Magic A25 Spoiler Discussion

>Three Visits
My kingdom for a Three Visits reprint. In my heart, I know they'll never do this, but I would honestly be so damn impressed if they surprise reprinted Riding the Dilu Horse.

Recruiter sees play in about two decks, Animar and Alesha.
DD, Armageddon, LD, Piper, and all of those multicolor rares are ~5> dollars.
Akroma (both of them) have been reprinted 5 and 6 times respectively and are a dollar each
Forgot Obliterator and Luminarch. I didn't count Blood Moon, RIP, and Pacts because they're popular in other formats.

>the panic-mode sets
Dominaria is the make-or-break set. If it's not well-received, Magic's days are numbered. I hate to say that but it's true.

I'm not sure what price has to do with it, but I agree with the first user that this set is far friendlier to Commander than any other format. Unless we count "kitchen table without sleeves on" as a format. Hence the "EDH Masters" jibe. It's not like being popular in one format means they can't be played in another.

It's a little difficult to make that claim at this point of time if we can assume that Wizards/Hasbro is making money hand-over-fist off mouthbreathers, but stores and distributors having tons of unsold Iconic Masters and M25 sitting on shelves 1 or 2 years from now will definitely hinder their attempt to sell the next Masters set. The state of Standard ain't helping, either.

>friend ordered a box hoping for Karn or Ugin
>before spoiler season even started
I almost feel bad for him

Values matter because why would we want reprints of things that are already dirt cheap?

I'm more exited about Savannah Lions, Diabolic Edict and Erg Riders than literally any non-Rishadan Port rare or mythic in this set.
WTF WotC?

Only Jace, Vendillion, Blood Moon, Chalice and Port will be over $20 by this time next year.

That's true. Dominaria is also the first set with the new Design team, so hopefully they get their heads out of their asses about making cards.

They need the fear of God put into them. Was it Urza Block where the entire team got called into the CEO's office and got chewed out?

>"If you ever fuck up like this again, I'll fire all of you."
They need that hanging over them.

>but stores and distributors having tons of unsold Iconic Masters and M25 sitting on shelves
This, my bro works at Wal Mart and they still have half a pallet of IMA 3 booster blisters in storage because the couple boxes they put on shelves haven't moved.

Senpai I agree that the set sucks value-wise but the reply chain is regarding whether the set should actually be called "EDH Masters" (personally I'd go with Draft Chaff Masters). It's not even a serious debate, the original post was just a joke.

>They need the fear of God put into them. Was it Urza Block where the entire team got called into the CEO's office and got chewed out?
That wasn't really a good thing since it was MaRo's rise to power and gave us fucking Prophecy.

Thats scary. That means WoTC will start shitting up the format more than they already have.

>Lol u can have a planeswalker as ur commander
>Lol u cn have 2 commandrs
>Lol ur commanders work in the command zone

WHERES MY RIDING THE DILU HORSE WOTC!

didnt mind planeswalker commanders

partner can and should be more fleshed out

third one is fucking stupid and eminence shouldnt exist

Eminence is fine if they use it right which they did. Theres a reason they limited it to a shitty strategy like tribal.they were vry careful how they used it, people just seem to hate it on principal. Its not something they can expand on very easily though as evidenced by Oloro

Free value, no matter what value, from the command zone is straight fucked. It is uninteractable, it is unavoidable. From turn 1 every vampire comes with a free 1/1, which is not irrelevant. Every Wizard comes with a clone for an additional 1, doubling your triggers. There is nothing you can do to stop this.

This. They might as well begin the game with a free emblem.

Walmart still tries to sell them at retail price, don't they?

>Eminence is fine if they use it right which they did
>Eminence is fine if they use it right
>Eminence is fine
Nah man.

Ever heard of a little thing called kiki my friend? Its not just 2 decks m8

So does that mean i should mail WOTC's office a sword of damocles? cant be that hard to find.

Emenince is cancer. I have a slightly modded Vampire Precon, that still uses the slow out of box mana base, and it recks shop at my LGS against fine tuned Riku of the Infinite Turns, Gitrog Faggotry, and Breya the OTK decks. For 0 investment you start the game off with an emblem with 0 drawbacks other than deck construction considerations. I don’t know how they made a set of commanders more powerful than the 2016 ones, but they did.

Mail them like 20 of this print

I explained why it was right there so if you dont feel like reading or are too bullheaded to see why eminence was fine in the capacity it was used in then I dont know what to tell you. Eminence was given to tribal because its a bad creature based strategy in multiplayer commander. By giving you free abilities from the command zone for playing your tribe's cards, your tribal creatures are generating effectively nearly card advantage. This evens out the disadvantage most tribal players have by playing generally worse cards than their opponents. It wasnt an accident it was used for tribal. It just cant be used for very much else.

>A25 as official abbreviation
>implying the game will live anywhere near long enough to M25

I don't agree. It's fundamentally broken, uninteractive garbage. If it's giving shit strategies a negligible upside then why fucking do it? There are any number of ways they could've accomplished the same thing without printing a cancer mechanic like eminence. Even if they never touch the mechanic again, which seems unlikely, I don't think it's contributed anything positive to the format. It encourages non-diverse, cookie cutter strategies which I feel like goes against what the format was founded on.

But yeah it was a bad idea and even if you're right about the best case scenario is that it dies a quiet death and is forgotten.

Wal Mart doesn't buy most product, it's consession so they can't put it for sale unless the concessionaire agrees. If they can't sell the product at certain date they give it back.

MJHoldings is gonna lose a lot of money.

Partner is pure cancer. In competitive games of EDH, partners are most of the top tier decks.

Having permanent access to a specific card makes EDH decks much stronger than simple highlander decks. Doubling the amount of cards that you reliably and permanently have access to is a further increase in power. If they flesh out partners any more it's very likely that competitive decks will all use partners except for cases where a general is used as a combo piece.

I am fucking livid. People want legacy and modern reprints not a wacky 40$ draft set full of bottom of the barrel trash.

I wouldn't mind if they were normal priced packs. They ask $10 for a fucking pack and put garbage in them knowing people will buy them for the chance of a foil jace or doomsday.

They needed a free, flexible, and easy way to give you effective card advantage for playing bad creatures. Eminence was a good answer. Getting free stuff for doing a sideways thing is the baseline for many many cards in magic. Eminence is space that can only be done in commander so they used it, but they were careful to narrow the band in such a way to avoid an Oloro situation where it didnt matter what you did, you HAVE to do what the deck is asking you to do. Is there other wyqs to reward shit strategies within these parameters? Sure. But eminence is something they a only do in commander and has limited design space. Part of good design is knowing when you can use narrow space to suit your needs.

Also it isnt "uniteractive" as used. Theyre all creature strategies. You interact by dealing with the creatures, an easy feat in commander. Thats another reason why eminence was good for this space, it gave an avenue of interaction to this ability unlike Oloro.

It's a tragedy that the tournament format ensures that this awesome card is complete shit

Absolute trash set. Complete bait and switch money-grab by WOTC by unbanning Jace and including him along with Imperial Recruiter to get idiots buying for the chance to get a $100 card when the rest of the set is just bulk chaff jank disgusting diarrhea SHIT.

It literally is uninteractive. It's like a planeswalker emblem only the game fucking starts with it in play.

This isn't arguable, that's just a fact.

Why can’t they just print another good fucking set like the first fucking modern masters, why wizards

So are we done with rares? There's no way, right? Why would Wizards end their spoilers with commons/uncommons? T-they'll surely reprint Snapcaster downshifted back to rare, right bros???

It's uninteractive as hell, you denying reality does not change that fact. The only "balanced" one if Arahbo, that's it.

Because they think everyone loves sets for being limited masterpieces, and not both limited and good reprints/constructed playables.

You know this isn't a new card right? Its been legal for years. Also its UUU to regenerate a 2/4, thats such a steep cost, I couldn't imagine anyone actually playing in a tournament,

Thats splitting hairs. Youre technically correct in that you cant deal with the ability itself, but in actual gameplay the ability doesnt do anything until they do a thing that you CAN interact with. I assumed we werent dealing in pedagogy but here we are.

So what cards that are in the set do you actually want/will probably pick up the singles for within a month of release?

>Obliterator
>Animar
>FTV art Nicol Bolas
>Azusa
>Hell's Caretaker
>Darien
>Thalia
>Ancient Stirrings
>Eidolon of The Great Revel
>Simian Spirit Guide

It's the definition of uninteractive and it pollutes MtG with a pernicious video gamey "perk" system that obsolesces previous legendary creatures.

Are we seriously going with Ur-Dragon being relevant at all?

>splitting hairs
Nigger it's literally what the word fucking means.

Based

>man this set sucks I'll probably only buy five boxes instead of six
>why does wizards keep doing this to me?

I bought a box of MM2 instead, shit I'd have a better time drafting that with friends instead of A25.

>used to mock fuckers who said that TMS would be unbanned because of A25
>TMS gets unbanned, proving me wrong once
>tfw the people who said that TMS unbanning to ship A25 were probably right, proving me wrong twice

Azami and Scion are still in the running for better dedicated tribal commanders, cats had no commander, and no other vampire commander incorporates all 3 colors and only one other I can recall rewards playing vampires, and it was shitty (Anowon). Edgar is the only one you could argue obsoleted anything and he had almost no dedicated vampire tribal competition, just commanders that were vampires that people used for tribal decks. I think more people used Olivia for vampire tribal than Anowon and she doesnt even support tribal.

You are being pedantic as shit. Yes, you are right, you can not literally interact with commanders in command zones. Is that what you want to hear? This isnt Oloro though, your opponents actually have to do a thing for the uninteractable command zone effect to do anything, and guess which part you can interwct with?

I'm gonna wait for A25 to come out to buy a box of IMA. That'll probably be around the price of a normal box by then.

I bet you think Atraxa is unbalanced too.

MM2 is heavily underrated. It's certainly better than this garbage.

I think you might actually be retarded. Please stop posting.

Nice argument. Looks like I lose this round.

Being able to interact with the result of the ability =/= being able to interact with the ability. No matter what you do, every dragon is getting discounted by 1. Every wizard is going to enter with a clone for an extra 1. Every vamp is coming with a 1/1 friend. These things are certainly not irrelevant and their abilities are by definition unintractable. If anyone here is being a shithead, it's you.

Atraxa is just annoying, she's not unbalanced, just annoying and boring because lol keyword soup.

I'm just gonna wait till A25 tanks hard, but even then I might just buy a playset of Vindicate, Blood Moon, and one Recruiter, and that might be it.

They can cast cards into a chalice of the void and still get a body out of it.

I bought one, and might buy another soon, don't know really.

Pretty much what you do with these sets. You wait for them to tank super hard and all the stores to have STACKS of unsold product to go in and buy.
I do feel like this one might just completely destroy any confidence in the masters sets being worth stocking

...

>They can cast cards into a chalice of the void and still get a body out of it.
Er... so? You dealt with the actual card. A 1/1 is not even worth a fraction of a card, doesnt threaten your life total even in multiples in commander. The point of ability is so they can cast their threats and then stop sooner than normal to avoid getting blown out too hard by board wipes. If youre countering their actual cards they still have to keep playing them out of hand in commander because 1/1s arent going to get there versus 3+ other players. This is why edgar was powerful in 1v1 20 life but not in actual commander.

Because wotc staff don't give a fuck about constructed. They sit around drafting all day and think its the #1 priority of a set.

Well depending on his this one goes, I don't know if the previous ones will skyrocket in price or what. Really unsure about it.

>they advance board presence and you either get whittled down by ants or waste your removal when they can always get another free conscript
>lol so xd

The heads of current design and dev must roll. Those trips demand it.

Why would I want to draft with a $10-a-pack set?

because of the UH MAZE YNG design of the set!!!!!!!!!!!1

Iconic masters is probably gonna stay low forever. There's NOTHING worthwhile there
I think the reason that all the masters sets are so shit now is cause they're using the same design philosophy for them that they use for standard, IE: They're treating it like it's not a vacuum and that they have to keep the power level low so it doesn't hurt standard. Either that or they're trying to stretch the number of masters sets infinitely, but they don't need to print chaff to do that...

This is the thing about the masters set that I've never fucking understood. Who the hell wants to pay 40 dollars to draft?

> uses pedantry to accuse others of pedantry

wew lad

All you have told me is that your imagination is too small to post on Veeky Forums

It's definitely because they thought the success was due to a draft environment, and not because of great cards reprinted AND a good draft environment.
Their heads are so far up their asses it's not funny.
Yeah, I mean the ones before IMA, I'm wondering if those are gonna skyrocket because if they continue this shit trend, IMA and A25 will be low as hell but the previous ones will get to 300-400 levels.

Forcing low win-rate jank doesn't make you imaginative

lol but you could just shock the oloro player so he's totally interactive, right?

Fuck off.

Not the same. Oloro works regardless of what either player does. Eminence commanders do not. of the eminence commanders, the closest to noninteractive is edgar, but edgar decks dont win 40 life multiplayer games by having all their real threats removed and having some 1/1 tokens on board, and he was, probably rightfully, banned in the format his ability was broken. They need to keep their anthems and tribal rewards on board which isnt happening if youre interacting with them.

At this point I'm honestly hoping that the rumors about Hasbro wanting to flip Wizards are true. Even Games Workshop would be better running magic than Wizards. Games Fucking Workshop.

I really wonder if the TCG landscape in NA will be changed at least, since there are other TCGs now and it's no longer just the big three, if WotC gets flipped it'd be interesting to see.

Depending on who ends up buying it we'll see.
It'd either be another toy company, another game company, or in the worst case a video game company. It all depends on Hasbro's asking price.

No shit it's not the same. Being able to interact with the products of something uninteractive does not make a mechanic somehow interactive. It does't matter if you feel a 1/1 vampire doesn't matter because lol removal the same way it doesn't matter if I say life gain doesn't matter because lol burn. If you cannot interact with something than it is uninteractive, which is a huge problem in a game based entirely on fucking interactions.

>the only answer is the one I am posting

I'm certain PETA or stormfront have message boards for you to post on

Ok, go put up tournament results or fuck off. If it was playable it'd be played.

The set is not far from factually being more interesting for the commons/uncommons than most of the rares/mythics. Pic very related.

>happy
Great Revel, Pact of Negation, Thalia, Stirrings, Spirit Guide, filter lands

>need these but prices probably won't be affected much
Bridge, Chalice, Vendilion

This set would have been very cool if it was priced at the normal box price; that would have been a nice treat/celebration of the anniversary because it would be drafted like mad. But it's not, so it's very not cool.

Even Rudy admits that its not as good as expected while he tried to shill boxes at $180, read the comments, all his viewers know he's shilling.

youtube.com/watch?v=e3njN9tonPw

A25 seems less a celebration of magic's past, and more a warning of it's future

>If you cannot interact with something than it is uninteractive, which is a huge problem in a game based entirely on fucking interactions.

Magic is the most uninteractive game imaginable. If you play EDH a table without blue just means everyone sits around wanking off towards a combo. If you play green you have no way to interact with creatures or the stack. Playing EDH makes it apparent how broken Magic is as a card game. The ability to hold priority and pull off a string of moves without your opponent's input is absurdly broken and abused to no end. The inability of almost every color to deal with ETB effects. Counterspells restricted to one color.

Play any other card game and you'll see how uninteractive Magic is in comparison.

Mind screencapping? I don't wanna give him clicks and taint my youtube history.

Set symbols watermarks saved magic. Unironically loving this set. Will not be buying any cards and haven't bought them since 2009.

Doesn't hearthstone not have instant speed anything

So your only complaint is thrasios hero of Triton and the draw cards chick. He others are perfectly fine with some having synergies with other partners.

Bruse tarl + Tana (swing n tokens)
Bruse tarl + tymna (swing n draw)
Tymna + vial smasher (draw n sling)
Vial smasher + silias (swing cast artifact fling)
Sidar of kondor + tana (token.flank)
Reyhan + ishai (counters matter without super friends)
Sidar + ikra (high toughness flanking)

>The ability to hold priority and pull off a string of moves without your opponent's input is absurdly broken and abused to no end.
Provide 3 examples
All of your complains are fixied with just splashing W. Blue isn't the end all be all of answers.

Then your opinion doesn't matter
Not trying to be a dick or anything, but if you're not gonna buy the product, it doesn't matter if you like it

You can combine Vial Smasher with whatever, the damage is staggering from it.