Goblin edition.
Discuss the lore and story of the Warcraft franchise and its application in and around traditional games.
>Document compendium: Contains official (ex-canon) DnD 3.x variants and a fan made DnD 5e version! Also contains the official Warcraft Chronicles volumes 1 and 2.
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The Horde future is elven and it's beautiful
Will upright orcs and red orcs save the horde?
>future Horde culture has elven magisters and aristocracy, goblin technology and alchemy, orc military, troll priesthood, tauren diplomats, and forsaken rockstars
Third for burning treehouse.
I hope Bwonsamdi becomes a benevolent collector of the souls of the Forsaken so Sylvanas won't freak out about dying so much.
Are Tauren or Zandalari trolls the tallest playable race?
Which one has the bigger peenor?
looks like a night elf
>troll priesthood
I'd be happy with this. Anyhow, looking at Zandalar and Kul Tiras, I'm noticing Zandalar just seems a lot better. It just seems to have a lot stronger flavor, and even develops its side content better than Kul Tiras. It leaves me wondering just what the cause might be. Is it because designing a Troll continent forces the developers to be creative, while Kul Tiras is just yet another Human land?
Seeing Rezan yelling at Bwonsamdi is great. I love seeing these gods interact.
Shame they don't look like that IG. They look like bizarrely proportioned Igor-people.
Arms are way too long.
>over time the Horde segregates itself into a caste system based on what each race is best at
I really wish this would happen, it'd be super cool
Go be Tau somewhere else.
>even in Warcraft, gue'las ruin everything
>implying this user wouldn't be in the 56% plebeian caste
>The Horde future is mutated trolls and it's disturbing
>implying that a Horde lead and administrated by blood elves wouldn't improve the lives of the dirt farming peons
Has anyone tried their hand at statting out Allied Race player character templates?
in a previous thread I wrote up a nightborne stats for 5e, but I feel like the racial abilities I gave them were overpowered
Did you make custom racial abilities for them or did you port their racial abilities from the vidya?
they were custom but I think even porting the in game rules would pose problems
horde is like a family everything just works.....even if it makes no sense ;) such a graet written faction..everything just goes along well.
did we ever get a source for these?
>Implying everyone who supports a caste system thinks they'd be on top.
...
no, he's a fag
>Orcs and Humans on cover
>Undead and Humans in cinematic
>Trolls and Humans on islands
And the actual Orc leader and Human leader are respectful of one another and on speaking terms.
I can't wait for chronicles 3
Well, where's the fun in just GIVING you the source?
reposting my old 5e nightborne stats with minor edits
>ability score increase: Int +2, Dex +2, Cha -1, Wis -1
>alignment: Nightborne society values order above almost everything, and most are quick to throw away morality in times of crisis; the majority of nightborne are lawful neutral
>An Illusion?: You have advantage on all rolls to discover something that is hidden or invisible
>Nightwell Essence: If you are a wizard, you gain 1 extra spell slot of 1st, 2nd and 3rd level when you first gain access to those spell levels. If you are not a wizard, you may learn and cast cantrips as if you were a wizard of equal level to your highest level class
>languages: Nightborne can speak, read and write Shalassian, and their choice of Common, Orcish or Dwarvish. speakers of Shalassian can mostly understand written Darnassian or Thalassian, but cannot speak it
So what you are telling me is that I could create a fem!Garrosh waifu?
Most races in 5e don't have stat penalties. And those stat penalties make Nightborne bad as Sorcerers and Warlocks, which I would consider characteristic classes for them. Also, 5e doesn't really have racial features that are dependent upon classes or particularly stronger for certain classes beyond incidental synergy.
Most likely.
that's the peril of converting WoW races to DnD. WoW racials are generally biased to some character class or archetype
Okay, here's a question- do the various races of the Alliance even care about each other when there aren't humans around?
Take Draenei and Gnomes. Do they ever discuss technology? Do Gnomes pester Draenei on how their crystals work, or Draenei asking Gnomes for more efficient ways of crystal layout?
Because their Horde counterparts, Blood Elves and Goblins, seem to be on much better terms even when there are no orcs around. There's friendly banter of focusing on magic or on technology, and generally they'll insult each other's approaches, but ultimately it feels a lot more friendly than Alliance interactions.
Alliance races only exist when they're being observed by a human
The best kind of Garrosh
I'm still not sure what the logic behind them joining the horde is.
>the Alliance
>existing outside of wanking off humans
Man, you're in the wrong lore here.
>generally they'll insult each other's approaches, but ultimately it feels a lot more friendly than Alliance interactions.
No it doesn't. Fact is there's just no internal strife among the Alliance because they all get along well.
The Horde is just a fucked up conglomeration that shouldn't exist.
>Thalyssra decides that the nightborne need stronger allies than "we're minorly helping you because you're against the Legion"
>goes to Tyrande
>Tyrande tells her that she thinks she's as bad as Elisande and refuses to help unless Thalyssra agrees to give up authority over Suramar
>Thalyssra correctly figures that that's fucking retarded and says no
>goes to Liadrin instead and asks her for help
>Liardin is sympathetic to the nightborne's plight and agrees to help them get into the Horde
1. Respective treatment from Alliance/Horde forces in the liberation of Suramar. Tyrande, and likely a number of other Kaldorei forces, still distinctly remember when Suramar closed itself off during the First Invasion, and thus have not culturally 'paid' for their arrogance of arcane magic. The Sindorei forces, however, have much more recent memories of losing their Sunwell, and falling into similar addiction/dependency issues, which lead to greater sympathy and more effort put forth to save the civilians.
2. As Thalyssra explained, the Alliance feels too closed off to her, with the various vassal races to the Human High King. She doesn't want to exchange a magical prison for one made of stone and metal. In the Horde, Thaylssra has the freedom to argue and argue HARD for the rights of her people and her home.
>>Tyrande tells her that she thinks she's as bad as Elisande and refuses to help unless Thalyssra agrees to give up authority over Suramar
Never happened.
play the nightborne intro quest
I did, it never happened.
Personally for conversion of Warcraft races into 5e races I 'm mostly decided on doing three +1s.
>Draenei: +1 Str, +1 Wis, +1 Cha; Necrotic/Radiant Resistance and Innate Casting of Healing Word once per Long Rest
>Nightborne: +1 Dex, +1 Int, +1 Cha (Haven't thought up any features yet)
>Troll: +2 Con, +1 Dex (Basically benefits from Bard's Song of Rest every Short Rest) (Can cast Haste on self as a bonus action once per Long Rest) Darkvision because why not?
its actually more the writers not planning ahead and realized when they were doing BFA that Nightbourne should go horde because some top devs gf/wife liked the way they looked and wanted to race change her blood elf priest to a Nightbourne. Thats why it seems so rushed and why Liadrin sounds like an idiot when she talks about Night Elves.
also they probaly made them all look kinda like old yoga teachers because thats how the devs wife looks like..
t. yrande
They like Blood Elves.
That's basically it. Humans are almost always treated as the default fantasy race. The Horde is quite fortunate to be exempt from this rule, but the Alliance simply isn't. And the thing about Humans as the default fantasy race is that they're typically given default fantasy culture, so there's not even much interesting there.
And that's why Kul Tiras sucks. It's personality is, simply put, mostly just Human. Without much of a twist. For some reason they have Druids in several zones. Druids completely detached from the plot and who go completely unmentioned and unexplored as a concept.
It doesn't make sense that ancient holy space goats, ancient tree hippies, technological midgets, and clans of short people that love industry and beer would all get along seemlessly.
Every Horde race has their own problems and commonalities for other races, whether it be honor, shared trauma, shared cultural beliefs, or simply forgiveness for the crimes of their forefathers.
Do they actually change the story lines based on reactions from MMO-c lore section/WoW Story Forums?
>Tyrande tells her that she thinks she's as bad as Elisande and refuses to help unless Thalyssra agrees to give up authority over Suramar
Bullshit. When first meeting during the Suramar campaign Tyrande asks her how she can be trusted not become another Azshara or Elisande.
Fact is she was right to do so, because the first thing Thalyssra does is join up with the mortal enemies of the Night Elves and burn down their capital city.
Probably. There are definite times when Blizzard has caved to fan whining.
>Horde cinematics feature everyone discussing stuff like friends and family
>Alliance cinematic is just GLORIOUS HUMAN HIGH KING OF STORMWIND
I'd pay dollars to donuts to have the rest of the Alliance actually call the humans of the Alliance on their shit.
Well remember, there was the time when the Dwarves wanted out of the Alliance and the humans decided to attack Ironforge to get them to stop.
>tfw Stormwind is basically a banana republic
>refuse to ally with someone and then insult them
>they ally with your enemies
>WTF HOW COULD THIS HAVE HAPPENED??
>It doesn't make sense that ancient holy space goats, ancient tree hippies, technological midgets, and clans of short people that love industry and beer would all get along seemlessly.
How not? They're all shown to be respectful of each other.
>I'd pay dollars to donuts to have the rest of the Alliance actually call the humans of the Alliance on their shit.
What shit is that?
>Well remember, there was the time when the Dwarves wanted out of the Alliance and the humans decided to attack Ironforge to get them to stop.
Never happened. The Dwarves were just undergoing civil strife.
>>refuse to ally with someone and then insult them
>>they ally with your enemies
>>WTF HOW COULD THIS HAVE HAPPENED??
Brainlet. The Night Elves did ally with them after that. It also wasn't an insult, it was questioning Thalyssra's integrity since Tyrande had seen the Nightborne betray them before.
>The Night Elves did ally with them after that
yeah but they didn't
>human gets mad people call him out
Man, remember that time Varian killed Ironforge soldiers before trying to kill the queen and then said that Ironforge's age old monarchy was being disbanded?
Remember that time Stormwind dragged the rest of the Alliance into a war because their king sperged out?
Remember that time that humans attacked the Horde while the Legion was invading and made another war go on while fighting the Legion?
It's almost like that the general rule of the Alliance is that the humans get to screw over everyone else and pretend like it isn't their fault.
We could go deeper than this, since most of the Alliance's lore consists of defending Stormwind or working for Stormwind or watching another leader get made to be a dipshit to shill Stormwind.
>while the Legion was invading
Hey, that one's on the wolf.
You know, this makes me wonder- has the Horde ever failed to make an ally or alienate a group that became Alliance supporters?
I mean, he's basically a human who turns into a furry now and then.
I like Genn, but he's at this point Stormwind Werewolf.
>You know, this makes me wonder- has the Horde ever failed to make an ally or alienate a group that became Alliance supporters?
Hey, let's ask Hellscream what he thinks of Night Elves.
Yes they did.
They were part of the coalition that helped retake Suramar.
>Man, remember that time Varian killed Ironforge soldiers before trying to kill the queen and then said that Ironforge's age old monarchy was being disbanded?
Varian attacked because the then ruler of Ironforge was holding his son hostage. He was just going to killer her but was talked into mercy, and took power away from the Dark Iron clan.
>Remember that time Stormwind dragged the rest of the Alliance into a war because their king sperged out?
No.
>Remember that time that humans attacked the Horde while the Legion was invading and made another war go on while fighting the Legion?
And it was a sound decision to do so.
>It's almost like that the general rule of the Alliance is that the humans get to screw over everyone else and pretend like it isn't their fault.
Humans just get the most focus, they never screw their allies.
night elves between WC3 and WoW is the closest thing there is
>go cut down some trees
>bunch of random people attack you
>summon a god who announces he wants to kill you
>fight back
>they sperg out and reeeeeeeeee
Night Elves are autistic as fuck, yo.
What? You actually want lore developed around other races? Like who? Do you want to quest in a deeply mystical zone entirely based around Night Elves, filled with temples to all sorts of Gods with clear roles and who are actually present in and relevant to their society? Or a Dwarf-based zone where they do whatever it is Dwarves do?
They once posed as Night Elves to alienate the Furbolg.
Assuming you're talking about Grom in WC3, he wasn't trying to make allies and the Night Elves wouldn't join the Alliance until after the second invasion had concluded.
Night Elves.
Jinyu.
Void Elves.
>Demon corrupted assholes invade your land and begin cutting down your trees
>Fight back
>THIS IS HORDE LAND YOU RACISTS
Yes, murdering people is clearly the correct solution when someone travelling along cuts down a tree. You sure showed him.
No but Thrall did tell him not to not engage other forces. His response to hostile activity was 'Charge at them, murderboner thrust out'
>Yes they did.
>They were part of the coalition that helped retake Suramar.
Tyrande says multiple times that she never cared about the nightborne beyond the fact that they were fighting the Legion and had no interest in actually allying with them
Don't waste your time. He's autistic and will spout the same "horde dindu nuffin!" bullshit literally all day and all knight.
>your old pawn is attacked by your ancient enemy, forced to re-enslave his soul to you, then REEEEs and kills your ancient enemy
>JUST AS PLANNED
>furbolgs
They were sabotaging that group from joining the Alliance, they never were going to join the Horde.
>Jinyu
Moreso being enemies of the Forest Hozen that the Horde ran into first.
>Void Elves
Blood Elves who were kicked out of Silvermoon because their presence threatened the safety of the city, so decided to just join the opposing team for whatever reason???
>holding his son hostage
>stopping any transport in and out is the same as holding hostage
>took power away from the Dark Iron Clan
You mean he heard that Ironforge wasn't supporting him, hopped on a train, killed guards doing their jobs, then tried to kill the queen before going "Okay, fine, no more monarchy, I'm going to revert your government into a puppet council appointed by me when you had a monarchy because your councils didn't work out"? Because that was a fun quest to play, getting to kill Alliance members when they didn't support you was fun, especially when Anduin showed up and said "dad, I wasn't in danger, don't be a fucking idiot, you're going to kill the rightful queen".
>No
>Battle for Undercity doesn't exist
>Ulduar doesn't exist
Funny how human players pretend like their shitstains don't exist
>Sound decision
>entire planet is being attacked by demons
>"lol, better start off a war between allies because I'm mad!"
>sound decision
This is your brain on human logic
>they never screw their allies
In the amount of time humans have been in WoW, they've fucked over everyone they've been allied with in some way shape or form.
>high elves
>time to throw them in jail and try and kill them all off
>MUH LORDAERON
>"We don't need to help you against the plague, have fun with that!"
>Night Elves
>"You're the first ones to fight the Horde in case anything goes wrong so uh, have fun doing that because I'm going to declare war without telling anyone else!"
>Dwarves
>"Dwarves can't make their own decisions, gonna' dissolve your government now!"
>Draenei
>Draenei are so fucking irrelevant they never do anything except in Legion when they're lead by a human
>Worgen
>They're just fucking humans
Garithos was wrong, the truth is never trust a human.
The Alliance is the Allies during WW2 mixed in with the Founding Fathers and the Revolutionary War.
The Horde used to be Germany Pre WW2 and a bit of Napoleonic France during the old horde days, Thralls horde was like post war Germany, IMO now the horde is written like some close family with no one having an identity and the old Orcish culture pretty much erased from the horde and replaced with time traveling Orcs who follow a different war chief than Sylvanas.
>Demon corrupted invaders
>Shooting them is murder!
Nigga, cutting down trees ain't some shit to start shooting arrows over.
This nigga got it right.
No she actually says she wishes them well and sends you to inspire hope in them by telling them the Alliance is coming.
Yes, killing somebody who has done nothing to you is generally considered murder by most sane people. I'm glad you figured it out.
The Humans actually fixed a feud between Dark Irons, Wildhammer and Bronzebeard that has existed since forever....and Varian showed the rest of the Dwarves that Dark Iron can be trusted by leading an army of Dwarves into a raid into a frost troll city and exterminating the troll menace.
>They were sabotaging that group from joining the Alliance, they never were going to join the Horde.
That was my point.
You mean the writers ignored that he did something that was basically throwing a coup. Because that's what Varian was, do something to piss everyone off and then have the writers pretend as if you didn't do it. God King Wrynn was the closest Warcraft got the Archaon.
>Nigga, cutting down trees ain't some shit to start shooting arrows over.
When the demon-blooded guys have killed your guys first, you sorta do. The orcs kill wisps (Which are night elf souls) before the first wave of night elves attack, since they are right in the base.
>>stopping any transport in and out is the same as holding hostage
Yes.
>You mean he heard that Ironforge wasn't supporting him
He went in to save his son then kill the cunt who had him held hostage.
>Funny how human players pretend like their shitstains don't exist
Undercity was retaliation for the Wrathgate. Ulduar just had him refuse to fight with the Horde.
>This is your brain on human logic
It's your brain when you realize that Sylvanas can't be trusted a.k.a when your brain is perceiving the world clearly.
>In the amount of time humans have been in WoW, they've fucked over everyone they've been allied with in some way shape or form.
No, and you're shitty green text desperately trying to twist shit into some semblance of a point proves it.
>Yes, killing somebody who has done nothing to you is generally considered murder by most sane people.
Killing a bunch of monsters invading your lands and cutting down your trees isn't though.
I think this really highlights the difference between Horde and Alliance- they're both monsters, it's just that in the Horde the monster is on the outside.
youtube.com
Watch this the writters didn't ignore anything. This pretty much explains all of it.
>You mean the writers ignored that he did something that was basically throwing a coup
If he wanted to do that he would have just killed her and installed another Bronzebeard as ruler.
It's not even just cutting down the trees. There are wisps right in the starting orc base, which your guys will automatically attempt to kill.
The Alliance are written and are portrayed as the most honorable lawful good, peace seeking group of people since Warcraft 1. They are even written in the manual that way. Which is way different than other settings that have humans where they are portrayed as some kinda shade of gray.
No, with all the demon blood and fel magic they've got plenty of monster on the inside too. I mean, literally in the case of the orcs.
>they're both monsters
This is why no one takes Horde supporters seriously. The Alliance aren't monsters.
The Horde are always at least former monsters, with a habit of slipping back into monsterisim.
I actually wish we did some actual war crimes agaisn't the horde....Taurajo wasn't even that bad compared to the stuff the Forsaken and horde have done.
>Horde cinematic features all the leaders having a feast while the rest of the Horde is left out of it completely
>Alliance cinematic shows the King of Stormwind and the other leaders sharing in the celebration with their citizens as a whole
gee, I wonder why people think the alliance hasn't called out the humans yet
Why does goldie like Anduin so much?
Would have thought she was pro sylvanas.....
Why would she be pro sylvanas?
I don't know look at blizzcon you always have those gamer girls that are into sylvanas.