/osrg/ OSR General

Welcome to the Old School Renaissance General thread.
>"Death of the FOE GYG meme" edition.

>Trove:
pastebin.com/QWyBuJxd

>Tools & Resources:
pastebin.com/KKeE3etp

>Old School Blogs:
pastebin.com/ZwUBVq8L

>Previous thread:
Let the shitposting commence.

Other urls found in this thread:

docs.google.com/document/d/17e1ltFE_rjXfBHI1HRXiU5GIngrO35BlqHMD9s3M578/edit?usp=sharing
pastebin.com/0zz7zpEu
theglobeandmail.com/news/british-columbia/judge-says-rcmp-entrapped-bc-couple-in-terror-case-overturns-guilty-verdict/article31199892/
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

>>"Death of the FOE GYG meme" edition.
>Let the shitposting commence
If you're gonna pit both sides against each other, make it more subtle.

GHOST TRACKER!
docs.google.com/document/d/17e1ltFE_rjXfBHI1HRXiU5GIngrO35BlqHMD9s3M578/edit?usp=sharing

Subtlety is not my strong suit.

Thank you for the effort on the OP pic, saved.

Oh yeah.

Big OC incoming. You can convert this to AC by increasing armor by x1.5 and calling it AC.

LOL

>Skerples! Add a School of Prisoner magic somewhere on your list of things to get around to.
Done.
There is also a great deal of silliness.
Nice!
>Let the shitposting commence.
Please no. No more edition wars.

There must be edition wars. This game says I can give XP for treasure but it isn't the only option and isn't OSR because of that.

Silly skerples, these aren't edition wars, they're the retroclone wars, the ones with all the knights of gygax like your father.

...

Nah. There must be OC. The rest is just people being silly.
More detailed notes:
Some good ideas here.
-I might change "Darkness Power" to the more evocative "In Darkness" and "In Light" sets. "Darkness Power" sort of implies a control over darkness or something, rather than a conditional supernatural behavior. Starting the bullet point with "In Darkness:" allows you to immediately start a sentence too, limiting padding.
-Speaking of, lots of padding here. Lots to trim.
-I'm not a huge fan of qualifiers. There's a lot of "seems to" and "could" and "might" in here. If this is for the GM, just tell them straight-up how the thing works. You can add "what people know" to a separate section or add some diegesic text.

Overall, good creatures. I'd say your next step is editing. Try to cut the descriptions down to the bare minimum.

Someone do one using this image.

Ran Dungeon World last weekend, actually had a lot of fun with the system and the move "system" is really good at beating good habits into people (both DM & players)

This is /osrg/, not Frank Trollman General.

Man, you guys work so hard on shitpost OC. Why can't you use your powers for Good? Or at the very least, Lawful Neutral?

>The thing is this shit hardly ever comes up anymore since we moved to the mechanical compatibility distinction.
>we moved to
Faggot, you're the only one who ever advocated for that, we told you a million times that nowhere else in the OSR uses that definition and you can't just change it by being an autist on Veeky Forums, and nobody else ever moved anywhere. The play style is the defining characteristic and you can fuck off with your autism.

I bet you're one of those rationalists who likes utilitarianism too because it makes it so easy to do math with morality, and never mind that every outcome is insane and counterintuitive.

What class SHOULD have been one of the core 7 from B/X, but was not?

Just having fun. I agree--edition/game wars suck.

Well, clearly..

Could we... just not? Do not eat bait. Bait is no good. Do not get mad. Mad is no good.

>everyone who disagrees with me is one person

I actually make a shitload of OC for this community. I guarantee you've seen it. Maybe you've even used it. I also like to laugh at the hair-trigger autism of this community. Chaotic Neutral, baby.

I don't get what's happening any more, why are people pretending like compatibility wasn't considered a defining feature of OSR?

You do the lords work.

Just leave him alone, he's probably pretty damn lonely even without enemies.

I like to laugh at it too, but more like watching a drunk hobo try to steal a scooter. It's funny, but you know it's not going to end well.

Though, truly, the baitposters are becoming desperate. They are trying every tactic in rapid succession.

Because our history was defined by two core ideas, returning to the old styles of play AND creating new systems to play these old school games in. Now we argue about which one is more important.

I don't know about "desperate" when anons are jumping over each other to bite on bait.

Please don't argue with the disassociated rules/compatibility user. It took up almost all of last thread. Just hide his posts and he'll get tired.

Because they don't like feeling as if they're being excluded from the club, so feel-good definitions that let everyone be part of the OSR, but don't actually have any usable meaning anymore, are the order of the day.

Best item on list?
Most boring item on list?

You guys are right. I apologize for shitting up the thread, and repudiate my bait-eating ways.

Most boring is the Apocalypse Pistol
Most interesting is the Liquid Hydrogen Gun, as much as it triggers my inner physicist.

>He's gone into responding to himself
Oh my

>someone playing an Order of the Stick expy
This shouldn't trigger my autism, but it does.

To answer your question, I think replacing the Thief or maybe Halfling with an Assassin class (that's based on the Fighter, not the Thief) would have been an improvement. I get why they didn't do that in the kid box, though.

Asking seriously? Because compatibility is relative, and because another defining feature of OSR is not needing to be spoonfed. So if something is cool, and you can adapt it, then it comes down to how much work you're willing to put it, and OSR players tend to be people willing to put in the work.

Some games encourage more of that than others; DCC is one. Beyond the Wall is another. You're dealing with both strict mechanical capability (closeness to B/X or 1st ed or OD&D) and overall gameplay aesthetics (Appendix N, player agency, lack of story and metastory). If one item comes out well, the other being not as strong might be forgiven as long as the solution is readily apparent and it seems like you're going to get something out of it that you won't get easily otherwise.

>Boring
The fruit
>Coolest: anti sin collar

No, we throw one of them out the window entirely in favor of inclusionism.

c

Wait, which is the expy?

I like the idea of the cape just always able to billow and instantly dry even if the character is wet like a James Bond tux and maybe adding to Reaction Rolls, but otherwise doing nothing.

The elf wizard named V, obviously. It's even arrogant and never satisfied.
To be honest, V's one of the more interesting characters in OotS anyway

Bah, it's not that bad. Just need to fiddle with the phase diagram a bit.
No worries. Now go forth and sin no more. Or go third, and post OC.
Well yeah, it's a master wizard cape. It does master wizard cape things.
I figure the fruit is boring but the results, in a food-scarce environment, are going to be hilarious.

V is my roommate Victoria. She literally only plays Elves and always names them V. She's not the most creative person. I can guarantee that any semblance to OotS was happenstance.

This is only quasi-OC, but a while ago I made some threads with the idea of Veeky Forums bestiary with rules kinda cribbed from Veins of the Earth in order to be system agnostic, but the threads never really took off and I ended up making most of them.

Still was pretty fun though.

But V is a girl, right?

Honestly, I think they had a good chance to have some sort of wanderer class that's good at surviving hexcrawls. That seems like a classic sort of character.

In OotS? No, they're nonbinary.

>She literally only plays Elves and always names them V.
How is her older sister Ivy and her much younger brother Xi?

I know, right? What's you favorite playbook? I like the Psion, but I haven't had a player use it yet. (I mean this one, there's like three Psion classes out there.)
Have you had trouble with players minmaxing armor? 'Cause that's been a pain for me.

>insulting LotFP fans has no repercussions
>insulting DCC fans gets you a warning
>splitting OSR generals is ignored every other time
>but when DCC is the OP suddenly the split general MUST be deleted
hmn

Yeah. My nickname for her has always been V. She always names her character that. She called me gay for running D&D and now she loves it (and even got a tattoo of her Elf, no joke).

I don't want to reply to 58141861 but I DO want to get this out there for noobs so there's some kind of hopefully-articulate explanation/vindication of sense:

>y no compatblty
It's because it's a skub meme. OSR is about the playstyle -- the resource-based, immersion-optional tactical gameplay, the functional loop. The reason games like TFT and Runequest aren't OSR is that they lack this gameplay; Torchbearer isn't OSR because it's more like a game simulating a game with tactical resource based play but personally I'm okay with it being in this thread, Dungeon World just borrows the trappings of an OSR game to look like one from a distance, and T&T is disqualified by being an unplayable broken mess.

DCC, weird OD&D/Chainmail homebrews and whole new games using the same design principles (consider Wolfpacks, which isn't *about* the same shit at all on a narrative level, but has a very similar essential feel) are all old-school and welcome in these threads.

Won't the True Compass just point at the guy who spent the blood, every time?

Anyway I think 10 and 12 are the least good because they're basically licenses for the player to act a right prat. Unlike the other user I like the Apocalypse Pistol because my experience is that it'll pretty inevitably click at a satisfying moment. Otherwise the Miracle Fruit.

Oops, accidentally the file.

What are you even wailing about

>Let the shitposting commence.
The more we look like we're in a shit hole, the more we'll act like we're in one.
Demi-moderators are called janitors for a reason.

Greyhawk Thieves only detect "small" traps (contact poisons, explosive runes, spring loaded boxes, etc.).

>Won't the True Compass just point at the guy who spent the blood, every time?
Separate compartment for the Thing you want to detect.
>Anyway I think 10 and 12 are the least good because they're basically licenses for the player to act a right prat.
Pppft, like players need a license.
10. Just because you can't sin doesn't mean you won't be beaten or lynched. It's really just a collar of confidence.
12. Oh yeah, this one is gold for prats. Fuck you, wizard. Fuck you, librarian. Etc. Until it gets them into serious and glorious trouble.

>I'm gonna redefine OSR until it includes only the systems I like, and not the ones I don't

Surprising!

>one OP calls for shitposting, one doesn't
>delete the one that doesn't

I know, makes ya think, right?

That there's some kind of jewish conspiracy that's bribing the mods or some stupid shit like that.

Maybe the compass just tracks the most recent thing you shove in it? Dunno why it has to be lubricated by blood, though.

Is sensible people are dumb enough to eat fondant why can't we attention whores eat bait?

I made this thread drinking another forty and eating taquitos. There is no mod conspiracy.

>Dunno why it has to be lubricated by blood, though.
Mostly just a flavour thing. Also prevents the PCs from using the thing all the time (or forces them to get a reliable blood source).

>/osrg/ resembles /pfg/ more and more every thread
We're gonna get forcibly merged into the /hwg/ threads aren't we?

Human body has lotsa extra blood between the party.

Because bait still gives you explosive diarrhea and we haven't figured out how to fix the plumbing.

That's just what you want us to think, isn't it?

Oh man, /hwg/ doesn't deserve that.

More like the /erpg/ threads.
>but user, /erpg/ is in /soc/ these days
Exactly.

Now I kinda like the idea of a failed magic compass that DOES just point at the blood guy every time, like a coder making a syntax error except the process was much more painstaking and expensive and you can't just correct the code when it turns out to run wrong.

Is there a good LotFP guide for treasure levels? Like, how much loot should be in a dragon's hoard, an orc's boot, a goblin's stash, etc?

1 is definitely the most boring. 8 comes close.
2, 13, 14, and 15 seem especially fun.

Just have to get blood from someone you're tracking

Just use the tables from DCC, it's OSR now.

>Now I kinda like the idea of a failed magic compass that DOES just point at the blood guy every time, like a coder making a syntax error except the process was much more painstaking and expensive and you can't just correct the code when it turns out to run wrong.
And now all we need is some of /that guy's/ blood and we can track him.

You wanna put your blood in the creepy compass? That's how you get ghosts, user. Ghosts and nightmares.

It's always been OSR.

And here we go again...

Guys. Come on. Do better.

Great, so he should use its treasure tables. Or maybe the ones from Dungeon World?

Sure.

What part of "commence shitposting" did you not understand, user?

>And now all we need is some of /that guy's/ blood and we can track him.
Nah, all we need to do is find his closest blood relative, get their blood, and then burn them until there's nothing left, then the compass will point to him! If it just points to another blood relative, we'll just be strengthening the signal.

Wait, do DCC and DW actually /have/ treasure tables?

Yes, that's the other thing, it's great when players can turn failed or garbage magic items to their advantage. Still, if you could get the guy's blood you probably wouldn't need to track him, right?

It's probably best used as insurance when keeping your eye on someone you've aready got under lock and key right now. Put his blood in the compass, if he escapes or is sprung, boom.

DCC doesn't.

I'm considering a Clerics Without Spells variant. I may test out the one presented in the 9and30kingdoms blog post, but I also want a slightly different list of powers for the Cleric.

Powers are
>Restoration (healing wounds and ailments)
>Execration (turn undead)
>Blessing (Protection, Bless, Resist [element], save bonuses, etc)
>Command
>Judgment (inflicts wounds and/or causes status ailments)

I may use the mechanic outlined in the blogpost, but I'm also wondering if I should limit certain uses of these abilities to certain levels, such as only allowing Judgment to be used by Clerics of, say, level 6 or greater, or restricting the stronger effects of these abilities to higher leveled clerics.
Any thoughts? For those who have used Spell-less clerics, how did you do it?

This is your ten-minute (sigh) reminder not to reply to bait, including bait about how fun bait is.

I can think of some situations to engineer getting his blood, especially if using them for tracking.

The Sacred Blacksmith is hella dumb, but those "swords" aren't mad of metal and the guy with the choppier "sword" is balls deep in a sketchy demon contract.

>Nah, all we need to do is find his closest blood relative, get their blood, and then burn them until there's nothing left, then the compass will point to him!
Oh hey look, he's moving towards us! The signal's getting stronger. I wonder why?
> closest blood relative... then burn them until there's nothing left
Ooooh...
Also good, but these are supposed to be "fuck yeah" treasure tables. There's a time and a place for tools that can be made great. These ones are supposed to start out good.

It's not about limiting them, it's more about what do you give for progression?

DCC doesn't:
>this work does not include detailed rules for
assigning treasure to monsters or encounters.

But here's the table from Dungeon World.

Yeah, DCC says "Use other OSR dnd tables they are compatible" as it's explanation. Page 393

Take this with a bag of salt because I use a modified version of the GLoG, but wait wait wait, don't run away just yet. It's not dependent on the system. All you need to do is pick 6 points in progression to give them access to these powers.

Here's a pastebin of what I did, I even included some extra goodies for chaotic and neutral clerics and variant orders.

>pastebin.com/0zz7zpEu

Enjoy!

>Also good, but these are supposed to be "fuck yeah" treasure tables.
Yeah, I was just riffing on the idea at that point, not really providing feedback, sorry.

No worries!
Right, but is there a specific LotFP table, or at least some sort of calibration curve?

That sounds like a Sage

How accurate is this?

Yes, DCC's treasure rules are basically "insert D&D here." Nice job, the book is 500 pages, but it tells me:
>The author suggests you adapt an existing treasure system of your choice, but carefully and deliberately evaluate the randomized results.

What? What did I pay you guys to do? I don't need you to point me at B/X and say "houserule that in, be sure to put in some time and effort, 'cause we didn't lol!"

In my mind, these are one and the same. I'm thinking from the top-down here: the most powerful Cleric could resurrect the fallen, banish powerful demons, grant immunity to lesser magicks, dominate a dragon, and instantly slay/petrify/paralyze lesser men. So the trick is figuring out at what level a cleric could begin to accomplish these feats.
I'm more concerned about the resolution mechanic in any case.

Interesting system, I'll see if I can take something from it.

Sorry user, there isn't one in the base manual and I haven't checked their blogs for it. You could probably drop a DnD one in and it would work with zero adaptation like for DCC.

>Is there a good LotFP guide for treasure levels?
The serious answer: not really; nothing official anyhow. LotFP's big flaw to this day is Raggi's refusal to add any monsters (even stat common animals) or loot tables in the rulebooks. It's possible that the new referee guide is meant to include some of those, but... given that it's a deliberate omission, I doubt it.

The reason AFAIK is that Raggi thinks everything should be unique and new and not stock, so he doesn't want to give any sort of guideline or rule of thumb. Which I think is dumb, but also entirely in-character. You gotta take the good with the bad, with Raggi.

The good news is that LotFP is basically just B/X! So you can use the tables (and monsters) from Moldvay Basic and Cook Expert pretty much untouched, just change every instance of "gp" to "sp" and divide the amounts of the smaller coinages by ten. Oh, and I guess change any instances of platinum pieces to gp.

Given my very limited knowledge... fairly common? Most of our terrorism plots have to be carefully shepherded by the RCMP in order to get anywhere: theglobeandmail.com/news/british-columbia/judge-says-rcmp-entrapped-bc-couple-in-terror-case-overturns-guilty-verdict/article31199892/
But that's neither here nor there. And it's definitely not /osr/.
Sadness and woe. Ah well. I'll calibrate it to the XP curve.

How many times should an entire dragon's hoard or a king's ransom cause a PC to level (assuming they started at, oh, level 5)?

Look at and then wonder if OSR is right for you if you're not willing to put in this kind of effort. I'm not even saying you're wrong, but this kind of shit is expected.

Why did you respond to him? He was too dumb to even read his own green text. I am disappointed

>The reason AFAIK is that Raggi thinks everything should be unique and new and not stock

More like he thinks that reprinting the treasure tables from D&D is unnecessary, since his modules and intended playstyle don't use it, and people who want to use a D&D monster manual can just use the D&D treasure tables with it. So he's got a point.

Yeah that is one case where adapting from OSR to DCC takes zero effort.

I'm not saying I'm allergic to effort, but it seems silly to me that they can write a 500 page rulebook and admit that treasure tables are a desirable thing for their play style, and not include some. Raggi's intended playstyle downplays the whole dungeon crawl->kill monsters->get loot thing in favor of weird horror, but DCC is all about that shit.
Why not include that? Why say "do it yourself, and be sure to be careful to make it work right with our system!" It's stupid.

And you were too dumb to see what I meant, since you clearly read it the wrong way around.