Flintlock Fantasy

Idea: The New World, unlike in real life, had a terrible epidemic disease rolling around that followed some of the early colonists home, devastating both continents in back-to-back mass die-offs. The current wave of colonists are not just here to found new homes, but to also collect and catalog the remnants of the First Colonies.

Can someone please explain baroque social customs and values, ethics and etc. Maybe some authors that were influential to them at the time please?

>The Baroque (US: /bəˈroʊk/ or UK: /bəˈrɒk/) is a highly ornate and often extravagant style of architecture, art and music that flourished in Europe from the early 17th until the late 18th century.[1] It followed the Renaissance style and preceded the Neoclassical style. It was encouraged by the Roman Catholic Church as a means to counter the simplicity and austerity of Protestant architecture, art and music. The baroque style used contrast, movement, exuberant detail, grandeur and surprise to achieve a sense of awe.[2] The style began in the first third of the 17th century in Rome, then spread rapidly to northern Italy, Spain and Portugal, then to Austria and southern Germany. By the 1740s, it had evolved into an even more flamboyant variant, called Rococo, which appeared in central Europe until the late 18th century.[3]

I've been playing a 1700's themed D&D game for the past 10 years.
>adventurers started out in not!Austria
>adventured to not!Rome; worked for the not!Catholics to conquer not!spaniards
>After handing not!catholics several decisive victories that spread the empire over the continent, adventurers realize not!Catholics are evil/ corrupt and escape to the New World.
>Adventurers are currently mercenaries that operate between the not!13 colonies, fighting and trading with not!indians (elves) and trying to find meaning in a world where their monotheistic faith isn't the centerpoint for their lives.

I use some homebrewed rules for guns to not make them imba or useless but limit their gunpowder so they have to make every shot count.
They're currently wanted in two colonies because they're not!catholics, and one tribe of elves wants to kill them on sight. Another tribe treats them with near deific reverence because they killed a modified Wendigo that had turned their tribe into cannibals.

You've posted this before

I still don't like it

>10 years
I envy you. I really do.

But the exact details bug me for some reason.

>You've posted this before
yes I have. It's been a lot of fun for my group.
>I still don't like it
That's fine.

>I use some homebrewed rules for guns to not make them imba or useless but limit their gunpowder
Can you share this ? Sounds super useful

I know exactly what you mean

If you want an actual, in depth answer, I can link Gropey to the thread.

The Clown?

Please don't.

>Not being down with the clown
>1778+240AD
What are you, gay?

Yeah. 18th century history is literally his day job.

Why not? Gropey is a bro.

Do we need to ride you out of town on a rail, user?

Call me old school, but I think cult of personality and name fagging on Veeky Forums is disgusting, and you all cheerleading him is equally disgusting. He doesn't need to trip to share his info, he just does it for the benefit of building up a fanbase and y'all rush to suck his dick.

Thanks boyo
More info is fine :)

>Calling yourself oldschool
>Not realizing Veeky Forums is and always has had a history of tripfaggotry as an acceptable thing.
>

Not him but that just makes Veeky Forums trash since inception when you think about it

>Not realizing Veeky Forums is and always has had a history of tripfaggotry
That's true
>as an acceptable thing
That's not
After you

Want to know the most ironic thing about you faggots arguing over Gropey?

At least he would post on topic info and pics while ya'll bitched at each other.

New topic: polearms in not!1700s Europe: would you allow them in use outside of warfare?

pike and shot formations
Landsknecht
long muskets with bayonets
musketeers

You're crossing streams there user. This is not 16th-17thC like warhammer, but 18thC. Think American/French Revolution, pirates and napoleon.

There were limited amounts of those things though during the era. And the original idea was 1700’s, which means we got over a century of tactical and technological changes to use.

1700s is 18th century

You're confusing the 15-1600's with the 1700s. By the end of the 1600's there were no pike formations, and certainly no landsknecht.

Main melee weapons are swords of all sorts, daggers, axes, hatchets/tomahawks, bayonets and occasionally polearms. Everything else is powder. Pistols, various long arms, blunderbusses, grenades, etc.

You see pikes for a BRIEF time in the swiss use, while they are still poor. Otherwise, you only see them in siege and naval use.

Alternately, nobody knows quite what caused the diseases. The only ships to make it back from the New World at all crashed on European shores, with the diseased pouring out and quickly spreading, none living long enough to say whether these plagues were natural or magical in nature, or even if they were caught from the New World at all. To this day, ship crews returning from the New World are met in port by port guards in as close to sealed suits as they can and a firehose, hoping to get rid of *whatever* it was that destroyed that Old World a century ago.

No, I’m not. As you just said, pikes and certain other weapons were kept in niche roles during the 1700s. That’s all I meant as well.

Are you really going to compare pike and shot warefare to "a niche role"?

The Runed Age would fit under baroque as well.

During the 18th century? It kinda was.

I mean, that it existed at all in the 18thC. It didn't. At all. Linear warfare fully replaced it for a reason.

Does the application of magic change how armies fight in a Flintlock Fantasy? I'd imagine having even low-level d&d style spells would drastically change how such a world would operate.

I typically see magic in these sorts of settings (rare as they are) either strike for the rational, Enlightenment/Scientific Revolution sort of feel or else they incorporate a more Witchcraft/Romanticism based magic. Strange and Norrel in particular embodied the struggle between the two quite well, in fact. Less often seen, I feel like more Traditional/Religious magic would also fit the era, either through some Protestant religious radical (early 17th and 19th century America was full of them) or a stuck up, proper member of one of the established churches back in the old country. So:

>Witchcraft: old magic, pagan, bloody, wild
>Theurgy: traditional, faith-based, state-backed
>Revolutionary: alchemy, constructs, industrial, mass-produced

Thoughts?

Pirates of the caribbean is about as much magic as I would go.

Fair enough, though I tend to want a /little/ more magic than that in my games, or at least more player-use magic.

Any recommended reading?
Other than Powder Mage and Shadow Campaigns? Fiction or historical, I don't have a preference.

The further along you go the more magic will warp things away from the look and feel.

No, I get what you mean. I just think (opinion incoming) that you can push what the limit is. Also, I tend to reflexively push for medium magic in worldbuilding because my players consider it a meme that I actually like low-magic and I'm a little self-conscious of it.

So we looking at all-humans? Elves and Orcs?

isnt baroque more late 1600s?

It lasted until the mid 18thC, before evolving into Rococo.

>Lies of Locke Lamora.jpg

user you make me happy. Such a good book series. Im gonna follow this thread just for that.

interested in running stuff in the 1800's but this is also relevant to my interests.

>Lex Occullum

user any idea if this is getting a US release at all? Shit sounds freakin awesome.

>ctrl-f "Nioh"
>zero results

Tell us about Nioh. From screenshots i thought that it's just a mystical version of feudal Japan.

Seconded.

>Time: IIRC, about 1598 (two years before the Battle of Sekigahara) to 1615 (the Siege of Osaka)
>Place: Japan (plus two missions in the Tower of London, which bookend the main story)
>Melee weapons: Medium sword, odachi (big sword), two small swords, spear, axe/hammer, kusarigama, or two tonfas
Each weapon class has various skills, but there's no really heavy magic in those. Weapons can, however, have special effects that are magical (extra elemental damage, no flinching when you're hit while aiming, extra damage when you use a certain skill...).
>Armor: Head, torso, arms, legs, feet
A weapon gradually builds up a bond of "familiarity" as you use it. This works with top-tier armor as well.
>Ranged weapons: Bows, matchlock rifles, and matchlock handcannons
With all capacity upgrades, ammunition is limited to around 15 per weapon class per mission.
Flavor text on a matchlock obtained in the final mission of the main story mentions that wheellocks have been invented but are too unreliable to have become popular yet.
Some NPCs also use crossbows. Also, see the next point.
>Magic: Onmyo (five elements like Naruto, temporary buffs, extracting the familiarity from your weapon to use it as a beam attack...) and ninjutsu (projectiles, bombs, temporary buff pills like the Akimichi in Naruto, FUCKING CALTROPS...)

>Enemies: Humans, demons (yokai), magical hybrids of humans and demons (made with Amrita, a magical stone), and humans with magical powers (granted by their guardian spirits)
It's like SMT: Persona in that the protagonist is the only character capable of switching his guardian spirit. His original guardian spirit also grants him immortality, which is the in-story justification for respawning at savepoints.
Mimics (Mujina--tanuki demons) exist. Instead of killing you instantly as in Dark Souls, if you open a mimic chest, it transforms into a copy of you, performs a gesture, and waits a few seconds for you to copy the gesture. If you succeed, it gives you the treasure. If you fail, you have to fight it for the treasure.

Bump

Could we add GURPS to the list as well?

What if we ditch all the different flavors of not!human, but include some of the "outsider" races like fairies and demons?
That would be dumb and pointless. You can use literally any generic system, that's what they're for
>Flintlock fantasy
>Image is the cover of a book with no guns

Mostly I just wanted to post the Alchemical Baroque setting.

So, ideas on the table right now
>Viral apocalypse stymied colonization
>Themes of rationality vs mysticism vs religion
>Fairies and demons, not elves and orcs
>Mid or mid-low magic, not so much that it totally warps the premise but enough that players can feasibly use it
#2 can gel really well with 1 and 3. Maybe the Outsiders weren't always around, and only started showing up in the wake of the Blight. Some think they're simply fellow intelligent beings who should be studied, some think they're inherently inscrutable creatures of power, some think they're fucking evil (and probably caused the plague) and should be driven out

Questions to consider
>What are the major countries, conflicts, and factions
I'd prefer something that isn't overly focused on not!Europe. At very least make the not!Ottomans interesting
>What are the major religions
Obviously there's going to be some kind of stand-in for Catholics and Protestants, but we can do a lot more. A religion who worship the plague or whatever caused it could be cool, especially if they aren't always-evil bioterrorists

Totally agree.

>not!Ottomans
I had been thinking before to use Dwarves there. An ancient, powerful kingdom just about to hit their great decline and just having ended a series of terrible wars with the Elves/HRE, known for their skill with cannons, highly defensive and surrounded on all sides by enemies that chip away at them.

This is the begginning of the “Sick Man of Europe” meme, though no one is gonna take advantage for at least a few decades yet. They’re not a paper tiger yet, but the glory days are now in their rear view.

Pike and Shot was already endangered as early as Gustavius Adolphus reformed the Swedes. Ironically they were still among the last armies to use a thin rank of pikes, usually in conjunction with supporting grenadiers to disrupt fire lines.

Tangentially, that would make an amusing "what-if." What if Warhammer Fantasy's tech-level was more early-1700s on average instead of the "pike-and-shot renaissance." So the Empire fields actual line infantry with muskets and bayonets, etc.

It would be an interesting variant at least.

I think things like Matt Mercer's Blood Hunter class would work in a flintlock fantasy setting.

There is no New World and the Continent's getting fucking crowded

Making dwarves "muh proud and noble dying race" would open us up to doing something neat with elves. Maybe make them Vorta- scheming, manipulative ultra-political creatures. I always thought that was a more interesting niche for long-lived races than "idk i just like trees/rocks n stuff." Fits the not!HRE thing very well too
I like that idea because I don't want this thread to get derailed by applesponge shitposting the moment we start discussing colonialism

I approve of HRElves.

Did the third book ever release? The second one ended on such a weird note.

>applesponge shitposting
What?

Which issss?

If you're going to samefag, at least post a thread appropriate image.

They are on book four dude.

Yeah, like 5 years ago. The fourth book is due this year

You explained a bunch of game mechanics but not why anyone should be interested in it as a flintlock fantasy setting

Alright, so Ottoman Dwarves and HRElves. Do I hear support for Swedish Orcs? Prussian?

>I have never tried/read WFRP: The Thread
Seriously, it has almost all the shit you guys are talking about.

What book series is this image from?

>Swedish Orcs
>aggressive
>focus on melee charges
>half the country in harsher conditions than the southern nations
sounds about right

>Comparing 18thC/Napoleonic fantasy to late Renaissance fantasy with shitty gun rules

I honestly hope you're a troll, and not retarded.

If we had a thread about games taking place in the Wars of Religion, we might have actually listened to you.

It's weirdly accurate.

I also nominate Russian Goblins. Maybe. Something that Dwarves don't get along with either, to do the whole "Ottoman vs Russia" thing.

Mmm. Dark Elves would also work.

I'm somewhat inspired by how in Moby Dick the whale seemed to Ismael to have something akin to heiroglyphics on its head amidst all the battle scars; equating it to some kind of unnatural and ancient pale god.

Whaling should feature prominently as a dangerous but richly-rewarding career. I think borrowing from that revelation of Ishmael's and from Dishonored to imply that the whales are some kind of ancient or eldritch being--maybe making them far more powerful than they are for us, and/or making their oil far more potent--could lend itself well to the fantasy elements.

I have always had a weird love of whaling. Just fucking love it.

I propose armored whales, typically with rhino-like horns or blade shaped heads meant to crack anything in their path. And make them much, much bigger.

Or maybe this ;)

Good to see this thread getting attention. Lots of interesting, if sometimes conflicting ideas.

Have ya'll seen "In the Heart of the Sea"? I have always been intrigued with whalling, but goddamn. You don't need horns or armour to make whaling fucking terrifying.

>You don't need horns or armour to make whaling fucking terrifying.
Oh, of course not. It was just a "fantastic" suggestion. Since it's still a fantasy setting.

Also, hi Gropey. Guess I shouldn't be surprised. I guess you heard your name spoken three times and the sound of a horse being sacrificed? Good timing. This thread needs an expert.

>It was just a "fantastic" suggestion. Since it's still a fantasy setting.

Oh yeah, I get it. But Jesus christ, I was already freaked out by Orcas after watchingt them fuck up a moose, that movie has ruined any non-baleen whale to me.

Hey Clown. How's the Colonies?

Ehhh....

>Jesus christ, I was already freaked out by Orcas after watchingt them fuck up a moose, that movie has ruined any non-baleen whale to me.
Pic related.

You said that your LARP is pseudo 18th in the LARPthread. Give a quick synopsis?

Which version of Pinocchio is that?

Swedes were one of the top dogs militarily for at least part of this period, right? I'm under the impression it was more about professionalism and innovative tactics than brute force, but there's no reason our orcs can't be different
It was due last year. Then later last year. Then earlier this year. Now "sometime this year"
Gentleman Bastard, specifically Lies of Locke Lamora, the first book. It's all about a gang of con artists led by a priest of the God of Thieves, set in a low magic (but alchemy filled) 16th/17th Century not!Venice. Ironically, there aren't any guns
>Lots of interesting, if sometimes conflicting ideas.
Where do you think you are?

Once Upon a Time, apparently. I just searched for scary Monstroso.