Tactical Combat RPG

Ops & Tactics, Phoenix Command or GURPS for a modern game centered around a counter terror unit, deadly terrorist attacks and government conspiracies?
How does one build a long term campaign out of something that essentially boils down to combat missions with little roleplay?

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>How does one build a long term campaign out of something that essentially boils down to combat missions with little roleplay?

Give them objectives other than "Kill all the bad guys".

Look at XCOM 2. You got missions for Saving people, killing or kidnapping targets, destroying enemy bases and stealing data. Then you include "downtime" stuff like investigations, spying, and more. Depending on what kind of story you are doing, you can try to pull characters' personal shit into the game or not.

>GURPS
All the way, it shines in the TL8 and 9 eras. And you can throw any flavor of tangent into the mix with zero effort. Supernatural, superscience, illuminati, illuminaughty, whatevs

Have extremely tense hostage situations., Do you actively try to save targets or do you not negotiate with terrorists?

So something like "disarm the bomb and save the kids" or "rescue the presidents daughter"? I wanted to base it on Tom Clancy stuff with them terrorist group being used by a politician for reasons but I'm not sure why
I've heard good things about it but thought the amount of splats for it was a bit intimidating. Is it easy to learn/use?
How do you make the situations feel tense on the players? Give them a countdown to when the terrorists start killing people?
Is there a way to make downtime a mechanically relevant factor? Should I use some kind of stress system that encourages r&r between missions?

>How do you make the situations feel tense on the players? Give them a countdown to when the terrorists start killing people?

Basically. Make it a challenge. So many failures means that they start killing people. Successes means that they start surrendering hostages and maybe give up.

>Is there a way to make downtime a mechanically relevant factor? Should I use some kind of stress system that encourages r&r between missions?

Sure, you can do that. You can also create situations that the players deal with between missions, like if one of them took an unnecessary risk last mission, their commander chews them over it.

If you'd be willing to tackle it, I'd highly recommend Rolemaster: Black Ops. It's based off of the RMSS, but even with RMFRP, it shouldn't be an issue. I've used it for a number of games quite similar to the one you're describing, and it's worked wonders.

The critical charts alone are enough to bring out the "realism" of being hit by a bullet, and my players began to draw weapons only when absolutely pressed to do so. Also, the characters themselves were more realistic, with detailed backgrounds (training packages) as to how they obtained their skills, what agencies they belonged to previously, etc. The characters were far from simply being stats and numbers on a page and my players came to value them highly.

The three sample adventures and various campaign suggestions for modern day espionage, counter-intelligence, counter-terrorism, etc, are very handy, allowing you to get in the game quickly. There is a large section profiling Intelligence Agencies from around the world, an "Espionage Timeline" of real events from 1951 through 1995, and an entire chapter dedicated to profiling Terrorist groups from around the globe (such as dates of their formation, estimated membership, headquarters, leadership, sponsors, and their various objectives). There is also a detailed "Terrorist Timeline," detailing events from 1968 through 1995.

On a side note, however, you will need three volumes:

1. A copy of either RMSS (Standard System) or RMFRP (Fantasy Role Playing)
2. A copy of Rolemaster: Black Ops
3. A copy of Weapons Law: Firearms

>So something like "disarm the bomb and save the kids" or "rescue the presidents daughter"? I wanted to base it on Tom Clancy stuff with them terrorist group being used by a politician for reasons but I'm not sure why

Pretty much.

Also use Ops and Tactics, if you like gunfights.

>rolemaster

This rolemaster?

1d4chan.org/wiki/Rolemaster

>Ops and Tactics
Leaning towards it, I like the idea of using something community made.
Speaking of which are you working on anything else currently?

>Speaking of which are you working on anything else currently?

NOPE! I'm still working on the very last release by doing a thorough proofreading and fixing spelling errors, gramatical errors, and actual stat errors, as well as making a bunch of changes.

After those books are done and released, then we're going to work on the setting, Kandai. Which is a space opera type book thing. That has all the rules.

Kill some of the bad guys?

I'm looking at your game right now and you honestly can't talk. Your game has just as many convoluted rules and things that would put Rifts to shame.

> Your game has just as many convoluted rules and things that would put Rifts to shame.

Such as?

>Is there a way to make downtime a mechanically relevant factor?
GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School includes detailed rules for learning skills that you can use instead of arbitrarily doling out XP.

Dude, look at the amount of tables in this thing. It looks like there is a table for every page.

>Post the amount of tables as a reference.

You do realize that about 90% of those tables are equipment tables, and that I organized equipment cost, weight, size and other statistics within tables, and the other 10% being reference tables to either specific skills(Such as the aforementioned stats for making the things, instead of buying them), and that you do not actually roll against said tables, right?

Those sprawling lists of guns are the POINT of Ops and Tactics.

Not yet. I am still reading. But why all of that shit? How much of that is redundant? I feel like you could do the same thing as this with 60% less pages. Like, what's the point of naming all the gun manufacturers or going through what kinds of guns different groups are using?

Ops and Tactics is supposed to be a /k/ and Veeky Forums wet dream. If you want to do the same thing as this with 60% less pages, play SQuATs.

That's in case a GM wants to know more about the guns in game and also it serves as a quick reference for a GM to know about what certain people might realistically be armed with.

>t yet. I am still reading. But why all of that shit? How much of that is redundant?

See . The sprawling list of guns is the reason for Ops and Tactics. I don't like generic weapons. At all. Period. I find it bland and boring. So I listed out guns becasue that is what I liked, and that is what the people who play this liked.(Trust me, I asked about replacing it with generic guns and they did not like that suggestion one bit. Despite that, there is a generic gun ruleset in the variant rules if you don't care about guns, also SQUATS, the simplified version also is like 80 pages.)

>Like, what's the point of naming all the gun manufacturers

Flavor. Cause we like guns.

>or going through what kinds of guns different groups are using?

Because there are a multitude of people who generally don't know anything about the equipment that people use. It's a reference for GMs that may not know. To ease and aid them in their GM duties, to give them somewhere to point to, instead of abandoning them with the giant list of guns.

Can't they just Google that if they really want to know?

So this isn't something people are actually supposed to play but instead something for gun nuts who happen to be roleplayers to masturbate to?

Can't you just Google anything then?

yes but its easier to have references in the book/pdf. WHERE YOU CAN SEE IT

Pretty much. When I do VtM games, I Google city streets and use Map View to get an idea of what that place might look like. I might read up about the area if I am really wanting to inspire myself.

V-Commandos

>this thread in a nutshell

>Can't they just Google that if they really want to know?

I suppose? But if we're going to go that route why even include any notes for the GM at all about lore, or history, or standard equipment?

>So this isn't something people are actually supposed to play but instead something for gun nuts who happen to be roleplayers to masturbate to?

No, it's 100% playable. But it's for people who care about the difference between an AR-15, a FAL, and a G3. It's for people who don't want "Generic Battle rifle" in every game they play, or they want to run a historical game(Which did happen, someone played WW2 and really appreciated the fact that I actually went through the trouble to actually stat out real WW2 guns instead of "Bolt action rifle" like a lot of RPGs did). That's who it's aimed at, because that's what I, personally, wanted.

If you don't care? Play SQuATS, or GURPS base set.

Okay, that's not quite the same though, I agree that's it's not necessary to have the gun manufacturers listed but it's not useless, and also listing the EQ that people use is handy in a pinch for a GM

>illuminaughty
Elaborate

But that means more pages for no reason other than to have more pages.

But if it's literally just a system/book that is all about stating guns then whatever. I think it's a bit ridiculous but that's my opinion.

>But that means more pages for no reason other than to have more pages.

Here's a copy of Ops and Tactics, Bloat removed.

Do you not know how to skim a rulebook? Or are you just retarded at all things?

Sure I do. But when I suggest something and some guy posts some shit about how bloated the system I suggested is in a condescending fucktard way, he better make sure that his shit isn't as fucking bloated or even more.

are you tilting at windmills? He didn't say anything about the system. he just linked a article about the system/

He just posted the cut down system dude, calm down nibba

Did you read what he linked? I'm guessing no.

He posted squats, the cut down version of oats.

I simply thought he wanted clarification. Listen, you seem really defensive. Did you write the system or something? Are you mad that Ops is free and yours isnt?

Not at all. I just think that he's a shit for trying to shot my suggestion down with that shit to promote his own system, in which the link he uses basically says it's bloated like fuck (it's not) when his core System he's promoting is just as bad. I don't care that he posted a less bloated version (Good for him for making one though), it's how he did that is what made me mad.

So your mad his system is superior and bloat free?

Real talk? I've never even heard of rolemaster prior to this thread. I goggled it and that was the 1st thing I saw. I read through it and asked a question, if this was indeed the same rolemaster that you were speaking about.

There is no need to be upset. Have a picture.

It's fairly easy, 3d6 roll under, also there's a book specifically about being navy seals operating in Vietnam. It's a toolbox more than a game, in a sense.

GURPS with some decent gadget/armament tables would be best. Gives an opening for more plot/interaction focused elements of the campaign to be developed too.

Although it's miniatures-based, perhaps a game (or just campaign creation system) akin to Inquisitor might be a decent route to go down? The base game is extremely bogged down in needlessly crunchy bullshit however, so a community-created and tested system such as In The Emperor's Name 3rd Edition or Inquisimunda would be a better fit for a more slick experience (if memory serves, ITEN has some ok breaching mechanics that help balance out combat). That said, you'd need to whip up some custom gear tables. The main upsides of would be the objective/narrative focus of the games, plus the easy visualisation for combat.

I played a 15mm modern skirmish campaign a few years back that was similar in concept to your setting (i.e. small teams, big mysteries) and had a blast, but I can't for the life of me remember what the damn game system was.

What you need to do is define the teams mission.

To raid the stable of Clancy-brand Clancy games, you're not going to get a good Rainbow RPG, because Rainbow isn't meant for RPGs, it's for miniatures games. Hell, read the book. It's fucking awesome, but Team Rainbow in and of itself (even in The Bear and the Dragon) doesn't do anything but direct action stuff suitable for miniatures combat games. In the Grim Darkness of the Post-Cold War Era, there is only room breaches.

RPG groups are more suited for Splinter Cell, The Campus, Ghost Recon (mostly Wildlands) and HAWX. Splinter Cell still involves talking to people and learning things before you get to the real shit, and honestly I think Blacklist most covers the pace of your average RPG campaign (burn every bridge to get the bad guys, and when things go bad, drone strike Tehran).

Ghost Recon (Wildlands) suits RPG groups well because it's basically Clear and Present Danger, only your players might run the risk of talking to in-country civilians and having to learn things before they plot their strikes. There's a nice sandbox campaign in there somewhere, really.

HAWX? Well, you've heard of Planes and Mercs, right?

The Campus is literally Spycraft Campaigns: The Books.

Shadow Watch (fucking no one remembers Tom Clancy's Shadow Watch) is the only actual goddamn Clancy-brand tactical RPG. It's the simplest to translate into a tabletop setting and I recommend looking into it because it's straight up Tom Clancy's X-COM.

Cyberpunk 2020 because it's simpler, quicker and allows for massive gun porn. Making a Rogue Spear campaign will be fairly boring, since Rogue Spear only goes into action once all the roleplay (intel) stuff has been done by other organizations.

>HAWX
I would love an Ace Combat/HAWX type of RPG but 3D aerial combat seems to be something that this hobby struggles to do well

>modern game centered around a counter terror unit
>deadly terrorist attacks and government conspiracies


There was a show about this that had loads of combat missions and roleplay.