't fast talking and she wasn't funny.

Of all the companies ADB could have picked to make a fleet level version of SFB, why why why did they think Mongoose Games were a good idea?

Spartan would have been better. Brigade Miniatures would have been better! A man in his shed with a resin printer and a mad glint in his eye would have been better!

It would be fine if used against an uninhabited portion of the world, just as a show of force. A big damn no-no if used to wipe out a population.

Using torpedoes against a planetary target in general isn't forbidden by Starfleet. Picard nuked a shuttle and the surrounding area with a photon torpedo in that Armus episode, and Kirk used an antimatter bomb to blow up half a planet to kill the gas monster.

If the weapon (or any weapon for that matter) is used with care and careful regard to preserving life, then Starfleet seems to be okay with it.

Yeah, probably. Though how many more plot lines could they really have had. Return of the Vaudwaar, maybe?

actually make us live the year of hell.

instead of summarise it. make it a 5 parter or something. truly horrify us with the wounds and maimings and deaths of our characters.

not do the timey wimey get home immediately, give us the 'voyager bad end' that janeway changed by going back. KILL Seven, break chakotay
s sprit when the woman he loves and mother of his child dies in his arms horribly.

Redundant organs, I guess. Not that the concept really makes much sense in the first place.

Space Land Sharks

>Klingons need to constantly be attaining honour or they drown

hyenas

you get approximately 86.4 Megatonnes of boom out of a kilo of antimatter if it hits something.
Representing the energy content of 1 kilo of matter and 1 kilo of antimatter, it's not that hard to calculate.

That doesn't pay any attention to the side effects all that radiation (across the entire spectrum, from IR to extremely energetic gamma).

I'm not sure we know what the maximum antimatter payload of a photon torpedo is.

Half a Spock.

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That thing doesn't show why they get all sparkly when fired

It's probably that the thrusters are crazy bright compared to the casing.

Or it has a field generator to try to help it brute force through shields. Which is made a lot easier if you know the shield modulation.
youtube.com/watch?v=7PQ36c9Uo6A

>Deanna take the helm
But why?

Who better to crash the ship than the only member of the senior staff we’ve never seen pilot anything.

> Mr. Worf, prepare a spread of photon torpedoes
> fires only a single one

Too be fair, they evaded some shots somehow

So much of the problems of Generations were them simply trying to defy expectations for some dumb reason, and trying to find uses for characters they're not managed to write in anything useful to do otherwise.

There's so many obvious simple fixes for the weirdness of Generations (like just having the Duras sisters in a proper capable ship, or replacing them entirely with a better threat that fills the exact same role). But the underlying problems that lead to all the odd choices would need a complete rework. And Generations was the result of a ton of reworks due to no clear direction in the first place.

It's really only carried by the strength of the actors and characters involved. Soren actually had a nugget of an interesting point to his character as a villain for one so it wasn't just the regulars.

I can feel the Warp (nacelle cancer) overtaking me!
>IT IS NOT A GOOD PAIN

I can just picture a Captain making first contact and trying to explain to the natives his ship's namesake.

Whoever made that should be taken out back and beaten with a hose.